Lack of Helicopter EMS in Canada

[SASless]

Did the lack of a Helicopter EMS operation in Quebec contribute to this death?

Why no EMS operation in that province of Canada?

Print Story: Doctor: Lack of medical helicopter cost actress - Yahoo! News (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090321/ap_on_en_mo/natasha_richardson/print)

http://d.yimg.com/a/p/afp/20090320/capt.photo_1237428012830-2-0.jpg?x=400&y=266&q=85&sig=pbjOG6m8odY6YkmugLU_CA--

[snotcicles]

After reading that article, it seems she refused medical aid at first so that may also have been a contributing factor to her death as well. There may not be a dedicated medical helicopter in Montreal however in most areas of Canada that are remote, there are charter operators that regularly would do medevacs that at the very least, could take a patient on a stretcher to a hospital...provided there is daylight.

[SASless]

How many times have we picked ourselves up after a fall....and felt it was no big deal.

It is when you then realize all is not right and then the need for medical attention is determined.....that is the point at which the clock should start ticking.

The key point is not that she delayed seeking help....but that there is no established helicopter EMS system in the entire province of Quebec....unlike just about anywhere else in the civilized world.

Also...if I am not mistaken there is no "private health care" in Quebec or am I wrong there?

Is this another failure of the Canadian National Health system we are seeing....not just in this one particular event but for all of the people of Quebec?

Has there been an attempt by a helicopter operator to establish a true EMS operation?

If so....why did it fail?

If not...why is there no EMS operation?

Is there a need for one?

If so...why is there not one?

Throwing an injured or ill person onto a stretcher and hauling them to a hospital with very limited medical assistance falls way short of a proper EMS operation.

How long would it take to organize a "charter helicopter" for such flights, get them on scene, and provide modern state of the art health care enroute as real EMS operators do currently?

Why "Day Only"?

Is there no IFR system in Canada?

[Great View]

The regular charter operators that snotsicle were referring to, and the majority of operators in canada are, are day vfr only. To operate at night in canada commercially, you need a multi-engine heli. I worked for a company in northern saskatchewan last year and we used to do medevac flights out of reserves for example, all the time, as long as we were day vfr.
There was a company in Quebec, Air Medic, that offered an EMS service with a Dauphin I believe but I think it went T/U a year or so ago. I'm not quite sure why. I have no idea why Quebec has no dedicated EMS provider as does Ontario(Ornge) and Alberta(STARS) but, I can say, that I was watching the news a few days ago and it has sparked some debate about it. How unfortunate someone had to pay the ultimate price before people start to have some interest in an EMS operation.

[Canuck Guy]

I'm sure Quebec would love a dedicated HEMS service, but they'd never pay for it.:rolleyes:

[the delaminator]

To be clear.

Health care in Canada comes under provincial jurisdiction. Some provinces have a dedicated system of HEMS and some do not. Alberta, British Columbia and Ontario for sure have 24/7 IFR capable HEMS both fixed and rotor wing.

[Mad (Flt) Scientist]

Mont Tremblant is definitely NOT 2.5 hours drive away from Montreal (as claimed in that news story); it's about 120km, along mainly autoroute (=motorway). I can't see any reason an ambulance couldn't average something like 100kph. (I'm sure there are Montrealers routinely exceeding that along that stretch without the benefit of sirens and lights).

The best case I can make for 2.5 hours is a RETURN trip, and if they sent an ambulance FROM Montreal to go bring here back .... that's an obvious case for improvement that doesn't require a helicopter.

[B Sousa]

In this particular case, she probably had no clue she was hurt for a while. So EMS or whatever should not even enter into the equation.
Had she not been a celeb, she may have gone for an ambulance ride which would have saved her life, if nothing more than by ground.

We can get into a big debate over how good is health care in the states. The answer is, its as good as you have money to buy. Im fortunate as I have Military. Its Good but there is better, I just cannot afford it.

As for EMS Helicopters/Fixed Wing. Its all about the money. Some of the Hospitals I have been, should I need it, I just hope I have enough breath to say somewhere else.

