Cathay Pacific Cadet Pilot Programme

[G-HALE]

Has anyone heard if they will carry out stage 1 Interview's in Europe in 2011?
I applied in Feb 2010 and have not heard a word from them. Is this normal to wait so long?

[Stallone]

it's normal...

they're going to london(3x), amsterdam n paris in 2011

[KeLC13]

Hi everyone,

Thanks for the response with regards to the visual requirements. I have got a reply from Transport Canada as well. They said they have amended the requirements for a Class 1 Medical. As long as eye sight is correctable to 20/20, then one will pass the visual exam. There is no restriction in the refractive standard.
However, I also understand that each airline may impose their own standard. I am still trying to find out from Cathay what their actual requirement is (whether they impose a refractive restriction or not).
I'll keep you guys posted!

I also see a lot of people are concerned about the salary. I don't think it will be anything too low. At the same time, I must agree it's about the passion! I am not saying I'll do it for free, I still need to live. But at the moment, being able to fly outweights the salary. At least this is the case for me.

Also, my cousin told me anyone under 35 will still be considered for the cadet programme.

[404 Titan]

KeLC13
I also see a lot of people are concerned about the salary. I don't think it will be anything too low. At the same time, I must agree it's about the passion! I am not saying I'll do it for free, I still need to live. But at the moment, being able to fly outweights the salary. At least this is the case for me.
That’s a pretty ignorant statement when it is quite clear you have never lived in Hong Kong and quite frankly don’t have the foggiest clue to what the real living costs are here. The reality is most of you will seriously struggle here on what an SO earns without a housing allowance and will go backwards financially. Even in GA in Australia on a pathetic GA salary I was still able to put some money away for a rainy day because the living costs were fractional in Australia compared to Hong Kong.

All professional pilots love flying but we fly to live first. If you want to live to fly, take it up as a hobby on the side of some other career. Professional aviation doesn’t need hobbyists polluting it ranks.:ugh::yuk:

[KeLC13]

404 Titan:

In fact I was born in HK and also worked there before. My dad currently works in Hong Kong now and I always inquire about the living standard and working condition in Hong Kong. As I said earlier, I will not do it for free as I need to live as well. I have friends working in Hong Kong and a cousin working as a SO. I won't say they live a luxury life, but they are able to survive.
I have heard SO does not make that much, but don't make it sound like you need to beg for money. Look at it long term. You'll eventually be promoted and make more. Another thing is, no one forced any one of us to become a CX employee, right? We made our choice. It's a good way to become a professional pilot.
Perhaps I am a little luckier as my family is in HK.

It's a little offensive for you to say hobbyists (or you might be referring to me only) pollute the ranks. I believe you need "the drive" to do well on a job and progress with your career. Nothing wrong in being a hobbyist (hence, the drive) and actually being able to fly. What is better than making money on a job you like? Yes, the pay may not be great, but it's not only about money (benefits, being able to stay in HK with family, etc.). If financially does not work out, then I don't think one would apply. I am sure people who applied does not just do it for the sake of wanting to fly. It's a career. I am sure we all have put in great thoughts about it before applying.

Anyways, I understand what your concern/frustartion is. Perhaps I wasn't quite clear on what I was trying to say. I apologize for any confusion caused.

Let's focus back on the programme! I am sure many are like me; having a lot of questions and many like you that can provide answers!

Pleasure meeting you!

[bigmouth1980]

Does anyone have any idea when or if Cathay will interview for First Officer positions?

Is the plan to only recruit Cadets from now on?

Thanks!

[pill]

You people can't be told, there's not much to love about operating the radio in the cruise. Small aircraft, doing lots sectors, hands on, is whats needed at the start of your career, not 6 hours sat staring into the inky blackness wondering why the guy beside you is starting to get twichy. The love of flight and wide body, long range ops are on different planets. Different galaxies if your not operating the take off/landing and climb/descent. I will admit though, that getting someone else to pay for your licence is a beautiful thing, just the talk of spending the next 40 years with them is far from rational. You are joining a corporation, you will be a tiny cog in a large machine, the replacment of which, will not make one scrap of difference to those that operate and own it.

[Stallone]

SO's starting pay is around HK$33k rite?

a month's rent is around HK$12k in Tung Chung??

just a rough guess, 'cause that's the price in Singapore currently and the cost of lving ain't too far apart

[lost&found]

Kelc:

I have to agree with 404..... the reason why the company can continue to lower wages/ conditions is because there are people out there with same attitude as you. im sure you mean it all in good faith, but saying to be "paid to fly is a bonus" is absolute rubbish! Its all well and good to be optimistic and say you will sign up now and HOPEFULLY the conditions will get better..... they dont and they wont, if people keep signing on to poorer conditions.

from previous posts it seems you have no flying experience.... maybe a TIF from the previous weekend at most....? How do you really know that you are going to enjoy flying at all? how do you know if you have the ability to fly? its a lot different PAXing from Hong Kong to New York than it is working.... you cant watch 16 hours of IFE, youre not being served food and drink the whole way.... for your time as an SO, you will probably be jumping in the seat at 1am HKG time, sitting there for the next 6 hours, arriving at the port to find you cant sleep because its the middle of the day in HK and then having to do it all the way back... There are alot of fantastic times had in aviation, but the conditions are no longer what they used to be and LEP's (cadets) have it worse....

Before you go for your interview.... get your PPL, it shows you are keen aswell as teaching you about the real world of aviation. Hire a 172 and bash around the bush for a week... you will learn so much in week on your own, flying into remote towns, finding a pub to sleep in, dealing with weather, planning your fuel/ legs... when you get into an airline you will also have experiences to talk about in the 6 hours you are manning the radio!

Flying is alot of fun... however, it is a life long journey and not something you should take for granted or choose to leave once all the excitement of starting work in the middle of the night, when all your mates are out on the piss, wears off!

Good Luck with the Journey!:ok:

[404 Titan]

KeLC13
My dad currently works in Hong Kong now and I always inquire about the living standard and working condition in Hong Kong.
So you have Daddy here to prop you up when you realise you are trapped (bonded) here on pathetic T&C’s. As the cadet scheme has now been opened up to international candidates, cadets with a family here are now a minority. Simply looking at the questions some of the wannabes are putting up here it clearly indicates most people aren’t seriously considering the living costs here with no family to fall back on.

I have heard SO does not make that much, but don't make it sound like you need to beg for money.
I have already posted early last year the true costs of living in Hong Kong as an expat. I suggest you and others read them. If you then choose to ignore what I have said you do it at your own peril. Just remember current local cadets are trying to get housing and other expat terms and having you come here and say “being able to fly outweighs the salary” doesn’t help their cause one little bit. The reality is you are diluting the T&C’s for all new pilots while we’re trying to improve them.
Look at it long term. You'll eventually be promoted and make more.
You are going to have to look real long term if you think you are going to make ends meet here on a SO salary. In the last 11 years the time taken to go from SO to JFO has gone from 18 months to 4 years 1 month currently and it is only going to get worse, even with the new aircraft on order. By the time some of you here will be ready for upgrade to JFO, based on past trends, upgrades will be possibly taking about 5 ½ + years with yearly pay increments stopping at year 4.
It's a little offensive for you to say hobbyists (or you might be referring to me only) pollute the ranks. I believe you need "the drive" to do well on a job and progress with your career. Nothing wrong in being a hobbyist (hence, the drive) and actually being able to fly.
What rubbish. As a professional pilot if you don’t have “the drive”, you won’t make it in this industry. All successful professional pilots have it in spades but we are still here first to make a living. If the financial rewards aren’t so important to you, go get a private licence and fly for a hobby. If you don’t like my bluntness, tough.:ugh:

Stallone

Hong Kong is a considerably more expensive a place to live compared to Singapore. While you can get a place to live in Tung Chung (at the Airport), the point is having a choice to live where you want in Hong Kong. With no housing assistance your choices are very limited.

[airdualbleedfault]

404 and Pill, great posts but you might as well go and herd cats.

People will not be told that they are about to commit to one of the most polluted, overcrowded cities ( people per sqft of usable land ) and officially the most expensive real estate in the world, all this for 5hit pay.

The difference between a CX pilot and an Emitares pilot from day 1 over 20 years is about 2,000,000 HKD less for CX ( someone tell me if I got that figure wrong ) and here's the kicker....that was WITH housing.

One day, god forbid, you might actually meet someone, marry them and have kids, try to imagine living on 40-50K a month in a 600' flat with 2-3 other people, by then I am sure you will be able to slice the pollution with a knife, for once, look past the next year or 2.

Anyway, good luck, after all, what would we know :rolleyes:

[KeLC13]

404 Titan

It's totally cool if you don't appreciate people that admire pilots and the industry and serious about becoming a pilot. That wouldn't stop me at least. I'm determined and I know it is something I want to do. Not for fun, but actually to make a living out of it. It may be tough as you said, but I had considered that. Life in Toronto is not too different from Hong Kong due to heavy tax.
As I said, I know people who make less but still manage to live in Hong Kong. Making money is definitely a conern, don't get me wrong. Otherwise, as you said, I'll just fly for fun. Why go through the application, right? My current job doesn't pay much.

I truly appreciate your bluntness. You are just stating the truth and making sure we are seeing the big picture. I thank you for that.

I do have a few questions for you.
Will you tell the same speech for someone just wanting to work in HK? Say someone wanting to work for the bank and had to start low. They make very little as well. Or are you just against people applying for cadet? Do you hate being a pilot?

Thanks again.

[thinkinglongnhard]

KeLC13 - they are the facts!

[GTC58]

bigmouth1980

It looks like CX plans to crew long haul flights up to 16 hours now with 1 Capt, 1 FO and 2 SO's when the new CAD371 / AFTL's come into effect. Actually they just started to crew some flights already this way.

Will be interesting to see if they will change the freighter long hauls from 1 Capt and 2 FO's to 1 Capt, 1 FO and 1 SO.

If this will happen it looks to me that there is no real need to hire DEFO anymore. All new positions will be filled with Cadets, maybe DESO and FO positions filled from within CX upgrading SO's.

[bigmouth1980]

Thanks GTC58

[Captain Dart]

I've said it once and I'll say it again: your problem will become my problem when you start moaning to me up in the Flight Levels over India at two o'clock in the morning about the poor salary, the hovel you are living in, the roster and the lack of promotion. You may not even be able to afford to eat properly.

If you accept these conditions, you must understand that Cathay Pacific once paid A Scales for a reason; it was not a 'Beneficial Society for Airline Pilots' even then. Hong Kong is an expensive, polluted, stressful and to me, boring place, and the very least you need is housing assistance, a reasonable living wage and the sniff of promotion to make it all worth while.

So you had better be 'Smilin' Jack' when you're flying with me.

[404 Titan]

KeLC13
Will you tell the same speech for someone just wanting to work in HK? Say someone wanting to work for the bank and had to start low. They make very little as well.
I fail to see your point. The banks in Hong Kong don’t employ expats in low positions. They employ locals. All the banks in Hong Kong that employ expats employ them in specialist or upper management positions on “expat terms”. Your question should really be asking would I support the local employees of the banks in Hong Kong improve their T&C’s? The answer is yes. It’s about time that employers in Hong Kong paid a real living wage to the locals but that is another issue.

Do you hate being a pilot?
Are you kidding me? I love this job. I just hate people that prostitute themselves. The end result of this selfishness is that everyone gets screwed.:yuk:

[Stallone]

ok, a little break from the debate here...

i found a blog with useful info on the cadet recruiting process

flygosh . blog spot . com

a post on december 15th 2010

check it out

[KeLC13]

404 Titan,

So no one should give the cadet programme a shot as any one being admitted to the programme is just dragging your ranks down? I hope you understand that this is not my intention. In fact, it's something I have always wanted to do and as you said make a living out of. Though you are telling me otherwise.

I agree with you employers should pay real living wage! Not just in HK, but around the world! I am struggling to live as well.
Will applying as local help the situation? Or the fact that they open the programme to international candidates screwed everything up? If that is the case, your comments should be towards the company, not to the ones who wants to apply. It only helps if NO ONE applies so the company realizes they are underpaying and it's not attracting anyone; hence increasing wages and benefits...

[1stflightout]

Looks like the cadet interview schedule is removed from the Cathay site now.

[thinkinglongnhard]

it's something I have always wanted to do and as you said make a living out of.

I can hardly believe that it has been a life long dream... you applied 2 years ago, but were unable to make the interview. In the following 2 years you have not even gone for a TIF... if flying was something you wanted to do, you would of thrown every resource you have (time and money) in to becoming a pilot. It appears, to me, that you have seen that CX has offered a course which is "FREE" and you are now jumping at it...

