US Presidential Marine One Helicopters on Stop..

[NutLoose]

BBC NEWS | England | Somerset | US helicopter contract stopped (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/somerset/8082891.stm)


Does not bode well

[ScrumpyJ]

Is the loss of a contract for 14 helicopters being lost, possible only postponed really worth a new thread. There havent even been any job losses as a result.

[MrBernoulli]

Once they have made their decision to buy American then all will return to 'normal'. Similar problem with the USAF tanker buy. :rolleyes:

[Postman Plod]

So if the first phase of the contact to complete 9 aircraft has been completed, have the aircraft been delivered to the customer? If so, are they being used, and what for?

[ORAC]

Four have been delivered and they are considering what to do with them. e.g. resale onwards or back to the manufacturer, test pilot hacks etc.

Same for the remainder of the batch 1 order, is it cheaper to pay the penalties for cancellation, complete for resale as a larger fleet with the first 4etc.

[Jackonicko]

AW have delivered ten VH-71s to Lockheed Martin.

Five Test Vehicles (TV-2 to TV-5, plus a static test aircraft), and five Pilot Production VH-71As.

TV-4 is Lockheed funded, but TV-2, 3 and 5, and all the PPs were purchased by Navair.

These were delivered 'green' to Lockheed for fitting out (AW aren't allowed to see or know about the interior!).

Previous aircraft used in the programme - AV-1 (CIV 01) and TV-1 (a leased USN aircraft) - have been returned.

[ORAC]

Hinchey, Schumer: VH-71 isn't dead yet (http://www.stargazette.com/article/20090603/BUSINESS/906030405/Hinchey++Schumer++VH-71+isn+t+dead+yet)
Lawmakers say Congress will have final say on helicopter

OWEGO - Area politicians aren't ready to cry uncle just yet when it comes to saving the presidential helicopter project at Lockheed Martin. U.S. Rep. Maurice Hinchey, D-Hurley, and U.S. Sen. Charles Schumer, D-N.Y., said the fight to save the $13 billion VH-71 program to develop the next generation of helicopters for the president is far from over.

Lockheed said Monday's announcement by the Navy, terminating the program, will immediately be factored into the company's workload analysis, which will lead to a reduction in force at its roughly 4,000-employee plant in Owego. "There will be a staffing impact across the business as the organization is restructured without the VH-71 program," spokesman Troy Scully said. "We will announce the magnitude of the job impact by the end of June."

Already, the company provided layoff notices to about 130 of its workers in Owego and at other area sites last month because of program cuts in the proposed defense budget for fiscal 2010. The layoffs are effective Aug. 17. Lockheed has said that in the end, the total number of job cuts will likely be greater than 250, though the company hasn't finalized anything yet.

Meanwhile, Hinchey and Schumer said they will work to keep VH-71 funded so Increment One, or the first phase of what was a two-phase project, can continue. Hinchey's office noted that the Navy's announcement Monday was "not a major development" but part of the expected process.

"The Navy is simply carrying out the direction it received from Defense Secretary (Robert) Gates to cancel the presidential helicopter program," Hinchey said. "Ultimately, the decision on whether to continue the current presidential helicopter program will be made by Congress through the annual appropriations process, which is set to begin in the coming weeks. The Navy's termination letter will in no way impact Congress' decision on how to move forward."

Pennsylvania Democrat Rep. John Murtha, chairman of the House Appropriations Subcommittee on Defense, has spoken in favor of continuing the program, said Hinchey, who is a member of that subcommittee. Hinchey said he will work closely with Murtha and others in the House to continue funding for the project. Schumer said he will continue to work with the Senate Appropriations Committee toward the same goal.

The appropriations process for the Defense Department is expected to be finalized in September, Schumer's office said. The stop-work order issued last month provides 90 days before pay to Lockheed employees is stopped.

About 800 area Lockheed employees are connected to the presidential helicopter program, which has produced nine production and test helicopters that are in some stage of test or integration at different sites, including Lockheed in Owego and a Navy facility in Patuxent River, Md.

Schumer will fight to have that 90-day deadline extended while the Senate deliberates on the appropriations bill "so that jobs are not lost," the senator's office said.

Hinchey said "an entire new fleet of modern, Increment One presidential helicopters can be completed within the original budget constraints." The program was estimated to cost $6.1 billion in 2005, when Lockheed won the contract.

Shutdown of the program at Lockheed includes "termination processes, asset disposition and inventory management," Scully said. "For example, disposition of government assets such as the helicopters, lab equipment, tooling, instrumentation and test equipment will be resolved with the customer."

