XH558 meets XM655 at Wellesbourne today

[The late XV105]

Being a local resident, today I toddled down to Wellesbourne Airfield for the annual Wings and Wheels event. The disappointment that suspected problems with other local resident XM655's Olympus powerplants ruled out the usual high speed run, nosewheel in the air, was more than compensated for by XH558 making a flypast en-route home from an event in the Netherlands.

Not something you see every day, two Vulcans together, let alone both with all engines turning....

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s202/mach1point02/XM655meetsXH558.jpg

Yes, we were treated to a nice climb-out after the last pass :)

[BEagle]

A most enjoyable day - and a great tribute both to 655MaPS and VTST for all their dedication spent keeping these grand old aircraft in such fine condition!

Splendid howl when 558 departed down the Fosse Way towards Kemble!

[Sam TC]

Did anyone get any pics of the red arrows coming over the top of the vulcan on the first taxi? It was a great sight from where I was standing

[The late XV105]

A selection of photos from today:

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s202/mach1point02/IMG_090621093112.jpg

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s202/mach1point02/IMG_090621093825.jpg

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s202/mach1point02/IMG_090621100446.jpg

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s202/mach1point02/IMG_090621105450.jpg

Who's late with the smoke then? (fuzzy through the haze of XM655 exhaust)

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s202/mach1point02/IMG_090621105544.jpg

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s202/mach1point02/IMG_090621105547.jpg

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s202/mach1point02/IMG_090621132340.jpg

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s202/mach1point02/IMG_090621134329.jpg

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s202/mach1point02/IMG_090621134352.jpg

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s202/mach1point02/IMG_090621134533.jpg

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s202/mach1point02/IMG_090621134616.jpg

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s202/mach1point02/IMG_090621135019.jpg

[ponks]

Excellent photos :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

:ok:

[Toddington Ted]

Just awesome! Shame that it wasn't a little sunnier there (by the look of the dark skies on some of the photos) but perhaps that was the Vulcan darkening the skies!

[ajh52]

Thanks for posting the pictures, shame there was no fast taxy, more than made up for by the sight of two running Vulcans together though!

[Postman Plod]

You can't have been standing too far away from me there XV105! We had to leave early though cos of an impending roast, with every intention of returning in time for 558 once we heard about its potential overflight, but alas it was not to be :sad: Gutted!

However considering I thought the weekend was going to involve going round some old stately home with the in-laws, seeing (and hearing) ANY vulcan was a positive!!

Silly question though.... on the top of the tail, there appeared to be what can only be described as anti-pigeon wires.... is that actually what they were???

[The late XV105]

on the top of the tail, there appeared to be what can only be described as anti-pigeon wires.... is that actually what they were???

Yup! :)

Hope the dinner was good and photos made up for any Vulcan disappoinment!

[Cricket23]

Does anybody know roughly what time 558 will be displaying at Biggin this coming weekend? I can't make the first hour of the show and it would be a shame to miss her.

Thanks in advance.

C23

[Metman]

A few snaps from the earlier run...
http://www.scottie.org.uk/vulcan2.jpg

http://www.scottie.org.uk/vulcan6.jpg

http://www.scottie.org.uk/vulcan3.jpg

http://www.scottie.org.uk/vulcan4.jpg

http://www.scottie.org.uk/vulcan7.jpg

http://www.scottie.org.uk/vulcan1.jpg

Now a question or 2...

I understand that the original intention was that XM655 was to be preserved as a flying display aircraft, but the original owner couldn't get permission from the CAA at the time - 25 years ago I guess airworthy military jets in private hands was a rarity? Therefore he let it "rot" until the airfield / preservation society stepped in... Now I know that there is, and never will be any intention of flying this aircraft, but the suggestion was that it was in remarkably good condition - so how airworthy is it? Secondly, some of the locals who witnessed the landing believe that there would be no way the aircraft would have been able to fly out as the runway was too short or the departure would be unsuitable. How true is this, bearing in mind what I'd understood was the original intention to display it?