[crwjerk]

Will you tell the same speech for someone just wanting to work in HK? Say someone wanting to work for the bank and had to start low. They make very little as well.

In addition to Titan's reply, I would suggest that if a qualified expat banker had his salary and very existence threatened by cheap inexperienced prostitute labour, he and his peers would fight to keep their profession the way it is. Unfortunately, I know it is not a very nice comparison, but until you all see that you are all applying for an inadequate package, that's the way it is.
We are only stating facts about the cost of living etc........... Make up your own mind, but the conditions will only get better if none of you take the jobs offered at this particular time.

[MilPilot]

Looks like the cadet interview schedule is removed from the Cathay site now.
They have also removed DEFO and DESO from their Career site. Links are still in the main menu, but they lead to a sorry page

[carl_g]

I would like to thank everyone here for their posts. Because of them, and my own research, I have decided not to proceed. I think the "cadet program" is just a scheme for Cathay to save money in the long run.

This cadet program allows someone to basically become a glorified radio person in the air who won't be respected by the other pilots at all.

I compare it to someone in my career who gets paid half of what I do, performs some of the duties, and starts to lower the standard for my job.

Plus you can't go to other companies because you only have a p2x rating or whatever. I don't know anything about flying but common sense tells me if someone wants to be a commercial pilot do the following:

Go to flight school and/or join the military

I've been reading a lot of your guys posts and I'm sorry but they seem a bit pathetic. You sound like a bunch of wannabees who are "starstruck" seeing these nice big shiny airplanes and are delusional about what is reall going on here! Wake up and give your head a shake, people!
Work your way up and pay your dues
Become respected in the industry
Make a decent living
Have a balance between work and personal life

[1stflightout]

If Cathay ceases to hire DEFOs and DESOs, will this mean a quicker upgrade for Cadets to Junior FO?

[MrCrawford]

What's the difference between a training captain (20 yrs in the airline) who went through the cadet program and a training captain (20 yrs in the airline + "paying his/her dues")?

[uspilot]

20 years...:ok:

[orangeboy]

773,

the requirement for the 30 week course is CPL and 250 hours

the requirement for the 12 week course is CPL + ATPL subject passes and 1500 hours


going by the above, i'd say that if you have over 250 hours, CPL and ATPL subject passes, but not 1500 hours, then you'd probably be put in the 30 week course since you haven't met one of the requirements of the 12 week course, that being the 1500 hour minimum.

[Cleared for take-off]

Hey all,

Does anyone know if candidates with previous experience require 100hr PIC and 10hr night (PIC?) in order to qualify for the 30 week program if CX accepts you? I believe that is what Dragon Air has that requirement, or is that a requirement for a general license conversion an airline has to do for you in HK? thanks :ok:

[MilPilot]

between the 30 week & the 12 week course from an academic point of view.

12 weeks of something that smells like flying before you become a system operator for the next 40 years :}

[coobg002]

hey guys, im sure this has been asnwered several times before but anyone who has been interviewed for the short course (accepted or rejected) would be able to answer this. What do they expect you to have to qualify for the short course? Is it JUST 250 hours or a frozen atpl or a MCIR or if it is just 250 hours do they prefer you to have the things just mentioned. The reason I ask is I was turned down in my interview in 2nd stage for the ab initio and told I can reapply in late november (interview was in jan) and now seeing as I have 200 hours think I am going to do my MCIR and try and get 250 hours all up and reapply. (I have my CPL and I am graduating my degree of civil aviation this yr, also mite give a crack at ATPL exams :) )

[coobg002]

hahah wait my computer didnt show the posts like literally just before mine. Never mind answering that, how about do you think I have a decent chance at getting another interview and do u rekon a MCIR and Aussie ATPLs may help my chances (im doing it either way as a hobby/challenge/watever)

[kbh]

Got my email notification for me being shortlisted for the Stage 2 and my Vancouver Jan 14th Stage 1 was a success! I guess they'll call me in a few weeks to give me a date?

Anyone else got good news after the Vancouver Stage 1?

[6cfn]

KBH,
I did stage 1 in vancouver on Jan 10.
and will be heading to HK . They also said they will give me a date soon.

Hope to see you there

[Jal1088]

Hi Guys,

Part of the initial interview involves a reasoning test has anyone got any useful information i could gloss over to help prepare for this?

Cheers.

[funfun]

Jal1088,

From what i remember it wasn't anything too full on, the first round was more of a meet and great. Most of the tests are designed to assess natural aptitude, as long as you read the questions and understand what they are asking then it shouldn't be a problem.

Have you (or anybody else) received their interview dates? I have heard rumors that it will be late March early April?

[1stflightout]

Did you guys who recently done the stage 1 have to do the Wombat test?

[6cfn]

No.
My first round consisted of the following

JKI Test
Personality Test
Reasoning Test
Interview.

However, I don't think these are the same everywhere. When you get invited to the first round, they will send you an email detailing the agenda for the day.

Does anyone know what to expect from the "aviation math" section for stage 2?

[Captain Dart]

A spelling and grammar test would also be appropriate for some of you.

Aviation, particularly that which carries hundreds of trusting passengers in very big aircraft, such as those operated by Cathay Pacific, requires significant attention to detail and a high professional standard.

You may think that taking the time to at read over, check and correct your post before hitting that button that makes it readable by thousands of people over the planet is not important. If this is your belief, it is incompatible with the mindset required to be successful in your training and advancement in this career.

[kbh]

Hope to see you there too 6cfn! Good Luck!

Galasphere 347... the basic design of the spinning ring is for generating artificial gravity; however, according to the cut away diagram, the living room and the walk ways alignment don't really work well with the spinning ring design.... gravity would have been felt coming from the side instead of coming from below.... perhaps there are graviton generators installed somewhere without my knowledge?? :8

[SloppyJoe]

What does

taking the time to at read over

mean captain? I am sure it is correct as you would have surely checked your own post after being so condescending, its just I have not heard at used in this way before.

:)

[Jal1088]

Good one "to at" Captain!:ok: Ironic that Sloppyjoe had to pull you up on that one.

[Captain Dart]

Good spot :ok:. I'll leave it unedited as a 'penance'.

[1stflightout]

Hi Guys,

It has been eight weeks since I have submitted my application. I have read recently that they state you should know by eight weeks if your application has been successful. Based on the past though, it seems that it usually takes months to get an invitation. Should I email the cadet email address to confirm that my application has been unsuccessful, so I can accept the fact and move on?

[SW1]

Anyone still needing to purchase the Ravens APM can contact me via PM! :ok:

[carl_g]

If you really want to be a pilot don't just move on. Do it properly! I don't like what I see here: a bunch of stunned applicants all "gaga" over this cadet program! The real pilots must get so irritated with this whole thing!

[adam692]

Any one else from yvr going? pm.

[SloppyJoe]

Just discovered all the stuff I used for my interview, lots of questions they like to ask with pretty good answers. This is for DESO and DEFO but seems the same questions keep cropping up. If you want all of it send me a pm with your email and I will forward it on to you. Oh by the way just to say it again you will find it very hard living in Hong Kong without housing allowance, if you are with a partner or kids and they do not work it will be pretty much impossible.

[SloppyJoe]

For those that have the stuff I sent to them just be aware that the answers are not always the best,

eg I remember something about carbon brakes and in the answer the guy says something along the lines of the colder they are the better.

The questions are typical of DEFO and DESO interviews and most of the answers are pretty good but best check them rather than taking them as fact.

[nmcpilot]

Hey has anyone here done the flight grading for the 32 week course? Any tips at all? I know what is involved 7 flights I believe, 3 General Handling then 3 Navs and then a GFT with GH and Nav. I suppose what concerns me is I have never flown in Australia before, I have flown in the US and the UK but nowhere else, any big differences?

[MrCrawford]

from talking to some people who has trained in ADL, unlike North America (I'm from BC) there are no rivers or trees to guide your flying. So VFR is virtually useless because you see a lot of dirt.

I haven't seen it myself.

[busdriver2010]

Hi, I was recently interviewed for Stage 1 in HKG 2 weeks ago. They called up and scheduled for an ICAO exam this month. I asked if this was part of Stage 2 since he did not tell me that I passed Stage 1. The guy told me that this is not part of either Stage 2 / 3 but part of the "assessment". Could you guys give me some tips/suggestions on what will be covered by this exam? Thank you very much..

[BigglesNBella]

Follow this link: http://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CBUQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.casa.gov.au%2Fwcmswr%2F_assets%2Fmain%2 Foar%2Fdownload%2Fadelaide%2Fairspace_d.pdf&rct=j&q=adelaide%20vtc&ei=BJ9TTbHCJIagvgOSrZXdCA&usg=AFQjCNFtSmEW_TYgaw1Mm7xgCyEUqzJB7g&cad=rja

and scroll through the excerpts of the local VFR navigation chart. It's no west coast BC in terms of navigation through valleys where you really can't go wrong, but there are grain silos and major roads and things like that to navigate by.

[orangeboy]

bus driver, i was in the same boat as you a few months back.

I did do the ICAO english test, there really is nothing to be afraid of if you can speak and listen to english relatively well.

heres what was covered when i did the test in September 2010

- explain some words that the examiner gives you
- listen to a series of radio conversations, then answer questions regarding those conversations
- explain a picture
- watch a short video and explain what was going on
- pick a few items from a list and explain why you chose them


try and relax and don't over think things, most of the content is very basic english stuff, but you will have to pay attention to make sure you don't miss any content :ok:

[nmcpilot]

Thanks very much for that BigglesNBella :)

[busdriver2010]

Thanks orangeboy.. By the way what stage are you in right now?

[orangeboy]

i only did stage 1 and the ICAO test, then got failed on the medical :ouch:

[busdriver2010]

@ orangboy: So you already reached Stage 3? Thank you again for your info..

[suntorytimo]

Orangeboy, can I ask what area you were failed on in the medical? Eyesight?

[orangeboy]

busdriver, nope, i only did stage 1, then the ICAO a few weeks later, then was later notified i had failed their medical - the medical form you fill in when you do stage 1.


suntorytimo, i did not fail their eyesight

[Stallone]

no obligations when going for the CX interview anyway..

and it takes roughly 6months for the whole recruitment process

so if within this 6months u get an offer for the B737 job just take it..

[Blomqvist]

Hi guys,
Anyone invited to attend the interview on 25 March in Singapore?
Just got my invite..
emails should be sent out to singaporeans alrd..do check!
FYI i sent out my application last july

[bananaman2]

Hi there folks....

Question to any UK based applicants.... has anyone applied and heard anything recently?

From the schedule that CX put up a short while ago about there regional recruitment over the forthcoming year, it claimed they were interviewing in London this month. I applied like 9 or 10 months ago and have heard nothing - they have told me on a couple of occasions my application is still being 'processed' though!

I see from recent posts, people have been notified about assessments in Paris and Singapore - so at least with these regions, recruitment is following the schedule.

Thanks in advance and good luck to all.

[up-diddly-up]

Bananaman2,

Hi mate, I'm UK based and have also heard nothing. I applied about June time last year so in same situation. Admittedly I was getting a bit worried when I saw the Feb date for London and still hadn't heard anything, so knowing there is someone in the same position is a little reassuring....unless we've both been knocked back, but I'm sure (hope) that won't be (isnt) the case.:ok:

Good luck to all called forward for their respective country assessments.

UDU

[victorlht88]

Hey guys,

I am based in Singapore and got notified to head down for interview on 22 March.

Anyone going for it too?

[AviatorJack]

I applied in July 2010 (UK) for the 12 week course and I haven't heard a single thing either.

Oh well just got to keep looking for other work!

[Alif]

i need anyone to respond.

I am Malaysian. i already obtain Malaysia CPL IR and Frozen ATPL with 200 hours including day flying, night flying, single and multi engine instrument flying, airways flying. now i am seeking for job. desperately!

almost 9 month i waiting for job, but now it difficult in Malaysia. any one can suggest me any company that available and accept me.

hope you guys can help me out.

[AviatorJack]

Nothing for you as a Malaysian national like MAS etc.?

No worries mate, I'm now ATPL 2000+TT and have been unemployed for 12 months, can't find a thing anywhere. No one even replies, let a lone kick my applications back :ugh:. But keep trying, its what gets me up every day!

:ok:

[Skybound79]

Hi Alif,

Have you checked out opportunities with Malaysian carriers like MAS, AirAsia, FireFly, MASWings, Jetstar and several of the Malaysian flight training organisations which have been looking for FIs/AFIs?

