View Full Version : Do i need a Proficiency check??

13th Jul 2009, 20:52
My PPL licence has run out which finished on the 27/6/2009 i have not done the hours required as i have been doing my IR and MEP.
Am i right in saying that i have to have a proficiency check so i can be signed off for another two years??

13th Jul 2009, 21:15
Yes, so you need to get to an examiner for the check.

13th Jul 2009, 21:17
ok so it is like a skills test then???

13th Jul 2009, 23:01
Usually yes, a cut-down skills test.

A short nav element (usually to get yourself to the LFA) then skills at the descretion of the examiner.

Usually nothing too taxing. If you've been flying ME/IR then your probably not too out of practice. However, practice is now no longer the issue as you have let the rating lapse it needs renewing rather than revalidating and that can only be done through a LPC.

You could also have revalidated by electing to LPC within the last three months of the original validity period - or by 12/6/1 thus keeping the same expiry date. Even if it transpired that you did meet the 12/6/1 criteria within the period, it would now be too late for you as the ratings page must be signed by an examiner before the expiry of the last period of validity.

But you probably knew that anyway.


14th Jul 2009, 10:29
My PPL licence has run out which finished on the 27/6/2009 Do you mean your licence or your class rating? How can you be going through training without a valid licence? One of the requirements to be on a course of training at an FTO is to have a valid licence!

14th Jul 2009, 17:33
When you do your MEP or IR test can't you get the examiner to sign you off then based on the test. Not sure it applies to an SEP (no PFL) but at least ask before you pay twice for an examiner.

14th Jul 2009, 20:01
IIRC then the MEP test does count as the "hour with" for an SEP. Trying to find the reference for it now.

However, "I'm fairly sure" that to renew your CLASS rating the trip has to be flown in the same class.

(Thinks......SEP would do a TMG, but not the other way around though!?!?!?)

14th Jul 2009, 20:15
The MEP skill test counts as the hour with the instructor as does ANY other JAA skill test.

However the other requirements still need to be met if revalidating by experience. The licence needs to be signed BEFORE the rating expires other wise an LPC is required in an SEP.

Revalidation by flying experience
A SEP (Land) and/or TMG class rating can be revalidated
by flying experience by producing logbook evidence to
an appropriately authorised JAR-FCL Examiner, before
the rating expiry date has passed, of the following flying
experience completed within the 12 months preceding the
rating expiry date.
12 hours of flight time in SEP or TMG aircraft as
appropriate to include;
i. 6 hours as pilot-in-command;
ii. 12 take-offs and landings;
iii. a training flight of at least 1 hour’s duration with
a FI(A) or CRI(A)* who must countersign the
appropriate logbook entry (see full details below).
*The instructor must be authorised in accordance with
JAR-FCL to instruct for the JAR-FCL TMG or SEP(Land)
rating as appropriate. UK QSP only may undertake the
instructional flight with a UK Military instructor. This
training flight may be replaced by any other aeroplane
proficiency check or skill test for an instrument, class or
type rating (as defined by JAR-FCL) with a JAA qualified
Examiner, or by a flight test for the issue/revalidation or
renewal of a UK IMC rating.
• If revalidating by flying experience, and providing
the examiner signs the Certificate of Revalidation
page within the 3 months prior to the rating expiry,
the validity of the revalidated rating will be calculated
from the date of expiry of the preceding rating.
• If the licence contains both SEP (Land) and TMG
ratings, the revalidation by proficiency check
requirements above may be completed in either
class or in the case of revalidation by experience in
either class or a mixture of the classes, and achieve
revalidation of both ratings.
Note: A SEP (Land) class rating cannot be revalidated
or renewed by passing the Skill Test for the initial
issue or renewal of a TMG rating and vice versa

Jumbo Driver
14th Jul 2009, 20:29
IIRC then the MEP test does count as the "hour with" for an SEP. Trying to find the reference for it now.

bose-x is correct ...

The MEP skill test counts as the hour with the instructor as does ANY other JAA skill test.

... and the reference is:

JAR-FCL 1.245(c) Type and class ratings - Validity, revalidation and renewal

which states:

(1) All single-engine piston aeroplane class ratings (land) and all touring motor glider’s ratings – Revalidation. For revalidation of single-pilot single-engine piston aeroplane (land) class ratings and/or touring motor glider class ratings the applicant shall:

(i) within the three months preceding the expiry date of the rating, pass a proficiency check in accordance with Appendix 1 and 3 to JAR-FCL 1.240 or Appendix 1 and 2 to JAR-FCL 1.210 with an authorised examiner in the relevant class; or

(ii) within the 12 months preceding the expiry of the rating complete 12 hours flight time in a single engine piston aeroplane or touring motor glider including:
(A) 6 hours of pilot-in-command time;
(B) 12 take-offs and 12 landings; and
(C) a training flight of at least one hour’s duration with a FI(A) or CRI(A). This flight may be replaced by any other proficiency check or skill test.

(my bold)


14th Jul 2009, 21:47
thanks for the replies I understand that i have to do a Single engine proficiency check and that when i did my IR test it was not possible for the examiner to sign me off as it was not VFR............however if i did my CPL in a single then i assume that the examiner could then sign me off

Thanks alot for the help

15th Jul 2009, 17:27
Nothing to with VFR. It is to do with MEP(land) versus SEP(land).

Whopity has identified that to undertake training at a FTO you should have a valid licence and rating. Worth checking.

For the SEP Renewal Test it is unlikely that you will be required to undertake any nav as you are currently flying, as you say, on the Multi-engine/IR course. No point to it, the Nav is the bit on which the examiner has discretion.