Bang Seat Limits

[Prangster]

A playright oppo has asked for some advice on bang seat escapes that defied the odds, either well outside seat and aerodynamic parameters or truly deserving of the term miraculous. He's particularly interested in any F4 escapes in RAF service

[ian16th]

Wasn't there a case from a very early Canberra at about 50,000' around 1950?

Just based on my rather shaky memory.

[Wrathmonk]

Not an F4 story - however Keith Handscomb, from a Victor (24 Mar 75) after a Bucc had clipped its tail off was, IMHO, pretty miraculous. See here (http://www.ejection-history.org.uk/Aircraft_by_Type/Victor.htm)

More about F4 (albeit RAF and FAA only)ejections here (http://www.ejection-history.org.uk/Aircraft_by_Type/F-4_Phantom_RAF.htm)- some have stories to go with them.

[The B Word]

Here's a good one (a top bloke as well): http://www.ejectionsite.com/midair.htm

The site is good as well..

[xrba]

Enough tales here for most.

Sea Vixen. Royal Navy. Carrier Jet. - Home (http://www.seavixen.org/)

[EngAl]

What about Pete Tait from the Vulcan?- See the thread:

Does anyone remember my Dad? 'Vulcan Bomber'

[mike rondot]

Mike Longstaff survived very high IAS (500+) supersonic ejection from Hunter XG261 in May 1980 with bruises and a broken arm IIRC.

[forget]

Peter Tait's escape here -

http://www.pprune.org/military-aircrew/259414-does-anyone-remember-my-dad-vulcan-bomber-2.html#post3819198

[ORAC]

21st March 1984
RAF Hawk T.1 XX251 CFS
Red Arrows
RAF Akrotiri Cyprus

Hit the ground during display practice at Akrotiri, Cyprus.

The first impact on the runway forced the ejection seat through the canopy and deployed the chute dragging the pilot, Flight Lieutenant Chris Hurst, backwards out of the aircraft, before the aircraft impacted a second time and disintegrated.

[Wander00]

Navigator banged out of an F4 outside seat parameters and landed in deep snow that saved his life. Recovered and went on to fly again, but no more ejection seats. Cannot remember his name -Steve?

[Prangster]

Thanks Wanderer you've re booted my memory banks with that one. All replies have been of use and I'm sure my thespian friend will find enough to keep him happy. It's nice that he took the trouble to ask and didn't just plunge off the edge as many are wont.

[Chris Kebab]

..did he have a cockney accent?

May we ask what he is penning Prangster?

[Treble one]

An EE (or was it BAe) test pilot Johnny Squires (sp) ejected from a Lightning T4 over the Irish Sea at great altitude/speed (I think his tail fin broke during a roll manoeuvre) circa 1959(?).

I think he may have been the first British pilot to eject from an aircraft at supersonic speeds. But I could be wrong.

[henry crun]

Treble one: I think that honour went to Hedley Molland in 1955, when he left a Hunter at about 1.1

[Treble one]

I stand corrected HC, thanks.

Regards
TO

[Prangster]

Scripts in the early stages of development are more secret than the most secret, secrets! All writers are terrified of plagiarism. That said he's dabbling in the biblical miracles and looking for modern equivalents I sort of tossed bang seat at him as a possible area of exploration and had him jumping on the spot with excitement, easily pleased these writer fellahs. Should the series fly I'll post and let you know

[Audax]

The pictures of Curly Hurst rising out of the remains of his Hawk (looked like an Airfix kit before assembly) were spectacular to say the least.

Many, many years ago, wasn't there a Sea Vixen observer who banged out on short finals as the a/c rolled uncontrolably, the seat + occupant hit the round going sideways and he survived the "landing" whilst still in the seat? Could well be wrong but certainly the story did the rounds at the time.

[Wander00]

Watton 1966, Canberra practice assymetric (and heavy), and started to roll - AEO (Ken Topaz?) banged out way outside the parameters for the seat and landed on the airfield still in it. Very badly injured, but helicoptered to RAF Ely hospital and a year later walked out, but no more bang seats for him. They were prety good the Service hospitals - but that's another thread!

[Fergusonic]

Hi

Yes, I think you are recalling Steve and my ejection on 7th January 1986 on top of Buckden Pike at 250ft and speed of 520knts+
I've given a brief over-view on the ejection.....www.ejection-history.org.uk
Details below:
Just replying to your questionnaire.......to the best of my memory (Any photos are in storage whilst we wait for house to sell)

1. Ian Ferguson
2. Flt Lt
3. 34
4. 7th January 1986
5. 0940hrs approx
6. RAF - 29 Sqn Coningsby
7. McDonnell Douglas Phantom FGR2
8. Flt Lt Steve Williams 29 Sqn Coningsby
9. XV 434
10. 29 Sqn
11. 'J' tail letter
12. ?
13. RAF Coningsby
14. 250 feet
15. 520+knts
16. 30 degrees nose down wings level
17. Buckden Pike - Pennines
18. mountainous - lots of loose rocks
19. clear cold winters day - snow on mountain tops
20. Peacetime Trg Sortie 4-ship mission
21. Self (Independent) ejection
22. Canopy jettisoned automatically in ejection sequence
23. Rolling seat - feet first - some grey out in decel
24. broken elbow either in collision with left canopy wall (this was a very sudden right hand only pull on ejection handle) Left still on throttles! OR elbow collided with PEC in airblast. Both visors blown off - Lost flying gloves part of O2 regulator. Broke right leg on impact with ground.
25. Massive time expansion - Could almost remember every detail of ejection (eyes open) in hundredths of second. This included initial seat charge firing and looking over front windscreen just prior to main rocket firing and then seeing myself leave the jet and it's impact into the mountain.
26. No
27. Mk7A with Irvin chute
28. Normal low level mission at 250ft 2 F4's acting as fighters verses 2 F4's acting as low level targets. We turned in behind at 1-1 1/2 miles for a chase down which involved reheat and accel to 520 knts plus. The nose of my jet 'dipped' - thinking this was a UCM I attempted to raise nose to encounter a sudden 8G pitch which forced my head down between my knees and the control column by my right ear! I attempted to slacken off the violent pitch but then encountered a windscreen full of ground as the jet pitched violently 30 degrees nose down - tried to recover into another big pitch up - decided to GO! Ran stick trimmers fully nose down and pulled handle with only right hand...the rest is history...as described above.
Difficulty getting out of parachute on ground which billowed up and started to drag me in the wind on the mountain top. Finally after much prayer and struggle freed myself from parachute harness and PSP which were all attached to this full parachute dragging me towards the edge of a cliff 2,500 ft down the mountain. Helicopter rescue excellent - My PSB was transmitting all the time despite NOT being able to activate it myself. No pain / No unconsciousness on mountain. Saw Jet Provost pass very low over me and Canberra searching for us. Mayday relay went out from the number 2 F4's navigator.


