Eurofighter flights - wasted?

[Jackonicko]

I read with great interest that Sir Peter Squire 'enjoyed' his jolly in DA4 the other day, and am sure that today's Chief of the Air Staff (like George Robertson, previous CASs, and other irrelevant VIPs) will have gained a favourable impression of an aircraft which will not enter service until after their tenures. With so few Eurofighters (especially twin-stickers) available, and with so little flying time available to the customer, can anyone enlighten me as to why is it being wasted in this way? I don't know exactly how many VIP trips have been flown (let's call it six), but surely there'd have been a more cost-effective use for them? Famil for the people fine-tuning the requirements for Batch 2, or for formulating doctrine? Extra flying for the FJTS EF project pilot? Trips for the designate COs of the first units? Jollies for those likely to be posted to the Typhoon OEU/OCU? Random jollies for young Jag/Harrier/F3 pilots to spread a bit of enthusiasm for the jet around the RAF? Even making more airshow appearances (or flying Jeremy Clarkson, or Delia Smith, or whoever) to show the long-suffering tax-payer what they are paying for?

But wasting such flights on elderly ex-Harrier pilots? I just don't see the gain......

Or perhaps its a reward for the way in which he's tackled the problems of retention and morale..........

[fobotcso]

Oh you are a tease, Jacko! Let's just say that these flights give credibility to influence. And if you think that an "elderly ex-Harrier pilot" can't cut the mustard you really do need to get out and meet more people! Elderly indeed; you wait! :)

Anyway, the flying time would have been productive in the pre-production data gathering program. I'll bet there are many times when the ac flies with the second seat empty. So this one was probably more productive than normal. You're just jealous, like me!

[Muff Coupling]

Good point Jacko..Will the Typhoon (or Eurofighter if you prefer)ever get into service!? Who knows, another couple of software gliches and JSF might arrive at Coningsby first!

The famil for CAS is probably a marketing ploy for Waste of Space, to prove the technology can be handled by the over fifties.

Heard a rumour, (funny thing that), that El Presidente has "directed" the Treasury hoods and the Defence Staff to ensure Typhoon gets " priority, along with full and complete" funding (even at the expense of the other 2 services equipment budgets / programmes) to avoid further "red faces" with our Euro-partners!

[BEagle]

Bo££ocks to the lot of you! Personally I'm v. impressed that the boss of bosses was able to fit this flight into his busy schedule. I like working for a 'company' whose 'CEO' had himself a blast trying out our latest jet - and it only goes to show that you can never take the fighter pilot spirit away from a real fighter pilot.

I'll also bet that it took hours for him to stop grinning afterwards!

In a similar vein, I saw the smile on the face of Sir John Allison at Shuttleworth this year after he received spontaneous applause for a perfect landing in a Hurricane. His reaction? To pat the aircraft on the nose implying that it wasn't just down to him! Always was and always will be a true fighter pilot - still flying fighters even in retirement!!

We are very lucky that our most senior officers manage to find the time to fly our aeroplanes - contrast that to working for some dull airline whose bosses are unknown to their employees - and who're mainly 'bottom line' focused having never held a control column in their lives!

Good show, Sir - and I hope you enjoyed every minute!!

[ 09 January 2002: Message edited by: BEagle ]</p>

[fobotcso]

Oi Beags, we're on the same page of the hymn sheet here! "Bollocks to the lot of you"; indeed!

When Jacko gets to 57/58 I wonder what he'll feel about being called "elderly".

My guess is that Squires will have got more out of that trip (and put more into it) than most JPs.

[teeteringhead]

BEags,
From your reference to the "CEO",are you just ever so possibly saying that it's better than working for a "limited company"??

Seriously - big tick VG for the Chief to show he can still do it - probably better than a lot of us.

[Jackonicko]

You miss my point. Yes it's great that he'd want to, and yes it's great that he enjoyed it. A great reward to him personally, and a nice perk for the CAS. But was it a sensible use of resources?

PS: Anyone over 38 is elderly, and that includes me!

[ 09 January 2002: Message edited by: Jackonicko ]</p>

[fobotcso]

Jacko. when you're in a hole stop digging! No we didn't miss your point, we answered it; credibility/influence, I'll spell it out if you want me to.

Adult life extends from 20 to 100. At 60 you're only half-way through your adult life. If you're as old as you feel, and you feel elderly because you're over 38, then I guess you're elderly, Jacko.

That explains a lot about what you write.