[kdash]

Dear all,

good luck for those heading for stage 1 for CX...my IR has lapsed and iam desperately seeking any flight school in ASEAN region for a renewal, does anyone know where to do it? Will a lapsed IR affect the initial interview with CX for the pre-qualified course.....any advise will be deeply appreciated.Thank You.:ok:

[Flying to home]

Hi guys,

I have a small (not really) problem cause I've applied just few days after new years eve. I've got the Cathay Pacific Cadet Pilot Programme Application - ApplicationSubmitted email but when I'm trying to login into my apllication and put my data the system don't see my app :/ I even don't have my PRN (or somethin' like that,or don't remember where I had it)...

[suntorytimo]

Once the application has been submitted you cant view it anymore

[busdriver2010]

Hi, I was just wondering for those international cadets like myself having no HKID / visa. Can HK Immigration / Cathay Pacific issue a working visa after a cadet has finished training? I have heard of rumours that international cadets were not issued visa after training in Adelaide. Also, are there present SO International Cadets who were able to get a working visa?

[easycompany]

Hey everyone. Just looking to get a hold of the jki booklet (the booklet for stage 1 right?) if anyone has one. Thanks in advance

[Stallone]

i'm a singaporean applicant too..

no news from CX, guess no chance already?

applied April 19th 2010, Singapore(1st choice) and Hong Kong(2nd choice) as preferred locations



will CX email rejection notification if not selected for Stage 1 interview?

[midnightsky]

Anyone going to Stage 2 on 14/3 to 15/3 from KL?
Maybe we can form a study group for it.

Guessed its back to burning the midnight oil.

[CJ89]

@FasterStronger


When are you going to Paris for stage 1?

[SW1]

If anyone still needs to purchase the Ravens APM you can PM me:ok:

[haliflex]

hey i'm from Singapore as well, will be going down for the first interview on 24th March, seems like it's one a day? :O we have 23rd and 25th, and mine is on 24th.

[Blomqvist]

@haliflex
yup ive heard of a 21st as well..
not sure if its 1 a day though..
but interview time is pretty long though..
from 1245pm to 5pm..
wonder how many they are doing at a time

[costas1979]

Hi Everybody,

The Cathay Pacific Airways Second Officer Cadet Pilot Programme has been expanded to consist of the following three streams:
A 61 week Ab-initio programme for applicants with little or no aviation experience;
A 30 week Advanced Entry programme for applicants who possess an ICAO CPL and in excess of 250 hours flight time in certain categories; and
A 12 week Cadet Transition Training programme for applicants with an ICAO CPL, passes in all ATPL subjects and in excess of 1500 hours total flight time........................................................ ............................................................ ............

I have a JAA license. Can I still apply?

Any feedback will be appreciated.

Regards.

[SW1]

Costas,

Yes you can still apply with a JAA licence. Plenty of folks there with JAA licences on the cadet scheme.

[costas1979]

Thanks SW1.

Also if you have a lapsed ME is it still possible to apply?

[SW1]

I went to my interview and subesequent flight grading with nothing valid, including my medical. You will have a medical at Stage 3 in HK.

Remember some guys have no licences or flying experience at all and get through. Just make sure you know your stuff for the interviews. I was not asked why i hadnt renewed many of my ratings.

I dont even remember there being a section to put in dates of expiry of licences and ratings, just apply:ok:

[suntorytimo]

A JAA license is an ICAO license

[jar25]

Hi guys,

Are there any special perks that direct entry SOs have over cadet pilots? I've applied to CX in the past on their cadet programme and made it as far as stage 2 in HK, however didn't progress past that.

In a few months time I expect to exceed the requirements for SO and should also have some single engine turbine time. Is it worth while me applying for DESO rather than cadet pilot this time round? Would that be considered a little cocky if I didn't pass the cadet assessment first time round?

Thx!

[victorlht88]

@halifax,

mine is on 22 March in Singapore though. Now we've got 22-24!

[Arkit]

Hi guys,

Does anybody know where to find the application number?

I have looked through all the things Cathay have sent me but I cant find anything!

I need it for my interview which is soon. Any help would be appreciated!

[trolleytothrottle]

Hi all

Was just reading the forum, and was wondering from people that have gone through stages 1 and 2 lately if they had to do the wombat testing? also is the aptitude testing with the joystick still happening also?

Also from what I know stage 1 interviews happening in april in auckland...... and new course starting in May in Adelaide for the 30 week course.

Any info about stage 1 that is different would be great.

Cheers :ok:

[Flaps10]

U don't want to come here!!!!

It's getting worse everyday. :hmm::ugh:

[Blomqvist]

hi guys. would like to ask the foreign applicants who have attended stage 2/3 b4.. hw many people do u actually see at these stages?
jus wondering how high is the elimination % at stage 1 or hw many ppl does CX actually import to HKG for further stages..
thanks!

[Stallone]

no quota

if you're good enough during your interview at Singapore, you're through

[cczoe]

finished cx cpp stage 1 interview on 14th this month and now waiting for reply. any other attended the stage 1 interview as i do?? anyone received any reply?

many questions from both the HR and pilot i cannot answer...:sad: is that mean i will be out? how long i am expected to wait? anyone willing to share their experience?;)

[airplaneridesrfun]

Instead of getting extremely excited to jump into a sinking ship, perhaps some of you should ask tough questions in the interview about your future at CX if you get the job. The first one will be how long it will take you to upgrade to First Officer, and the second - how long will it take to upgrade to Captain. Realize, that most of what you are told will not be the truth as CX is just trying to put warm bodies in seats at the lowest total cost.

You will be banging your head against the wall for a very long time as an SO if you are not careful. Good Luck.... Trust but verify (make sure the contract you sign protects you - it Doesn't!)!

[crwjerk]

Oh but if I dare ask a tough question at the interview, then I'll be scared I won't get accepted.

[Smell the Coffee]

I asked the question and was informed "variable - about 4 years".

In turn, I was asked 'what's stopping you from leaving CX once you're FO and going back home'. :}

[crwjerk]

Ummmm....... "Nothing.... you made sure of that when you decided not to give me any housing allowance":ok:

[mcdjsf]

Hello guys, I am invited to attend the stage 1 interview in HK on March 8th. Anybody here get the same day? For those of you who recently attend the stage 1, any updated news that I should know before I go? Your insight will be helpful.

Also, I am planing to book a hotel on the 7th near HKG. If you don't mind sharing the room, you can PM me and let's arrange.

Thanks guys! :ok:

[pilot_chicky]

Hi I applied in March 2010 and just recieved an invite to Auckland on the 7th April - the invite said that there will be 4 areas they are looking at - >Interview with both Personal and Technical Questions (45mins)
Technical multiple-choice Questionnaire (45mins)
Reasoning Test (45mins)
A Personality Assessment (30mins)

I will read through the 100 or so pages but any info will be much appreciated - I have 450hrs tt, all ATPLs and current MEIR...fingers (and toes) crossed :)

[mcdjsf]

pilot_chicky :
Interview with both Personal and Technical Questions (45mins)
Technical multiple-choice Questionnaire (45mins)
Reasoning Test (45mins)
A Personality Assessment (30mins)


man, it seems like overseas interview doesn't have the Wombat-CS Test part. :mad:You guys are lucky!

[flynhigh]

Grow a pair....c'mon they need to have there head examined....:yuk:

[delay256]

Hey Guys Im from Toronto Canada and ive just applied, I have a CPL/MULTI-IFR/Instructor Rating already and 900 TT with commercial experience on a navajo. I wouldn't mind starting over again to learn the 'cathay' way with their SOPs.

Good luck to everyone here! Any idea how many candidates they take per batch and when the interview cycles run? Ive put HongKong as my first choice for interview preference location.

[trolleytothrottle]

Hi guys

Just after some infomation on the reasoning test. Is it based on maths questions or more verbal and abstract.

Any help would be appreciated on what to expect.

Thanks

[GTC58]

1. Same
2. No housing, other benefits the same
3. Cadet = no housing
4. Public forum, not the place to tell
5. No. seniority is determined by date of hire.
6. Seniority determines time to upgrade to JFO, not performance. Presently around 4 years after finishing cadet course and starting SO training.
7. P2 time can be logged only for time in the right seat. Captains can log the entire time of flight.
8. Sim module every 2 months.
9. Not true.
10. In accepting a contract on lower terms, you are setting the stage for lowering the conditions of all CX pilots in the future, making your contract the standard for all new hires and making it very hard for the present CX pilots to improve conditions. Most try to rationalize that even though they start employment with CX on lower conditions, they eventually will get the same benefits and contract conditions then the present CX pilots which is not the case. It's the simple supply and demand game. As long as CX can lower conditions and find enough pilots/cadets to fill these positions the trend to lower contract conditions continues until the situation reverses, meaning CX has to raise contract conditions again to find enough qualified people to supply hiring demand.
In my opinion you can make CX only a viable career if you can hold a US base (guessing you are American) after JFO assessment, which there are none available at the present time.
If you consider living in Hong Kong with wife and without housing benefits most of your income will be used up, making it very hard to save money for retirement or create home owner equity. When you are promoted to Captain in 15 - 18 years you will get a special management allowance which is presently about 1/3 of the housing allowance.
You truly love flying? Pilots don't fly at CX or any other particular long-haul widebody airline, pilots operate and manage automation.

[WhatThe?]

The HR lady told me that was NO education allowances either, as the public Hong Kong schools were available to locals.

I was in the 2008 DESO pool, said No to the cadet scheme.

I have over 4500 hrs and the lifestyle is what I'm looking for, the cockpit is the same on a Dash8 as it is on the 747, just a little higher and faster.

Times are turing for the better, just wait.

[GTC58]

1-3. Absolutely no housing for cadet at the moment. Special management allowance when promoted to captain which is around 1/3 of the housing allowance and 1/5 of the present rental allowance for captain. Local employed pilots are getting now an education allowance as far as I know, so cadets will get it too.
7. SO do not take-off or land the aircraft. SO operate the radio and maintain fuel log in cruise. When flying with Captain SO sits in right seat when flying with Relief Qualified FO, SO sits in left seat. SO time can not be logged, as you will have a P2X rating.

[Duff]

There has been talk of a possible housing allowance for cadets. Has there been any progress on this?

[SloppyJoe]

A SO cadet upgrading to JFO has no more T/O and Ldg experience than 4 years previously when they flew in Adelaide. Not sure what this T/O, Ldg experience is that you are asking about, if you can pass the upgrade you will be a JFO if you can't you won't be and will be fired.

There will be no progress on housing until the first international cadets have enough time as a JFO and all start leaving for other jobs, CX will then provide just enough to make it worthwhile staying.

[SpiritofMGL]

Does anyone know if English Listening & Grammar test is still on Stage 1?
It looks like some folks didn't have it on stage 1

[LHA649]

no its not on! whats on is:

- reasoning test
- JKI test
- wombat-cs test
- personality test
- interview (personal + technical)

[carpet weaver]

anyone else got a march 30th interview in HK?

[SpiritofMGL]

Thanks a lot for the info

[theredwoodbus]

sloppyjoe, what a/c do you fly now? did you have a fleet choice at that time?

[LHA649]

I had my Stage 1 interview in Hong Kong on Feb 14th and there were THREE of us!

[LHA649]

go to pilotenboard.de, then to Air Berlin und weitere Airlines, and select my message 'Cathay Stage 1'.

[LHA649]

hey Zoe,

check ur email :)

It doesnt mean that you're out ;) I think I did well, but I can't say if I made it or not. Its a pain and a matter of waiting. 2-3 weeks. so we get to know sometime between Feb 28th and March 5th

Tim

[LHA649]

hi everyone,

I've been reading numerous posts about information regarding Cathay Stage 1. Here's my report!

I had my Stage 1 one Feb 14th! It contained of the following things:
- Job Knowledge Test
- Reasoning Test
- Wombat-Cs Test
- Personality Test
- Interview (technical + personal)

Job Knowledge Test
Upon your invitation to Stage 1 you receive a JKI Booklet detailing information you NEED TO KNOW for the Job Knowledge Test. It is a multi-choice test, 50 questions, 40 minutes. I can just urge you guys: learn it IN AND OUT. You will also need this knowledge for the technical part of the interview (the guy picks certain questoins off the booklet and specifically asks you. E.g I was asked to explain how VSI works)

Reasoning Test
Not Maths related! Just comparing and analsying graphics and pictures. Easy, but it gets more challenging as you progress. You have 5 Minuts for 8 (i think) questions and 30 minuts for 30 (i think) questions

Wombat-Cs Test
Google wombat-cs test and study the manual. It tests your situational awarness and your multi-tasking skills. It lasts 60 minutes.

