Biggin Hill Airshow - or not -28th June 2009

[Tempsford]

3 1/2 hours after leaving home (left at 09:30 to be there in good time), close to saying forget it and come home, I arrived at Biggin Hill Airshow today. Had pre-paid taickets with 'A' Car Park Pass. Never saw a sign for 'A' Car Park and was told 'look just park there mate'. #3 Son had to buy a ticket. Hundreds of people coming in at this particular gate - 3 people selling tickets- 1 with a Credit Card Machine. Absolute mayhem!
Made our way to the display line - absolutely chock a block. Nowhere to stand let alone sit.
Then was told that the gates had shut - probably leaving a loy of very hacked off people outside.
Then it got even better, we already knew that the B17 was u/s, but we were then informed so was the Lacaster and surprise surprise, the Vulcan. Watch the mini migration home when some folks heard that the Vulcan was a no show. And yes, I do know that aerplanes go u/s.
Was there a positive at all today? Yes, one. The Virgin B747 in formation with the Arrows, that was it. Well done to the folk involved with that.
Over 30 years of airshows, been to Biggin many times before. By far the worst air show I have ever been to and probably won't bother with Biggin again, ever!

Annoyed? Too damned right I am!

[kit344]

I also went to Biggin Hill today to see the Vulcan. I checked the official website, but I did not really want to pay £21 for each adult, as there were no concessions for OAPs. An enterprising local farmer was only charging £6 per car for a field with a good view of the display, so I parked there instead.

No Vulcan to be seen on Sunday, and LBC 97.3 and 1152 did not seem to mention it, although they were supposed to be the official air display radio channel according to local signs.

Oh well, I still hope to see the Vulcan in the air before the end of the year.

Keith.

[One9iner]

I agree there was a major lack of organisation and leadership regarding the parking. I had also pre-booked tickets and had an "A" parking badge, which served no purpose. Arriving to within 3 miles of the airfield by 11:15, to then not get to the display viewing area until 12:45 is not acceptable. The shambles trying to get out was worse and I found the experience offensive! To have that many people & cars, and have absolutely no system to gradually filter traffic out section by section was just the poorest piece of planning I have seen for a long time, not just at airshows. It showed a 'don't care' attitude from the event organisers of the day for the well being of a lot of paying people, including many, very warm, elderly and young people.

After nearly 2 hours of standing around our car, I approached a Police man & woman to indicate that things were ridiculous. They almost shrugged their shoulders and claimed a second gate was not being allowed to be opened by the airport, and that they and the organisers were "trying to convince the airport authorities to open the gate; other than this there was nothing else they could do."

Adding to our frustration, the event staff kept telling us all gates were open but because all of the local roads were blocked and nobody could reach the M25, there was nothing they could do...

Well guess what, we checked the traffic reports both online, on the mobile, and via the radio. No signs of trouble on the trunk roads to the motorway or back towards London, and once we eventually battled our way through the bottle neck(or at least waited our turn!! UNLIKE SOME!) all the roads were fine once clear of 1 mile from the airfield.

Once inside I had a great day, and well done to all those involved in the positive aspects of the day. But really, next time, SORT THE PARKING OUT!

I suspect a lot of B.Hill 1st timers who experienced the parking problems today will not hurry back next year. Sadly.

[coolbeans]

We received a report that the majority of the early traffic chaos was caused by a copper being knocked off his bike in the village and the main road being closed/heavily restricted by the constabulary.

Then it got even better, we already knew that the B17 was u/s, but we were then informed so was the Lacaster and surprise surprise, the Vulcan. Watch the mini migration home when some folks heard that the Vulcan was a no show. And yes, I do know that aerplanes go u/s.

Well thats not really the organisers fault, twas my first airshow weekend and I thought it was brilliant.

[Skipness One Echo]

Slept in and left the house at 11am, on public transport....
On the bus from East Croydon hit the traffic and the driver wouldn't let us off a stationary bus at a bus stop on a UK road. "I'm not insured mate". Numerous people saw others getting off the bus in front and it was clearly quicker on foot, so two Aussie guys beat me to the lie I was preparing and claimed to be feeling sick and the doors opened, cue a mass exit.