My Nav passed through the fireball and his parachute was burnt in half - literally. he imp[acted the mountain and suffered major injuries. He was found lying in the snow face down in unconcious position -Miraculously saving his life! I do believe through prayer and good medical support went back to flying, but aircraft without ejection seats. I went back to fly F4's and then converted to Tornado F3's also a Flt Sim Instructor before retiring and taking up my present vocation as a minister in Grace Community Church, Blackburn.

The reason for the accident according to the official Bo E investigation was a 'Feel Bellows' proportional pitch control system exploding in the fin. How? ---Poss through a Feel bellowsTube blockage(leading edge of fin) the clearance at high speed which caused a sudden in filling of air into the proportional bellows pitch control system and a rupture
causing violent pitch control motion.
Hope this information is of interest to your readers.
p.s. I've never lost a wink of sleep or ever been scared of flying again....(A question I'm sometimes asked)

Very kindest of regards

Ian

[VinRouge]

SR-71 Break-Up (http://www.alexisparkinn.com/sr-71_break-up.htm)

Amazing story.

Not technically an ejection though.

This one is pretty amazing, met the chap a few years later when I was in ATC. He gave a fantastic presentation.

http://www.rafjever.org/pictures-118/118sqnpic205.jpg

[JamesA]

This one was probably within operating parameters but still worth a mention, IMHO.
Red Arrows, Brighton sea front, 80/1. The usual seaon opener between the piers. Head to head pair pass twice, on third pass one clips yacht mast. Boat owner got frightened and decided to move. Half of wing cut off, pilot ejects and lives to tell tale. All captured by tbe Beeb, who were shooting the Reds for the opening sequence to the Saturday summer variety shows. Incidentally, he was the last to bang out of a Gnat and first out of a Hawk

[bakseetblatherer]

A couple of good stories here, including without a parachute!
EJECTION STORIES (http://www.ejectorseats.co.uk/Stories.html)

[B Fraser]

I used to work alongside a chap (Alan ?????) who ejected from a Canberra which undershot at Leuchars. The aircraft was on the sea bed. He survived but it was a close run thing.

I reckon the event took place in the late '50s however some of the retired RAF Ppruners may have more information.

[xrba]

Of course there was dear old N.B. who banged out when he didn't want to, and didn't when he did, if you follow my drift! Way outside any parameters both times. Perhaps he will tell his tale here?

[Schiller]

I don't recall a Vixen observer banging out at low level and skidding across the ground as the parachute deployed, but it certainly happened to a Scimitar pilot at RAF Changi in the 60's.

There was an observer who managed to fire his seat while standing up in it facing backwards doing his preflight checks. I wouldn't have thought it survivable if I hadn't witnessed it myself. He flew through the air with the greatest of ease before coming down on the deck with a thump. He was a bit battered and in a cast for some months, but eventually returned to normal flying duties.

[hum]

Plenty spring to mind... 1st female RAF ejectee was a very close call - probably only survived because she was so light and thus avoided being killed on impact following a birdstrike in a Harrier at low level... IIRC the stitching in her boot let go (along with many bones) with the ferocity of the arrival, she then only narrowly escaped being burnt to death when her front seater - himself dazed and injured by the birdstrike, managed to find her and drag her clear of the fire...

Another amazing escape was the USMC guy who was doing the harrier 'Bow' at the end of his AV8A airshow routine (involves rotating the aircraft around the nozzles as they are moved to the 'braking stop') The aircraft started to descend a little as he 'bowed' so he moved his hand to the throttle lever to add power, unfortunately for him, his sleeve caught the nozzle lever and slammed the nozzles aft with the aircraft pointing 20ish degrees nose down.... Result = a spectacular 'tentpeg' right at crowd centre...

Amazingly, the seat fired on impact - apparently not pilot initiated - and everything worked perfectly - no-one was injured (and I guess the crowd went wild :})

I met a German 104 pilot once who told me about his miraculous escape... He overcooked it in a low level evasion turn, clipped some trees and the aircraft broke up... He woke up hanging from his parachute in a tree... apparently the wing came off, the fuselage started to spin and somehow the seat was flung out - the main cartriges were never fired...

Makes my 0.6 sec MB initiated parachute ride seem boring... :)

[xrba]

Schiller, the Vixen looker skipped across the sea in his seat, late ejection at launch.

N.B. had 2 faulty seats, 1st, Vixen underwater mechanism triggered on recovery snagging sear wires, 2nd, Toom handle came of in his hands,[at about M1.7!].

[sycamore]

Prangster,PM for you...