Fresh CPL heading North or West

[Andy05]

Good day,
I know this has been spoken about over and over and over,
my question is to the pilots that have just made there way up north or west, how are they finding things? and how are the employers feeling with
the economy the way it is? Just curious as I have my CPL and IFR exams booked for the last week in March and if all goes well I'll have my bags packed and heading up there with my fresh CPL as soon it's off the printer.


Cheers

[bill.lumbergh]

I would also really appreciate anyones feedback on the state of GA up there this year. :) Given I have a wife and a mortgage its a bit much to ask the missus to quit her job and walk away from her life in Melb with no more info than "pack your car, head up north and find out for yourself". :ouch:

[Andy05]

I'm married and I have got a mortage and we looked at the options and
my wife has decided that she will stay in Sydney seeing that she has a great job that pays well which means I only need to send home a small amount of money to make sure that mortage is paid and that she'll be fine she also has lots of family here that are great.

[Mr. Hat]

bill, there was a thread or two about a year ago from memory from a couple of "older" guys with families. Might be worth doing a search and chasing them up to see how they faired and what advice they may have.

[the wizard of auz]

well, from an older married and mortgaged point of view. the GA scene for new CPL's is very difficult. the wages for new starters is pretty lame. I do a little flying for a company in the NW during the build up and wet and although they pay better than average for the work I do, and the equipment is good and the flying great, I really battle to make ends meet after a about three months.
I am lucky enough to not have to pay rent while I am up there, but it still gets pretty hard unless you have a second job. I reckon it would be a killer if you were trying to pay the exorbitant rents that are the norm for the area.
Good luck with it, but be ready to work hard in two jobs to make ends meet.

[FourBalls]

which means I only need to send home a small amount of money

Sadly Andy05, the likely direction of flow for you and your wife's money will be, at least initially, northward.

[Tiger 77]

Trust me, its easier if you leave your wife/girlfriend at home in the city. Although some will become conformtable in their new outback home, the majority seem to become quite restless after the first few months and thats where the relationship will really be tested. I've seen this plenty of times.

Its the same situation for female pilots who decide to bring their other half up north, or guys who bring their boyfriends up.

Cheers

Tiger

[QF5]

Sorry for any thread drift...

Tiger 77, you've raised a point that I've been wondering for a while now,

Can anyone shed any light on how well gay guys generally get along in GA?
Probably sounds like a stupid question, and I'd imagine there really wouldn't be any difference provided we don't push the fact onto everyone we meet and put in the effort like everyone else, but I was just wondering if gay guys are generally well accepted in some of the smaller communities. I may be ignorant for even asking, but I've honestly not lived anywhere smaller than Perth and am genuinely curious.

Cheers,

[wish2bflying]

80k? That's a damn sight more than what I'm getting to support a wife and two kids! I've been under the impression that starting salaries are in the order of 25K if you're lucky and if you stick it out for 5+ years you'd be lucky to get up to 65-70K, which is one of the main reasons I've stayed in my non-flying job. At 35 years young, these decisions are getting more and more difficult to contemplate. :(

[bill.lumbergh]

Guys thanks sincerely for taking the time to offer your honest opinion and experiences. I appreciate the feedback. :ok: It sure is a tough and complicated decision.
Gadrivr thanks for your post. I think maybe the solution is similar to yours. Promise the wife to limit the bash to a year or two and if its not working out to go back to flying a desk.
Like they say Fortune Favours the Brave.

PS if I make it i'm going to write a book on how to do it. I know i'd buy it.

[Mr. Hat]

GADRVR what sort of hours do yo have?

[GADRIVR]

2100, MECIR, 100 ME, cabin class twin time. The usual for a BK dog.
Where are you now? I've followed your posts with interest. We may know one another:ok:

[Mr. Hat]

At home! My posts with interest! Ha no wonder you are getting sick of aviation (just kidding!).

400 multi and things could change for you. Circumstances are different for all but you might find that the playing field changes once you have your 500 me cmd.

Things are bleak at the moment yes but don't forget that many aircraft orders are still in place so eventally either they will be cancelled or crewed.