Response time. Consider in many places in the states, response time is in hours. Thats the way it goes. Helicopters are like Cell Phones, if there is little business there is little service. Again $$$$$$$

[Rabina]

Airmedic flew a couple of ex. Norwegian Dauphins in the EMS role until they went belly up during 2008. AFAIK they are still trading during liquidation. I haven't heard from any of their staff for at least 7 or 8 months, our company is still owed money for parts provided.

[wde]

As one intimately involved with HEMS in Canada let me say this. Our company , Cdn Helicopters Ltd (Not CHC, its domestic cousin), is the largest HEMS operator in Canada running a total of 12 S76As in Ontario and Nova Scotia. We have secured the contract to operate the AW139s that have been purchased in Ontario. Alberta has dedicated FW services as well as STARs providing RW service for about 85% of the Alberta population. The run BK117s and are buyinh 2 AW139s. BC runs 2 S76As and a B222 and are looking to expand their operations.

Manitoba and Saskatchewan are currently investigating HEMS ops but their area is large and population is low so financing is an issue.

The Atlantic region suffers from the same affliction.

Quebec is a funny duck; Air Medic, modeled after a European Motor Club model never made any money and is insolvent.

Certainly Ms Richardson's death has highlighted the issue in Quebec but is there money and the right equipment for the job. They have some pretty nasty winter weather ...

PM if you really need more info

"For the Record"

wde

[SASless]

The Government Response to Criticism of the Lack of EMS Helicopters.

Helicopter ambulance not a priority for Quebec
Questions raised in wake of Natasha Richardson's death will not change province's policy, government says

RHÉAL SÉGUIN

March 21, 2009

QUEBEC -- The Quebec government is making no excuses for the lack of a helicopter air ambulance service to transport trauma patients such as actress Natasha Richardson, who died of a head injury after skiing at Mont Tremblant this week.

Purchasing a helicopter ambulance is not a priority and there are no plans to acquire one, a government spokeswoman said yesterday.

Health and Social Services Minister Yves Bolduc refused to be interviewed regarding Ms. Richardson's accident. His spokeswoman Marie-Ève Bédard said Mr. Bolduc was concerned that anything he said could be used in any potential legal action against the government.

Ms. Richardson was taken by ambulance to the Centre Hospitalier Laurentien in Ste-Agathe, a 40-minute drive from Mont Tremblant, more than two hours after she took a tumble at the resort. The hospital stabilized the actress and she was then taken by ambulance on an hour-long drive to a specialized trauma centre at Montreal's Sacré-Coeur Hospital and later flown to New York.

Since Ms. Richardson's death, questions have been raised about Quebec's lack of a helicopter ambulance. British Columbia, Alberta, Ontario and Nova Scotia have helicopter air ambulance services. The other provinces do not.

Quebec decided to buy two airplanes for its air ambulance service after a report in October, 2007, called for the consolidation of ambulance services in the province and the expenditure of $10-million to improve it.

The report made no major specific recommendation regarding air ambulances, but the government decided in January of 2008 to spend $40-million on two fixed-wing aircraft.

"We decided to give priority to replacing aging air ambulance planes with the purchase of two new airplanes," Ms. Bédard said in an interview yesterday. "We don't exclude the possibility of introducing a helicopter service, but we insist on noting that if we need to evacuate someone rapidly we always call on civil emergency services for a helicopter to evacuate people."

François Rivard, who runs a private, non-profit medical helicopter service in Quebec called AirMédic, said he has approached the provincial government several times about integrating his service into the Quebec health-care system, without success. Mr. Rivard, a paramedic who has served with the Canadian Forces in Bosnia, said prompt delivery of trauma victims to specialized care can be crucial in saving lives.

"It's impossible to do that by land, especially in a vast territory like Quebec's," he said.

Ontario's air ambulance service, known as Ornge, airlifted 5,700 patients by helicopter in the past fiscal year. The service reaches remote communities, provincial parks or car crashes that would take longer to reach by conventional ambulance.

"The major advantage of a helicopter is that it goes places without a landing strip," said Dr. Chris Mazza, CEO and president of Ornge.

"Helicopters are tremendously useful components of our health-care system."

With a report from Ingrid Peritz in Montreal

[B Sousa]

Try to give Quebec back to France. France wouldnt take it.....:=