Amsterdam Airlines off taxitrack at EHBK

[Optimus-Prime]

This afternoon an Amsterdam Airlines A320 PH-AAY (sn 527), scheduled for a flight from Maastricht-Aachen (EHBK) to Ankara Esenboga (LTAC), ended up next to the taxiway while taxiing out to RWY 21, reporting "we lost the nosewheel steering".

http://img34.imageshack.us/img34/2078/vliegtuig20090802.jpg

[tigger2k8]

did they lose it or was the bypass pin still installed?

edit: dont see any evidence of the red streamer, thx for the explaination below, not familur with that airport :ok:

[Navigator33]

Bypass pin still installed is highly unlikely since pulling out of the stand and on to the taxiway at ehbk requires some turning.

[bereboot]

taxiing being the most under-estimated part of the flight !:oh:

[Lon More]

Looks like he was still on the apron

[Avman]

Seems to be just past W3.
Disregard the above, it's actually on the turn at W1 (opposite the Cargo West apron). In another photo the taxiway looks very wet.

[babemagnet]

http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/8377/phaay.jpghttp://img156.imageshack.us/i/phaay.jpg/better pictures here:

MST-Aviation.nl - Euregional Aviation Portal (http://www.mst-aviation.nl/portal/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=14506)

It was told here on the news they lost the nosewheel steering! not a pilot error.

[vapilot2004]

BCSU fault is the likely cause.

[RoyHudd]

That'll be BSCU then.

[vapilot2004]

Brake and Steering Control Unit (computer). :ok:

[Fatfish]

Computers,computers! Once Flying real aircraft was so much easier than flying computers these days. :confused:

[4HolerPoler]

I lost braking as a new 320 captain years ago. Real scary. Pedals went to the floor. Had a switched-on F/O - he understood & jumped on his brakes. Nothing! IAC with the FCOM I had him turn the Nose-Wheel Steering & Brake switch (can't remember it's exact nomenclature) off - had my feet flat on the brakes (as we were not far from hitting an aircraft) and came to a sudden halt.

Got home and called an old skipper friend of mine and told him my scary story - he said "Oh yes, happened a number of times to me - you just recycle the BSCU switch."

This is a problem Airbus has been aware of for well over 12 years - can't believe that they haven't resolved it and regretful that it's still causing incidents like this - no pilot in his right mind would taxi into the rough - the aircraft let these guys down.

[Jetjock330]

In accordance with the FCOM 3, supplementary techniques, the BSCU reset should only be done with the park brake set, as the nose wheel makes a full deflection to the stop during the reset. If this reset is done during taxi, you may well find yourself in the grass. The switch may be turned off, and alternate braking relied on without steering.

If this reset was done because of a nose wheel steering problem, it is "mandatory", according to the same chapter of FCOM 3, to be entered into the tech log and the aircraft returned to the stand.

I have no idea what happened in this case.

[Airbusguy320]

But if you loose your normal braking system the procedure in the FCOM requests you to put the A/SKID en N/W STEERING OFF.

[45989]

Fatfish I hear you! The Fcom is about as useful as tits on a bull in circumstances like this. One can always read it after to find the gotcha that was'nt on the ECAM

[sanddude]

Jet Jock 330, check your memory items:ok:

[Jippie]

Interesting the BSCU stories.
Is there any risk that the BSCU fails during takeoff?
Loosing your steering and braking while making a high speed RTO?

[Dani]

This is a problem Airbus has been aware of for well over 12 years - can't believe that they haven't resolved it and regretful that it's still causing incidents like this

Also from a moderator I would expect that he admits that the facts are only known when we have an official report at hand.

And yes, it can happen. Although I have never experienced it. FCOM has a by-heart-item in place, that says "no brakes: pull the bypass switch". I guess your airline also has this item. It's only one of four in total, so it would be easy to know it.

Loss of brakes and/or stearing is possible on every aircraft. I wouldn't know of any where it's not. Just because there is an electronical controller for the system doesn't mean it's more dangerous.

Dani

[dkz]

Actually the new 320 have a different bscu unit, from msn 2900 all had the new unit in my previous company.

[Dani]

But the by-heart item remains valid.

[Avman]

Did some taxy runs this morning, then parked with no further activity around it. AOG since Sunday. That must hurt.

[babemagnet]

overheard some cabin crew talking about Amsterdam Airlines in the bus at AMS the other day complaining about that the A320 they have are very old, managment is bad and maintanance is poor. So stupid when people start complaining with more people around them.

[Avman]

The DC-3 I flew in in Canada last year was "very old". Amsterdam Airlines's A320s are 16 and 13 years old respectively. The older one (PH-AAX) started life with Dragonair in '93 and was with Mexicana before joining Amsterdam A/L. The other (PH-AAY), which had the problem at MST, started with SAETA in 1996 and was last with America West / US Airways.

[Harry Burns]

But the 16 year old A320 might have 40 000 hrs or cycles respectivly. The DC-3 might not have that much.

[Avman]

But the 16 year old A320 might have 40 000 hrs or cycles respectivly. The DC-3 might not have that much.

:ok: Very true, of course.

[wings1011]

The rumour says that they found the main gears serviced much to high on the c-check before delivery to amsterdam airlines, this with an faulty gnd/flt sensor caused the aircraft while turning on gnd to become "airborne" and cut out the nosewheel steering.
Seems like a probable cause to me.
I guess the official report will tell more


Regards

Wings 1011

[Robert Campbell]

I flew Dc-3s with over 70,000hrs on them. They were well maintained, and we had few problems except that the company always tried to overload us.

There were clues that we looked for on walkaround after the freight was loaded. We looked at the main gear struts. they said a lot about gross weight.

If we couldn't get a fist between the tailwheel and the fuselage, we knew we were too heavy aft, if not overweight. And, finally, on takeoff, if the tail didn't lift by 60 kts., we aborted.

Flying an aft loaded DC-3 for several hours is no fun. It can't be trimmed. It's a constant fight to stay within 200 or 300 ft. of assigned altitude, and the landing has to be handled very carefully or the airplane will start hopping until it stalls and rolls unless power is added and a go around initiated for another try.

Most people don't realize that the 3 has a swept wing. She's very docile until she's not.

________

I would think that a crew rated in an A320 might notice that the struts were over inflated, and that that fact might fool the beast into thinking it was airborne. squat switches only work when something is squating on them:ugh:

[SOPS]

70000 hours?!?...and that is just DC3s? Have you ever slept/eaten/done something else other than been airborne in a DC3?

[ZuluKilo66]

SOPS, I think you'll find our friend means that the a/c had done 70k, not him personally.

[SOPS]

Ahhh..I see...its all about how you read the sentence.:ok:

[Dysag]

"You are hereby sentenced to spend the rest of your days behind the locked doors of an airborne DC-3".