Personality Test
BE HONEST! It contains three exercises. In the first exercise you need to rank 8 sentences according to your description of your personlity. In the second exercise you need to do the EXACT same thing and this is where Cathay is testing you on your honesty! It is pretty hard to memorise 8x7=56 sentence orders, so my advise is to be honest. The last exercise is about answering questions and selecting yes, no or maybe (cant remeber the exact structure)

Interview
30 minutes personal, and 30 minutes technical! in the personal part be friendly, show interest, sell yourself well and persuade them to take you. In the technical part don't be put down by questions you cant answer ( I couldnt answer 4 questions). Be honest and say that you cant answer the questions. If you studied the JKI well, you'll be fine

Overall
I think I did a good job, but even then I can't tell if I got through or not. You need to wait 2-3 weeks and during this time you just need to 'survive' it! Its pretty hard and I'm anxious and cant wait for the feedback, but you've got to wait.

Hope I could help.

Tim

[suntorytimo]

...I have to disagree on the reasoning test being easy.

http://www.iqtest.dk/main.swf - perfect example of the Raven's progressive matrices which you are tested on in the reasoning test. Not as easy as it might seem, if you get 90%+ on that test consider yourself extremely clever.

Studying for the interview goes far beyond knowing the JKI booklet inside and out. Supplemental knowledge is vital for this, especially information on Hong Kong, CX, and AFT. They will ask you technical questions to the limits of your knowledge, and then a little bit further. They look to see that you have the knowledge that you ought to possess considering your aviation experience, and that you have done even more research (if you were really interested in flying you wouldn't just learn the bare minimum but you would read up on more advanced material). Furthermore you will be asked questions that you do not know the answer to, how you respond to such questions is vital, can you work out the answer by piecing together what you do know?

Exude confidence in your interview, if you have prepared yourself sufficiently this will come naturally, walking in to the interview you should feel ready to answer anything they throw at you.

[carpet weaver]

After you get an interview, what should i expect? Will they send me information in the mail? So far all the information I received was that I was given an interview.

Thanks

[Loken]

Has anyone received a call or email to go for a CX interview from the Africa region?

[orangeboy]

carpet weaver, they will send an email inviting you first.

After you have confirmed your receipt and availability, they will send you another email detailing the interview day i.e JKI booklet and what tests are involved.


goodluck :ok:

[SW1]

...I have to disagree on the reasoning test being easy.I totally agree, although with the right practice you can ace them. Contact me via PM for more details:ok:

accept no substitutes!!

[Vibes]

Anyone here going for the CX interview in SIN on 23rd March 2011?

[carpet weaver]

Hey does anyone know where I can buy the Ravens APM book?

[tyson744]

Hi All. I know it is exciting to look forward to a airline job. I know as it was for me and still is for me now. I have been with Cathay since 1998 and love my job. I just think you should not ignore this package you are being offered. Be very aware that if you come here with no housing allowance you will not be able to afford to live here. It is one thing being in a low paid job in your own country, and a completely other thing to be in a low paid job in some one else's country. In Hong Kong most foreigners have quite well paid jobs and these are the people you will be socialising with. You will just be miserable and resentful when you find out too late that you can't afford to buy your kids milk in the supermarket. Don't think about staff travel as you won't be able to afford it. Small 3 bedroom flat at the moment in DB about 15 to 25000 per month. Not much left on a 32000 per month income. And for those that have been told no school allowance as local schools are free. First, classes are in Cantonese, and second if you were going to send your kids through the public school system, why would you not do it in your own country.
You are being misled in the interview. By the time you find this out, if you came with a family, they wont be here as you will not be able to support them in Hong Kong. I have two children, wife and a nice garden apartment. I live in a style that I would expect to live in my own country given the job I have. If I was living a as a pauper and not around my family and friends at the same time, then I could not live as an ex-pat.
I've taken the time to post this as you need to know the facts. If you have a job in aviation, do not leave it for this one. If you are unemployed at the moment with little or no prospects of employment in your country then ok. Hell, I even got housing paid for when I was working in PNG nearly 20 years ago.

[suntorytimo]

If you went to live in Discovery Bay in your first year as an SO you would be absolutely nuts, what an expensive place to live. What about Lantau island? You can get a reasonably sized 2 bedroom flat for 10,000 a month at the upper range. Share that with another cadet and you're fine.

If you're single with no dependents then the cadet program is incredible. Remember you get paid for duty flight hours as well, and that the new salary pay rise is really quite good for SOs.

[Cpt. Underpants]

What about Lantau island

Sorry to burst your bubble, but "expat" grade apartments aren't HKD10K any more. Try HKD15K+.

Then you'd need a car, public transport (when you want to go to work) is really not that reliable unless you WANT to add an hours' grace...

Car licence HKD5500/year.
Insurance (liability only) HKD1500/year.
Petrol HKD14+/Litre
Lantau permit HKD?
Parking HKD1600/month
Car P.O.S. HKD20K - Decent shape HKD60K+

Share that with another cadet and you're fine

Crash-padding working for CX? Living the dream. Remember Colgan Air and KBUF.

Think carefully.

[aile_striker]

Hi everyone,

I'm new to this forum. Like everyone else, I have a dream of being a pilot. Dream, but not unreachable. I took my first attempt 5 years ago (in 2005) and failed miserably. I guess I was categorized as a 'passing phase', a commonly found wannabe, which i wont argue because that was probably true.

But after working for 5 years in another totally unrelated industry and numerous other life experiences, i still feel my love for aviation and decide to have a second shot at it. I just applied 2 weeks ago, before the Chinese New Year holidays, any one else here have applied around this time?

I've been reading the first 20 pages of this thread.. there's so much useful information here! Anyhow, does anyone know if the selection process have changed since this thread began in 2009?

I've a some questions:

1) is the holding period still present? (the CP32-5 classes waiting up to 12 months before having first flight and CP36 up to 6 months)

2) i notice there's a session going on right now, does anyone know when abouts the next intake would be?

Thanks!

[LHA649]

It is nice to inform us Cadets and future SOs about the housing and funding situation in Hong Kong. I believe it is all a matter of how one approaches life in Hong Kong, and how one deals with the given circumstances.

[busdriver2010]

Anyone for Stage 2 on Mar23 in HK?

[LHA649]

not yet, but could be as I had my Stage 1 on Feb 14th. Hope I hear back from then soon :) When was ur Stage 1 and how long did u wait for Stage 2?

[busdriver2010]

Stage 1: Feb1, ICAO exam; Feb 17.. Are you finished with your ICAO exam?

[Pitot Probe]

1st: I normally don't even read these forums anymore. It is way too negative.

2nd: To all the current CX pilots delibarately shooting down the dreams of potential flyers because they only worry about their own jobs: shame on you!! If you cannot state facts in a professional manner and hate CX so much, then do us all a favour; leave.

That said, I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but it seems like CX has just decided to cut the S/O to F/O upgrades for this year by half!
This stems from the new rules coming into play allowing them to crew long haul flights with two S/Os.
For someone like me, that's been around 3 years, and was hoping to upgrade inside 4 years; it now looks like closer to 5 years as a S/O, with no further pay rise till upgrading!

I know that a lot of new joiners will see this as a mere blip in their career, but I do beleive that this should be weighed as a factor when making a decision to join CX. I am now reluctantly accepting the fact that it will take more than 13 years to become a captain (beleive me, that sucks!)

As for the new contract on offer for International Cadetts - I will only say this:
If you are young (<24) and single, you can possibly consider it. Get in, get to F/O and get out. (You can then restart in a company in your home country at around age 30, which is still possible to do)
If you are married or coming to HKG with a partner: forget it, this contract is just not for you.

I apologise if I am breaking my own rules and being too negative here, but I am trying to keep emotion out of it and provide facts only.

If anyone needs ANY information about moving to HKG, cost of living, available housing, prices, etc; please PM me, I will provide as much help as possible.

Regards
PP

[LHA649]

so 16 days, cant wait!

no whats the ICAO exam about?

[LHA649]

did u get a call or mail from cathay?

[suntorytimo]

Well 5 minutes of research yielded the following 4 properties in South Lantau

http://www.expatflats.com/property-pui-o-lo-uk-$6000-2215-2.html
http://www.expatflats.com/property-tong-fuk-2/f-plus-roof-$6k-2121-2.html
http://www.expatflats.com/property-mui-wo-scenic-crest-terrace-$5500-2225-2.html
http://www.expatflats.com/property-mui-wo-center-$10k-2233-2.html

The top 3 are all 2 bedrooms and about $6000 a month. This took 5 minutes, I'm sure with more time you could find better properties.

You seriously don't need a car, even in Lantau, take a minibus!

I honestly think that when you guys are setting your standards for coming to Hong Kong, they are not typical of what should be expected as a SO. We don't expect to have houses with gardens and nights out in Wan Chai. We expect to have to scrape by at first, and when using sensible figures and sources to calculate monthly expenditures, there's quite a lot of room to play with before exhausting that month's salary.

Go ahead and do the calculations yourself, take one of those $6k properties, although they're two bedrooms, assume you're renting it by yourself, and see how much cash you have left over that month. Don't play silly buggers and throw in ridiculous expenses like cars. Even if you give yourself insanely high allowances for food, utilities and others, I doubt you can exceed that month's budget.

[Cpt. Underpants]

We don't expect to have houses with gardens and nights out in Wan Chai. We expect to have to scrape by

Your expectations will be met - and then some. For years and years and years...

[NoseGear]

The breathless rush to take up these cadet positions is quite frankly sad to see:(

sunytorytimo, have you ever been to Hong Kong? Your statements justifying being poor, no nights out etc etc are ridiculous in the extreme. What are you planning on doing in your tiny little flat during your 20 days off a month...?:hmm: And by the way, Disco Bay IS on Lantau Island. If you want to prostitute yourself then I'll make a little wager with you and any other cadet here....in less than 3 years, when you are still broke, no pay rise, can't go out, can't travel and staring down the barrel of at least another 2 years in the back you'll all be whinging like a windmill in a Typhoon:E;):D And not one of us will want to hear it. Of course, there is then the small matter of your JFO upgrade after 5+ years in the jumpseat, because if you don't pass that, your out and you'll soon find your P2X rating about at useful as soggy loo paper.

Pitotprobe......
To all the current CX pilots delibarately shooting down the dreams of potential flyers because they only worry about their own jobs: shame on you!! If you cannot state facts in a professional manner and hate CX so much, then do us all a favour; leave.

You make this comment and then go on to moan about 5 years as an SO? Are you not doing the exact same thing?:rolleyes: I've read this forum and what I can see is current pilots advising, using facts, about what these cadets can expect when they get here and perhaps opening their eyes and, dare I say it, even helping some make an informed decision. You offer nothing and if you think its a case of "shooting down dreams" don't you think CX is doing that to you, and most definately to the cadets....?:ugh: Good lord man, get a grip. :hmm:

The wager stands.

[Cpt. Underpants]

Suntory

http://www.squarefoot.com.hk/property_more_images/3570242/5

Your third search (Scenic Crest) is on the commercial wharf, 24/7 unloading for the "Wellcome" (spelled correctly) supermarket directly opposite, the correctional services wharf (prisoner transfer for the nearby gaol) and within earshot of the cement factory - just out of view. Did I mention the VERY popular "China Bear" pub and it's noisy clientele (unaffordable on an S/O salary BTW) across the way?

Great choice. You'll last a month, then spend 11 months trying to wriggle out of 24 month lease...

[404 Titan]

suntorytimo

As has been stated before, you can find many cheap places in HK but do you want to live in an area that isn’t accommodating and welcoming of expats? Do a little research and you will find that there has been some serious unrest about expats moving to certain parts of South Lantau in the very recent past. Racism unfortunately is alive and well in Hong Kong for those expats venturing too far outside the more traditional areas that expats tend to live.

Sure you don’t need a car “all the time”. Have you actually done any research into the bus service on South Lantau though? What about the taxi service? When you have come back and tell me how you will make it work. Just in case you haven’t worked it out yet, you won’t be working normal office hours in this job

It still amazes me that some of you actually think you know more about living in Hong Kong from browsing the internet than some of us who actually live here. You really are in for a rude shock when you actually move here.:ugh:

[Cessna414CC]

Anyone out there reading these postings, possible inside CX, know approximatly how many cadets have applied since it opened to International and how many thus far have been accepted to the programme?

