Windows 7 snagging thread. [Archive]

Sprogget

8th Sep 2009, 09:49

Well, I got my hot little hands on the final retail version of Windows 7 Ultimate & built it on Saturday, so having had every beta build from 6596 to 7729, here's a couple of observations.

It's actually slightly slower than any of the beta's that I've had, discernibly so. My guess is that Ms have bloated it out with features & that eats into the performance. I've turned off a bunch of features & services I don't require, but then again, I did that with the betas' so build for build, a slight decrease in performance.

My media centre extender (Linksys dma2100) finally works as advertised - prior versions would not recognise the music library, so hurrah for that.

There is an irritation with Windows consistently querying whether software installed correctly or not - a dialog pops up around 1 in 2 times when I add an application, but a minor irritation at worst.

I'm back on the update trail, so far it's been on my box for four days & has wanted to add something like fifteen updates just for the os alone, although the driver updates have been welcome & as with previous versions of 7, nearly every driver was installed on first use.

I like it, we're gonna be friends, but as ever, not quite the finished article.

arcniz

11th Sep 2009, 07:22

Microsoft's entire business franchise seems to rely on never getting it all right all at once. Keeps folks coming back for more.

Sprogget

11th Sep 2009, 07:59

Squawk7777

11th Sep 2009, 08:07

Do you know if W7 can use 4GB RAM? I still don't understand why some manufacturers advertise their "top-end" machines with Vista and 4GB ... :confused:

Sprogget

11th Sep 2009, 08:34

Yes, on 32 & 64 bit installs, but as ever, you will likely see 3 to 3.5gb due to the inherent limitations of 32bit machines completely independent of the operating system.

This is an ok-ish explanation of memory limitations in 32bit systems.

The 4GB Windows Memory Limit: What does it really mean? - Brian Madden - BrianMadden.com (http://www.brianmadden.com/blogs/brianmadden/archive/2004/02/19/the-4gb-windows-memory-limit-what-does-it-really-mean.aspx)

planecrazy.eu

14th Sep 2009, 11:15

I am installing W7 tonight after work, have W7 Business given to me to load on my IBM machine, been told XP drivers are the ones to use as some vista ones have issues with W7, not sure how true that is.

Main thing i want to know:

- Am i going to make a hugh mistake going from XP to W7?

Dont play games, but i do edit my photos (CS4) and ProE and Autodesk, as well as come CFD and FEA software get used daily, so will i see a slow down or no change?

Thanks

Sprogget

14th Sep 2009, 12:15

Provided your hardware meets the minimum requirements, I don't see why not. If however, your hardware just about meets the minimum requirements, it won't run as fast as xp.

I wouldn't worry about drivers - by the time it's installed, it will have found just about every driver you need & installed them before you get to click away at anything.

Guest 112233

14th Sep 2009, 14:45

Call me a bit of a bottom dweller if you like, but I think this tread is going to gain momentum - W7 seems to have the potential of being a first class operatiing system given time. Its the poor idealists; who collect the early real life flack once new operating systems are unleashed into the expectant gaze of the real world.

I can imagine that the final release will be a bit slower in some ways; when compared to the pre releaase candidates. Think of security and memory handling at code level etc.

I will come clean, having had the experence of having taken the brunt of commercial damage caused by a major software upgrade; not Windows by the way, I'm like many of the "eternaly cautious" out here, watching the progress of the brave in implimenting Win 7 - I'm an XP and Ubuntu troll who will have to bite the bullet re W7 in the near future.

Without trawling through the forums of the mags, the shared postings of hitches and their fixes, are useful for the great silent masses who eyeball here. Its the long term niggles that really do effect attitudes to consumer operating systems. Think of Visa for example. PS you are right about online help - but its saves disk space.

CAT III

Sprogget

14th Sep 2009, 14:58

Yes, it may have been a helpful thing to have included network & internet connection problems on the os itself.:)

I am contemplating whether or not to build 7 on the box I use at work all day, every day. I have done this before with one or other of the beta builds & run into a few problems & as a result, I'm back on xp. The old adage if it ain't broke probably applies to windows 7 - if you have a working machine that is important to you, why change? My trouble is I can't leave it alone, I always want to see what's around the next corner & on the whole, that attitude hasn't burnt my fingers too badly & it helps one to learn a trick or two along the way.

I've had my full version of 7 on for a week now & it's pretty flawless still. I use media centre, firefox, livemail, excel, word, flash player, adobe reader, all the mainstream stuff & they all work just fine, as does a small home network. It is still update heavy, running at four or five a day so far, although nothing over the weekend - but I'm trying to find broken stuff in it & failing.

Mr Grumps

18th Sep 2009, 20:26

I'm running a rc version of W7(evaluation copy build 7100) and very pleased with it on my laptop except for one thing. It will not recognise or rather connect to any network after waking up from sleep mode. It won't even authorise my vodafone mobile broadband dongle. It requires a restart to connect which it then does perfectly happily. Everything worked OK when I was using XP.