[hunterboy]

Metman, You are opening a can of worms!

[Metman]

http://managementcraft.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/canoworms1.jpg

Yarr! :}

Although obviously I'm not really intending to open any cans of worms - just plain old fashioned honest curiosity! :ok:

[c130jbloke]

And just what exactly is the point of having the thing taxi up and down the runway going RRRRRROOOOOAAAARRRRR !!!!!

Sorry, whilst I fully respect the efforts put in by others on this project I don't see why they go to all the bother.

And now we are into wholsale cow killing, as outlined in other current threads about the impending defence cuts, maybe it's time to take a long hard look at the BBMF and how much public money is expended on that outfit too.

Before anyone starts to flame me, once again I have the highest respect for what they represent, but with some real financial pain coming I think it is time to get really nasty about what is going to be chopped. And I have said before, offering up the reds for cutbacks should be on the table as well.

[sooty655]

And just what exactly is the point of having the thing taxi up and down the runway going RRRRRROOOOOAAAARRRRR !!!!!



The point is that it provides a great deal of enjoyment for those who choose to attend and for those who choose to maintain XM655. And it costs you, c130jbloke, absolutely nothing. No taxpayer funding, no lottery funding, no charity commission funding, nothing.

So if you don't want to see it, stay away. We'll be happy not to see you, and you'll be happy that you haven't supported it.

Rant over.

Sooty

[Metman]

and that certainly isn't a can of worms I envisaged opening? :confused:

As Sooty says, its not publically funded, and has nothing to do with the BBMF, Red Arrows, Blue Falcons, Green Toads, Pink Fairies or MoD / Government. If you want to have a rant about cutting any of those, there are plenty of threads dedicated to just that, and if they're not good enough, make your own, as I don't think this thread really fits?

[Tankertrashnav]

C130jbloke I can think of about 4,567 things I would chop before the BBMF and the Reds. Perhaps someone can start a sticky thread and we can see what things others would chop before them. How about Trident for starters? - oops, sorry that means the other 4,566 chopped items not required, and with a few bob change we can get the Brunty Victor airborne legally as well ;)

[c130jbloke]

Good to hear that the Vulcan costs nothing and what's a Victor ?

As for the BBMF, all I know is that the personnel who run it are public servants, which means that if they spend so much as 1 minute of their work time on it, then the taxpayer ( i.e. us lot ) are footing the bill. As for that, with god knows what horrors coming our way with even more cutbacks, if it's not a core function then it needs to go. I think what I am saying sucks, but it's a consequence of the situation the armed forces are now in. As for keeping nukes, I would love to see them scrapped too, but with the way the world is going :eek:

[Report@Boddam]

C130jbloke

it is people with attitudes like yours who undo the good work of all those who went before you. Respect is a two way street and I hope you recieve the same level of respect that you are so keen to show. :ugh:

[c130jbloke]

Sorry, whilst I fully respect the efforts put in by others on this project

Why don't you try reading the whole of my post instead of just the bits you don't like.....:bored:

it is people with attitudes like yours who undo the good work of all those who went before you

What do you mean ? Is it because I dare to question BBMF and RAFAT ?

BBMF: A flying memorial to those who have fallen - and not the only memorial to remember them ( and when did a Dakota feature in the battle ? ).

RAFAT: A flying advert for BAe. I understand that they foot part of the operating costs - so why not all of them. Yes, the reds have a recruiting function as well, but thanks to the credit crunch the careers offices are pretty full right now and if we are taking "capabilitiy holidays" elsewhere then why not here too ?

Just so we are all straight - I HAVE NO AXE TO GRIND AGAINST THEM :ok:

[BEagle]

Good to hear that the Vulcan costs nothing and what's a Victor ?

Is that the best you can come up with, c130jbloke?

