West Freugh

[Tower Ranger]

Was just flicking through copy of Testing Colours that has been gathering dust on my bookshelf and was wondering about the state of play at West Freugh these days.
I worked there as a controller in the 90`s and the last I knew it was being mothballed, does anyone have any up yo date info?

[Arty Fufkin]

That takes me back. Surf and Turf in the Crown!! Used to go there quite a bit in my early days teaching at Linton (and years earlier when I was a stude.) Last visit must have been 2002, I seem to remember the guys who worked there were a little unhappy at the time as they had just been told it was due for closure.

Also seem to recall a certain creamie mate going for a swim after closing time. Can't remember whether or not he was singing the "Grand Old Duke Of York" on that particular occasion though!!:)

Happy Days.

[tyne]

Not mil so forgive the intrusion. I last flew from there on ExNorthern Light 03 when Merlins from an RFA made regular trips in along with a COD SK from Invince.

Had one brilliant day back then spending the day with some RN blokes disposing of ordnance (Flares etc) on a big bit of open runway. Diesel, fire and fireworks!

I was up there a few weeks ago. It still appears to be used - but it may be being run by one of those organisations liek Quinetic....All the radar domes and stuff are there.

I can also tell you the Crown is fit and well and the Surf and Turf is as good as ever. Big Dave still works behind the bar.

Also the cracking little hotel and pub in Sandhead is great, the Port Logan Inn.....The Harbour House bar has changed....but still nice.....

Happy Days.

[Tower Ranger]

I lived there for four years, in Lochnaw, Kirkcowan and finally Mosscroft which was about half a mile from the Airfield boundary. During that time I got to see some of the most unusual sights and some of the most amazing standards of airmanship I have ever seen.
Where else in the world can an Atco ask a passing Lynx to come pick him up and try to find some dummy pods that just fell of a Harrier during its run n break. A few pints in the Crown that night for sure!!
I am just wondering if the place is still open as I am back that way later in the year and might see if I can get a visit arranged.

[dropintheoggin]

If I remember rightly, Linton and Valley were told by fax of the impending closure before the staff at The Freugh were told! The staff only found out when 10 Tucanos and 10 Hawks were booked in the following week for one last push for a Surf and Turf!

Ladies and gentlemen, a minute's silence for West Freugh....a wonderful place

[Stretch182]

Rumours of WF's demise appear to be premature....

Secret Scotland - RAF West Freugh (http://www.secretscotland.org.uk/index.php/Secrets/RAFWestFreugh)

Google is your friend...

[Double Zero]

Aah,

I often wonder if the surf & turf can still be as good, thanks for reassuring me; I keep telling her indoors we're going...

The people at 'The Frook' were the most professional & decent crowd I have ever worked with, if Kenny & co' from Photographic, Taff' from Range Control, any read this, Thanks.

The last I heard, and believe this still true but will check, is that the range is still open as in aircraft can come in and do their bit, but aircraft cannot land & base there.

So, most people gone, presumably Range Control & maybe Tower still manned.

I expect you all know the place was supposedly based on Peenemunde in layout, and I seem to remember the steel cupolas of the Kine-Theodolite cameras had embossed swastikas, painted over !

I've just remembered another one - the 'Bridies' ( Scottish pasties ) in the decidedly non-luxury canteen. The opposite experience to the Surf & Turf...

One of many events we had there was a then new GR5 doing rocket attacks on the beach target; as was customary there, he HAD to do a beat -up afterwards.

Ran straight at the Tower at below top window height, fast, banking around at the last possible moment.

When he landed we found he'd been pointing at the tower with a hung-up rocket !!!

The yellow & green Buccaneers for chase / photo - one day the station boss ( A.A ? ) agreed to a photo sortie of one, from the back of the Andover.

By a resident photographer I might add - ( I never dared take a hand camera on site, the security was quite something ) they were red hot with all sorts of complicated & antiquated kit, but probably didn't do a lot of air-air work or indeed have the boss's ear, so no briefing or input, everyone just did it...

When the prints rolled out, all the upper surfaces of the Bucc' were covered in white spots - dust on the print ?
No, a contribution from the Jackdaws who were quite entertaining, roosting in the hangars.

Whever I hear or see one now I smile & think of W.F.

I don't think the boss was very chuffed though.

On another occasion, it was as usual blowing a whoolie, but just to go through the motions I and Test Pilot of the day Bernie Scott walked over to the tower to get the weather, him for flying and me for setting up onboard cameras.

As we went in, Bernie looked around craftily, then gave the needle arm on the anemometer trace a mighty flick.

When I raised an eyebrow at him, he whispered " I always do that here, I'm trying to get the highest recorded gust in the UK ! "

Up hill from the Crown is The FernHill Hotel, also very good but not as friendly as the Crown, a little more genteel.

