View Full Version : Question
TheMessenger
22nd Feb 2009, 02:03
Setup:
3 Crew members ( 1-Captain, 2-FO's) arrive at Ethiopia Addis Airport
None have ever been there before.
The rep takes you in the crew bus to the ramp.
The "rep" takes the Captain away to go to "OPS".
Question:
A. You wait for the Captain to return to the crew bus.
B. You allow the bus driver to take you to the airplane without talking to the Captain.
?
Wait for the Captain to return to the bus, unless...it has been arranged and discussed at the time to the contrary.
Common courtesy.
TheMessenger
22nd Feb 2009, 05:30
411A
Right. You NEVER leave your wingman.
Top Gun 101
Agreed. If no other arrangement made, sit tight.
Intruder
22nd Feb 2009, 13:28
That may or may not work at ADD. Routinely there is not a dedicated crew bus for each crew, so the bus will not wait in place while the Captain files the flight plan. It should be a very simple matter for the Captain to send the other 2 off to the airplane to start their preflight work. There is no reason for 2 pilots to wait around, doing nothing...
Intruder, I think the question is more: "if nothing else arranged/agreed"...
Actually, the more I think of it... maybe my previous was wrong.
The object of the exercise is to get away ontime (well +- depending on where you are), with the usual saftey caveats. An F/O F/E L/M F/M can get a lot done whilst the Capt is paying for this that or the other. (PS in our outfit it is usually the L/M that does the paying...)
Interested to hear from others. And let me say right now, if someone feels the urge to hijack this thread just because 411A has given his opinion, be ready to not post on the forum for a while. I won't put up with that **** here.
Actually its important for both pilots to attend the brief, flight plans weather, notams etc. Crew bus problems are not really important when it comes to doing things the correct way, if this is what caused the issue.
Late departure because of crew bus is the stations problem, not the front end crew.
SNS3Guppy
23rd Feb 2009, 02:37
I'm not sure why it's important for both pilots to go file the flight plan or get the weather. That can be had by the Captain, who can bring it to the crew while they ready the airplane. Printed material is really a self-brief, and if there's anything to be shared or discussed, the captain can do that when he gets to the airplane.
IslamoradaFlyer
23rd Feb 2009, 06:01
411A's opinion was indeed valid as were others. I agree with CR's comment about departure time; I guess the underlying question is how fluid is the current political situation? An uptick in instability would lend consideration to everyone sticking together.
If it is stable, that's good. But common courtesy should be the rule unless the Captain decides otherwise.
Intruder
23rd Feb 2009, 07:47
Actually its important for both pilots to attend the brief, flight plans weather, notams etc. Crew bus problems are not really important when it comes to doing things the correct way, if this is what caused the issue.
Late departure because of crew bus is the stations problem, not the front end crew.
When I was there last fall, my crew didn't want to have any part of "Ops" -- they were very happy to take the bus right to the airplane and leave me to do the planning and paying and stuff...
When it comes down to it, it's not much different than any other place: Once I got to the airplane with the paperwork, they looked at it just as they would have if the station rep brought it out in any other station (except they got to snicker at the handwritten flight plan I had to do).
free at last
23rd Feb 2009, 13:05
It is always nice to have great ground support, and very much appreaciated by all crew members ,the team, and definatly a good safe operation. Having operated out of Africa I would say flexibility is the Key.
AvEnthusiast
23rd Feb 2009, 14:12
TheMessenger,
But I see your question from definitely different prospective. You said these guys arrive at the airport and have never been there before.
- which means they have just landed there. and the rep of the company comes and picks them up while the captain goes with rep for a postflight duty or whatever and then they are going to their guest house or whereever then the other pilots need to wait so they will all go together.
- but if they come for a departure from that airport then it means they have been there while they landed. and now if the rep takes the captain with him to ops then it means he is the one managing things there and of course while getting off the bus he would have explain to the bus driver or to the pilots what to do. or how long it's going to take them there. or asks the captain that they need to go to ops and the time it takes them there and what does he want his officers to do.
Heck, Enthusiast is right; we've assumed departures, but re-reading the original post.... non-specific. Interesting.
The key, of course, is the six P's....Prior Planning Prevents Pi** Poor Performance.
Africa, you have to have a sense of humor, and a buckfull of patience.
Both, generally work wonders.
Ah, patience & Africa... yup, got it in one. Go there and start shouting the odds, "this is unacceptable" etc, they'll just turn around and walk off. And then you're screwed and then be invited for tea without biscuits... "so... what was the 36 hour delay all about....?"
Need a certain attitude over there, gotta pretend to be cooler than them and care even less than them; whatever happens, smile and shrug your shoulders... otherwise you're finished. Not just this turnaround, but the next and the next and the next...
Once they've decided that CR2 is a :mad: , CR2 is finished.
Once they decided that CR2 is :ok:, well, the impossible becomes possible...
A lesson to the youngsters, offered free of charge by me. By doing it the wrong way first. Then again, at 21 you know it all better ;)... LOL
PS: ADD was my very first trip as L/M, had a minder with me :-) Special flight too; an ex L/M was flying left seat with the Chief Pilot RHS.... His last sector prior to getting his 4th stripe. We continued to NBO that day... well, what a party afterwards ;)