( I was looking at the emergency exit but there were a LOT of Police around and I am sure I would have been charged with escaping from a sweltering stationary bus in accordance with blah blah.... )

Walked a good 45 minutes just in time to see the Virgin / Red Arrows, poor photos but got in OK and had a good day out. The organisation looked a bit iffy though I agree. People were being turned away and I don't know if my bus made it in.

[treadigraph]

It all seemed to work OK on Saturday coming in from Croydon by car via Keston and Downe, where a moving queue started in the village; we got in pretty quickly at about 10:45 and out again with no trouble at all, although we left a bit early at about 4:15pm.

Although crowded, there was room to sit on the grass - it sounds as though there were far more people on Sunday. There seemed to be far too much hospitality stretched along the display line at the southern end but I guess that helps to defray the costs and seems to be a fact of almost every event these days.

I always theorize that families are more likely to go to airshows on Sunday (Saturday = shopping) and go on Saturdays myself. Wonder if the theory is a fact?

Sorry you guys didn't have a good day. :(

[One9iner]

Treadigraph... fair point re: Sundays potentially being busier at these kind of events. I for one, if visiting B.Hill again, will go on the Sat if it remains a 2 day event.

The issue here is event management.

If the organisers sell a quoter of; for arguments sake 100k pre-sold tickets for a 2 day event (where by the pre-booked ticket holders can arrive on any of the 2 days of their choice), and above these ticket holder numbers they expect people to arrive ticketless at the gate willing to pay on either day due to good weather, then these implications require some kind of understanding and pro-active behaviour from those in 'control.'

If you do not monitor the number of pre-booked tickets used on the 1st day, then how do you know how many people with pre-booked tickets, with parking pass A tickets will arrive on day 2? If a pre-booked ticket holder arrived today on day 2 , at 2pm, he/she will have probably been refused entry due to the venue being full... This is wrong.

I can see a lot of business being lost by the way this event was managed. Possibly 3rd party agencies were employed, but something needs to be reviewed before B.H.2010 that's for sure. :=:ugh::ugh::= :ouch:

[Jofm5]

I went yesterday (Sunday) also, the traffic was dire as it always is at the biggin hill for the air show. I arrived around the same time as you one9iner so had to park outside the main carparks to the right and walk in across the whole carpark to get to the display area. I was walking in as the apache and lynx were doing their displays.

On the whole the show was not bad, cant really complain about the planes going tech as thats just the nature of the beasts - a bit disappointing not to see the vulcan tho.

Last time prior that I went was three years ago and there was a much better display, however alot of what was missing is explained by the fact that our military resources are stretched with Iraq and Afgahnistan. There was still alot to see and on the whole it was quite a good show.

I just wish they could do something about the traffic but I cant see what they really can do - perhaps have it pre-pay only so there are no queues at the gate.

[One9iner]

Jofm5. I agree, display wise, weather wise etc...it was a good day, and nobody can direct any blame for aircraft going tech. I also appreciate your point regarding military resources being slightly stretched comparable to previous years.

Traffic wise, all of the authorities clearly need to sit down together, and work out a plan, and stick to it. Having no system in the car park, and the odd bobby standing on a few street corners outside is not a workable solution and is a waste of everyones time.

If I return next year I'm just going to take a bbq incase there is the same mess again, and relax until the traffic has gone!!

The most laughable moment during our attempts to leave, was over hearing a lot of military guys moaning that they had to get back to base for various reasons. After speaking to one guy in the Blue's and Royals, he said he was organising all of his guys with cars to line up and they were going to force their way through in a direction that civilian cars were not yet allowed. They did just that, civilian cars followed, military guys stopped them... and it worked..

This I found unbelievable. The lack of any real system was that bad, our own military were trapped.

Anyway. Rant over. Letter of complaint in the post :mad:

[3rd_ear]

Heh, yesterday I got stuck in the jam on the A224 around 12, turned round and went to the equally-bad A25, gave that up sharpish... and then found a little route in that left me in a 100yd tailback in the village and voila, I was in. Scarpered before the end of the Red Arrows and got away lightly.

Not too many highlights this time, not enough really loud mil jets tbh lol. Still love the Hunter though :)

[Michael Birbeck]

I like Biggin as an airfield (my home base as a PPL for while) and the airshow is usually very good but the road traffic situation is unacceptable.