Excuse me going on but I think you'll like this one, and it refers to we visitors, not the range staff.

One weekend, I found myself with just a new Flight Test Engineer at the Crown - he'd been really thrown in at the deep end, running a trial only a few weeks after joining - stupid idea.

I tried to show him what ropes I could, and in the evening made friends with the locals - easy to do when on expenses !

The next weekend he was there on his own, and slightly nervously made his way to the locals bar of the Crown.

No worries, they all remembered him as he hung anothe round on his tab.

He thought " this is great, I've only been here twice and I'm in with the locals ! "

Then he was introduced to someone else - " This here's Brian, he's one o' they range w***ers " !

[The Helpful Stacker]

Ah, lovely Wet Through.

Last time I was there was back on the first Ex Pegasus Strike, where it remained distinctly non-wet all the time we were there. Well up until our final night there when it hammered down all night.:rolleyes:

For us wing-less mortals there was a cracking little road side cafe on the A75 near the Water of Fleet on the route to WF, where you could just about squeeze an average TSW FRP-sized convoy onto the lay-by outside in order to experience their fantastic square sausage sandwiches.

[LUNGEMAN]

I was last there in 2007 to set up a TLZ on Luce Bay beach followed by a RAL on the runway itself and the pubs are still as briefed. Luce Bay was always fun as the driving rain pooled on the sand and restricted the strip to one sandbank which was a struggle to find in the dark. Good times.

[Monty77]

Arty:

27 Mar 2002. I have a piccy of some 72 Sqn renegades posing on the tower stairs. Closed the next day. Said creamie (who shall remain nameless, so let's call him Michael) did indeed take the plunge the night before and somebody nicked his clothes. Suitably chastened the next morning, we realised his jolly jape could have been misconstrued as drunken drowning, with all the attendant complications of police, lifeboats and the general mayhem associated with a 72 Sqn visit. Ah well, nobody hurt, the clothes eventually turned up and the surf and turf went down well as always.

Personally, during the confused ransacking of the tower, I was after the impressive German WW2 submarine binoculars which were mounted on an impressive, er, mounting. These had been removed for 'servicing' (yeah, right) by management the previous week once they'd been informed of the closure. So all I got to steal was an RAF issue bible from the downstairs flight planning bit next to Met Man's place. Said bible may well be still languishing in 72's staff crewroom and I shall undoubtedly go to hell. I often wonder what part of a pre-flight briefing the bible filled.

[green granite]

Spent many a happy day there in the 60's on various weapon trials, used to stay in the Northwest Castle in Stranraer. Theu had the most amazing line-up of malt whiskeys I've ever seen.

[Grabbers]

Lungeman,

Don't you mean you sat in a warm dry landrover yelling encouragement to a newbie monstrously headed chap?

[Firestreak]

;)Happy memories Monty 77, I was with you when you liberated the bible and if the photo is the same one that I saw then I'm in it.

IIRC, we only took 4 Tucanos, not the 10 mentioned above--you, me, the exhibitionist creamie and I think UB was the 4th. Shall be seeing said creamy in a few days time, should I remind him of his past considering his present occupation do you think?

Back at Linton a few days later we received a photo of a Tucano very low over the runway sans u/c, hasty checking of the auth sheets revealed it was the one least inclined to do that sort of thing so it had to be a spoof--thankfully, it was.:}

[Tower Ranger]

Some of the photos I liberated just before I left.
http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb255/Towerranger/scan0004.jpg

[Tower Ranger]

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb255/Towerranger/scan0001.jpg

[Tower Ranger]

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb255/Towerranger/scan0003.jpg

[wingcmdr]

Ah the memories (hankie out)

Well we arrived there when I was just 5 years old ....45 years ago.
Old man got a great job doing Air Mech Elec things (ex fish head)

Started primary school in Stoneykirk and biked there every day from the married quarters...snow, rain, hail, and pestilence could not stop me.

We lived in a great big house at No 1 Galloway Place right next to the old guard room....sadly now all torn down (including our old house)

Played cricket for the Sunday team aged 7 (short of blokes that day) and was on the score sheet as "out not out"....just as well as I could see bugger all over the top of my pads.

Used to love going to the Club on a Saturday and Sunday and play snooker with my Dad on one of the two snooker tables. These were the days when it was safe to take your kids to the pub and leave them with a slightly pissed armourer (family friend)

In later life (13 to 16) spent many happy hours in KG 661 doing sonar drops and throwing up. Also used to be invited up to the Tower by a very close family friend to listen and watch the aircraft (yes I have touched the mighty German binoculars)......Great days!!!!!