[GTC58]

The number I've heard is around 20000 cadet applications since the international cadet program started. Intake was around 80-120 cadets/SO per year. Apparently this year the cadet intake will be doubled.

[flynhigh]

Has any of these tools have actually passed Cathay type training….getting an interview is one thing but passing Cathay training is something else….:{

[aile_striker]

well spotted.. seems like there's almost no one coming back to the forums and write to us after they passed the interviews and the training... or they havn't said so

[SloppyJoe]

there are of course many ex cadets working as SOs at cx. Most pass the training after AUS and most but not all pass the upgrade to FO.

[suntorytimo]

Fine I surrender, I'll just go and take that other pilot job where they pay for all of my training and then start me off on £32,000 a year post tax.

I beg your apology for possibly suggesting that a pilot who has just received his CPL would scrape by, because lord knows, all new CPL pilots start off on really cushy jobs, don't pay for type ratings, and get housing allowances in Europe, and of course there are enough of these jobs going around for everyone!

You want to know why no one goes on this forum, because most of the guys with a modicum of sense steer clear of you trolls who clearly have an axe to grind.

[404 Titan]

suntorytimo

Again you shoot from the hip. If you had bothered to do some research, something you seem to be reluctant to do, you would have discovered I have helped many wannabes try and get into CX in the past. I won’t sit by though and let wannabes have their lives ruined by financial entrapment when they discover they can’t afford to live in Hong Kong on the package being offered. £32000.00 before tax will be a very tight existence for someone in the third most expensive city in the world to live. I had more disposable income in my first year of GA flying in Australia in the late 80’s then you will have here flying a wide body jet. If you can’t see you are being taken advantage of because of your naivety of everything to do with this industry then god help us all.
You want to know why no one goes on this forum, because most of the guys with a modicum of sense steer clear of you trolls who clearly have an axe to grind.
You’re kidding right? 2224 post on this thread, 95% by wannabes speaks for itself. Considering you only have 24 posts to your name it's a bit of a rich calling us trolls. I suggest you look in the mirror sunshine.:ugh:

Hong Kong, Third most expensive rents in the World (http://blogs.wsj.com/hong-kong/2011/02/15/hong-kong-rents-third-most-expensive-in-world/)

[Cessna414CC]

Thanks GTC58. Do you know when it opened to International, not too long ago correct?

[GTC58]

Approx. 2 years ago.

[TopTup]

Suntory & friends:

Let's get one thing straight. The CX iCadets are nothing more than the CHEAPEST way CX can fill a map folding seat. Nothing more, nothing less. You are not part of ellite group as the speaches at the graduation ceremonies will tell you via a Goebels-esque propagander speach. If this were not true they would've employed the many pilots on the T & C's that they interviewed under & were successful in those interviews from 3 years ago. At least they (all but 1 i believe) had the experience knowledge of CX & the industry to see when they are being taken advantage of & refuse such an insult.

Pilots with actual CX experience and knowledge are not offering hints or advice, they are telling you & the others in no uncertain terms the truth. But it is obvious you & the others are so easily led & ignorant to to truth & facts that you insist on dismissing them.

When all is said & done you have actively & deliberately lowered the T & C's of a once great airline. In truth, I don't blame ignorant, starry eyed children for such mistakes. More so the greedy managements profiteering from this ignorance. I do & will blame ignorant, starry eyed children when all the advice & evidence is before them but they are so arrogant in their own assertion to be right that they ignore it.

[crwjerk]

We expect to have to scrape by at first, and when using sensible figures and sources to calculate monthly expenditures, there's quite a lot of room to play with before exhausting that month's salary.

Wake up call......... A CX second officer has never had to "scrape by". It's always been a positive career move in many ways, financially mainly. Not so any more though. With all these SJS jumping at these inadequate conditions, they are sure NOT to improve.

By the way Pitot Probe, spell check before you spout off.

[Cessna414CC]

Not a commercial pilot, not a cadet either. However, in reading these posts, it seems to me two things must be accepted if one has the choice to become a cadet:

1. Money is bad as SO, especially in HK. No housing credits either, likely never.
2. The overall airline trend is to cut benefits and pay. CX is no exception, and the cadet programme is a great example of that. Seems to me one must get used to that if they're in the industry. That's the way it is, join them eyes wide open.

What I wonder is how someone with limited experience as an aviator, after a flight school and undoubtedly great training, can expect to fly with 4 years of monkey see and zero monkey do (save for sim training I understand every-other month) with adequate performance in tough situations? So long as you accept the two facts above it seems like a great opportunity but will this give the proper foundation to move to FO and so-forth?

I'm not knocking what I am sure is expectational CX training, and nobody would move to JFO without passing the evaluations. Nonetheless it begs the question......

[WhatThe?]

The answer to that is 'DEFO', the FO spots will go to outsiders when needed, that is after the current DESO's are moved up to JFO.
My "crystal ball" is telling me the ICadets will stay as SO's for the maximum term of their contract, then be upgraded very slowly. Because after-all they will all be soooo bitter by then that as soon as they make FO and get some time on something larger than a Cessna.....they will be leaving in droves.

However if you are 20 now, you will be a Widebody FO before you are 30, and with 30 more years of flying ahead of you this might just payoff for you? Now if you are 30+......well......ahhhhh:eek:

[The Rents]

Hi, just joined the forum, I have never posted before, but do have a little bit of up to date information to share with you guys who are considering the Cathay Cadet Scheme.
The initial salary has just risen by 9% this year, will increase by 3% next year taking OTE to approxamately £40,000 per annum with the inclusion of annual bonus's and allowances. I have just found out from a very reliable source that there is going to be a housing allowance allocated to Second Officers of approx £10,000 per annum.
There are about 40,000 applicants in the pool at the moment looking for sponsorship and it seems that Cathay may be looking to double the intake for Cadets this year.
My experience of Cathay is limited, but I have found them up to press to be an extremely supportive company towards their cadets where opportunities for these young men and women are few and far between.
The Cadet scheme is open to all nationalities and has been since June 2009.
I know that the cost of living is expensive in Hong Kong, but the reality for these cadets is to have no prospect and no money or grasp this chance and have a carear with a first class world leading company and a bright future.
I sincerly hope this helps some of you hopefuls out there make a more informed decision. If any of you guys have interviews, the best of luck, be assured though, you will have to be exceptional to be chosen.

[captain.weird]

Hey Guys,

How can I the best train myself for Stage 1? What sort of selection is it(interview,test)?

Thanks!

[LHA649]

have a look at my Cathay Stage 1 report!

[orangeboy]

Captain Weird,

Few suggestions

1 - read this entire thread - there's alot of waffle going on, but also alot of good info regarding all aspects of the selection process

2 - what level of flight experience do you have? your knowledge should commensurate your level of experience at the very very least, but would be strongly recommended you study material beyond what you would be expected to know with your experience. There is a base knowledge level that is expected of you being the material in the JKI booklet that is sent to you when you are invited for stage 1.

3 - you can never be too prepared

goodluck and sit patiently till u get the email invite :ok:

[carpet weaver]

Quick question regarding the JKI test

Are the questions about specific information on the booklet CX sent us or are the questions more general stuff from the booklet.


For example

The book gives an example about variation.

"the variation in Burma and Western Australia is nil, whereas at Vancouver Island it is 25 Degrees E and the other side of Canada, in Newfoundland, it is over 30 Degrees W."

Could CX as a question like

"what is the variation in Burma and Western Australia"..

Im trying to figure out the best way to study for this...

Thanks

[tarmac12]

Just a quick one. I noticed today CX advertising for cadets on a European website. I have had an application in for 6 months and not a peep from them. I have fATPL with the right education and thought I would at least get a reply. Others I know who applied at the same time have gone off for stage one and others as well as me hear nothing. Is there some magic wand that is waved to select people?

I find it hard to understand why they are advertising when they have I would think hundreds of people on the books already.

VIEW JOBS - Latest Pilot Jobs provides the latest aviation vacancies around the world. (http://latestpilotjobs.com/view-jobs.html)

[SloppyJoe]

Just out of interest tarmac, are you married or have kids/dependants?

[Chewie-gentle giant]

Does Anybody know what is in the aviation maths test for the 2nd stage of interviews?

Anybody that has done it recently any info would be much appreciated

[captain.weird]

Dear Orangeboy,

No, I don't have any flight experience!

@LHA: What a report! Thanks!

[Cessna414CC]

Sloppyjoe, do you have insight as to why/whether being married with or without kids matters to CX? Obviously, one would need some other form of income to make that work on SO salary but would that automatically omit you from being a candidate, based upon your knowledge?

[CharlieFly]

Hi guys, I know this is a question from a novice but what is the JKI booklet and where can i get a copy?

thanks

[carpet weaver]

Quick question regarding the JKI test

Are the questions about specific information on the booklet CX sent us or are the questions more general stuff from the booklet.


For example

The book gives an example about variation.

"the variation in Burma and Western Australia is nil, whereas at Vancouver Island it is 25 Degrees E and the other side of Canada, in Newfoundland, it is over 30 Degrees W."

Could CX as a question like

"what is the variation in Burma and Western Australia"..

Im trying to figure out the best way to study for this...

Thanks



bump!!.........

[Smell the Coffee]

Most of the JKI questions are specific to the booklet, there are one or two questions the booklet doesn't cover (what's longer, a 747 or an A340-600...etc.)

The JKI test really is pretty basic - very little thinking and more of a memory test than anything else.

Basically, can you be bothered to read this booklet we've sent out to you, and understand the main points?

It really is not worth worrying about ... I think you need to focus on learning at least up to your experience level and beyond.

You'll also need to think about your career at CX, and whether it will suit you in the long term - some interviewers will ask. Hong Kong is NOT for everyone ...

[Koyo]

You can't calculate magnetic deviation since it's not evenly distributed. If you're in US, go down to your local pilot supply store and pick up either From The Ground Up (US edition) or ASA The Pilot's Manual PM2 - Ground School and start reading. At least understand the PPL bits of the book so you actually understand the JKI instead of repeating answers. They will for sure ask questions based on your experience.

[Capt Toss Parker]

Record profits and yet they expect pilots to try and live in Hong Kong on this dismal package with no housing .... it's a joke guys.

Real-estate has gone up 120% in the past 5 years ... the P2X rating you get as a second officer is not a full rating ... you cant do anything with it if you decide to leave after 2 years.

YouTube - Fragrant Cadetships (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D1y2YaWFh2M)

[Stallone]

people who want to get into this cadetship must be ready to stay for at least 5years, or until F/O rank

if not you're simply wasting time., 'cause you'll end up with nothing

well unless another airline recruits you, then you can leave..

[NoseGear]

If it wasn't so serious, and distressing to see, the accurate and critical information regarding the cost of living here is just completely disregarded by the applicants.:rolleyes: Just read above when suntory et al were arguing with those of us here....just completely ignored in the rush for "how do I get on that shiny jet":ugh::ugh::ugh:

[crwjerk]

Looks like they'll now get something much better than nothing per month, up to a maximum of not much at all after 10 years as a Captain. Still, the amount was offered because nobody is taking up the positions. So come on up boys and girls!!!

[The Rents]

Am I the only guy in the world who has heard that CX Second Officers are going to get a 10000 HKD per month Housing allowance soon.

Please someone else tell me they have heard this too !!

If this is the case congrats to all those that have committed already to CX cadet Scheme...

[Capt Toss Parker]

$10,000 might sweeten the deal but it is still the biggest con act in history.

S/O's used to get 24K and then they went to the full housing after two years ... they got $55K on the variable rate.

Dicky Boy has effectively halved the S/O package ....

The company is making record profits and they still have the gale to hit the flight crews where it hurts. :yuk:

[404 Titan]

The Rents

Yeh, we have heard about it. Looking at your posts (Grand total of 2 and first registered Feb 2011) you seem to know more than any cadet should know. You even know more than pilots already here know. I would guess you are probably management trying to talk up the Icad scheme.:yuk:

All I would ask though is it in your contract? If it isn’t, then it isn’t legally binding. Ask the instructors in Adelaide what they were promised by the company when they were due to come to Hong Kong after completing two years instructing in Adelaide. They were promised full expat packages including housing etc only to have the company renege on that promise. Unless it is in your contract it isn’t worth anything.

If the rumour is true though and the company honours it, it will be a cash allowance and not a Housing Allowance. Would you like me to explain the difference and the tax implications of receiving a cash allowance? How about the implications of it not being indexed to the Hong Kong Government rental index, especially considering that Hong Kong is experiencing high inflation at the moment caused by the peg of the Hong Kong Dollar to the US Dollar, low interest rates and the influx of hot money into emerging markets like Hong Kong and China from the US’s QE2 policies.

