View Full Version : Tornado, new british steam loco 1st mainline run yesterday!

1st Feb 2009, 09:33
planes ?? pah :ugh:heres a real toy lol!


yesterday i travelled on the newly built a1 steam loco Tornado from york to newcastle, this is an amazing feat of 3 chaps who said lets build an engine from a 1949 design but from scratch !:D

heres a real way to travel hehe
this kid at the end just sums it all up !!!:O:O:O
YouTube - Tornado 60163 at Durham (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=QSWh1qlhhxs)
and this one is mine below, great atmosphere last night!
YouTube - a1 loco tornado 31 jan 2009 leaving york after her fast and first run (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=6EC8Mf52_5Y)

for more info on the loco!
The A1 Steam Locomotive Trust (http://www.a1steam.com)
lotsa stuff to read for railway chaps and perhaps sponsor her for only
5 a month
its loadsa fun:O

1st Feb 2009, 09:35

1st Feb 2009, 09:36
i was in 5th coach

wicked pic

1st Feb 2009, 10:08
As global warming is a myth, we should scrap all electric trains, and bring back the Steam trains, re-open the Welsh coal mines and establish a proper rail network.

Proper trains, proper jobs, proper services.

tony draper
1st Feb 2009, 10:32
Magic!!good to see summat built in this country that doesn't look like tat from the Franklin Mint,in fact it's just good to see summat built in this country.:ok:
By Englishmen as well.:E

1st Feb 2009, 10:34
yes deffo,
when a new steam train hauls 500-600 people at a time then the climate effect is b:mad:r all !
get more people off their bums outta their cars,off the roads and into nice steam trains lol

yes Tornado is mostly all british bits except the boiler which was made in germany,
boiler technology sadly passed away after the last steam loco here in 1968 so the germans were sourced as they had kept upto date with making steam boilers,
and very good it is too !

the youtube clips above make yer hair tingle !

1st Feb 2009, 10:41
Thank you all for the lovely piccies you've posted.
Great stuff.
Only ONE complaint though!
Where the HELL did they get the WHISTLE from ????
The bell on my trike when I was 3 was louder than that!!!!
It's PATHETIC. Lovely BIG steamers should have PROPER
Not something that sounds like a nursery toy!!!

I can only assume that the "Noise Police" got involved.

1st Feb 2009, 10:44
quote/Thank you all for the lovely piccies you've posted.
Great stuff.
Only ONE complaint though!
Where the HELL did they get the WHISTLE from ????
The bell on my trike when I was 3 was louder than that!!!!
It's PATHETIC. Lovely BIG steamers should have PROPER
Not something that sounds like a nursery toy!!!/unquote

here you go:O
YouTube - Tornado 60163 at Durham (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=QSWh1qlhhxs) chime
this is better lol !:O:O
she has 2 whistles btw
one is a toot toot, the other is a 1930's original chime from an old A4 loco kindly lent to the trust,
YouTube - a1 loco tornado 31 jan 2009 leaving york after her fast and first run (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=6EC8Mf52_5Y) (this is the toot toot lol)

1st Feb 2009, 10:50
Used to have a 1930's original chime on the mantlepiece.

1st Feb 2009, 11:05
what from an actual engine?

tony draper
1st Feb 2009, 11:27
Great demo of doppler shift.:)

1st Feb 2009, 11:36
And the whistle is wrong for an A1 Pacific.
What they're using there is a 'copy' (pretty poor one) of an A4 Pacific. :8:8:8

Oops. Just noticed end of post 8. Still say that's not an original A4 whistle.

1st Feb 2009, 11:39
sorry but you are incorrect, its not a copy,

please see the trust's website for details on where the chime whistle has been obtained...
its an original one from an old a4 loco lent by its current owner,


1st Feb 2009, 11:43
sorry but you are incorrect, its not a copy,

I'll take your word for that. Maybe what we hear on Youtube is both whistles being used - that would explain it. Cracking job though. :ok::ok::ok:

1st Feb 2009, 11:45
you are right, BOTH whistles can be heard in the 2 clips above,

the night time clip of mine is the 'toot toot' one lol:O
and the one wiv the kid at then end is the old chime one which is wicked:ok:

just as an aside the liner queen mary 2 (2004 launched) has one of the original steam whistles from the old queen mary (1936)
it sounds amazing;)

Dan Gerous
1st Feb 2009, 12:10
It's coming up to Edinburgh on the 28th Feb, so I will try to ambush it somewhere along the Forth coastline, might even get it going both ways. :)

1st Feb 2009, 12:51
She's beautiful. Nay, she's GRAND! :ok:

1st Feb 2009, 13:03
They do say that beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Well this beholder thinks that this is a true work of art. I know that modern trains are supposed to be more eco friendly, etc., but a steam train has character.