I used to spend all my summer holidays on top of Grey Hill over looking the Freugh watching and waiting with my cheap binoculars(best present my Dad ever got me) armed with jam sandwiches and the latest Observers book of Military Aircraft (under Buccaneer ... armament, weights and performance...restricted)
Great to watch the German F104 screaming past at low level chasing the Noord Atlas support aircraft

Spent the best times of my life there and do I miss it.......You bet I do!

Sorry to wax lyrical but if anyone has pics of my childhood playground I would love to see them.

Ah well best stop now as the memories are starting to flood back and I am tempted to call my Dad to clear up the grey areas and its late.

Oh I nearly forgot ...................No enough too many memories and tales to tell.

Thank you for your indulgence

Ex RAE Freugh brat

[Grabbers]

I have only visited for a short while in a similar capacity as Lungeman but still have fond memories of the place. Really nice atmosphere, friendly locals and great smokehouse down the road.

[Tower Ranger]

Wingcmdr,

You`ll remember this then! I got to fly the Devon a couple of times, low level up the west coast of Scotland and back via the North Antrim coast. Not many civilians get to take some of the jollies we got there. I think the best was on the flight deck of a C130 doing a LL sortie through the lake district finished off with a tactical short field landing between the cables.
It seems crazy now thinking of some of the stuff. Like during an NVG trial borrowing a set of the motorcycle NVG head gear and tearing round all the local lanes in the middle of the night with no lights on in the car. Hit an awful lot of wildlife that night.
http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb255/Towerranger/scan0002.jpg

[wingcmdr]

Thanks Tower Ranger

Great picture and brings back fond memories.

Best trips were the sonar jobs with KG661 and then on to Machrihanish for lunch followed by a low level return trip home.

Great fun chasing trawlers in a Dak :) :) :)

Never forget waving to my family, stood at our front door, from the right hand seat as we circled low and slow overhead in KG661.

Happy to see more pics if any available

Cheers

[tyne]

Sorry for the intrusiion from a civvy again....A question about the Harrier pix above.

Is that a GR7 with a load of GR3s in the background? I thought the GR3s would have been long gone by the time GR7s were around.

Going back up to Galloway in about 3 weeks. Know the palce well, but would love some reccomendations of goos pubs/eateries/places of military interest.

Dan.

PS There is a hotel near Sandhead which has a bit or ArkR IV's flight deck. Its the top of their septic tank.

[BossEyed]

Is that a GR7 with a load of GR3s in the background? I thought the GR3s would have been long gone by the time GR7s were around.

Early GR5 on trials, I'd think, given the black/white stores.

[The Helpful Stacker]

Aye and that GR5 appears to have a gun pod fitted to it.

Good thing they dropped that idea eh? Its not like such a thing is needed these days.:ugh:

[Wet_Freugh]

Tower Ranger,

Great photos..

Spent some great times at the Freugh early 90's with you and many of my current colleagues now slightly further up the coast...happy days.

Hope it's all going well for you.

[CleartoFire]

An update on the Freugh:

Qinetiq currently run the site on behalf of the MoD. Luce Bay Range (D403/402) is used regularly by both air and ground assets and proves a very useful facility.
Sadly, the runway is now closed with big white X's painted on it although it is still in remarkably good repair. In the last few years the airfield has seen quite a lot of helicopter traffic and some C130s but run as a greenfield site.

[Double Zero]

Tyne,

That pic' is a GR5 when they were brand new ( you can tell if it's a GR7 onwards, as they have the FLIR mounted above the nose ) - also this is an early shot as it has strakes underneath the gunpods; I know this intimately as I was once under there when the pilot started up the Pegasus - I finished the last 2 fasteners, then made the quickest move in my life - no-one had told him I was there, comms cock-up.

The 'gunpods' are actually made of mahogany & housed 4 high speed 16mm cine cameras 3 pointing outboard for weapon release observation, one in each cannon position to film rocket / missile firings, Photo Sonics 1VN's able to do up to 200 frames per second ( though we found 150 more reliable, and had no end of trouble hanging the things externally in CBLS200 pods - film gets brittle at -40C despite the 100W heaters on each camera !

We came up with some 'inventive' auxiliary heating / insulation.

The aircraft in question is ZD319, one of our 2 GR5's at Dunsfold for development trials.

ZD 318, the first UK AV-8B, was used for avionics work, while 319 did the hardware dropping / firing.

At that time the 25mm Aden was considered future standard kit, and I agree it would be jolly handy right now sorting out the Taliban; unfortortuantely internal politics took over - the perfectly good & hard hitting Aden 30mm as used by the Harrier GR1-3 & Sea Harrier was replaced by the 25mm which I filmed shooting its' guts out.

Strange thing, the UK have never fitted the GAU-12 gatling as used by the USMC; whenever I mention this I get private messages from outraged Royal Ordnance people; well, the fact is, the GAU12 while not without problems generally works when asked, the Aden 25 didn't !

