Bored of India, anything out in Africa for me

[LOGS]

Well I'm an expat pilot flying in India and well I'm looking for a new challenge. Africa has always excited me and would give me a chance to do some "real" flying till I retire to an airline job or something like that. I know the old saying of just show up and start asking around but that's really not an option for me. My experience:

[four engine jock]

Stay Away!!!!!!!!!!

[LOGS]

How was I insensitive or had a bad attitude about anything? I understand the economy is bad but most jobs lost in the aviation world are with commerical airlines which never really appealled to me so really never effected me. Should I have the attitude in switching jobs because I have to, not because I wanted to or wanted a new challenge? Seriously this forum has the worst attitude I've seen on the web.

[PhoenixDC]

Hey LOGS, if you can not take a joke, you should not live and work in Africa!

[AlternativeProcedure]

The guy wants information about openings in Africa, if you can help him out please do so, if you cant no problem. People move jobs for different reasons. Lets leave the reasons out of the issue. If you have any useful leads, and you are willing to help him then do so, no need to slaughter the chap. After all, when he leaves his job in india, there will be an opening there for someone who needs it.

AP

[TXaviator]

suitecaseman:

your assumption that the ONLY choice in aviation in VERTICAL job movement is false.

people can OFTEN move LATERALLY to other jobs for many many reasons, many of which are perfectly valid and nonthreatening.

perhaps you feel threatened? sounds like a personal issue.... let the man look for a job wherever he feels suited to look.

[WDaron]

Jason -

Suitcaseman gave you some excellent advice. I don't understand what your problem with it is.

[ugflyer]

Oh boy, and yet another one!
I am sure LOGS is well aware of the global downturn and how that's affecting everyone. I second the opinion that if anyone has any leads, please offer them and if not, then leave it at that. How's everyone here doing today?
The heavy snowstorm kept many grounded here on the east coast. Really felt bad for the Emirates that was due to depart JFK at 11pm yesterday but did not get off the ground until 8am today. All I know is that it logged a lot of taxiway miles as it made it's way back and forth from the deice pad.....all nite.
Happens to be an off day for me anyway, but back to the skies tomorrow!

[Kep Ten Jim]

Suitcaseman - lighten up! Jeez you sound like a boring old fart. The man was simply asking for info on flying in Africa - he wasn't asking for a lecture on sensitivity or attitude. His question was simple and straight forward - 'I am bored with flying in India, can anyone tell me about flying in Africa'?

If you can't answer his question, don't post

[Propellerpilot]

LOGS if showing up is not an option for you, I very much doubt that anyone will employ you in Africa. Take time to read this forum to conquer some of the boredom, there are a lot of hints all over the show. The question posted by you very rarely ever gets answered directly by PPRUNE. You will probably just have to do the work like everybody else and market yourself to the operators. Suitcaseman wrote things that some people don't want to hear because it is an answer of unsatisfying value and judgement of attitude - if you remove or filter that personal subjective opinion, what it comes down to, is that it is difficult to find jobs at this point in time-nothing really new but definatly a big factor in the employment equation at this time. Not more not less.

I also appologize for not posting answers to your questions.

[Der absolute Hammer]

1. suitcaseman's advice was correct. His attitude assumptions vindicated.
2. Flight aviation is in practice, almost always a vertical movement. Most pilots do not have lateral career skills, I think.
3. Emirates should have done what El Al did in 1983.
4. This Forum might have the worst attitude seen on the web? Possible but then this is a forum meant for Professional Pilots - not amateurs or scambled egg wannabbess with baby powder problems.
5.The orignal post is a joke? Yes, must be. Reads like something out of Flashman.
It goes like this....
Well...holy Hindu cow- -I am looking at you people over there in Africa, thinking how lucky you are, that I am talking to you from my great height here in the land of the elephant. I have a wonderful job and I am a Captain with much experience. 3,000 total hours with only 1,300 command on light turnbine. However, I am totally bored with my own limited existence and want to come and fly in the bush because I have heard that it is a real life experience. This is only a short term measure until I move on, as I will for sure, and put my feet up in the jet cockpit and have it all done for me. I can't be backsided to get across to see for myself-sorry-that is either because my job is so good and they need me so much or becuase well, I can't be faggeded.
Okay then, here is some really good advice. If you want to expeience the real Afrika and have some real experience flying-pop across to the Congo. In the meantime I will pack my suitcase and go Globetrotting.