Strangely it was the traffic that contrived to mercifully spare me the Air Cobra accident a couple of years ago as my nettled partner and I, having got into the show after a hot 3 hour wait in the car, contrived to have a huge row and we immediately left 10 minutes before the tragedy.

I am happy to say I am still with said partner but have not gone back to Biggin for airshows.

[Flypuppy]

Used the in-car GPS to find a route around some tiny little backroads that brought us into the back gate of Biggin and we had hospitality tickets so missed the worst of the parking mayhem.

The airshow itself was very good, but was surprised at how many aircraft went tech. The obvious highlight was the Red Arrows and Virgin -400 (Red 11??) flypast. The less obvious highlight for me was meeting F/L Michelle Goodman DFC - a proper genuine heroine and a smashing person to talk to. That was one the high points of the day (possibly my life!)

If no one beats me to it, I'll try and put a couple of photos up later on today.
http://photos-b.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs118.snc1/5179_115521903823_751618823_2911457_6433505_n.jpg

http://photos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs098.snc1/5179_115522208823_751618823_2911472_7946350_n.jpg

[silverelise]

As a local I remember the uproar in the local paper last year about the appalling traffic arrangements and jams getting in and out, and an undertaking from the organisers (Air Displays International - remember it's not the airfield that organises the show) that the same mistakes would not be repeated. Sounds like the lessons were not learned.

Having said that, I'm quite surprised to hear people turning up at midday or even 2pm. It's an all day event why not be there all day?

[Vino Collapso]

After nearly 2 hours of standing around our car, I approached a Police man & woman to indicate that things were ridiculous. They almost shrugged their shoulders and claimed a second gate was not being allowed to be opened by the airport, and that they and the organisers were "trying to convince the airport authorities to open the gate; other than this there was nothing else they could do."


The airport authority knows nothing of gate restrictions and suggests that you were fed a line to cast the blame elsewhere.

[Jofm5]

silverelise:
Having said that, I'm quite surprised to hear people turning up at midday or even 2pm. It's an all day event why not be there all day?

Thats the whole point silverease, both myself and one9iner were within 5 miles of the aerodrome around 11am - the first of the displays was scheduled for 11:45 - however to do that last 5 miles took roughly 1hr 45 mins so we did not get in until about a quarter to one.

[silverelise]

Thats the whole point silverease, both myself and one9iner were within 5 miles of the aerodrome around 11am - the first of the displays was scheduled for 11:45

That's *my* point :p

It's an all day show. Get there by 9am, get parked, you have two hours to look at the static displays, trade stands, stalls etc. before the flying display starts.

Timing your arrival to get you there with enough time to park up get settled and find a spot is asking for trouble. Which it sounds like you got.

[EGCA]

Somewhat off-topic, but do forgive me. I remember going to the Biggin Hill Airshow as a nineteen year-old in 1965. The highlight then was the arrival of the Lancaster rescued from the Far East.
It took ages to get back to London on the Sunday evening after the show, because the organisers had not arranged enough buses to ferry us back to civilisation, in the days when many more people went by public transport.

Best way to get to a UK airshow? Undoubtedly was by Air Atlantique Dak, sadly now a thing of the past due to Eurotape.

EGCA

[Jofm5]

Getting there three hours before the first display is a bit extreme, There is not enough to look at to last the near three hours for the first display - unless you want to go on the funfair.

It is not unreasonable to think that aiming to arrive 45 minutes before displays commencing would be enough - to park up and take a leisurely stroll round.

But thats neither here nor there - the real point is the traffic problem and lack of redress from the situation last year. Taking 1hr45 to do five miles is poor by anbodys standards.

[PPRuNe Pop]

Is it still Jim Maitland organising it? If so, it is no surprise it's a shambles.

[Leezyjet]

Silverelise (nice car BTW),

Completely agree with getting there early. I got to the back of the queue about 09:00, coming down a series of narrow country roads and through the village of Downe and was inside and parked up by 09:50-10:00 ish.

Wandered around the stalls and the extremely disappointing static display, and all the way down to where the biz jets were parked by the end of 29, and back again, then found a spot right behind the grandstand (by the Merlin) and sat there and watched the display for the rest of the day. It was close to the toilets and the food stands and as we were a little way back from the crowd line, it wasn't too crowded either and meant one could lie back and had the perfect viewing angle to watch the aerial antics.