The reality is that if most of you num nuts had never applied to the Icad scheme in the first place the company would have been forced to offer full expat terms. :ugh:

The mere fact there is a rumour that the company may offer some cash allowance is an indication that CX aren’t getting the numbers of suitable applicants they need. They have effectively shown their hand and admitted that the current package is insufficient. The reality though is that even the new package, if true, is grossly insufficient as well.

Caveat Emptor.

[G_Orwell]

Whoever applies for the scheme, should at least talk with a pilot of Cathay Pacific in Hong Kong. Networking helps trust me! If I were you and progressed to the 2nd interview in Hong Kong, I would contact HKAOA for info. Seems like everybody are extracting all their info from this forum (This has been said before).

[carpet weaver]

Hey guys,

iv been reading through these forums and i have noticed people talking about stage 1a/1b. I have invited to attended just "stage 1". Is this both stage 1a and 1b combined? I have also noticed people talking about a presentation and ICAO test. In my email it said that I will only be doing

· Job Knowledge Test (45 minutes)

· Reasoning Test (45 minutes)

· Wombat-CS Test (Situational awareness)

· Personality Test (30 minutes)

· Interview (General + Technical)(45 minutes) Technical questions will based on the Job Knowledge booklet attached and further gauged to the individual’s experience level

can anyone give me some insight as to whether of not i have a presentation.

[AKOTA]

The Ultimate SO Guide
By Second Officers X, Y and Z.


Introduction

Ever dreamed of soaring among the clouds, pushing the throttles forward as you accelerate 400tonns of metal down the runway? Watched aviators navigate the skies, arriving with a firm touchdown some fourteen hours later and wonder if that could ever be you? Remaining calm as you’re confronted with an emergency requiring all your knowledge and skill to be applied in just the right sequence to save the lives of your passengers and crew?

As a Second Officer, you can forget all that. Your function is to eat any food not consumed by senior crewmembers, prepare the bunks for the real pilots and stare into darkness knowing that if anything actually happens which require the last bit of decision making or actual pilot skills, you’re on your way to the back of the cockpit as fast as you can say “sandwich?”

Since your job doesn’t really amount to much, the company hasn’t bothered to write a job description for you. The only place you’re mentioned is when describing your place in the food-chain; squeezed in tightly between the ISM and the safety pilot. In real life, mind you, you’re below the ISM, the captain’s wife, all first class passengers, as well as any positioning aircrew. If you want some respect as a result of your fancy title and giant hat, the 19 year old stationed at L5 is your best bet. Anyone wearing black, blue or purple uniform is above you, and if it wasn’t for the fact that there are actually two pilots required in the cockpit, you’d never see any of them from takeoff to landing.

So we’ve written this guide to help you along in your new role as a Second Officer. With the ink still wet on your P2X rating and your hat still looking like a nuclear mushroom cloud, reading the following pages will at least let you pretend to know what you’re supposed to be doing.


Dispatch

Sign on time is 70 minutes prior to departure. You’d be an idiot to actually show up 70 minutes prior to departure, giving away your newbie status immediately. As a Second Officer, you’re expected to be there early enough to stock the flight documents bag with all the essentials; ear plugs, sanitary wipes, moisturizers and covers for the headsets. You’ll ultimately be blamed if a missed NOTAM causes any problems down the line, so you’re also expected to memorize closed taxiways and shortened runways for airports you’ll never see from your windowless seat. You should retrieve the DDG from dispatch if there are any ADD’s raised, and be prepared to wait outside the circle as the rest of the crew huddle in secrecy to discuss any implications the DDG might have. Once they’ve finished, you take the DDG back to dispatch without a clue as to what just happened.

This takes us on to the flight documents. Gross-error checks are big part of the operation, and just like real pilots you’re expected to make your own little notes on your own little paper in your own non-standardized way about the flight. Make a note of the estimated ZFW on your paper, and when the others decide on how much fuel to bring, add that to the ZFW. You now have your very own ramp weight, and after deducting any taxi burn you should be able to estimate your TOW. A further deduction of trip-fuel should give you the landing weight, which as the SO has no meaning to you what-so-ever.

Some captains, having recently completed a CRM course, might ask you about relevant NOTAMS or weather of concern. But most don’t. Keeping your mouth shut, your back straight and your eyes down will make you look the role of a seasoned SO; not expected to provide any useful information and not deemed worthy to share any with.

As the “briefing” comes to a close, expect the ISM to approach the table having finished her own separate briefing for the cabin crew at a different location. You have no idea what she has told her crew, and in the best CRM fashion she has no idea what we're expecting from the flight. She will smile, introduce herself to the Captain, and shake your hand.

With everything set to go, your job is to collect all the paperwork, less the Initial Dispatch Message and Crew Currency Sheet. Place them in the flight documents bag and carry them to the aircraft like the junior crewmember you are. If the captain wears a jacket, put on a jacket. If he wears a hat, put on your hat. And off you go to board the bus.

[AKOTA]

Boarding

Once on the bus, it’s customary to introduce yourself to the girls if you haven’t already done so. A big wave while stating your name is just fine, and expect a synchronized greeting in return. The girls sit in the back, while you take your seat somewhere in the first two rows. Once the bus gets rolling, expect the Captain to make a “briefing” to the girls, which includes the flight time, the weather at destination, the taxi-time and the procedures to be used for opening the cockpit door. Any query for questions at this stage will be met with silence.

When arriving at the aircraft, enter the aircraft via the L2 staircase; not the L1 leading to first class. An engineer or refueller will approach the captain with a water sample, and the operating FO will hand the refueling record to the same guy with either flight-plan fuel (minus X tons standby depending on your fleet) or some other fuel figure unknown to you on it. Climb the stairs to the door leading into the jet bridge, preferably behind the captain as it’s common courtesy to let him enter the aircraft first.

Making your way to the cockpit, the magazine rack looks very tempting. Try not to let the girls see you grabbing the last copy of The Economist, Newsweek, and Car and Driver, and depending on whom the captain is it might be a good idea to keep them out-of-sight until the first fuel-check is complete and you're sitting in deafening silence over Indonesia with the poor sod who's been nominated RQ.

 
Pre-Departure

Once arriving on the flight deck, the first thing usually done is a read-through of the aircraft log. Most captains will work their way from the front to the back, highlighting any noting exterior damage to be verified on the walk-around by the RQ. SADDs, PADDs and ADDs are reviewed, with any open items requiring DDG dispatch. As a second officer, you merely observe this process and are seldom asked for any input or comments. Once the log review is complete, the RQ departs the flight-deck for the walk around leaving you with three all-important tasks; making the bunks(744 only), eating the sandwiches and performing the safety-checks in accordance with FCOM 3. Performing the safety checks should take you 2-3 minutes, leaving plenty of time for the sandwiches and bunk-making. Take note, however, that making the bunks is catch 22. Almost all captains, increasing with seniority, expect you to make the bunks. Some captains, however, expect you to be on the jump seat observing every entry made into the FMCs, and will reprimand you for preparing the bunks when there’s “real work to be done” (like watching the back of someone’s hand punching fingers into a keypad you can’t read below a screen that you can’t see for reasons you can’t know because the ATIS and final ZFW are lying face down above the throttles.) Make the best of it.

You’re usually done making the bunks about the same time as the RQ returns from his hike around the aircraft. He’ll often take the middle seat, although FOs waiting to hit the bunk at clean speed might offer you the seat. Once seated, you’ve now got ages of time to enjoy those tasty sandwiches before it’s time to complete your final task; checking the fuel figures.

The engineer will bring the fuel order form to the flight deck once refueling has been completed. This can’t be done before we’ve received the final ZFW, which means checking the final fuel load is one of the last things we do before departure. Your job will be to verify that the expected upload matches the actual upload. Add the sums of all the liters (or US gallons) uploaded from the fuel receipts, multiply it by the specific gravity to arrive at the total upload in tons. Compare this with the expected upload, allowing +2t/-1t of discrepancy, and at the same time compare the actual fuel distribution in the tanks to the pre-calculated fuel distribution tables found in the overhead console. Pass the fuel-records to the skipper and let him know you’ve checked them to be correct.

Once this is complete, you’re all done. Sit back, fasten your belt and try to stay awake. The final visit to the cockpit will be done shortly by the gate-agent, who provides the captain with the final passenger number and load-sheet edition. She’ll close the cockpit door on her way out, and as soon as the L2 door shuts the guys in the window seats will ask for a pushback.

[AKOTA]

Taxi, Takeoff and Climb

If you’re sitting in the middle seat, it’s expected that you open the Jepps and follow what is going on via a third set of charts. This, of course, would require you to actually know what departure they’re going to fly and what speeds have been briefed. Unfortunately, you were probably tucking in the sheets on the Captains bunk during that part of the briefing. But normally, reclining in the seat behind the captain, just try to keep your eyes open while reminding yourself why you’re even there in the first place.

The last task which may be assigned to you prior to takeoff will be obtaining a new RTOW if any significant weather changes have occurred since they entered the takeoff data at the gate. Now you’ve got to mobilize yourself from complete apathy to vigorous engagement in a matter of seconds, finding the latest ATIS, remembering how the ACARS actually works, and re-enter the data which you haven’t entered since, well - Never. Because the change was not given until just before takeoff, we don’t have a lot of time and the RQ FO steps in to save the day. New thrust figures are subsequently derived, the V speeds fall out and are rapidly reentered, and seconds later the jet rumbles down the runway. As the centerline lights turn from white to alternating reds the aircraft is rotated and the sandwich tray you’ve heroically been trying to finish launches off the back of the desk and hits the wall in a loud crash, while the padding for the escape hatch (744) falls to the floor resulting in a significant rise in cockpit noise during the critical phase of flight. At this point, shrug your shoulders to the RQ and hope that the skipper didn’t have a(nother) heart-attack.

After the takeoff has been completed, it’s not unusual to hear the DEFO ask for flaps up during a turn while accelerating through the clean speed. As a result, expect either strong buffeting or a strong reprimand. The latter is more enjoyable, rest assured.

Once clean (and out of the buffet), ask for the clipboard and start doing the arithmetic of modern aviation. After you’ve added together all the individual leg segments to the departure time, you should be presented with an expected arrival time. Once complete, you’re once again free to relax and enjoy the tranquility of the modern flight deck.

 
Cruise

At top of climb, you either hit the bunk or climb into the seat for the next X monotonous hours. Once you’re in the seat, you’ll probably be performing the function of PM as you’re getting the worst rest (SO, remember?), and with the captain taking the good rest the only guy left for you to fly with is the poor guy who’s been nominated as RQ. He can only perform RQ from the right, and since you’re not allowed to “fly” the aircraft from the left the only possible outcome entails you doing all the paperwork, radio work, and staying-awake work. Touching the heading bug or pressing the "level change" button is years beyond your qualification level, even though the guy sitting next to you (who only joined about 6 months ago) is "relief command qualified" and should theoretically be capable of protecting you from your own incapable self.

Once you’ve got the seat and pedals adjusted, it’s time to start the paperwork. But not before missing a radio call because you can’t find the microphone since you’ve never actually been in the seat without a headset on. Even if you did, you still don't have a clue as to what the Chinese controller is saying. But not to worry, most don't. Reply “Roger. Maintain FL[XXX]m, report [next FIR border waypoint], estimating [FIR border waypoint] at [xxxx]. That should safely get you through most of China, Mongolia and Russia.

Now, start the paperwork by doing a fuel check, noting the difference between the totalizer/calculated totals and the expected total on the CFP for a certain waypoint. Note the difference on the CFP, and compare this figure to the takeoff fuel. Once every hour, you’ll do a new one. It might be a good idea to mark these off on the CFP so that you don’t forget amongst all the other important things you’ll be doing, but we're confident you'll figure that out all by yourself.

When you’ve managed to ascertain that we’re not going to run out of fuel just yet, it’s time to “put the steps in.” By itself, the FMC will calculate the optimum FL based on the aircrafts current weight and speed, and subsequently display this figure on the VNAV cruise page. However, the “optimum” flight levels stipulated on the CFP are based on aircraft weight, aircraft speed and forecasted winds along the routes. It may not always be smart to step up into a 50kt headwind to save a few kilograms of fuel due to weight. Therefore, you must manually enter the steps as found in the CFP into the FMC. This should update your arrival time to a more correct figure, which is further improved once you’ve entered the expected STAR and approach into the FMC. When the ISM calls up and asks you for the expected arrival time, you’ll hopefully have finished this and be able to provide her with an accurate ETA. Keep in mind that the service schedule onboard is built backwards from the arrival time; screw this up and you’ll be drinking coffee sweetened with saliva and cyanide.