[WDaron]

Der absolute Hammer - I could not have parodied LOGS better myself!

Well done!!!

[Propellerpilot]

Yep the Hammer has spoken !:ok:

[austra1998]

what the hell is wrong with you guys?

i think the bored one is not this guy in india but u guys in africa.

and i'm bored too in Malaysia..thats probably why i waste my time replying to this useless discussion.

[WDaron]

eh, but Jason is just naive its almost become a sport.

The man has all of about 7 career posts in about 3 days of being on PPrune, and has been flamed almost double that - which has to be some sort of record. Look Jason, you actually EARNED that achievement, instead of BUYING it!!!!! Lets see you do the same with your next flying job..... :D:D:D

Daron

[AlternativeProcedure]

Back to the question of does any body have any leads for the guy? And whats all this talk of people only getting jobs in Africa only when they show up? That maybe the case in certain parts but certainly not all. I've flown with at least 23 guys who got jobs flying dash-8's in west Africa within a short period and not one of them had stepped foot in Africa before hand. Showing up is a good way of getting ur face known aswell as networking, but it certainly not the only way. Life is all about happiness in the things we do LOGs, if you are bored and you are capable of getting something else in this current economic climate, make yourself happy and go for it. I'd much rather fly with someone who's happy than someone who feels they are just putting with a job. Life's too short, make the most of it. PM me by the way, maybe of some assistance.

AP

[JTrain]

The Dash 8 guys in West Africa were likely on UN contract, so thats a separate story.

[AlternativeProcedure]

UN Contract??? I think not!!! A normal scheduled airline with some contract work from oil companies. I flew for them for at least 3 years so I know.

[chileno 777]

Search Airline Pilot Jobs - Flight Deck Jobs, Flight Crew Vacancies, First Officer Jobs (http://www.airlinepilotjobs.com/powersearch.asp)

[helldog]

Hey Logs.

I worked in Tanzania for a few years. The news I am hearing from there is not great at the moment. Looks like things are a bit slow. Same in Kenya but they seem to be ticking along. If you want some names to start you looking. Air Excel in Arusha has a 406, your kingair command time might make you attractive to them, they also have a Let 410. I heard a whisper not so long ago that Tanzanair in Dar Es Salaam is looking for kingair crew.

Now about pprune because you seem quite new to it. You will get a bunch of idiots talking sh!t here no matter what the subject. The best way to deal with them is not to engage them at all, they will soon get errm......bored and go away. If you check under their user names you can see where they are from. If you notice the guys that are giving you a hard time here are all from the J'burg area. These guys should not worry you. For a start you will not get a job in SA, but thats not the real Africa anyway. I promise you will not bump into these guys at some bush strip in East Africa. Don't be discouraged mate, if you go somewhere like Tanzania you will find you will be welcome. There are heaps of expats flying there and the Tanzanian pilots are very friendly and experienced. They are chilled out guys and you will find that don't display the same attitude that you have seen here , cheers bud.:ok:

[anotheradam]

Hello Logs,

Where are you working in India?? I have JAA ATPL(fz), TT5200 mostly GA multi, intructing and 500+ turbine (Shorts360). Any leads your part of the world please. If got offered KingAir job would do the conversion.
Cheers,

[perceval]

Hear , Hear the words of wisdom of the top (hell)dog up there at 35000 ft .
Try looking at a relatively exhaustive list of operators (Jp airline fleet for ex.or websearch ) and call them up .Some form of direct contact will always be better .Also try to sum up what kind of country you want to work in .Hard core adventure dodging mountains , bullets and dangerous humans or hollyday type destination dodging palm trees , ladies and wild animals .You've got it all , it's a continemt ...good luck .Reverse question , How is it to get a turboprop captain job in india at the minute ???