How about:

"I apologise without reservation to the Vulcan to the Sky Trust and its loyal contributors for their work in restoring XH558 to flying condition and to the 655 Military Aircraft Preservation Society for its work in maintaining XM655 in taxying condition".

And as for and what's a Victor is that a puerile attempt at humour, or yet another display of your total ignorance. Have you never heard of the Falklands War?

The Lancaster did not take part in the Battle of Britain, neither did the Dakota. However, both were an integral part of the victory achieved against the Nazis in World War 2. I presume you might have heard of that?

I suggest you back your JCB out of the hole you've dug for yourself and wise up to the fact that cutting RAFAT and/or the BBMF wouldn't add one penny to any other area of the RAF.

[Double Zero]

C130Jbloke,

I have every respect for your namesake aircraft, and can't help thinking we ( U.K. ) would be a lot better off with more of those and C-17's, than trying to be political with the A400M; if it's not too late, that among other huge projects is where to save money...

However I take issue with your comments re. the BBMF and Reds; the latter being great ' salesmen ' for U.K.Ltd; if the U.S. can afford the Thunderbirds and Blue Angels, we can damn well afford a bunch of Hawks - and as for the BBMF, I think the phrase is something like " He who would see what will be, must first see what has gone before ".

DZ

[Tankertrashnav]

and what's a Victor ?




C130jbloke

Whats a Victor? WHAT'S A VICTOR? !!!!!!!!!!

I refer of course to the most sublimely elegant aircraft ever to emerge from Fred's Shed. The fastest, most beautiful, biggest bomb load carrier of the V Bombers, beside which the Valiant looked like a pregnant guppy and the tin triangle looked like - well, a tin triangle. A 1955 Victor B1 in anti-flash white before they started sticking all the bits and bobs on still looks like something from the future. Still I suppose if you spend your life around airborne American trucks it's bound to affect your taste.

What's a Victor indeed!

Seriously, I love it when someone sticks their head above the parapet - certainly livens things up:ok:

[The late XV105]

Three final Wellesbourne photos to post:
http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s202/mach1point02/IMG_090621105150.jpg

Photographer credit for the next two photos is to my mother who together with my father was as pleased to be there as I was; ex of Coningsby when I was still in nappies and with plenty of Vulcan related stories to recall, some entertaining and some very poignant.
http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s202/mach1point02/IMG_090621105433.jpg

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s202/mach1point02/IMG_090621134510_1.jpg

[Dengue_Dude]

Get a life guys . . .

C130JBloke is as entitled to his views as anyone else, even if you don't agree.

If we all agree all the time, we'll be swimming in a world of bland in no time flat.

[davejb]

...and everybody is entitled to come on here and have a pop back at him, or doesn't democracy work in both directions?

[BlackadderIA]

We all feel the benefit when we get rid of something major - remember all that extra cash that was suddenly floating around when we chopped the Jag fleet. Heady days indeed :hmm:

[Ramshornvortex]

Now I know that there is, and never will be any intention of flying this aircraft, but the suggestion was that it was in remarkably good condition - so how airworthy is it?

Well for a start, the CAA would require that we had a supply of zero-houred and bagged Bristol Olympus 301s, as our four have been installed since before 1984. Unless anyone out there knows any different, there are none in the world, and the money that RR would want to set about manufacturing new ones for us would probably keep the BBMF and RAFAT flying for years!

As Metman mentioned, '655 has been out in the open for 25 years, longer than her 20 years service life - the inspection and rectification costs would make the £7.5m spent on '558 pale into insignificance!

some of the locals who witnessed the landing believe that there would be no way the aircraft would have been able to fly out as the runway was too short or the departure would be unsuitable

Joe L'Estrange landed '655 in about half the length of the 3000' runway. With minimum fuel and 103% on those 301s, she would get off if she had to!

Now back to the bickering.......:hmm:

[c130jbloke]

or yet another display of your total ignorance


Coming from you Beags I could almost take that as a compliment. Tell you what, I will apologise if you do too for all the pompous drivel you have laid down on this forum (15 000 + think about it :uhoh:).