There are costs associated with terminating VH-71, though Lockheed could not specify the amount of money it would receive. "Lockheed Martin continues to gather relevant cost information and will work with our U.S. Navy customer to properly propose the costs associated with the termination," Scully said. About $3.2 billion has already been spent to develop the copters, with an extra $400 million to $600 million needed to cancel the program.

The Navy is developing a new presidential helicopter construction plan while deciding what to do with the nine Increment One aircraft.

[Vox Populi]

Is the loss of a contract for 14 helicopters being lost, possible only postponed really worth a new thread. There havent even been any job losses as a result.

I think the five posts after your one ScrumpyJ, with further information, discussion and comment answer your question. I though yours was an odd post.

[StopStart]

really worth a new thread

Must be all those concerns about the internet running out of space. Which I've also just contributed to with this post.
Damn. :hmm:

[NutLoose]

I never saw an old one...

[nunquamparatus]

Definitely delivered at least one - saw it being loaded into the back of a USAF C-17 outside my office about 3 weeks ago. Nasty horrible yellow colour. If I was Barack I'd ask to get it repainted.














cue those with no sense of humour...........

[ScrumpyJ]

I dont think $13 billion is very much anyway. . . .

[OFBSLF]

Four have been delivered and they are considering what to do with them. e.g. resale onwards or back to the manufacturer, test pilot hacks etc.
They've delivered green aircraft to Lockmart. They have not delivered (nor were they close to delivering) completed aircraft to the Marine Corps. Though I'm sure that the intention of manufacturer's press releases were meant to cause exactly this sort of confusion.

[Green Flash]

Apologies if this lights the talking-out-of @rse caption, but I was wondering if, assuming the US don't want them, that there was any chance of getting them back and into RAF/RN service?:confused:

[Hilife]

The RN/RAF already has three airframe and three or four engine variants, so adding to both just makes supporting the fleet a more difficult task.

[Squirrel 41]

And without the rear ramps, what's would we use the VH-71As for, anyway?

S41

[blandy1]

Buy them cheap !!!???? :}Reengine them with RTMs, transfer the fadar & use as Carrier born AEW

[minigundiplomat]

And without the rear ramps, what's would we use the VH-71As for, anyway?


Bookends for the JHC FOB?

[MarkD]

Why not use the VH-71s in RAF service for the purpose originally intended in USMC service?

Although a Chinook HC3 style fiasco could be the result...

[pr00ne]

MarkD,

"Why not use the VH-71s in RAF service for the purpose originally intended in USMC service?"


Why on earth would the RAF want to ferry the US President about????????????

[GreenKnight121]

I think that 9 would make a perfect "Royal Flight".

[Hilife]

Thankfully our Head of State manages to get by with just the one helicopter.

[NURSE]

wonder if the EU could be persuaded to take them for VIP transport as I think new health and safety & enviromental rules stop them burning the money!:hmm:

[Metman]

Sorry to dredge this one up from the dead, but...

I thought the VH-71 was dead due to presedential decree, but on reading a very autoritative article on MSN (:}) (pages 7 and 8) it suggests that whilst Obama tried to cancel the programme, the house appropriations committee over-ruled him?

VH-71 Kestrel - Top 10: most expensive aircraft (http://him.uk.msn.com/in-the-know/photos.aspx?cp-documentid=152105447&page=7)

A high-tech replacement for the big green presidential 'Marine One' we often see lifting off from the White House South Lawn, the $241 million Kestrel was scrapped by Obama when he discovered it was running 50% over budget.

The US House Appropriations Committee thought otherwise, however, and he was unanimously overruled. The most powerful man in the world? Not when it comes to cancelling his own helicopter.


So is this programme as dead as it appears everyone seems to think?

[ORAC]

The programme isn't dead, but the VH-71 is. A new competition is being held (http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/news/2010/02/military_marine_one_helos_021710w/), expect Sikorsky to win it, and the total bill including spent costs and cancellation fees for the VH-71 to be way in excess of carrying on.

Politics and protectionism at it's best. Roll-on the KC-X where the RFP is made public today (http://www.nwcn.com/news/business/Gregoire-other-governors-pushing-for-Boeing-air-tanker-84955717.html). :hmm:

[Roadster280]

$13bn, 800 workers in the US alone, 14 helicopters all to carry one (two if the VP is counted) from the WH to Andrews.

It would be cheaper to put a runway on Pennsylvania Avenue for AF1!