SAS Q400's in Canada?

[DashPilot]

There are two Q400's parked on this side of the pond with the SAS markings taken off. Any idea why?

[LN-MOW]

Delayed delivery until further. SAS must have had a cancellation/deferral clause. Not sure if they ever will take them.

[jbc2001]

Are they at Downsview? - if so they might be 4002 & 4003, two of the test aircraft. Beleive they were both in SAS colours for sales purposes.

[Knold]

You don't say!? . .When having to modify every aircraft up to sn 034 extensively.. .When SAS already have taken one to the scrap yard.

I can't see why they should be questioning the reliability? <img src="rolleyes.gif" border="0">

[EX FTE]

DashPilot: You say they have the SAS markings removed. Just the letterring or have the nacelles & tail been repainted? What colour are they?

SLB: 4002 & 4003 were never painted in SAS colours for Sales efforts. That was 4004.

Knold: SAS taken a Q400 to the scrap yard? Oh really - which one and why?

[preflight]

They had a tailstrike with one of them but I´m not sure if it´s that aircraft...

/Preflight

[Knold]

Bombardier/SAS do the modifications in our hanger. One of the mechs told me that. I don't know which aircraft induvidual it was.

Kinda' raises your eyebrow when thinking about what these mods must cost Bombardier...

[EX FTE]

A tail strike does not warrant a trip to the scrap yard. Aerospace structural engineers probably spend more time on repair schemes throughout service life than on the initial design of an aircraft.

[Knold]

This one probably did :)

[Justforkix]

Knold, you are just that.

No SAS Dash 8 has been scrapped. End story.

[Knold]

Justforkix, for what I know preflight was on the right track.. .But as I said this info is only from one of the mechs working solely with this aircraft type... <img src="rolleyes.gif" border="0">

BTW I'm all that :)

[ 21 February 2002: Message edited by: Knold ]</p>

[Justforkix]

Both planes that had tailstrikes are flying.

[Knold]

How do you know? . .Do you work for SAS full-of-sh!t departement or?

[pilot18]

Sorry K, both A/C who had tailstrikes are flying. There were some major damages on one of them but they fixed it.

bst rgrds

[Knold]

Seems like they changed their minds then...I stand corrected I suppose.

Would be nice to know which one it was.

[Nite_Flite]

Knold...I wonder why you are so interested in SC Q400, while considering it a full-of-S*** department? Never ceases to amaze me! and they don't my salary either..

[Knold]

Not that interested, more like amazed by the fact that an airline can buy something this crappy.

[EX FTE]

OK, I have to say that the Q400 is not crappy. It is a huge technological leap from the older and shorter DASH8s - there were many development problems but the have been overcome or are in the process of being fixed. The introduction of what was effectively a new aircraft was always going to suffer problems - I think to much was made of the "its still a DASH8 so it be fine" philosophy.

Knold; have you actually flown in one of these aircraft? If so, have you flown in an ATR and ATP and a Dornier? If the answer to these is YES then you must be able to see the fact that the Q400 is a great passengers aircraft - quieter, quicker and roomier.

From an economics sense, the fact that SAS are flying the pants off their fleet says all you need to know abou how much money they are making with the Q400.

And before you ask who's payroll I am on, I'll declare my vested interest as one of the FTEs from the certification program!! And proud of it!

[EX FTE]

SK111: You mention a call out to alert the crew to attitude during approach & landing. Interested to know what this is. Is it one of the EGPWS height callouts or is it a new one coupled though the AHRS pitch information? Dont recall there being one when I worked the program.

[pilot18]

Ex FTE

The callout is a pilot not flying callout warning for pitch in excess of 5 degrees.. .And it may be a technological leap from the older Dash 8...but honestly...it's not that impressive. Most of the problems come from the old electrical system. A DC one at that!! in a NEW aircraft!!? Don't get me wrong, it's a VERY nice aircraft to fly, lot of power, handles very well...but..some things aren't that good about it. I agree..it takes some time to get things in order. I just hope that it will happen anytime soon.

bst rgrds

[Knold]

EX FTE; Wideroes -100 is quieter than SAS –400, and yes, it's real life experience. BTW who said that either of ATR, ATP or Dornier is a greater passenger aircraft? (Even though my money would be on the Dornier) . .The fact the you were on the certification program (and proud of it) wouldn’t have any impact on your objective judgement now would it?

. .SK111 It would be nice to know since I obviously have been misinformed and would like to get the story straight.

BTW2; to comment one thing that slipped by me earlier. The full of S*** department thing wasn't meant for SC-400 especially but at SAS in general.

Anyhow I regret that this debate has turned out to “I like this and not that” which I will have to accept some responsibility for. I (along with many others) don’t approve much of the –400. That’s my opinion, sorry if you don’t feel the same way.

[Flip Flop Flyer]

And as one of the "lucky" who had their regular B737/MD80 replaced by a Q400 on the route I most frequently fly, I will testify that compared to those two the Q is a cramped, noisy, vibrating areoplane. Fast ? You must be joking ! Sure, compared to other props it's quite fast, but still adds another 15 minutes to the flight when compared to "real" aircraft. That is, if the ****** want's to fly at all ...

However, the strongest indicator of the apparent failure of this type is the lack of orders. Most regionals are moving towards jets, as the massive success of regional jets of all kind proves. I am confident the Q is cheaper to operate than, say a CRJ700. But the CRJ, or any other RJ, has much more passenger appeal and that is one of the reasons regional carriers have, or are, largely abondoning the props in favour of jets. Me thinks SX should have followed the trend, but probably another case of "we know better" prevailed in Stockholm.

Give me back my MD <img src="frown.gif" border="0">

[Vmu]

In week five, 88 sas Q400 flights were cancelled for technical reasons. That was about 10% of the total number of flights. I question whether the term "airplane" is correct for this thing; it spends much more time in the hangar than in the air. I am worried that if they don't find solutions to all these problems very soon, myself and many other sas commuter/sas pilots will be fired.