The reality is however that Jet or no Jet, aviation is not what it used to be. If you compare what teachers, nurses and police earned 10-15 years ago to now and do the same for a Jet pilot you soon realise that its not a very good trend. And in some cases it looks like its going to get worse.

Good luck.

[bill.lumbergh]

Things are bleak at the moment yes but don't forget that many aircraft orders are still in place so eventally either they will be cancelled or crewed.

If it makes you feel any better the one area I am "knowledgeable" about is the airline industry. True the situation is FUBAR but give it 18 months to 2 yrs and it will be back performing well. Remember its a cycle, not a turning point in commercial aviation. With any luck there may be an even greater shortage of applicants than last time. And a lot of the old busses will be replaced by then too.

[solowflyer]

Like Bill says. Things might be looking gloomy now but people have short memories and things will bounce back. Just thinking of all the things that have hit aviation hard in the last few years 911, SARS, when they all hit every thing went pear shaped for a while, airlines went bust tourists stopped travelling and it was the end of aviation, but it did bounce back and it will again, just got to be ready for the next wave. I believe the next wave will be bigger than the last.

To all those not sure what to do I say bite the bullet and go for it, if you can't get a tourist gig look outside the square make an effort, make some enquiries, most jobs are not advertised,eg glider towing, meat bombing, dog baiting, bird scaring, mustering there is still many more ways to get the hours up. As to wages, think of it as an apprenticeship the first few years are lower paying but they do go up as you accrue more experience.

Get into it

[ditchin]

I'm heading up to Kununurra in a weeks time, I don't have a retractable undercarriage endorsement, and as it seems a lot of the flying is done in 210's, I was wondering if this will be an issue in gaining employment. Is it a must have before heading up, or do companies endorse you on these aircraft?

[torsion]

Ditchin,
If you have the time and money get your retract. It's not essential but if two equal candidates come up for the same job one has retract the other doesn't the one with it will be favoured. It is almost impossible to get done these sorts of things done up here, so have all the boxes ticked before you head up.

[tinpis]

See that button/lever marked GEAR?
Well....UP means gear up dont land yet
Down means gear DOWn yer kin land if the lights are GREEN
Please PM me for the total amount payable for your retract endorsement
Yours
TeePee
Have a nice day

[ditchin]

anyone know somewhere in melbourne where it could be done? preferably the cheapest..

[Metro man]

Can anyone shed any light on how well gay guys generally get along in GA?

Think of the sort of places where most G/A goes on. Smaller, regional communities where the population is not as "enlightened and progressive as the capital cities". The sort of places Pauline Hanson was very popular and those who didn't vote for her voted National.

Think red neck hick towns with farm workers, miners, military, road maintenance, railway, etc, workers. These people can be some what narrow minded and unsympathetic where poofters are concerned. Trying to pick up another man in a pub in North Queensland will probably get you slung out the door with a black eye.

Best advice is keep it well to yourself. No lisping, mincing walks or limp wrists. Be seen reading RALPH, FHM, Shootin Magazines etc. Keep your usual lifestyle for back in the city and you should have no problems.:E

[harropster]

i wouldnt bother coming up here without a retractable endorsement......

[Di_Vosh]

Gawd! Assuming you're not winding us up, get your Retract endorsement before you go! As was said earlier, do NOT go up there without one.

anyone know somewhere in melbourne where it could be done? preferably the cheapest..

Any flying school around Melbourne would be a good place to go. Ring around for quotes. Don't necessarily go the cheapest (this is possibly how you got your CPL without a retract endorsement in the first place). :sad:

Some of your other comments are telling me that you might be a little unprepared to go to Kunnanurra "in a week". There's plenty of info here in D&G on local operators, minimums, conditions, accomodation, what to take, etc. I'd suggest you do a search to get more info.

DIVOSH!

[tinpis]

Think red neck hick towns with farm workers, miners, military, road maintenance, railway, etc, workers.

Anywhere just North of Perth really
Most have yet to learn to walk on their hind legs and some are known to eat their young :hmm:

[bushpig]

Hahaha! Couldn't have said it better tinpis!

