Win 7 and apps

[Keef]

My old laptop overheated regularly, and shut down because the heat sink compound had been forgotten. Since then, I run a nifty utility called Notebook Hardware Control, which puts a little icon with CPU temperature in the taskbar.

With Win 7, it wouldn't start at boot time. I've just solved the problem: I turned off User Account Control and all is well. UAC isn't actually about User Accounts, as far as I can see: it's about stopping software from working.

So if you have problems with stuff not running, try turning off UAC.

[Loose rivets]

I've just had a look at User Accounts...for several minutes, but can't find how to simply turn it off!

[Loose rivets]

Control Panel/User Accounts/Turn User Account Control On or Off?

Wouldn't you think it would be that easy?


I'm the only user and Administrator. W7 RC Build 7100


I had another look in the light of day, just in case the wine had befuddled me more than usual last night. Again, I entered every sub menu.

Absolutely no offer for me to turn of...well, anything really.

Ah! When altering the level at which I am warned of soft arriving etc., I noticed that it was not at default. I went to put it back to that setting and it tells me that I must reboot to Turn my Admin controls ON.

That could be a clue. :} But, to my certain knowledge, I have never moved this slider from the default. In fact, when W7 arrived, it worked well straight out of the wire.

But, shouldn't it offer to turn it on - if resetting it gives a menu to turn it off?

[Simonta]

Folks, I'm sorry but threads like this really rag my goat...from the NCH FAQs...


How do I can start NHC on restricted user account (accounts without administrator rights)?
To run NHC on restricted user accounts you need the professional version of Notebook Hardware Control


To get around this, you are proposing turning off a very useful security feature which Microsoft put into Windows in attempt to deal with the biggest security flaw in Windows - users using admin accounts for every day usage. What you're saying is effectively "I don't like all this stuff trying to protect me, let me run whatever I want to, regardless of what it does to my system". This leads to people like me wasting untold hours trying to help people out of a hole they dug for themselves.

When you are connected to the internet (nothing to do with the browser) as an administrator with UAC turned off, every server and website you visit (whether via a browser, or some code known or unknown running on your PC) must be trusted. Do you want to take that risk? It's not just about visiting only websites and servers you know because then you trust the entire IT team of all of those servers and sites to have secured their end properly so no-one can inject malicious code and so on.

The correct approach to this is to enable the true admin account (it's disabled by default in Windows 7) and take your everyday account out of the local admins group (it shoudn't be there anyway). Use the admin account only when needed, for example when installing software you trust which needs admin rights. You don't have to log on/off to do this - you can use "run as".

It takes a little discipline but if you can't be bothered to do this, then please don't moan when things don't work and yor system falls over. if you do the right things, Windows is actually very secure (ignore the b*s* from Linux and Mac folks - the main reason they suffer less is because in general, they do not have this problem as they do not, by default, run as "root" which is the equivalent of admin. Turn root access on and all bets are off. Any code you run, known or unknown, can do whatever it likes to your system with or without your knowledge.

Finally, please don't bleat about Microsoft. They have a tough corner to fight. Prior to Windows NT, there was no notion of admin/non admin and a lot of developers got into the habit of doing whatever they want without regard to security. Microsoft could solve this problem in one go but would wipe out a huge amount of the badly written software out there. This is an industry problem, not a Microsoft one. You can get very close to secure Windows by the advice contained herein. With a little more effort, primarily about turning off undeed services and securing IE, you can get all the way there. By doing this, I've managed to collect only one piece of crapware in the last 7 years and yes, it was my fault, desperate to get a piece of software working - of dubious origin - and ran it as an admin. Only format c: got rid of the ensuing cr*p.

Cheers

</Flame Off>

[Loose rivets]

Oooo...Is it clear to pop one's head up yet?


I used find myself saying to some poor beleaguered first officer now and then, when Training Captain Daemonic is blazing at you, just hang on to you seat and listen. Somewhere in there will be a nugget, and you will have gained on the day.

Here's my nugget. ;)



The correct approach to this is to enable the true admin account (it's disabled by default in Windows 7) and take your everyday account out of the local admins group (it shoudn't be there anyway). Use the admin account only when needed, for example when installing software you trust which needs admin rights. You don't have to log on/off to do this - you can use "run as".

[Saab Dastard]

Simonta,

Good to see someone else with the right idea about "least privilege" :ok:

SD

[Keef]

Can I come out yet? Is it safe?

I have some software that I've been using for a while, and I want it to start automatically at boot-up. It does, now that I've turned off UAC. UAC wouldn't let it start. Now, if UAC had a "let this one run" as does (for example) Zone Alarm - then it would be useable. It isn't, so it's disabled. That's a choice I have to make. RealVNC and NHC both run as required.

I have a good firewall in my router, active virus protection, and several other protection utilities in the browser and other places. Like Simonta, I've had one virus in ten years, but that was a brand new one turned loose that very day and unknown to Mr McAfee (it was that long ago, that I was still using McAfee). I've had both laptop and desktop rendered unuseable by "features" in MS software several times rather more recently.

I had both machines offline for several days earlier in the year because I deleted a "Homegroup", not realising that Windows would lock down both machines as soon as I did so. I also had Windows Mobile Device Center (sic) wipe the contacts list off my phone with nary a warning. Each of those cost me around two days' work to recover. The virus took ten minutes to remove.

That's the risk you take, using computers. I check my two every month or so with Gibson's "Shields Up" and they both score 100% every time.

[daved123]

Simonta,
Your 'run as' remark addressed a niggle I had with some programs.
I try to enforce security and work with a limited user account for daily ops but was having to log out then log in as admin in order to update some security applications. Then log out and back in as 'daily user', all together now, ahhh, all those passwords to type......
Just for once giggle was my friend and pointed me to the support.microsoft site and I used the the 'run as' recommendations, which worked for me, even on a desktop shortcut.
Thanks,
DaveD

[Simonta]

Keef, sorry to flame you - I was a little terse wasn't I?

Check out this link for a way to get restricted programs to launch at startup without the UAC prompt:

Run UAC restricted programs without the UAC prompt | Microsoft Windows | TechRepublic.com (http://blogs.techrepublic.com.com/window-on-windows/?p=730)

Daved123, glad it helped.

Anyone with Vista or Win7, if you want to find something like user account control, just click the Start button and type it into the search window. Once you get used to it, it's heaps better than searchinh through menus and control panel.

Cheers all

[mustpost]

Yeah, good advice all round, first app to flag it up for me was Sp****y. Then went and checked UAC and all was well. It's the best OS yet from them since, oh, well Windaz Too Thoosand..