CONTINENTAL VOTES IN ALPA

[SKYDRIFTER]

The Continental pilots voted their approval of the merger with ALPA. The new contract talks should be interesting.

[ironbutt57]

Hey look at this...scabs for life? Guess not! so now all you big union enthusiasts can bag your tough alpo talk next time an airline hires replacements...

[Rogaine addict]

Just curious, what percentage of the CO and CoEx pilots are scabs? Maybe they were part of the 39% that voted against the ALPA merger. I would suggest we consult our scablist and continue to deny the jumpseat to scabs.

[dc8ray]

So with ALPA forgiving the scab Continenial pilots, where does that leave the rest of the scabs?

Is it time to do away with the list and let it go????? Where is the line???? Is one group of scabs ok and another not????? Does my head hurt just thinking about it?????? What's the deal???????

Ouch, dc

[ironbutt57]

I would hazard a guess that about the top 20% are scabs....so even if they're denied the "opportunity" to join, they'll still reap the "rewards" of any pay/benefit packages associated with future collective bargaining agreement signed on the property....the message has been sent...the threat of being branded a scab for life has been lifted...future strikers beware..old Frankie must be laughing..hear he's making a comeback..mmmmmmm

[SKYDRIFTER]

FRANKIE -

Coming back? Not surprised. Any details?

[Airbubba]

>>I would hazard a guess that about the top 20% are scabs....so even if they're denied the "opportunity" to join, they'll still reap the "rewards" of any pay/benefit packages associated with future collective bargaining agreement signed on the property...<

ALPA offered amnesty to all the CAL pilots with unfortunate dates of hire as an incentive to vote for reentry to the fold. They are now "former scabs" as they call themselves on the union forums. Wonder if ALPA will order them removed from the infamous "Jumpseat Protection List"?

Sometimes crime does pay...

[ironbutt57]

So airbubba...what do you think...is the scab a non-entity in america..i passed up a job OFFER (after interview and sim eval) with CO in 1984 on a principle...so who wins...looks like Frank to me.

[Qwntm]

Remember, most of the guys at Continental Express have less than 3-4 years seniority, (like 90%) so Express is definitely not a "scab" airline. As a matter of fact, pilot unity at express is very strong.

Continental is still having some friction, but it's mostly from a very small, very vocal minority that has nothing to lose...i.e. scabs...

The majority of Continental pilots are very strong Union supporters as well, so just because you hear "Continental" don't assume anything, but do check the list, you don't want one of the few bad fish jumping with you...stinks up the place something awful!!! (Hard to make a nice landing under those conditions...)

[Airbubba]

Continental pilots went on strike in 1983 following a walkout by mechanics. Frank Lorenzo attempted to void the labor contracts using bankruptcy laws. Replacement pilots were hired in droves and ALPA quietly ended the strike a couple of years later.

Here's one brief account:

http://www.tsha.utexas.edu/handbook/online/articles/print/TT/ept1.html


The pro-ALPA pilots at Continental have a web page at:

http://www.truth-squad.org/main.htm


[This message has been edited by Airbubba (edited 14 April 2001).]

[This message has been edited by PPRuNe Towers (edited 15 April 2001).]

[SKYDRIFTER]

FOR WHAT IT'S WORTH -

"Scabs" started the present union and pushed it into ALPA when it became clear what they'd done to themselves. As paradoxical as it is, that is the history. A former New York Air type was pushing ALPA to the max.

The internal resistance to the ALPA vote came partially from the former ALPA types fearing ALPA's claim on prior union fines.

The major resistance came from those in fear of the ALPA merger policy which has quite a control mechanism that allowes ALPA National to sway merger results.

[411A]

Airbubba is quite right about Continental pilots going out with mechanics. Something I have never understood is why ALPA or ANY other pilot union has ANY respect for a mechanic (or hostie, ground service, etc) when these same folks have NO respect for flight crews. Any comments?

[SKYDRIFTER]

SOMETHING LEFT OUT -

The "utexas" web page, above, left out the purchase of Frontier - another interesting aspect of Lorenzo's empire worth mentioning.

It is also worth noting that Hollis Harris left CAL in disgrace (in theory), only to become the Air Canada CEO, when any other American couldn't get a janitor's job in Canada - really strange.

[Ignition Override]

411A- Excellent question! It must be a complex answer, depending on which airline situation. It must have something to do with mutual defense, and the exact timing and calculated repercussions from the company.

As for the recent AMFA talks at NWA, I'm still scratching my head. AMFA is not in the AFL-CIO (general US union group), and apparently had very little or no funds ("war chest") set aside to help its members weather a strike, and knew that Bush would start a PEB process. Their national AMFA leaders seem to have understood neither the terrain nor enemy, as was the case with Varus and his three Roman legions marching in narrow columns (too little space for "testudo" shield walls) in the German forest (9 AD: [Arminius] Hermann's tribes were waiting-18,000+ wiped out in three days), along with Napoleon at Waterloo, very complacent.

Pardon the overdramatic comparisons.

[Airbubba]

>>It is also worth noting that Hollis Harris left CAL in disgrace (in theory), only to become the Air Canada CEO, when any other American couldn't get a janitor's job in Canada - really strange.<<

Don't think leaving Continental was much of a disgrace in those days - ten CEO's in ten years before Gordon Bethune got CAL back on the road to victory. And doesn't American have a Canadian at the helm these days (whose brother was CFO of CP as I recall)?