Loose rivets

18th Sep 2009, 21:13

Hows-about Hibernate?

Simonta

18th Sep 2009, 22:37

hurn

18th Sep 2009, 23:00

One poorly thought through element is the help & support function. In previous versions of windows, it was held on the machine. Now it's online.

When my box dropped the internet connection unexpectedly the other day, I clicked on help and....er...You'll find Microsofts' business model will be heading towards having more and more content based online.

Eventually I expect them to introduce an online subscription service for Windows or whatever they call their operating system at the time.

Personally I find Win7 ok, but still haven't found a compelling reason to upgrade from XP x64 as yet.

Sprogget

19th Sep 2009, 01:29

Simonta,

Yes I have run the expeience test & it comes out at 4.6 as it has from day one with the betas from 6956 or was it 6596, I forget.

I'm not complaining, I like 7 a great deal, particularly more than Vista & I liked Vista when that arrived, I suppose because I've built my machines around the spec, so they've always been up to the job.

The 4.6 score always highlights my 8500gt gpu as the weak link, but I don't use the box for games, so I'm happy enough with the score, but it is noticeably slower than the six or seven beta builds that I pinched off the net (sorry MS, couldn't help myself).

I only make an observation based on personal experience, but now I have my bought & paid for copy, I wouldn't hesitate from recommending it to anyone considering an upgrade. It is a good operating system,

P.s., it wasn't me who suggested changes at the code level.:ok:

Mike-Bracknell

19th Sep 2009, 23:04

Strange that you find it slower. Microsoft has a very rigorous release process (I've been directly involved with it) and the release candidates were "code complete" some time ago. They most certainly have not bloated it nor added "memory checking at the code level". Have you run the Windows Experience rating or other benchmarks? There are many things that could cause the RTM to run slower than an RC and it might be a fixable problem for you.

I think the blame lies squarely at the 3rd party manufacturers and their software writing skills. It's deplorable that Adobe for instance doesn't have a 64-bit IE8 plug-in available. I've also noticed the Sun JVM give problems with certain installs. I'm now also trying to troubleshoot a video performance slowdown which only manifests itself as minor jerkiness in YouTube videos which is probably their fault too.

cessnapuppy

19th Sep 2009, 23:25

One poorly thought through element is the help & support function. In previous versions of windows, it was held on the machine. Now it's online.
LOL

Poorly thought?? As Microsoft loves to say 'This behavior is by design".
They get to see who uses help (location, time of day)
What they are asking for help on
Browser version and .NET runtime version
(possibly licensing -legal- status)

And of course, a simpler way to update and disseminate the help files....

Sounds like its very well thought out to me!

p.s. If you are using a dual core processor system make sure the 2nd cpu is turned on. It was on on the betas but off on the final (compatibility reasons?)

Sprogget

20th Sep 2009, 09:02

Sounds like its very well thought out to me!

Provided of course that you are not the one suffering a connection problem & experiencing no way to display a help file...:)

I have no idea about switching on the 2nd cpu on my dual core system. Nothing obvious in the bios or control panel for that particular line of thought.

cats_five

20th Sep 2009, 15:40

I've had the RC running happily inside VirtualBox and established that the software I really need works under it. Not really a surprise since mostly it's Office, IE and CS4. Will be ordering it once the academic licences is available in the UK.

At present I have a .open.ac.uk email address so should qualify for a copy for £30. :cool:

Sprogget

25th Sep 2009, 20:09

Got a couple more...

I took a deep breath & built it n my main work box, having put all the data on my infallibly reliable freecom hdd. It all went in ok, as did the apps which are:

MS Office 2003
Quickbooks 2008
Acrobat reader
primo pdf
Avast
Acronis true image
Windows live mail
firefox 3.5
a few other bits and bobs.

Anyway, I do a lot of faxing from excel. In my business, we are still staring wide eyed at this machine that looks a bit like a typewriter and spits out bits of paper written on hundreds of miles away - we're essentially stuck in 1987.

Windows fax console is now updated to windows fax & scan. Previously, I would click print, then choose fax & select a fax number from my handy list of fax numbers stored in outlook.

Now, Windows F&S happily does the same, but sends a blank page. I have to print my page to a pdf & print that to fax, which adds an irritating step to the process - I send about twenty faxes a day, so it does pinch a little.

Also, windows converts any document to a tiff file by default when you fax & you can't preview it in windows - it doesn't recognise the format! Slight disjoin there chaps.

Windows contacts I have found live in different folders between live mail & any other application that uses them. If I add a contact in live mail, it doesn't appear in my fax numbers for example. They live in a folder under users documents, so I do have to duplicate them on occasion.

Still like it though.

Keef

25th Sep 2009, 21:06

I've not sent a fax from my machine since I converted to Win 7, but I did find that Windows Fax & Scan can't see my scanner. Everything else can. It's a pretty conventional USB scanner, running through Twain. But no way will W F&S see it. I can faff around with Paint Shop Pro and printing to the fax, but that shouldn't be needed.