We hung around for a bit at the end, and left after the Sea Vixen had done it's mini-display when it departed. Walking back to the car, I thought it was going to be a nightmare getting out looking at the queue that was there, so I took my time, set my self up for the return journey and even though I was parked almost by the exit, prepared to go and join the queue getting out. At that point, 2 mini busses full of Royal Marines belted over the grass where I was parked, through a gap in the hedge at the bottom of the field and round the corner, so I followed them. It turned out that there were several lanes at the entrance, but only 1 was open for cars leaving (all had been open to let people in), however some kind person had taken out 2 of the barriers leaving a nice car sized space to get out just to the side of that, so I was out in just over a minute !!. :ok:

It was an ok day out, and the cost compared to a major sporting event for a whole days entertainment was reasonable. The flying display was not the best, with long gaps between displays - not to mention the unfortunate tech a/c that were the high lights of the show. The static display was shocking though. Nothing like the shows I've been to in the past at Finningley/Mildenhall/Fairford etc. Not even 1 USAF a/c there on the ground, and the only one that did come just did 2 low flypasts.

I'd been put off by the price of RIAT the last few years (I normally only go to one big show per year), however in future I will be giving Biggin Hill a miss and spending the extra few ££'s to go to RIAT as it is just so much better in both the flying and static displays.

:)

[expedite08]

Get there early 07:00! You guys all got there far too late! Same regards for any airshow! Thats rule one! get there early!

[Wander00]

Anyone know who was flying the 747 - a former Red by any chance?

Wander00

[Jofm5]

It was virgins chief pilot Geoff Andreasen

[One9iner]

t there early 07:00! You guys all got there far too late! Same regards for any airshow! Thats rule one! get there early!

How many people attended B.Hill on Sunday? >80,000 according to the guy on the tanoy.

How many police, stewards etc... did I see. No more than 30.

How many people attend a top 4 Premiership football game? >50,000 people

How many police and stewards attend these events? 100's if not thousands!!

Granted, Biggin Hill is not Old Trafford or Wembley, and this needs to be understood and appreciated by all, there are no real violence threats, no masses of drunk lads, but there is a logistical similarity, if not a worse logistical situation due to there being no purpose built public transport facility and really; arriving 4+ hours before the show begins is not ideal. Especially, when the static display (as already mentioned) was little more than a couple of hawks, a merlin, tucano, and a few tanks. If aircraft such as the Lanc went tech, why not have back up plans to push the aircraft into a position where a managed barrier can be maintained, but paying punters can get up close?

I repeat my opinion that the air display aircraft, atmosphere and weather made for an overall enjoyable and value for money day, but the one major negative (parking and queue time) was a clear result of the organisation running the operations on the day, doing so very, very badly.

[VeeAny]

I went both days and Sunday was a lot busier than Saturday.

We usually stay in Biggin (missus is from there) so the drive can be easy, Saturday at 1145 was empty, Sunday was horrendous even outside the house. We waited till around 1230 and the roads had quietened a bit.

Whether the security chaps who were directing traffic on the public roads outside have the legal right to is a question that needs asking, perhaps paying the local plod like the football clubs do would be a better idea, it was almost farcical to watch.

There seemed to be more of an emphasis on stopping people getting in who hadn't paid than helping those who had have an enjoyable experience (just an observation, I know its a business).

There does need to be more control over the morons who pitch their windbreaks and tents / towels on the display line but think its ok to block the walkways so no one can move , perhaps there should be a line in the sand kind of thing behind which you should not pitch, there were people just stuck near the army tents who couldn't get past because of some idiots who had set up camp there, (hint for next year if there is no space left go somewhere else or stand up).

The display was good Reds + 747 and the Vulcan were the highlights, but I thought the RAF King air was brilliant and met the pilot in the bar on Saturday nice chap.

Needs more organising I agree, but a good show all round.

We left at 1545 and were back in Cornwall by 2015. No sitting in queues but we did leave when we knew there would be little if any traffic.

[One9iner]

Just incase anyone else feels a brief, yet frank account of what was experienced by the majority needs to be communicated to the shambilisers of the event; here's the only address I can find:

Address

Air Displays International Ltd
Biggin Hill Airport
Kent
TN16 3BN
Registered in England and Wales Number 764085.
Phone Number

(01959) 57 22 77

[Jofm5]

but I thought the RAF King air was brilliant and met the pilot in the bar on Saturday nice chap


I did enjoy the way he chucked that about - at times I was wondering if the guy was rembering what he was flying...