Captain Stable
1st Feb 2009, 13:10
I can't help but notice that they used the WRY-06 rivets instead of the later model YTR-7-8A rivets which, as any fool knows, were the later model, developed to stop crank crinkle after the the introduction of TKN-QWE type plate... ;)

What a load of spotters you blokes sound like...

tony draper
1st Feb 2009, 13:15
Well our generation went in for the likes of train spotting rather than going in for mugging pensioners and smoking crack Captain S.

1st Feb 2009, 13:31
A much gentler and civilised age which those who would mock would do well to examine their lives in this current era :=

Cap'n Stable - perhaps if you had been able to perch on a platform end to witness these wonders of mechanical engineering then you might have a better appreciation of the better things in life which transcend the modern "have it all now" attitude.

Captain Stable
1st Feb 2009, 13:31
I wasn't aware they were alternatives, or even the only alternatives...

Personally, I have never gone in for either. I do like the look, smell and sound of a steam locomotive. I wouldn't dream of getting into an argument about something like And the whistle is wrong for an A1 Pacific.
What they're using there is a 'copy' (pretty poor one) of an A4 Pacific.

1st Feb 2009, 13:33
But presumably you would be able to tell the difference between a 747 with Pratt & Witney engines rather than Rolls Royce?

Back in your box Sir :=

Captain Stable
1st Feb 2009, 13:37
Actually, I don't think I would! :uhoh:

I can tell a 737-200 from a -300 and later, but that's about it.

1st Feb 2009, 13:41
Ah well, you can't be all bad as you do like the look, smell and sound of a steam locomotive :ok:

1st Feb 2009, 14:08
Tornado brings a tear to my eye.
The emotional understand why.
The age of steam.
The engine a gleam.
Furious as it thunders by.

Evening Star
1st Feb 2009, 17:12
Dumped Mrs and Miss ES at MetroHell and took train in to see Tornado arrive at Newcastle. Time well spent I say. Look, my allegiances are more Western/Midland, but I tip my hat in respect to what those guys have done. When the project first started I said it would never happen. Think it was about the time that the boiler arrived that I realised that eating ones own words was on the menu. Yesterday was marvellous.:ok:

tony draper
1st Feb 2009, 17:16
Sadly I have to report I forgot again :(,even after copying the timetable to me desktop, she would have passed about a quarter of a mile from my side of the Team Valley.

1st Feb 2009, 17:21
At last, a Tornado that the UK can be proud of....:E

Captain Speedbird
1st Feb 2009, 17:48
Great effort! :ok:

An excuse to post my favourite youtube clip. Check this (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=QpQSFMK3F80) one out!

tony draper
1st Feb 2009, 18:16
Feckin Magic!! Captain, :ok:all that glorious smoke,that's whats wrong wi this generation of weedy asthmatic and allergy ridden milksops we have bred the last forty years, they didn't get a good lungfull of that stuff to build up a immunity in sproghood.
Great sound as well turned up me speakers full.

1st Feb 2009, 18:34
Wonderful pic ORAC. The fat cont..the fat cont...the fat cont...the fat controller, would be proud!

Sorry about the stammer - and I know in this PC age it should be "the big cont...the big cont...the big cont...the big controller".

1st Feb 2009, 18:49
How long will it be till this project runs out of steam...........( kinda like the Vulcan ??) :ouch:

1st Feb 2009, 18:50
It's the Fat Controller, still is on the current season of Thomas. :ok::

just as an aside the liner queen mary 2 (2004 launched) has one of the original steam whistles from the old queen mary (1936)
it sounds amazing

For those in the UK who want to hear her, she is doing a lap of Britain in October. I'll wave to you. :ok:

1st Feb 2009, 19:16
Pity no one in the UK could build the boiler.

Do the Chinese still build one loco per day?

1st Feb 2009, 20:27
Fan-bloody-tastic! Mallard next?

1st Feb 2009, 21:30
was busy on Saturday on the Cotton Mill Express but today off I went to York to see the beast in anger.