Apart from that, I'm impressed. The only annoying bit is all the stuff I've installed and set up that I'll have to do all over again when the DVDs arrive from Mr MS in a few weeks' time.

Sprogget

25th Sep 2009, 21:14

Keef, could you not do a simple settings & data image & put that on after building? I'm sure that True image allows for that - a bit like a thousand mouse clicks in one go, if you will.

Keef

25th Sep 2009, 22:37

Er ... dunno. I didn't "build" my Win 7, I just installed it off the DVD. It "just worked", once it had downloaded all the extra drivers it needed.

... apart from Windows Fax & Scan. I open Fax & Scan, tell it to scan, and it says "You ain't not got no scanner, Mister." Oh yes I piggin' have!

I can import pictures, so scanning the document first and saving as a JPEG works fine.

But then Fax & Scan can't read my Outlook address book, where all the fax numbers etc live, so it's all a bit of a mess, really. I'd have to open Outlook, find the person, copy and paste the fax number, and ...

I've not got as far as trying to see if it then finds the Faxmodem. Life's too short!

I've got this prehistoric bit of software called WinFax that I bought last century.

Mike-Bracknell

27th Sep 2009, 10:00

Managed fax service :ok:

(cheaper than a dedicated fax line and fax software)

Keef

27th Sep 2009, 11:13

There's no dedicated fax line here. The prehistoric faxmodem is connected to the POTS line. The software is prehistoric WinFax (these days it's owned by Symantec, but I don't think it was, back then). It all works flawlessly, as it has done for many years. It costs 0p a month, and a few pence when I send a fax.

Windows 7 comes with a bit of kit called "Windows Fax and Scan" which is supposed to be able to scan a document and then fax it. It doesn't work. It alone, of all the software connected to the PC, can't see the scanner. It insists, firmly and irrevocably, that there isn't one.

So I scan the document with Paint Shop Pro 5 (far quicker than the latest, very clever but very bloated Paint Shop Pro 12), save the JPEG, and then use WinFax to open and fax the JPEG.

About once or twice a year I need to do that. I'm happy with the process, but disappointed that Microsoft couldn't get Fax and Scan to work. I have "raised a ticket" but they seem uninterested. Status quo ante.

Loose rivets

27th Sep 2009, 16:33

I've mentioned before that I've had problems with faxing. After years of not wanting to send a fax, I threw my son's castoff into the trash. Murphy's law cut in, and everyone and their uncle wanted, nay, insisted, that I fax them. Sony, with 'proof of purchase' requirements, not even allowing me to mail them! You have no idea how hard I argued this point.

I have sent a fax with W7, but it was just chance. I have never been able to repeat the process. Unlike Keef, I can get the scan in, but never build the .jpg into the page I'm sending. Also, unlike Keef, I have not been able to get my WinFax Pro to work reliably. For years. :ugh: Sad, cos the little WinFax that preceded it, worked perfectly.

I need a fax program that will allow me to put pauses in when dialing. Right now, I have to get the soft to dial the phone company, wait while the verbiage is gone through, and then quickly auto-dial on the office phone, Now, I can't even do that, because with W7, the dialing tones are not sent to the sound system or computer speaker. Can't find anything to turn them on.

frostbite

27th Sep 2009, 16:47

The software I used to run accepted commas as a pause instruction.

Multiple commas if required.

Keef

27th Sep 2009, 20:21

The WinFax I use has comma=pause (I forget how long, cos I don't need it). Multiple commas does the obvious.

Sprogget

27th Sep 2009, 21:43

Another possible prob; I have tried several times today to burn a disc image using windows burn image & it has read the file as corrupt. It's done this with three different types of the same kind, but not the same file.

I'm going to tey it on xp tomorrow & see how I go, but this is holding up a big-ish project. Grrr.

Keef

28th Sep 2009, 00:03

I've burned several CDs and DVDs using Win7, both .iso straight to DVD, and "conventional". No problems.

I treated the DVDRW drive as if it were another hard drive - copied stuff to it, then when done clicked "Burn". It worked!

Loose rivets

28th Sep 2009, 00:44

Thanks Keef. When I was writing the question, I had a terrible feeling of deja vous. The answer gave the same feeling. Oh, dear...one will soon have to be put down.

:ugh: <<< this helps.

Mike-Bracknell

28th Sep 2009, 00:54

Deja vu = already seen
Deja vous = already you

;)

Mike-Bracknell

28th Sep 2009, 00:57

...incidentally, why would you want to burn a CD nowadays? I very rarely burn CDs or DVDs now (the only reason I see to do it these days is to install an OS), as things like Daemon-Tools and USB hard drives make CDs/DVDs fairly much redundant.

(it's a shame Microsoft didn't include a native ISO mounter in W7)

Basil

28th Sep 2009, 01:29

Two things:
I'm reluctant to have a phone (fax) line connected directly to my PC in case of inadvertent (or malware engendered) dialling.
I still burn DVDs for distribution or additional (belt & braces) backup.

Mr Grumps

3rd Oct 2009, 07:22