With the initial fuel check being completed, the steps entered and the expected arrival set up, you’re now looking forward to several hours of complete and utter boredom. You are, as a matter of historical tradition, expected to know where the hell you are, for which the Jeppesen enroute charts do wonders. If you ever actually manage to locate yourself on one, get a highlighter and mark the spot, because the chances of doing that twice are next to none. Your best bet for maintaining situational awareness is to print the maps off the route briefing pages on IntraCX, and keep track of the airports listed in the NOTAM list as you progress. Along with the magnitude of information available to you in the AERADs, this should be plenty to keep yourself oriented as you cross Continents and Oceans.

Apart from updating the CFP, there is really nothing else to do. Your trusty RQ will fly the aircraft single-pilot, get all the weather, and make any decisions which may or may not need deciding. You are truly being groomed for the responsibilities that lie ahead. With nobody expecting anything from you, there is no need to deliver.

About halfway through the flight, wake the guys up and creep into a nice, warm bunk.
 

Descent and Landing

Expect to be awoken from the bunk either by someone shaking your foot at TOD or by your own eardrums popping as the cabin equalizes during the final descent. Exiting the soothing comfort of the dark bunk, you’ll stumble down the stairs into bright daylight still wearing your pyjamas and earplugs. The guys are all wearing sunglasses and configuring for landing as you notice the toiletries have been removed from the bathroom and you can’t find your toothbrush. So you put on your uniform, run water through your face and pop a piece of gum before taking your seat and strapping yourself in as we descend on the glideslope and drop the landing gear. You’ve probably never been to the airport before at this stage, but what does it matter? After touchdown the airplane makes its way off the runway and taxis among all the other jumbos on its way to the gate. You’re still wondering where we are as the aircraft docks and the PF cuts the engines and turns off the seatbelts. Time to work.

“Pass the Charts, Gentlement” is your statement at this stage. Taking over the charts and the mini-jepp, you meticulously place them back in the binder in numerical order, making the extra effort not to put them back into the departure airport. You then unlock the cockpit door before removing all the garbage, magazines, newspapers and water bottles and placing them outside the cockpit. Retrieving your jacket and hat, you exit the cockpit and comb the upper deck for earplugs, toothbrushes and socks to take home as presents for your girlfriend. Once the real pilots have shut down and secured the aircraft, everyonel exits the aircraft in an orderly fashion, making sure to thank all the girls you can’t remember the names of.

Now, get on the bus, check into the hotel and get some sleep, watch some porno and drink plenty of beer before doing it all over again on the way home.

Do this for 4 years straight and you just might become suitable to move into a window seat.

[captain.weird]

and further gauged to the individual’s experience level

And if the candidate doesn't have any experience, what will/can they ask then?

[orangeboy]

if no flight experience, then they'd probably ask you questions from the JKI booklet and probably anything upto a BAK level - i had about 20 hours when i applied, so i was asked questions upto a BAK level. But tbh, if you only read from the JKI booklet then you can leave yourself quite exposed as they want to see you have done extra reading rather than just what they have given you.

There is so much material you could possibly tackle, but always start with the basics and progress from there, don't try and jump a few levels missing the basic foundations.

if you'd like an idea on material, maybe visit or talk to a flying school and see what they use textbook wise to train students from scratch to CPL, or even go into an aviation store and ask them what they'd recommend.

[midnightsky]

Good day guys,

Anyone heading to HK for stage 2 on the 14th - 15th of March?

I've got a question, when they say "Aviation Math Test", what kind of question will I be expecting? I've gone through all pages in this forum but no avail. Any idea?

[crwjerk]

Once clean (and out of the buffet), ask for the clipboard and start doing the arithmetic of modern aviation. After you’ve added together all the individual leg segments to the departure time, you should be presented with an expected arrival time. Once complete, you’re once again free to relax and enjoy the tranquility of the modern flight deck. OR just add the flight time to the take off time. But that would be too much common sense at this stage?

After the takeoff has been completed, it’s not unusual to hear the DEFO ask for flaps up during a turn while accelerating through the clean speed. As a result, expect either strong buffeting or a strong reprimand. The latter is more enjoyable, rest assured. Don't you mean Flaps 5 Speed? :eek:

Aviation Maths, after all the hard study at Uni to get a Maths degree, is simply adding, subtracting, and multiplying. Sorry to waste your time!

[midnightsky]

Aviation Maths, after all the hard study at Uni to get a Maths degree, is simply adding, subtracting, and multiplying. Sorry to waste your time!

Does this includes interpreting graphs and charts?

[SeniorEagle]

Does Cathay take Indian Pilots?

[betpump5]

I'm usually the first to slap down any fool who ridicules the cadet programme. However that was so well-written and funny that I must applaud you for writting it AKOTA :D

By the way, 10K is not a rumour.

HK$45K a month (£4'090/$5770) for doing everything AKOTA said.

Best deal in the world.

Oh to be an SO again.

[Harbour Dweller]

Brilliant reading AKOTA :ok:

[Stallone]

oh, so it's confirmed there will be HK$10,000 extra per month?

[Green T2]

Correct it HAS been confirmed as 10K a month Housing Allowance. But all new joiners please keep in mind this amount is 1/7th the amount of H.A. that a second officer has access to after 2 years in company under the previous system. You have managed to force them to give you something due to your absence at the job offer phase. If you continue your leverage, through job offer refusal, the offer will improve! Something to consider

[Cpt. Underpants]

To all the halfwits that took the iso offer before the "adjustment" - shame on you. I'm not a betting man but I'll wager you'll ride the backs of the AOA members all your unsatisfying, unfulfilled tenure here.

To those that have stayed away - and continue to do so - good on you. Your actions (and your actions alone) have forced the company to increase the T&C.

[ETOPS240]

By confirmed, do you mean signed in writing on cadet contracts? Or one of the many rumours that are going around..

I sincerely hope it's the former..

[Stallone]

wow, hk govt giving everyone hk$6000 cash.. So good..

[flynhigh]

If these cadets, just wait and not take the job for another 6 month I will guarantee you that CX will add another $10,000 on top of it….they are trying to see how many will take the job with only $10,000:yuk:. Business 101 start low and work your way up base on supply and demand….but these Cadets are too blind to see it:ugh:.

[404 Titan]

Stallone
wow, hk govt giving everyone hk$6000 cash.. So good..
No they aren’t. To receive the tax rebate you must be a permanent resident, i.e. you’ve lived here more than seven years and applied for and received permanent residency or you were born here. As most Icad’s weren’t born in HK, they won’t qualify for the one off rebate.

Regarding the housing assistance promised by the company, it isn’t confirmed until it is in a signed contract. Again ask the instructors in Adelaide what the company promised them. They too thought it was a confirmed deal only to have the company renege on it.

[TopTup]

I'm usually the first to slap down any fool

As usual, wanting to either punch colleagues in the face (previous posts) but this time reverts to a more masculine slap.

Fool: "A silly or stupid person who lacks judgement or sense" (first online dictionary that came up with a hit...)

Oh to be an SO again.

"Again"? Since when were you EVER an SO?? You came to CX as DEFO. We're not all as stupid as you look.

So to allow others to (again) know this "fool's" platform (information from previous posts):

1. a guy who went from flying school to 737 because daddy paid for the endorsement and training, then CX as DEFO on the 74F;
2. a guy who advocates the lowered and lowering conditions borne by the cadets in order to allow one group of CX pilots to suffer financial loss so (as admitted in previous posts) as he sees it, so he doesn't have to. After all, someone has to take the hit and it's better it's someone else rather than yourself (again, just quoting previous posts);
3. a guy who is a member of the AoA advocating for the division of rights and financial reward of some for his own personal gain;
4. a guy who offers cadets words of wisdom from how, what and when to even the role of female pilots at CX;
5. a guy who is so busy feathering his own nest at the expense of others (own admission) that can't wait to throw pure and utter abuse on this forum to anyone with a differing opinion;
6. a guy who admitted to having to change his username in case others discovered who he was and hence retribution due previous (work) history.

Betpump5: I will agree with one thing though- My housing allowance as a DEFO makes it all worth it and yet you push so vehemently for more cadets to take the job and lower the general T's & C's, again, just so you can be comfortable.

iCadets: this is the type of person you are supporting and keeping in the lifestyle he believes he deserves, all at your expense. As he admits, without the CX housing allowance, the job isn't worth it.

People like this are the lowest of the low. Hiding behind an AOA membership yet advocating and pushing for the lesser T & C's of your colleagues.

The iCadet scheme is nothing but the CHEAPEST way to fill a seat. Full stop. No elitist group of the best of the best. More like the naive of the naive. Nearly all of those (except some "fools") see it as a downward spiral in the T's & C's of a once great airline. It is a C-scale movement as defined by the AOA which good 'ole betpump here is a card waving member of, apparently. It is a decline of entry level standards in the extreme and a bastardisation of the original intent of the entire cadet scheme, and all under the cheap guise of racial equality and non-discrimination to lower costs and drive up personal gain (profit bonuses) and share the price.

[betpump5]

you keep on bringing up the same old BS. Lets get something straight. Mr and Miss young CPP Cadet don't give 2 sh!ts about you, me or the T&Cs of the more mature generation at Cathay. They don't know us so hence will not care that us at CX have seen our pockets being emptied over the years - and why should they?

45'000 HKD (£4000) per month for doing bugger all for 4 years! Who the F wouldn't take that deal??? Telling these little lovlies that they'll be living in a shoebox won't matter to them. Change the record fool.

You are giving these poor cadets earache..And giving me heartaburn.

[TopTup]

Is this comment still from your time and experience as an SO? HA! Too funny!!

As an astute financial advisor you have also taken into account cost of living, tax, capacity to rent or buy in the future, the potential financial status upon retirement.......all been said before on this thread.

What do you care? Daddy paid for your career and you have a housing allowance that you believe makes the job (quote).

An earache? Only if you continue to want to bitch slap everyone opposing your point of view (or uncover the truths about you, your motives and history)!

iCadets, here is your representative!!!!

(PS: Saw your PM "Word of Advice". Not sure if a threat or other.... don't care. It was deleted and not read. I've done my yards in this industry and now toward the end as a TRE/I on the 777. I won't waste my time with a person advocating lowering the bar in both experience and financial reward for our industry and passion while riding on the naivety of others so as to feather one's own nest).

[betpump5]

Deleted my private message to you? Very mature. But I have nothing to hide from the readers here. This is what I wrote (naturally i've censored some words):

Whilst no one is criticising your hidden agenda on these forums (none of us want to see our pay pockets emptied), you are going about it completely the wrong way and on the wrong forums and to the wrong people.

its p!ss!ng me off. no cadet deserves to read the negative sh!te you trash the forums with. I stand shoulder to shoulder with you on 100% of everything. just not the method you are going about things.

[stevop21]

you keep on bringing up the same old BS. Lets get something straight. Mr and Miss young CPP Cadet don't give 2 sh!ts about you, me or the T&Cs of the more mature generation at Cathay. They don't know us so hence will not care that us at CX have seen our pockets being emptied over the years - and why should they?

45'000 HKD (£4000) per month for doing bugger all for 4 years! Who the F wouldn't take that deal??? Telling these little lovlies that they'll be living in a shoebox won't matter to them. Change the record fool.

You are giving these poor cadets earache..And giving me heartaburn.

Thats not true, I was thinking about applying for the scheme when I am old enough. I would personally care as you would certainly want respect from the guys above you otherwise you will have a pretty miserable experience. I find it useful what many of the CX pilots have commented about on here, it gives a view of life in CX which will be a big concern to most people joining any company.

I certainly wouldn't take that deal. A couple of minutes of calculations answered that question for me. I did a google search of renting apartments in HK and was shocked by the cost. I found an online supermarket and calculated a weekly shop. Rent and supermarket bills take a big lump of that 4000 away, add electric bills, gas, tax and activities for fun.

If many cadets still accept these conditions then by how much further will the conditions have deteriorated be like when they get to Captain???

[Thierry121]

Hi All,

Thought I'd share my experiences from stage 1 in February at London, I was alongside one other candidate throughout my afternoon.

Interview: This was pretty straightforward, 30 mins HR related questions and 30mins of Technical. I was a complete novice and the questions were in my opinion suited to my capability, however if I were to do it again I would read more than just the amount you think is right, go further and more in depth than the JKI booklet provided.

