Folks your help is needed in reuniting a ww2 pilots family with his property

[NutLoose]

Posted on a modelling site I visit.....


Hi folks,

today I received an e-mail from a fellow modeler (we're both Croatian).

He received an querry from a fellow aircraft enthusiast, who found an silver RAF ID plate/bracelet with an RAF crest and motto on the right side, and engraved J. SCARRATT 124473 on the left. The location is mountain Biokovo, near the village Podaca (http://www.worldplaces.net/hr/hrv/15/podaca/ (http://www.worldplaces.net/hr/hrv/15/podaca/)), on the south coast of Croatia.

According to witnesses in spring-early summer of 1944 there was an air battle between 3 Spitfires/Hurricanes and 4 Messerschmitt's/Stukas. 5 aircraft were downed, two of them British. One British pilot force landed near the Umcani village (http://www.worldplaces.net/hr/hrv/15/umcani/ (http://www.worldplaces.net/hr/hrv/15/umcani/))and was taken prisoner by the quisling NDH forces, apparently he was Scottish and was smoking a pipe near his aircraft when he was captured.

The founder would like to return the bracelet to the family of the airman. In may this year he contacted the UK embassy and sent them the photo, but he received no further answer and his online search found no missing airman named J. Scarratt.

Is there an RAF missing persons agency or similar he could contact?

Any help would be appreciated.

Bye,

Vedran



This was suggested,

The Royal Air Force - History Section (http://www.raf.mod.uk/history_old/rafhis.html)

anyone else able to narrow it down for him?

Cheers

[forget]

NutLoose, Here's the first problem. The surname 'Scarratt' may not exist. From 'British Surnames'.

Search for 'SCARRATT'. Sorry, we don't currently have any data for SCARRATT.

If this is your name: Congratulations, you are a genuine rarity, at least in the UK. Maybe you should try to breed, to avoid the SCARRATT family becoming extinct!

If you know something of the origin of this name, why not start a thread about it on the forum - if we get enough information, we may be able to add it to the main site eventually.

[NutLoose]

but what about his number?

[forget]

Sorry, Disregard the 'British Surnames' web site - bag of nails. :suspect:

A simple Google for 'Scarratt' throws up lots of people. I should have done that first. :hmm:

PS. There's a Sqn Ldr Gordon Scarratt at RAF Kinloss. Worth trying ??

[NutLoose]

but what about his number?

[c-bert]

Welcome to the Imperial War Museum : Royal Air Force Service Records (http://www.iwm.org.uk/server/show/ConWebDoc.2556)

Might a letter to Innsworth be the way forward?

[BossEyed]

The following is offered for elimination: A search for "Scarratt" within the London Gazette comes up with a few hits (http://www.london-gazette.co.uk/issues/1939-03-15;1948-12-31/all=scarratt;event=world-war-ii/start=11), but none that mach the Service Number.

A search on "124473" is also fruitless (http://www.london-gazette.co.uk/issues/1939-03-15;1948-12-31/all=124473;event=world-war-ii/start=1) - no links with the surname Scarratt.

Could he have been a Commonwealth airman, and if so might that explain why he doesn't appear in the Gazette?

[sycamore]

N-L, try the `keypublishing` web(Flypast) historic forum,as there is a good group of `anoraks` on there as well.

[green granite]

There were some South African squadrons flying from Italy at that time who did sorties over Croatia, (I found a ref to a german killed by marauding SAAF spitfires "The top-scoring Croat fighter pilot was Nadporucik (Lt.) Cvitan Galic with 38 confirmed air victories. He was killed on the ground by marauding South-African Spitfires at Zaluzani airfield, Croatia, on 6 April, 1944.") so it might be a good Idea to search in the SA archives.