[alpha-b]

Well said Helldog.There are some bunch of guys here who always are here to discourage others,instead of shedding lights on the matter with the guy they just go on and fire him with bullets for information he's asking

[LOGS]

Helldog, that was the post I was looking for, I really appreciate it. I just want some names of companys out there so I can do my own research. I've decided though to finish my contract out here which is only 4 months and then kinda see what trouble I can get into.

As for the bashes, I figured they're natives, just the vibe you get as an expat pilot sometime. Doesn't bother me and actually is entertaining sometimes.

As for getting into India, first you need at least 100hrs on type, DGCA rules. Getting into the commerical aviation world is becoming ever more difficult because they're trying to get all the expats out of the country. On the charter side, most jobs are gotten by word of mouth. I got mine from a buddy who got his job from a buddy and so on. I honestly cannot see expats being driven out of the charter side because they really need us. Most indian pilots are terrible, very very terrible. I truely feel that if something were to happen to me while flying, my FO wouldn't beable to get it on the ground safetly and that's with every indian FO in my company. Anyways, from what I've heard theres need of one piaggio pilot and thats all I've heard about recently.

[Abul Qais]

Hey jason
Just wondering if you could give me more info's on what u r flying in india and how do i go about landing a job there sometime in near future .I have Aus CPL with approx 2000 hrs total and some turbine exp

[ugflyer]

helldog; I have to say that you put it well. Ignore them and they go away for they will have nothing to say to "nothing".
LOGS; All the luck in your endeavours......nothing wrong in expressing your dissatisfaction of a position and just like AlternativeProcedure said, you do not have to be in the area to be noticed.
Excuse me for I have to pour some Johnnie Black on the rocks gentlemen! .....I am thirsty:ok:

[Csanad007]

LOGs don't get embarassed,
for a start check out my blog. Just google this: Africa (Botswana, Malawi, Namibia, Tanzania, Zambia) Low-time Pilot Wannabe's Info

I think you'll find a sh!tload of info on companies, requirements and some other stuff.

cheers buddy and hope you'll have luck in Africa

[aditya104]

All expat pilots will be phased out from India very soon. So, its good time to start looking for a new job outside. Jason, Can u share with us ur Indian experience.

[LOGS]

Aditya104 -
They say they are phasing out the expats but within this last week they extended the deadline another year and I'd bet my left nut its gonna be extended even longer. Bottom line is they just won't beable to do it. Airline side yes, but not corporate side.

Expats must be P1 pilots, P2's are not allowed. To be a P1, you must have 100 hrs PIC. Anything needing a type(over 12500) you must also have a ATPL. To get my temp FATA was very easy, the company helped everything.

What else do you want to know? List the questions and I'll answer what I can.

[Der absolute Hammer]

So glad to find that the sympathy card hs provided the informaiton that was wanted.
But in a serious position now for a minute please. I think that things are really getting pretty bad through Africa in general. I find that many of the safari companys that used to need type rated King Air pilots-even part time-now do not have the work for ther full time pilots. Sefofane in Maun are almost stopped, I heard and if that is true-and Sefofane do not confirm that-then things will get worse.There are not the rich tourists to generate the camp flying.
Do not forget that although South Africa is not Africa, according to some, - much of flying sub sahara does run from SA in one way or another.There are South African companys flying throughout Africa, but even if you have an Emb 120 rating or a Caravan on a licence, it seems that things are closing in. This is not meant to be pessimistic-it is just what I have found after speaking with all the people in aviation down here that I know for a long time. Even instructing opportunities seem to be getting harder to find.
It is obvious that there are opportunities about but also there are many pilots with local licences, contacts and type ratings looking for the work also.
So while I wish everyone very well in their searches-if you have the job and can renew a contract you possibly had better do that and-ride the mustang for a while. This situation will not, no way, get better soon. If you want to do some research then find out how important tourism is to SA and east Africa and just think where those bucks have vanished in the last few months. The only people spending the money are those who know how to make the money in a recession and they are not like locusts on the ground.