Reasoning: It was based on the Raven's matrices as mentioned on numerous occasions in this forum, just practice on it till you feel comfortable.

Personality: Just be honest and you will be fine, lots of questions asking you to rank sentences that describe yourself.

JKI Test: Revise the hell out of the booklet and more importantly understand the concepts and how things work with the aircraft.

Well, it's not much of a thorough review, but of what I encountered during the day.

[SW1]

Reasoning: It was based on the Raven's matrices as mentioned on numerous occasions in this forum, just practice on it till you feel comfortable.

PM if you guys needhelp with this..

[Chewie-gentle giant]

Hey guys anyone that completed stage 2 recently can you tell me what is in the aviation maths test and any examples would be greatly appreciated

[arjens]

@Thierry121: When did you apply?

Also: Can anyone tell me what the training in Adelaine is like? How is that town, food, housing, life there. Are you being paid then already?

All discussion seems to focus on the life as a SO, and the incredible (going from positive to negative) pay conditions. But I would really like to hear about the training phase before it too :)

[Vibes]

Hi All,

Pls advise as to how many days is the second interview conducted over in HK?

Thanks.

[SpiritofMGL]

Can anyone send me a JKI booklet please? I would really appreciate it

[Arkit]

@ Thierry121

Hi has Cathay gotten back to you about stage 2 yet?

[The Rents]

Arrive 1st day.

Second interviews and tests are the following day and if successful you will be notified that evening and invited the next interview stage which will be the following day.

Third interview the following day along with a medical and a uniform fitting. Usually leave for home the same evening, depending on flight times for the individuals.

If you are successful on the third interview you will usually be notified within 2 weeks.

You are then invited to Adelaide for flight assessment, probably a month or so later. This is usually for 1 week. Check FTA Adelaide for course details.

Wait 2 weeks again to see if you have passed flight assessment and if successful should be offered a cadet place.

Hope this helps !!

[The Rents]

Hi Arjens,

Be prepared for lots of hard work, lots of fun and lots of flying, but, beware, when you first arrive you feel a million miles away from home and all alone, but this will soon pass when you start making lots of good friends.

All living expenses are covered, the food is good and you stay at Flight Training Adelaide billeted with 3 other cadets, you have your own private room and shared bathroom and living rooms.

You will be given a 100 AuD weekly allowance and the course is normally 61 weeks.

Hope this helps !!

[Thierry121]

@ Thierry121

Hi has Cathay gotten back to you about stage 2 yet?

They haven't got back to me yet, so I'm fearing the worst to be honest. What about you?

[Arkit]

I haven't received any word yet, I was told around 10 days and it may be over the phone or by email.

Guess we have to just wait for now. Hopefully I'll see you in Hong Kong.

[Thierry121]

Yep same thing said to me, it's been a week since the Stage 1. Was yours on the 25/02/11 in the afternoon?

[The Rents]

Don't give up hope guys, when they say 10 days they probebly mean 10 working days.
Start to worry if you don't get a call 2 weeks on the dot from your interview date !!

[SloppyJoe]

Absolute rubbish, they seem to be really lacking with time keeping in the recruitment section. When I interviewed in 08 they said we would know in two weeks, 6 weeks later I got the job offer. Thought I was out for sure. They will let you know and if it is not instant it does not mean you are not in even if you dont hear for a month it means nothing. They will let you know, if they are sure they don't want you it will be a quick email as why make you wait?

[lloyd_dsouza]

Good for you guys....i dont think cathay is coming to India for the cadet pilot

[betpump5]

Say I went on the program and got my ATPL and then decided to fund my own proper type rating using the money saved by my parents (if the amount saved isn't enough a bit more could be raised). Would cathay consider promoting me to FO quicker than the usual 4/5 years?

Please be brutally honest, I won't be offended.

I was going to be slightly polite in answering what I consider to be the most ridiculous question ever asked on pprune but since you won't be offended, then I'll be less diplomatic.

So yeah, you are an idiot mate who obviously has no idea about the industry. So your parents have saved 25-30K? Yeah that will pay for a nice 737 type rating at Ryannair. Have you looked at prices for a A340/777ER or 744 rating???? Just so you know, doing touch and go's on a 744 burns a little more fuel than a 737. And by the way, the independent TR won't be to Cathay SOPs or traning standards.

Secondly, no. Obviously CX will not promote the guy who can pay for more training over his peers.

Thirdly, why did I even respond to this. But congratulations anyway on asking the most stupid question I've ever seen.

[uspilot]

And these guys are future of Cathay Pacific....God help you guys....I really feel bad for Capt/FO who have to fly with these guys for 10 to 16 hours...yea buddy go pay for your rating...make your family go broke to make yourself happy.....if you do that to your family I hate to see what you would do to your fellow colleague...:{

[The Rents]

Don't embarrass yourself Sloppyjoe

Move with the times and keep up to date, if your a pilot I hope your more current than this !!

At the end of 2010 the calls were being made after two weeks, sure it may take longer but if it does there are usually abnormal circumstances.

Perhaps Cathay have got their act together now, in 2008 the cadetship was only open to HK nationals and not an open book.

[cyrilroy21]

Saw the ad for Second Officers in the Flight International magazine March 1-7 2011 .

Is Cathay that desparate for S/O's ?

[flyber]

When are these guys ever coming to Africa? I applied in May 2010 and till today, no interview invite.I just get the automatic reply service." Your application is under processing. We will get back to your geographical location." Can my application still be valid after all that period? Should I apply again?

[Cessna414CC]

How long ago did they stop looking for direct entry SO and focus only on cadet?

[6cfn]

I came across a question from the questions listed by previous candidates that I couldn't answer. I was wondering if anyone could lend a hand with this one:

" If we are at 3000' and the QNH is 990, what is the pressure altitude?"

From what I've read, altitude increases 27ft every 1 mb. So, would this simply be (1013.25 - 990) x 27 +3000 = QNE = 3627.73 ?

The difference between the pressure altitude and the actual altitude seems to be a little on the high side.

Thanks for help.

[MilPilot]

@6cfn

Given the low altitude that answer would be ok in an interview situation with no aids. In reality the number you got is a little on the low side. The conversion changes with altitude:

1 mb = 27 feet at sea level
1 mb = 50 feet at 18000 feet
1 mb = 100 feet at 39000 feet

Correct answer would be 3640.7 feet using the real formula.

h2 - h1 = 221.1T (logP1 -logP2)

[chchflyboy]

Hey everyone, wow this is a long forum to read. Anyone going to the April interview in Auckland? I'm hoping to nail it to get out of this disaster zone we call Christchurch. Any tips would be greatly appreciated, especially these sample questions! Keep em coming! :ok:

[6cfn]

Thanks for the quick response. Appreciate it. :)

[flyingmam254]

Hey can anyone answer the question of how long from submitting your app online to getting a positive/negative answer? also did anyone get a date for europe this year?

thanks

[carpet weaver]

just curious if there is a medical or eye test or anything like that during your stage one interview.

Thanks

[SW1]

No medical only in Stage 3 in HK.Although you will get a medical form to fillout and list any injuries or defects you may have. Be wary of this because if there is something on there that they dont like, you wont be invited back for Stage 2 even if you ace the whole thing.

[carpet weaver]

oh cool thanks sw1

[james35]

hey does anybody know what types of engines cx uses on each aircraft?
cant find it on their website.

[chchflyboy]

Hey James,

Here's my input into the forum in return maybe someone can help me.
747-400 uses either the RR (Rolls Royce) Rb211 or the PW4056 (Pratt and Whitney)
777-300 uses the RR Trent 892
777-300ER uses GE90-115B's
777-200's use RR Trent 877's
A340's use CFM56's
A330's use RR Trent 772's

One word of advice- Wikipedia.

Now as for everyone else, can someone please point out how would I identify the difference between a 777-300 and 777-300ER as they are the same length etc. Only difference I can think of is slightly bigger wings and bigger engines on the ER but how would you know if only one model is on the table...
Come to think of it, how does the -200 differ, (33.3ft smaller?) Should I count doors or something?

Cheers

[orangeboy]

greatbattle, i can't see anything wrong with your calculation other than you have used a rounded figure of 30ft per 1mb (which is used for simplicity) :)



chchflyboy

if you think about what makes the 300ER wings longer, then u will be able to spot the difference

as for the difference between 200 and 300, counting the doors is a very easy way to tell, and if you look at enough pictures of the 200 and 300, you will see the difference clear enough

:ok:

[boer69]

Hi can someone post some examples of the Mathematics questions for Stage 2 please!!! Thanks

[crwjerk]

My advice, knowing the interviewers, would be to concentrate on the answers to the personal questions instead of worrying about who can search the internet the best. Your personality and attitude will get you this job.

[stevop21]

simple way to tell the difference between the 773 and 77W is that racked wingtips

[PurdueFlight]

Hey guys,
Quick question! I got an interview on april 14th in San Fran. Since I don't have 1000tt and haven't done ATP written, I applied (in Nov 2010) for the cadet program. But this is what I recieved: "Cathay Pacific Airways is pleased to invite you to attend our Second Officer Initial Selection in San Francisco"
So, is this going to be a cadet or s/o interview? I'm confused.
Thanks

[Jason8]

Hi guys,

What are the GCSE requirements? I have a C in science and a D in maths. Does this mean I'm not eligible? A few months ago I knew nothing about flying but taught myself using microsoft flight simulator, well followed the lessons and I have learnt a lot since and absolutely love it. Got a real flight coming up soon as I know real flying is a lot different from simulator flying.

Thanks.

[stevop21]

Jason8: Why don't you look on the website? I don't think a D will be good enough

[sioux115]

Well, since you applied for a cadet position I would assume it would be a cadet interview.

[orangeboy]

jason

These are the minimum education requirements (taken from Cathay Cadet Pilot page)



5 passes in Hong Kong Certificate of Education Examination / GCSE (O Level) including Physics and Mathematics, together with 2 passes in Hong Kong Advanced Level Examination / GCE A Level, Science subjects preferred OR

Passes in Physics and Mathematics to year 10 and completed high school with the required university entrance qualifications, Science subjects preferred OR

Hold a degree or diploma in any discipline.

[theredwoodbus]

cadet interview, cx scheduled to show up in san fran for recruitment on april.

[ryan2a9]

So if i'm reading this correctly, if you get picked as a cadet, finish the program, and get hired on as a SO you won't be getting the housing allowance?

If you're hired as a DESO you will get the housing allowance?

I'm just a little confused as to the difference between the 2 SOs. Just one going thru the program and one not. I've been offered an interview for the cadet program and i'm trying to get this straight. If you don't get the housing allowance after going thru the cadet program going thru with it would be dumb IMO

[tocum]

g'day
anybody done their 1st stage selection with CX in Melbourne this week?

would u like to share ur experiences, thx

toc

[lost&found]

Ryan - if you read through the posts you will see that there are NO DESO or DEFO opportunities at the moment. there are 3 avenues for the cadet program, an ab initio (0hrs - 250hrs TT pilots), and 2 advanced entry options (spending either 6 or 3 months in Adelaide depending on your level of experience) in which you get a SO position. the company is offering a "housing allowance" but you wouldnt be able to afford a macbook computer with it, let alone an apartment in HK. Hold out a little longer and the conditions will get better....

[Manuel233]

Hey,

I have now searched this thread for any mention about the eyesight requirements for the Cadet Program (ab-initio) at Cathay Pacific and couldnt find them!

Can someone tell me what the expect for your eyes?
I have -2,75 and -1,25 Astgmatismus on one eye
and
-2,25 and -0,75 Astigmatismus on the other eye...

If Cathay isnt working for me are there any alternatives for me!?

greetings

[carpet weaver]

Just curious

What order do you do everything in during your stage one interview?

Is the technical and hr interview last or in the beginning.

[orangeboy]

no set schedule, you might find that on the day, your schedule will be different to the others that are there.

[ixg888]

Hi I have applied in CX cadet program too.. but im a Filipino I hope I would be a given a chance too..

[ReverseFlight]

im a Filipino I hope I would be a given a chance too

If a Hong Kong pilot applied (say) for Cebu Pacific, do you think he/she will be given a chance ?

[orangeboy]

I don't see why being filipino or any nationality should disqualify you. If you meet the requirements, your application stands out and they are coming to your area, or you are willing to travel to HK then you should have as good as chance as anyone else. When did you apply? What makes you think you don't have a chance?

[Chewie-gentle giant]

Hey guys anyone that has done the stage 2 interview recently can anyone tell me
what sort of technical questions you were asked?

anyone that knows what questions are asked any info would be great