List of SAAF units: http://milhist.*************/2009/11/south-african-air-squadrons-of-second.html insert b l o g s p o t . com without the spaces in place of the *

[Icare9]

There is a list of PoW Names on the internet, Scarratt (or similar version) does not appear in the PoW List in Germany.
CWGC has no listing for any Scarratt in RAF, RAAF, RCAF, RNZAF or SAAF records.
Tried searching PoW database for 124473 but no hit so far, trying other letters of the alphabet to see if anything similar appears elsewhere, if a valid ID No. (RCAF usually start with Alpha/xxxx).

Looks as if you need to get RAF Records involved with losses that day, which may narrow down the search.

[c-bert]

Looking at the Imperial War Museum website, it is possible that it is earlier than WW2? My history of the region is a little fuzzy.

[StopStart]

It may be that your history of history is a little fuzzy too!

I'm pretty sure that Spitfires weren't shooting down ME109s before WWII...

It doesn't appear that J Scarratt features on the Runnymede memorial either. As a previous poster said, I think a search of the RAF Records will be the only way forward with this.

[green granite]

From: RAF/RAF OR Service Numbers - RafCommands Forums (http://www.rafcommands.com/forum/showthread.php?t=27)

It would appear that the service number 124473 was issued in 1918 "122001 to 125000 Jan-Feb 1918 RFC - civilians"

[c-bert]

It may be that your history of history is a little fuzzy too!

I'm pretty sure that Spitfires weren't shooting down ME109s before WWII...

It doesn't appear that J Scarratt features on the Runnymede memorial either. As a previous poster said, I think a search of the RAF Records will be the only way forward with this.

For the hard of understanding I was implying that the bracelet was un-related to the Spitfire story. See Green Granites' post.

[Airborne Aircrew]

GG:

Since it seems possible the pilot was an officer the list you used is for other ranks only and thus won't help.

[green granite]

I understood that officer's numbers started with a 7, but the numbers wouldn't be the same would they?

edited to add: a better list here: http://www.ab-ix.co.uk/rfc_raf.pdf

[grizzled]

A suggestion that might be of help: Vedran should post an image (or several) of the bracelet on the web. A look at the emblem, motto etc would be of great value in determining the era -- and whether it was even RAF.

FWIW
grizz

[NutLoose]

I am letting him know what we have, or should I say you have found, latest from him is


It was found near the aircraft remains. No mention of the body. The locals have been using the wreck for parts after the war.

I'll ask for more info.

EDIT

What do the RAF WW ID tabs look like? Is it possible that the downed pilot was a relative of J.SCARRATT of WW1 vintage?

Upon re-reading the e-mail I found that the Scotsman is identified as last name Gray, he was POW in Zagreb with 2 other Brits and about 60 Americans, downed over today's Croatia and Bosnia and Herzegovina.



Thread is here

RAF missing pilot info - Britmodeller.com (http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=40012&st=0&gopid=422773&#entry422773)

[philrigger]

;)

From the London Gazette; The number 124473 was allocated to
F/O GHM RICHARDSON. Who was discharged from the RAF for medical reasons in 1943.

Perhaps the number relates to Royal Navy FAA? Or to another allied air force?
There are a number of SCARRATTs mentioned in the LG but mostly army with one navy. (As far as I have searched). But very few J. Scarratt.
There are lots of SCARRETTs.
There is nothing on the Commonwealth War Graves Commission site.

The plot thickens. I now leave it to others!


Philrigger

[helidriver]

After a quick search of the Commonwealth War Graves Commission website the following is shown:

KEY

No Surname Rank Service Number Date Of Death Age Regiment/Service Nationality Grave/Memorial Ref. Cemetery/Memorial Name

1 SCARRATT , JOSHUA Private S/7412 21/05/1916 21 Black Watch (Royal Highlanders) United Kingdom I. A. 9. BULLY-GRENAY COMMUNAL CEMETERY, BRITISH EXTENSION

2 SCARRATT , JOHN ARTHUR Flight Cadet 128917 28/12/1918 18 Royal Air Force United Kingdom North-East of Church. CRAIL PARISH CHURCHYARD