[GIATT]

You'll have to superimpose the rear view of your favourite airframe, but I've spent the last 40 years watching all sorts of things high tailing it in the direction of the top left of the picture. The Vulcans used to pass right over the sport where I was sitting with the doors starting to open.

Of course it's never this sunny during the summer.:(

http://i615.photobucket.com/albums/tt240/brainmcmillan/20080212_View_to_Mossyard.jpg

[Horrible Little Man]

Good old Wet Through!

Been there on ex. with TSW. It's run by Qinetiq now. The hangars are empty, but one seems to have been turned into a workshop for 4 ton trucks.

[Double Zero]

As technical photographer ( those in the photo of ZD319 are camera rather than gun pods ) my job was done once I'd set up the cameras; same went for my chum on avionics.

So, we were sent to a distant O.P. to set up and launch the weather balloon before each test flight.

My esteemed colleague, who eventually became a Wing Cdr, would answer the 'phone with " Hello, OP end of the world " as the gales howled over.

Eventually boredom set in, so in each 'sonde' cardboard box ( we always wondered where they ended up ) I put a message in saying ' congratulations, you've won a prize !' with the Flight Test managers' phone number.

[Double Zero]

The 30mm Aden was based on a WWII German design - like the 88, they were unfortunately good at that sort of thing.

[LUNGEMAN]

The WOLF was dry but definitely not warm! I did get out on occasion to give him a steer but any fool can be wet and uncomfortable and he seemed to be doing okay. Anyway, the night tasking was the other way round so the Heeeed got his own back.

Cindy was nice and warm afterwards though!

[Riskman]

I often wonder what part of a pre-flight briefing the bible filled.
For now we see through a glass, darkly
Bible, 1 Corinthians xiii. 12.

or

In the multitude of counsellors there is safety
Bible, Proverbs xi. 14.

;)

[DavyC123]

Hi wingcmdr,
I used to live at 2 Galloway Place West Freugh 1966 to around 1982. I do have some pics of your playground as it used to be mine too! Know where your coming from! Davy :ok:

[Double Zero]

I was definitely there during the shot of GR5 ZD319 carrying Mk 82's, so am sure I know you and I was priveleged to work with you.

NB the strakes under the dummy gun - actually camera - pods which made it a sod to get to the cameras.

The shot of the Sea Harrier carrying the Boscombe 6-camera pod was asked to be 'lost' by the pilot ( who did rather well in the Falklands War )as he was about to join us at Dunsfold as Naval Test Pilot !

If bothered see my posts 7 & 30...

Thanks to all at West Freugh in those days, the most professional bunch I have ever worked with.

DZ

[DavyC123]

I was but a lad in those days and didn't work there but lived there, on the base. You would certianly know my Dad as he was Senior Police Officer at the time. I knew all the guys that lived in the married quarters and few outside too. It was actually 1985/6 when I moved out to my first house in Stoneykirk. I spent 13 yrs at faslane as a MOD Cop from 1987 after leaving Stranraer but I digress! It's just nice to finally track down the blokes who used to regularly try to remove the chimney pots off our house!! :eek: Many a change of underwear was required in those days! :hmm:

[Akrotiri bad boy]

I've just returned from enjoying, or was it enduring?, a caravan holiday at Sandhead.

In the brief and infrequent gaps in the rain I could see cones at the low water mark on the beach. Are these the "Kine Theodolite" thingys mentioned earlier in this thread?:confused:

[Double Zero]

No, the kine theodolites were in grey domed cupolas, around the airfield.

There were various goings-on at the beach by Maritime types, + a target for things such as unguided Matra / Sneb rockets etc.

On one such trial involving a multiple rocket firing by one of our development GR5's, ZD319, a Volkswagen camper van somehow got onto the beach and happily bimbled along straight in front of the target !

There was also a thing like a young oil rig, a target for the development of a certain missile.

This had 2 decks, the idea was that there'd be photographers under the target ( which raised on an arm ) so as to process the trials films quickly and/or reload cameras.

I think even Kenny & co. were a bit dubious about that one, as far as I know the photographic staff stayed ashore.

[Fishtailed]

Kine theodolites, that takes me back. We installed a pair at Warton in the seventies. Again, WW2 German technology, brilliant engineering. With the covers off for servicing it was mesmerising and deafening as the shutters wafted back and forth and the geneva wheels stopped and started, they sound just like a loom (anyone who's been in a weaving shed knows what I mean) and those magnificent binocs sat on top, magic.:)

[Brooster]

Akrotiri bad boy,
I believe the cones are early concrete range markers showing the extent of the shore range area visible from the air?
However there are some serious cannon round pock marks in them!

B