OO - Take issue all you want fella. My point is that with both the Reds and BBMF they need to deliver bang for their bucks.

C130JB

PS: While we are at it, chop the Falcons too.

[BEagle]

You can be as rude to me as the moderators will allow, c130jbloke, but at least have the grace to apologise to VTST and 655MaPS for your ignorant comments.

[c130jbloke]

Try reading the post again Beags :ok:

If you think that the above counts as rudeness then you REALLY need to get out more - but as I said, 15 000+.....

My offer stands, I will if you will.

[hurn]

For what its worth, I'm quite happy for some of my taxes to go on paying for the BBMF and Reds.

MPs' expenses however........ :=

[ZH875]

Joe L'Estrange landed '655 in about half the length of the 3000' runway.


But he had the advantage of minimum fuel from Waddington, and use of the Drag-Bag on landing.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v604/ZH875/XM655001.jpg

XM655 taxiing after landing at Wellesborne Mountford in 1984

[Ramshornvortex]

Great photo ZH875! :) Have you got any more of that day in February 1984? We have very little at Wellesbourne and only poor quality much copied video.

[ZH875]

The quality of pictures aren't brilliant, but just like the Vulcan, if not taken care of they lose something.

1. Arrival fly-by
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v604/ZH875/XM655002.jpg

2. Taxy

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v604/ZH875/XM655003.jpg


3. Crew Exit
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v604/ZH875/XM655004.jpg

4. Landing

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v604/ZH875/XM655005.jpg


5. Drag-Bag jettison
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v604/ZH875/XM655006.jpg

6. Taxy

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v604/ZH875/XM655007.jpg


7. Landing run
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v604/ZH875/XM655008.jpg

8. Down for the final time

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v604/ZH875/XM655009.jpg


9. Arrival overflight
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v604/ZH875/XM655010.jpg


10. Approaching stop area

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v604/ZH875/XM655011.jpg

[Ramshornvortex]

Fantastic ZH875 - a lovely bit of nostalgia :D:D:D

On the surface at least, she looks better now than she did 25 years ago - and the engines don't smoke any more now than they used to either!

[BEagle]

Ramshornvortex, how did the engine checks go?

[Ramshornvortex]

how did the engine checks go?

As usual, they're faultless......Sooty655 sees to that, although DT did use rather a lot of fuel though:oh:

All we have to hope now is that the Fun Police will acknowledge that we know what we're doing - we always put safety first anyway.....

[SENTENEL]

c130jbloke...

dont the reds do that? Help BAE systems sales etc, which raises taxes, which pays for them? i bet they get lots of help from BAE etc

BBMF - value for money.. lets just shut every english heritage place? they are just as much a waste of cash! (not my opinion)

what if someone said well lets scrap the c130s and use comercial carriers better value for money?

[Tankertrashnav]

Talking of taking V's into short fields there is a good account of Tony Cunnane taking a Victor K1 into Catterick (3,300 feet) here Final flight - XA939 (http://www.tonycunnane.co.uk/finalflights1.html) It was being delivered to the RAF fire school there. No photos, which is pity, unless there are some unpublished ones out there. I had flown into Catterick in an Anson and a Varsity, but would have loved to gone along for the ride in 939 which was a 214 aircraft I had flown in many times. I did ask, but Tony was keeping the weight down (and I wasnt the slimmest nav radar on the base!) so he turned me down :sad:.

[c130jbloke]

Sent:

Like I said, if they give bang for the buck, then great. As for BBMF, they are not the only memorial to the historical events that they represent - but granted they are the only flying example. Honest question now, are their activities sustainable ? I would have thought that lack of engine spares would ground them one day.

As for the C130 case, you bet your ass if the FSTA PFI works out, then why not outsource the Tac AT activities too. For AirTanker read AirTrucker :eek:.

Final point - and credit where due, the ac pictured in this thread looks in better condition now than ever ( if those engine exausts are anything to go by).