Bustitution - no trains from Leeds to York - Sod It - drove! At least I got there. People from Leeds didn't as a fight kicked off on their conveyance and the police had to be called! Sunday morning eh???

Then by jumping passing NXEC trains I got to see it at Darlington, Ferryhill, Durham, and Gateshead

An A1 on the ECML - just looks "right"

1st Feb 2009, 21:44
Sounds a bit like me chasing CNR 6218 down a foggy highway one morning many decades ago.


1st Feb 2009, 21:58
well to reply to the above poster,
i really do not think Tornado will run out of steam...

its a tight well funded and well run ship (well, loco)

we do need more money all the time, so if you chaps love steam then why not put just 5 a month into the trust as a supporter and i can assure you many years of fun !;)

you all say you love the smell, the sights,the sounds so go on then,
join up!

im glad i've made you all very happy sharing with you here my great day yesterday and sharing some stories too...
keep em coming !

ps late great news,
the official naming ceremony of Tornado will be announced very soon,
hopefully hrh charles prince of wales and camilla duchess of cornwall will do the honours possibly at the NRM york,
the royal train will be hauled by Tornado and maybe a fly-past by 2 RAF Tornados' to honour this loco,
Tornado, the name was given in honour to the service given by the RAF in the gulf war,
well, so i have heard, great stuff eh?

1st Feb 2009, 22:10
late great news,
The A1 Steam Locomotive Trust (http://www.a1steam.com/)

the official naming ceremony of Tornado will be announced very soon,
hopefully hrh charles prince of wales and camilla duchess of cornwall will do the honours possibly at the NRM york,
the royal train will be hauled by Tornado and maybe a fly-past by 2 RAF Tornados' to honour this loco,
Tornado, the name was given in honour to the service given by the RAF in the gulf war,
well, so i have heard, great stuff eh?
YouTube - Tornado 60163 at Durham (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=QSWh1qlhhxs)

1st Feb 2009, 22:20
As long as 'British Rail' allow access to the mainline I expect that there will be enthusiasts willing to pay a premium to travel behind Tornado, and that will finance at least the running costs.
Whether there will be enough to cover repairs when they are necessary remains to be seen.
Perhaps an insurance company could be persuaded to underwrite the boiler in return for advertising?

1st Feb 2009, 22:41
lotsa trips coming up soon to travel behind tornado,
see the a1 steam loco website link above for travel details,
next saturday from york to london and
there a valentines dinner trip from london on 14feb

take the wife ?:D or gf or bf?;)

BBC News | Enlarged Image (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/spl/hi/pop_ups/08/uk_enl_1233472193/html/1.stm)

Old 'Un
1st Feb 2009, 23:07
Half a world away, but great to see the pictures and read the stories.

We haven't had an all-new steamer built in NZ for a long while, but there are many rebuilt/restored steamers on mainline 'special' runs here, with even more running on private lines.

Wonderful to see a brand new steamer running - and a 'coaly' to boot!

Oh, the sight, the steam, the sound, the smell.... the soot, the dust (cough, cough).

Only kidding. Long may she thunder along the iron roads.

(Yes, I'm jealous)

Le Vieux

Howard Hughes
1st Feb 2009, 23:14
I can only assume that the "Noise Police" got involved.
In Oz trains are exempt from noise control laws!:ok:

1st Feb 2009, 23:19
hi old'un (in NZ ?)

complete white-out snow blizzard here tonight in london

thanks for the nice comments,

yes its all the loco smells and the sounds, shes a beast, alive and personal!

cheers m8
another 2 clips for you
YouTube - Tornado viewed from Brafferton 31 01 09 (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=TJmF1cdEbsw)
YouTube - 60163 Tornado. 'York-Newcastle' Inaugural Train 31st January 2009 (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=isoxVpxWquM)

1st Feb 2009, 23:33
Tornado brings a tear to my eye.
The emotional understand why.
The age of steam.
The engine a gleam.
Furious as it thunders by.

how nice.....
posted by a chap lordgrumpy on page 2:D

also someone asked how they turn locos?
well they do have a few turntables left in the UK but generally they will turn the loco and/or train via a 'triangle' loop someone near...

also big hello to lexxity;) page 2 also
and thanks to capt speedbird for a wicked double-headed loco clip
cheers !:ok:
thanks to all the posters here for which this small piece of british history has made you all quite sentimental and happy !
YouTube - Tornado viewed from Brafferton 31 01 09 (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=TJmF1cdEbsw)
and its bloody snowing outside too !!!!