[LOGS]

^^That is extremely true just about everywhere in the world it seems. I wasn't looking for anything right now, I was more looking when my contract expires in case I can't renew it or whatnot. Seems like the States are bouncing back a little bit with the lower fuel prices but it is nowhere where it was a year back. Luckly though, when the industry changes, it changes quickly and I know we all hope for that day to be soon.

[Der absolute Hammer]

There is a rumour that there exisits another forum more specifical to Africa called something like Africa Aviation. That might possibly be another lead to make a posting on.

[Immelmann1979]

ok guys, disregarding his phraseology , does anybody has any useful info on the subject, contacts, company names, whatever?

He might have a luxury problem, but i just want to go, one because i want to and two, i dont have a job anyway.

So if anybody can share some info with me, would be awesome!!

[JTrain]

Try the search function.

In no particular order, put in these company names: Executive Turbine, Naturelink, Federal Air, Qwila, Solenta, Cemair, NAC.

There's a bunch more that I can't think of off the top of my head.

There are several threads comparing life at different contract operators.

jt

[Csanad007]

Hammer and all, the African Aviation forum is way worst. Already seaqrched a while there but PPRUNE has more useful info.

Hammer: I still have the hairspray!

[HVYMETLDRIVERWANNABE]

Go to Thailand instead bro, you'll have more fun. Theres an ambulance service there I know of that flies KingAirs that will probably hire you especially since you have a lot of PIC time on type!:ok:

[LOGS]

^^Got a name for the place?

[Csanad007]

yepp and some requirements?

[HVYMETLDRIVERWANNABE]

Try Siam Land Flying Co. on google, thats one they fly the 350 and they were hiring not to long ago, theres another I found too but its not coming up lemme look some more.

As an expat you'll need 2500TT and the time on type with the rating since the government is strict about the hiring of expats. Its tough to get in, but I don't know of anyone that ever regretted living in Thailand! :ok:

[jumbo Mouse]

:} Is it not strange LOG's, that all the people who tell you to stay away from African aviation are locate in Africa, and all those encouraging you are from USA/UK and so on, well man I can say you should listen to those in the know!!!

Just a friendly word mate.

[SLIPANDSKID]

For some reason I come and read this forum, but for the life of me I don't know why?!

So much dross coming from these morons. I've only been flying here in "real Africa" for 3 years. It is not that hard, it isn't that dangerous and you don't have to be a macho marlboro smoking cowboy to hack it. Just rock up, keep you head screwed on, get stuck in and have fun.

As for jobs I spoke to coastal by email in Tanzania and they said I should fly down there next week and if I stay to work they will reimburse my flight! starting in a c206 and upto c208 when proved myself, if i remember. And as for the boredom thing, 90% of us started flying for fun and excitement, so if his job isnt that anymore, he should pack up and move on. And guess what? If he moves here to work that means there is a flying slot in India so maybe one of this forums idiots can rock up over there and get it!??!

I'm in Africa and think you should come on over.

[AlternativeProcedure]

Me too, I only flew in "real Africa" for 3 years up until recently so what do I know about getting jobs there? And the fact my location says UK, is only because I was in the UK some years ago when I registered on PPrune, so I really dont understand any connection about this issue of advice and location?????

[Der absolute Hammer]

Yes but you see - LOGS says that coming over on speculation is not an option for him so it is hard to see what he can do from where he is unless he does exactly what he really should do but whcih he says he cannot?

[AlternativeProcedure]

Well suitcaseman, you may have been flying in Africa for the last God knows how long, good for you, but I'm sure the internet wasnt invented then(sorry to rub it in). Thankfully for the new generation, it has been invented. So in the words of my CRM instructor, use all the resources available to you. The guy wants recent advice, thats what I've given him, and also gave him an example of guys who I flew the dash with who never stepped foot in Africa but used the internet effectively. LOGs you have my advice, as i said earlier, if you need some assisstance, send me a PM(making use of the internet again). You'll love Africa!!!