[psycho joe]

Think of the sort of places where most G/A goes on. Smaller, regional communities where the population is not as "enlightened and progressive as the capital cities". The sort of places Pauline Hanson was very popular and those who didn't vote for her voted National.


As opposed to your "enlightened" city folk who simply adorn the national flag and act out neo nazi style ethnic cleansing.

Think red neck hick towns with farm workers, miners, military, road maintenance, railway, etc, workers. These people can be some what narrow minded and unsympathetic where poofters are concerned.

Yes, lazy slackers who wouldn't know an honest days work and do nothing to contribute to society.

Trying to pick up another man in a pub in North Queensland will probably get you slung out the door with a black eye.


So would espousing the virtues of Jihad, or the enlightenment of Scientology.

Infact, being slung out the door with a black eye may give you some credibility as most pilots would save their bar room bravado for the safety of an anonymous forum. Example...

Most have yet to learn to walk on their hind legs and some are known to eat their young

You tell em.


Country people go by a pretty simple set of rules. Work hard, be useful and try to fit in. When in Rome...

[GADRIVR]

Ok....I've got a sense of humour!!!
Psycho Joe.....lighten up my man. Seems you've missed the point.
A gay dude was asking how he would go up North. He was answered quite bluntly by people who've obviously been there and done that. People who have come from the city, lived in a remote area and have learnt the meaning of the word tolerance during their time in the city.(whether they liked it or not!).
I'm originally from the bush up Nth Qld so here's some facts.
Fact...gays aren't tolerated.
Fact...aboriginals aren't tolerated
Fact...anything different is viewed with suspicion
Fact...people generally speaking don't have or want much to do with city folk (as your post reflects quite nicely)
and to finish....FACT...you didn't actually give the gay dude any advice.
Says it all really......now...there's a good chap, pick yourself up, wipe the spit from your jaw,comb your fur..sorry hair and go back to your cave darling. I'm sure the little missus will be sitting there waiting with your meat and three veg warming, after which you'll be able to sit down and watch the ABC before going to bed dreaming of the pig hunt and beers afterwards coming this weekend!
Notice I didn't use the word prick or sanctimonious or lazy slacker or so on.
I'm not judging you my friend... I don't have to. I'll finish with this.
Aren't people above advising the dude essentially what you finished your post with? (when in Rome etc).:E

[psycho joe]

You tell em! :D

[the wizard of auz]

Anywhere just North of Perth really
Most have yet to learn to walk on their hind legs and some are known to eat their young
Hey Tinny. I'm pretty sure Darwin is a fair trot north of Perth.
Hows that two legged business going???....... gotta go, the kids are cooked.:}

[QF5]

GADRIVR & METRO MAN,

Thanks very much for taking the time to answer - I appreciate it.

You've pretty much confirmed what I had thought, which - truth be told - is a little sobering, but I'm still really looking forward to heading out bush... what's life without a bit of a challenge? and honestly, I managed to get along as a 'straight guy' for my first 17 years, and I've only had two years of the hook so it shouldn't be too hard I hope ;D *fingers crossed*

Cheers,

[tinpis]

Not the locals wiz ya big dummy
The stuff that moves in there

[solowflyer]

not sure bout dem dear red necks being all straight. Have you not seen Deliverance "Squeal like a pig boy":eek:

[Mr. Hat]

QF5, GA and the pilot role in general is stereo typically a very macho dominated work force. In GA its porn, FHM and RALPH day in day out. Great if you are straight but I imagine difficult if you are not. To top it off everyone is competing to be the ultimate Alpha male if you know what i mean. This generally does not breed an environment of open mindedness. However, you will find on an individual basis most pilots are quite broad minded and understanding of individual differences. It is the group acceptance that could be difficult.

If flying is your passion then i wouldn't let these "hurdles" get in your way. I suppose its all about knowing how to behave in order to minimise the negative behaviour. On this i suspect you would already have quite a bit of experience because closed minded people are readily accessible in cities to!

I suppose common sense is the approach. As far as I'm concerned if you pull your weight and operate as a professional then thats all that matters. What you do at home is not of any interest to me.

Good luck.

P.S. It has been done before and odds are with the number of Airline pilots in Oz that there are quite a few gay people amongst the ranks.