2nd Feb 2009, 00:43
Fan - f:mad:g - tastic! :eek:

O.K. so the boiler is German, some other fittings are from Seth Efrika, but who gives a damn?
Tornado is an achievement we Brits can be proud of! Well done to all involved! :D
There are several other "extinct" steam loco classes which will soon be seen again, as new-builds are under way.

Great stuff. Thanks for posting the vids!


2nd Feb 2009, 07:22
yer welcum critter

hope you can get to see tornado soon one day !

regds rog

heres a salute
YouTube - 60163 Steam Locomotive Tornado "Peppercorn Pioneer" train departs York 1st Feb 2009 (part 1 of 3) (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=hFRmZZ7xTFM):ok:
:ok: (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=hFRmZZ7xTFM:ok:)

2nd Feb 2009, 08:27
Leaving aside the glory of this loco and the extraordinary effort to build it, weren't coal powered steam engines reputed to be the most uneconomic form of transport?

2nd Feb 2009, 08:39
probably...thats why the diesels and electrics came in,
then massive Beeching cuts,
then the whole railway world changed for ever..:rolleyes:

a way of life gone, together with 1000's of jobs, homes, skills,
and some towns and villages left now without anyway out except sitting on clogged roads in dirty costly cars;)

Old 'Un
2nd Feb 2009, 09:03
Yep, I think you're right Gannet & Rog. But I guess some of it comes back to how you measure efficiency. It's a somewhat academic argument, because definitions need to be agreed before measurements/comparisons can be drawn up. Then you get into costs, which will vary from country to country and so on. Electricity generated by nuclear plants will have a different cost per kwh than that produced by hydrogeneration.

Who cares? To see those rods flashing at speed and to hear the "chuff chuff" as valves and pistons work in harmony is music to my ears. It beats the pants off the "dung dung" of a diesel, or the almost silent operation of an electric. It's like trying to compare a RR Merlin with a JT8D. To my ancient ear, the Merlin and the steamer both say "raw power". Who cares about efficiency?

My daughters are right. I am a dinosaur. AND I'M PROUD OF IT!

Alright I'll take my meds and go to bed.

Le Vieux

2nd Feb 2009, 09:09
Rog 747, why is Willie Thorn driving Tornado in you Post 44?

2nd Feb 2009, 09:12
ooh i dont know

tony draper
2nd Feb 2009, 09:17
There are some other great clips on he youtube page,the cousins put together some beasts, those Big Boys are monsters,are any of them in running condition in the Colonies?.

Captain Speedbird
2nd Feb 2009, 09:31
I'll give you three guesses where those monster articulated Beyer Peacock Garratt locos were designed and built........... :p

2nd Feb 2009, 09:36
I'll give you three guesses where those monster articulated Beyer Peacock Garratt locos were designed and built........... http://static.pprune.org/images/smilies/tongue.gif


Captain Speedbird
2nd Feb 2009, 09:43



2nd Feb 2009, 09:51
I'll give you three guesses where those monster articulated Beyer Peacock Garratt locos were designed and built...........

Wasn't it at Leiston, in darkest Suffolk? Boy. :rolleyes:

"It was here that the first steam threshing machine was developed. In the Long Shop the Garrett family showed the world how to make machinery on a conveyor belt with each worker doing the same jobs as each new machine was moved in front of him. This was long before Henry Ford Here too were built the great Garrett and Beyer Peacock locomotives."

Or is that just a Suffolk Myth?

2nd Feb 2009, 09:55
UKsteam.info - UK Railway Preservation - Home Page (http://www.uksteam.info/index.shtml)

for those of you interested in uk mainline steam train trips then click on above, the 2009 tour index gives you a week by week guide to mainline steam runs, its fairly good and updated...links too for the tour operator.

if u wanna travel on one or just know where to watch and/or photo then its a good site...:ok:

we have had in the UK alot of press recently above over-zealous police and railway security jobsworths giving genuine enthusiasts/spotters and novice photographers very nasty hassle and sometimes detaining the person(s) under the terrorism act, :ugh:
luckily we have a valliant editor from the UK's oldest monthly mag, the
Railway Magazine,
chris milner, who has strongly objected to the PM via meetings and petition to stop these weird and heavy handed measures being adopted against genuine railway buffs.
the 'pc' bridgade here was going too far and trying to say trainspotting/photos by little lads can be linked to terror is a pure waste of precious police time,
infact had any accident/incident occurred then the said 'spotter' would probably have witnessed/recorded anyway !:D

if you do wish to go onto platforms or photo a train on railway property then just see the 'main man' at the station and you will be fine...:O
dont trespass on the railway and just be responsible.

regretfully some of the incidents of police and security action against even some young boys simply spotting and jotting down numbers or taking a piccy has been disgraceful.....almost like the KGB:=

2nd Feb 2009, 11:40
this i soo funny but actually abit emotional too...