[Kiting for Boys]

"well done, well done, well done" as they said in the Brownies

[Gainesy]

Jacko Quote:"Even making more airshow appearances (or flying Jeremy Clarkson, or Delia Smith, or whoever) to show the long-suffering tax-payer what they are paying for?"
Not on the short list then mate? <img src="rolleyes.gif" border="0">

[solotk]

Personally, I always liked the comment of one former CAS being interviwed on newsnight, during the "Name the EuroFighter" farce, with us being worried that we might offend the boxheads whatever we called it

Fangy Newsnight Bod: "Well it's not very efficent is it, all this time and still no name, is too much consideration being given to our partners sensibilities?"

Ex-CAS: "I think we should call it Spitfire II and have done with it" -lol

Well said Sir

Tony

[RubiC Cube]

If CAS can't play with his own train set, who can?

Jacko, remember that you are only as young as the woman you feel!

[BEagle]

They 'wind' theme of Tornado was perhaps continued over to the TypHoon with some difficulty - most 'wind' names having been used by RAF ac of WW2. I guess that the Tchermans wouldn't have been too happy with 'Hurricane' or 'Tempest' - and 'Cyclone' might have been OK except that the T-bird would perhaps have been 'Cyclone B' - or 'Zyklon B' auf Deutsch....probably not a good idea??

Incidentally, why is the RAF still referring to it as the EF, not the TypHoon?

[AirfixPilot]

Top stuff!! :)

[Hong Kong Fuey]

We're referring to it as EF cos only the export ones are officially called Typhoon. That said, the name will be (and is being) quickly absorbed into the common vernacular.

[BEagle]

...and which export ones would those be then?

[Zoom]

BEagle
The reason why Allison got the 'spontaneous applause for a perfect landing in a Hurricane' was probably for landing it all, rather than planting it upside down in a potato field as he did an ME 109 a couple of years back. And the reason why he patted it on the nose was relief at landing it at all, rather than planting... etc. Still, at least he did take all of the blame for the ME 109 prang - and, obviously, all the credit for the Hurricane landing. Miaow, what's wrong with me today?

[Blue Stuff]

Can I have a go now? <img src="cool.gif" border="0">

[Ex F111]

When I get to be Chief, I will also fly it.

[Reheat On]

I hear that when the Hoonmobile enters the hangar, it will be so efficient and reliable that the RAF will be able to reduce to just aircrew, ATC and the essential aircarft support team.....

*sigh* snaps out of dream

Surely the waste, JN, is that here is an aircraft costing GBP-gadzillions which will be pretty much unuseable in the FDOTs [Future Distant Operational Theatres] under the Contractorisation Of Conflict plans. All the discussions of range, endurance and payload have all been held elsewhere on this forum.

Have you seen the fortune they are spending emergency upgrading the Tanker avionics .<a href="http://defence-data.com/current/page13294.htm" target="_blank">RAF air tankers get new communications systems</a> - does this mean one ponders, that they are angling to delay FTSA, which might at least be the essential logistic line for TuffHoon, on the basis that the present fleet remains battle capable!

Mark one's words - after the Afghan Happy Hour finishes, the Treasury will be around to collect the IOUs.

edited for url

[ 19 January 2002: Message edited by: Reheat On ]</p>

[BEagle]

This news about Tactical Data Links for some RAF tankers is welcome indeed. But all tankers were originally supposed to be fitted with a very comprehensive Link 16 system; this was forever pushed to the right in funding terms and was eventually not proceded with, much to the chagrin of those involved in the project. However, following lessons leant in Kosovo, an Urgent Statement of User Requirement led to Link 16 systems being designed by AeI, fitted and tested in a very short timescale and JTIDS-tankers were operational both in the Balkan and Gulf AORs. The system was originally supposed to be fitted for 12 months, regrettably it relied upon 'borrowed' equipment and although it had proved operationally effective, it was removed earlier than anticipated when the original owners needed their kit back. However, the wiring was left in situ and the kit was refitted to certain aircraft recently for an operational requirement in anticipation of this new contract to fit improved Link 16 to certain aircraft only. It has a much improved operator keyboard and an improved display; more importantly it is being fitted as a proper SEM rather than as a temporary piece of kit under a UOR.

[Art Field]

How frustrating it is to see that only now, nine years after we were looking at the final preparations for installation of JTIDS in Tankers that the kit is going in permanently, albeit in a limited number of aircraft. Do we always have to have some form of conflict to gain progress. I wonder if crews are still strapping watches to their ears to mark the passage of time as in the Gulf?. It took the South Atlantic to get IN for the Victors so long as you did not mind clambering over a large box on the floor.