[ix_touring]

BBMF: A flying memorial to those who have fallen - and not the only memorial to remember them ( and when did a Dakota feature in the battle ? ).



Perhaps a rename to Memorial Flight then... but then it wouldn't have the same draw for air shows etc, the merchandise revenues would go through the floor, the donations would be lower, there would be less volunteers etc etc etc.... hence ending up costing more. Great! :ok: NOT.

Recently the Dakota did the VE day fly past at Runnymede (Air forces memorial) commemorating the end of WWII. (The Lancaster was tech in Holland).

If you can the BBMF etc, how appropriate would it been for this to be been done by the latest Plastic/carbon Fibre white elephant in years to come? Not very in my view.

iX

[Blighter Pilot]

At which point in time do we stop remembering the Battle of Britain by utilising the BBMF?

How about a Falklands Memorial Flight? Sea Harrier, Harrier GR, C130K MK1 and a Nimrod MR2?

All knocking about somewhere hopefully

Just thinking of something more relevant for todays airshow generation.

[airborne_artist]

How about a Falklands Memorial Flight? Sea Harrier, Harrier GR, C130K MK1 and a Nimrod MR2?

The cost to operate such aircraft would be way out of proportion to the BBMF's existing fleet.

[steamchicken]

How about a Falklands Memorial Flight? Sea Harrier, Harrier GR, C130K MK1 and a Nimrod MR2?

We could call it "the Royal Air Force".

[Dengue_Dude]

Ah . . . you do have a fair point - I concede on that one.

It just gets SOoo tedious how quickly these threads get into a slanging match.

All I had been trying to do is read about and look at these outstanding piccies.

Good luck to the Vulcan projects - I'm sure I can still 'feel' the last fly-by I experienced (from the ground - never flew in the beastie myself, closest was Canberras).

[sooty655]

Good luck to the Vulcan projects - I'm sure I can still 'feel' the last fly-by I experienced (from the ground - never flew in the beastie myself, closest was Canberras).


It doesn't need to be a fly-by. Just stand anywhere near a moderate power ground run, and it will make your teeth rattle. :ok:

That's one of the reasons we do it, and it's why a static display just ain't as good.

Sooty

[ajh52]

Hi,

Thanks for posting the photos of the delivery.

One thing that hasn't been mentioned is the fact that XM655 has been used by TVOC for crew training.

As for take off judging by the way the nose comes up on a fast taxy I wouldn't think that it would be much more run before it left the ground.

I believe the drogue chute is safely stored as well.

Thanks to all the guys who keep it running!

[GeeRam]

Honest question now, are their activities sustainable ? I would have thought that lack of engine spares would ground them one day.

Sustainable for quite a while yet.

Engine spares won't be the issue to eventual grounding one day, most likely would be the lack of AVGAS to run them on.

[Dengue_Dude]

AVGAS ?

Surely not, you'll be filling the engines with OMD370 next !!!

[ajh52]

Hi again,

It would be interesting to hear Joe L'Estrange's memories of that last flight and landing at Wellesbourne.

[BEagle]

It was hoped that Uncle Joe would be able to make the journey, however, he wasn't able to do so.

Great fun flying with Joe - he had an independence of attitude which was most refreshing. He also had an exceptional pair of hands whether flying a Vulcan or a Chipmunk.

He also considered Air Traffickers to be rather more of a hindrance to flying than an assistance. "Good VFR, continuing.....", he'd say when some ATCO tried to intervene....

A wonderful old rogue even 30 years ago!

[Barksdale Boy]

I don't think Joe's attitude to Air Traffickers extended to absolutely all of them. I well remember on one of my first Vulcan sorties in 1968, incidentally in 558, some splendid banter between our QFI, Joe, and a Finningley Air Trafficker, Joe's wife.

[hunterboy]

Was that Roy Jacobson talking to the crew in one of ZH875's photos? Whatever happened to him?