YouTube - Tornado 60613 steam train passes Darlington 31 Jan 09 - Marian watches (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=s_mQ_uGp2iM)

2nd Feb 2009, 11:48
Fantastic videos & pix! I've amended my Ian Allan Combined Vol (1959 edition) accordingly:


Maybe I'll get to underline No. '163 one day soon.

Captain Speedbird
2nd Feb 2009, 12:04
Fantastic videos & pix! I've amended my Ian Allen Combined Vol (1959 edition) accordingly:

Holy smoke, look after it! I lost mine a looooong time ago, but you stimulated me to go hunting on ebay. Gasp!


The missus would have a fit if I did! :E

Anyone know if you can get reprints?

2nd Feb 2009, 12:16

They were built at Gorton Tank here in Manchester, and shipped out along the big ditch.

They probably still had their wheels on as they passed Fort Perch Rock becuase they were on board ship! :p

The Beyer Peacock works were on the south side of the line to Sheffield and the GC works on the North Side. The Beyer Peacock erecting shop still stands.

The old railway - the old anything really - had a different face in our day because people were employed - not IT and electrickery to replace them.

The people took an interest in their job, and in the kids who were interested in their job - (they weren't class as paedos if they did in that day) ergo less vandalism etc.

There is a cost to everything that the bean counters and efficiency experts just don't see in their modern gated communities as they sit at home and pay with their Wiis, or watch Sky, or whatever other other social avoidance lifestyle they participate in.

Me - see you for a noggin at the Buffet Bar on StaleyVegas station where we last had steam outside the door on Saturday, where the kids can go in and share time with their parents because its a station buffet - and you can soon think yourselves back in a better time - socially anyway.

2nd Feb 2009, 12:21
Originally Posted by Discorde http://static.pprune.org/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.pprune.org/jet-blast/360361-tornado-new-british-steam-loco-1st-mainline-run-yesterday-4.html#post4689798)
Fantastic videos & pix! I've amended my Ian Allen Combined Vol (1959 edition) accordingly:

Holy smoke, look after it! I lost mine a looooong time ago, but you stimulated me to go hunting on ebay. Gasp!


The missus would have a fit if I did! http://static.pprune.org/images/smilies/evil.gif

Anyone know if you can get reprints?

the ian allan shop or online site may have a reprint of a year or so eitherside,
if not then ebay is best bet...
i got my 1961 observers book of locomotives oon there as i too lost my original:sad:

2nd Feb 2009, 15:03
Just checked my earliest edition of the compendium and it doesn't have a date anywhere I can find, although it's probably about 1961. (It cost 11/6d and has a picture of Silver Fox on the cover).

(And, with the underlinings and the scrawled calculation of somethings tractive effort inside the cover isn't worth anything. Except to me).

Captain Speedbird
2nd Feb 2009, 15:07
Silver Fox was on the cover of the Spring '63 edition.

What? Have I crossed the boundary? :confused:

2nd Feb 2009, 15:35
YouTube - race with A4 train (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=pFTphTnv2Q8)

go to channel4.com catch up player, choose speed machines,
and watch weds 14 jan (a4's 1930's archive footage plus LMS streamliners too)
also the tues 13 jan is empire and clipper flying boats 1930's footage,
and mon 12 jan is 1930's great ocean liners, normandie, queen mary.

its amazing stuff........:ok:
Speed Machines | Watch Online | Free Catch-Up on Channel 4 Shows (http://www.channel4.com/video/brandless-catchup.jsp?vodBrand=speed-machines)

3rd Feb 2009, 06:52
pm sent to old'un in NZ.
and thank you to everyone who has shown soooo much interest in the Tornado locomotive,:ok: its been overwhelming !