[3rd_ear]

Was that the guy that landed after a ridiculously steep approach angle? Forgive me for imagining that the aircraft was very redolent of a Mosquito, with it's high tail and the way he flew it. Yeh, that was good.

[treadigraph]

Few years ago I saw a pic of a Kenyan Super King Air doing a low pass at the Wilson Airport Airshow in Nairobi with both props feathered, very redolent of Bob Hoover - wonder if the RAF could work that into their routine...! :}

3rd ear, that's a "Que San" approach developed, I believe, by USAF Herc drivers in Vietnam to avoid small arms fire at hot landing strips. At Biggin probably developed to avoid small boys with catapults.

[spamcanner]

Well said expedite08! If you can be bothered to get out of bed
and arrive at a sensible time (we left at 0700, arrived 0820
and drove straight in to the A holders parking zone!) you might
find the experience more enjoyable and not feel the need to moan.

As for the displays, yes I was very disappointed about the Vulcan,
Lanc and Sea Vixen going u/s on the Sunday but that's aviation.
Carolyn Grave gave a superb display, the Reds and 747 was a once
in a lifetime formation and for those who could be bothered to stay
until the end, the Spitfire display was stunning with low, graceful
flypasts and a stunning dive down behind the trees into the Biggin
valley.

Still a good display despite the various problems.

At least those who are tardy in their arrival make it easier for us
sensible folk! There was plenty to see before the flying started
so why make life difficult!:ugh:

[Tempsford]

Yup, let's all be 'sensible' and arrive for 07:00, all 80 000 of us....Geez:ugh:

That is not the answer.

After the Grandstand the area between the taxi way and the runway was full of tightly parked cars with the 'early arrivals' firmly established in their gazebos, fenced off areas, large camper vans etc, etc. No vehicles should be parked anywhere near the dislay line thus allowing more people to see the display than the lucky few who paid the same amount in entrance fee see fit to play on (but they were sensible enough to get up early!).

They eventually had to shut the gates as it was realised that the last cars they had allowed in were now stopped and parked where they were, in a queue as there was no more parking available. I walked past this and then saw other cars coming the other way, looking for somewhere to park. They too were parked where they stopped.

I felt for those who had queued for hours to get in only to be told that the gates were now closed. I am glad that you had a good day, I didn't.

Yes unserviceable aircraft happen, that is part of aviation, but bad organsiation and control is avoidable.

I thought well at least being 'late' in I would be able to hang around til the traffic queues died down. Nope, some of the folk who were in first seemed to want to get out first and the poorly managed traffic control had cars everywhere making it quite dangerous to walk in some areas. Anyway, I shan't post on this again. I have tried to make my point, but that experience has put me off airshows full stop.

[coolbeans]

I dont know what the organisers can really do about it, The roads around the village of biggin hill weren't designed to deal with 80000 peeps turning up all at once, and that accident with the copper in the village didnt help things. As for 3 hour waits - have you ever tried driving into Silverstone or Glastonbury on their event days, 3 hours is par for the course.

Then again I was on the Western side of the field so I dont know what the marshalls were like with respect to parking.

[treadigraph]

that experience has put me off airshows full stop

Nah, don't let that happen, come and join us at the Shoreham Airshow in August. You can get a train across from Seaford, it's a ten minute walk from the station (or there's a bus), walk onto the airfield and enjoy the show (and the excellent terminal bar) - and maybe a few pints at the Red Lion (opposite the bus drop-off/collection point) on the way there and on the way back. Now that's what I call civilised!

And it's a lovely little show as well.

[Memetic]

Late to the discussion, but I am glad we went on Saturday (Although we did miss the Virgin + Reds)

40 mins frpm home to the area, 30 mins slow traffic to the gate, sitting ready for the show - right next to the Chinook - as the show started. Photos are better at the end of the display line in my view.

About an hour from the car park to the M25

Par for the course I would say, no real problem. They do however need to make the PA reach the whle length of the crowd area as LBC stop for news, weather traffic etc.

Sounds like they got swamped on sunday and that was compounded by an accident.

We would go again.

Now, as i got offered some spare tickets for the Air Tatoo I need to find some accomodation - off to start a thread.