3 SCARRATT , J H Sapper 507708 25/09/1917 37 Canadian Engineers Canadian III. F. 12. AUBIGNY COMMUNAL CEMETERY EXTENSION

4 SCARRATT , JAMES HENRY Private T/204925 09/08/1918 21 The Queen's (Royal West Surrey Regiment) United Kingdom Panel 3. VIS-EN-ARTOIS MEMORIAL

I draw your attention to Serial 2 where the Service Number bears some resemblence to the individual in question. All hyperthetical of course, but both Scarretts could be related, maybe brothers and the WW2 one carried the bracelet as a keepsake. Any of the Scarretts listed may well be the WW2 individuals Father and he carried the bracelet for the same reason.

An interesting find nevertheless, and I really hope there is closure, but the answer may not be as straight forward as one might suggest.

h

[Union Jack]

Could one of you clever fellows please try a different angle of attack and track down the loss of the two aircraft in the area specified in the admittedly fairly broad period of spring/early summer 1944, and see where that leads?

Also, I wonder if anyone has access to Air Force Lists for the relevant period.

Jack

PS Only punctuation, but British naval officers did not have Service Numbers until the 1970s

[WATB]

If the aircraft involved were Hurricanes that narrows it down to 6 Squadron who were active from February 1944 attacking targets along the whole Dalmatia coast. The only other candidates are the two Yugoslav RAF squadrons (351 and 352) but they were not operational to late summer 1944.

[Topsy Turvey]

May be worth an enquiry to RAF Records office which is now at Cranwell (not Innsworth as suggested by Imperial War Museum link earlier in thread).

RAF - Contact Us (http://www.raf.mod.uk/contactus/)

If you explain what it is about they may be willing to forward a letter to last known address of airman or NOK. asking them to contact you. Failing that try the Historic Casualty Team at the JCCC (still at Innsworth / Imjin) who may have / be able to obtain information on the crash.

[ImageGear]

Google might be a little more of a friend...

http://www.shrani.si/f/1a/dK/CUQg7HD/yucrashes.xls

Imagegear

[green granite]

Good find ImageGear :ok:

Suggest a link is posted on the other site so that the local guy can check locations against local knowledge.

[Icare9]

Thanks to Image Gear
There is an entry for a Grey:
but doesn't sound as if he would be found leaning against his plane smoking a pipe.
Name: GREY, JOHN NEVILLE
Initials: J N
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Flying Officer
Regiment/Service: Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve
Unit Text: 6 Sqdn.
Age: 22
Date of Death: 23/05/1944
Service No: 125837
Additional information: Son of Thomas E. Grey, and of Amy Grey, of Low Fell, Co. Durham.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: Panel 13, Column 1.
Memorial: MALTA MEMORIAL
322 23/05/1944 Hurricane IV KZ381 No 6 Sqn A/C Code Letter: N F/O J N Grey Yugoslavia Hit by flak while attacking shipping in Podgora Channel; b/o (baled out?) but parachute opened just before hitting the water; observed floating in Mae West profusely bleeding.
As you might guess, no easy find for a Scarratt or Scarrett though.

[NutLoose]

:ok:

You guys are just amazing, have updated the other site with the new info for him, just awaiting a reply :D

[Airborne Aircrew]

As you might guess, no easy find for a Scarratt or Scarrett though.Being a dabbler in Genealogy you might also try Scarrott for the surname. I know for sure it exists - it is the surname of my best mate in the Regiment.

[Top Bunk Tester]

Although not a lot of help for your particular search there are at least 120 J Scarratt's around on the Electoral Roll. I know that the Scarratt's have been around in the Para Regt for many years as well. In fact I ran into one yesterday, who I've known for 20 odd years, so not that uncommon.

[FJJP]

Another possibility is that the bracelet could have belonged to a relative with a different surname who served previously. So the guy wearing it might not necessarily have the same surname...

[ImageGear]

This is an RASC Badge as shown in the other forum

http://www.kinnethmont.co.uk/estates/leith-hall/gf-taylor/rasc-crest.jpg

Imagegear