shes in London kings cross this saturday 7feb at 13.47 arriving from darlington and york.
if you wanna see her then come along or watch her along the route down from the north on the ECML,
t0207a.htm (http://www.uksteam.info/tours/t09/t0207a.htm)

then again in london sat 14 feb on 2 trips.
waterloo am to overton/andover hampshire and eastleigh.
victoria pm to guildford/redhill.
t0214b.htm (http://www.uksteam.info/tours/t09/t0214b.htm)
t0214c.htm (http://www.uksteam.info/tours/t09/t0214c.htm)

heres one for you all:)
YouTube - Tornado steam locomotive 60163 first main line passenger run "Peppercorn Pioneer" near Darlington (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=_nbJpJS2QnY)
YouTube - Tornado Rips through Durham (Again!) (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Ut27rSwkV2k)

thanks again;) enjoy!
Diary of Main Line Tours (http://www.a1steam.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=154&Itemid=149)
The A1 Steam Locomotive Trust (http://www.a1steam.com/)

Evening Star
4th Feb 2009, 17:59
also someone asked how they turn locos?
well they do have a few turntables left in the UK but generally they will turn the loco and/or train via a 'triangle' loop someone near...

As it happens, one of the remaining turntables is at Heaton depot, the main depot serving Newcastle. However, this is for turning single ended HST power cars and would be rather too short for Tornado.

Aside from a 'triangle' loop, one is looking for a more normal loop. So, after arriving at Newcastle over the King Edward Bridge, a departure over the High Level Bridge and turning right towards Greensfield Junctions will get one pointing south without any tedious mucking about with turntables. Easy.:}

[And for the next time one has a spare five minutes with a rail atlas, might try this return loop trick and see how far one could travel non-stop from Penzance to Penzance, assuming limitless fuel on board and a driver that never sleeps. Guess head to Bristol, through Birmingham (via Bescot to avoid the New Street reverse), up WCML, Carstairs South Junction, Edinburgh, down ECML and tracking through north London before a romp down GWML to the finish.:8:8]

4th Feb 2009, 19:13
Press announcement: Historic first visit to London for new 3m steam locomotive on 7th February 2009 (http://www.a1steam.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=240:press-announcement-historic-first-visit-to-london-for-new-p3m-steam-locomotive-on-7th-february-2009&catid=1:latest-news&Itemid=123)

there are a few seats left if you want to make this historic steam trip to london on saturday;)

5th Feb 2009, 07:52
hey mr ES
are you out this sat at darlington?

Evening Star
6th Feb 2009, 17:39
hey mr ES
are you out this sat at darlington?

Thought about it, but to be in place for 0745 at Darlo means an unreasonably early start from up here on the Moor.:sad:

6th Feb 2009, 21:01
Ah - but don't forget 46115 in the snow tomorrow 10.12 off Hellifield to Carlisle

6th Feb 2009, 21:22
Anybody here going to see her off tomorrow? I've found a nice spot in an icy field near Potters Bar to watch her go by but I don't fancy standing there freezing my bits off if she's canceled due to the weather. So if some kind soul could report her timely departure here before I set off I'd be grateful!


P.S. Old Oak Common TMD still has a turntable looking at the pictures from Google Maps ...

7th Feb 2009, 10:57

Taken just south of 'Gamston (EGNE) Bank'

Background Noise
7th Feb 2009, 15:22
Bit earlier, between Northallerton and York:


7th Feb 2009, 16:28
well chaps, wow pics from today already cool !

just a quick update now

ive just got in back to london after coming down on the big T (tornado) from darlington/york this morning, left ontime at 0745 and good run to york, we had some slow running now and again and then held at peteboroough due OHL probs,

im not doing back to the north as i live here and its diesel back anyway as big T is now in london til next sat at old oak common,

we arrived a bit late into kx due the overhead line problems (not us lol)

all went well then and once we got going again south and onto in bedfordshire we stormed down to london,
am sure you had some good vantage points,
the stations at st neots, hitchin, finsbury park etc were crammed !

kings cross was chaos hehe
and no doubt the tv news will have her on at 6pm

the police chopper in bedforshire and north london was keeping up with us, what fun for them:ok:

i will upload some videos after tea !
phew im knackered:D

7th Feb 2009, 16:47
ITN - Steam power rolls into London (http://itn.co.uk/news/c5b4770f8ed82c3b7ab9644c28491444.html)

BBC NEWS | UK | New steam train makes London trip (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7876162.stm)

7th Feb 2009, 17:18
To a Locomotive in Winter
By Walt Whitman
Thee for my recitative,
Thee in the driving storm even as now, the snow, the winter-day declining,
Thee in thy panoply, thy measur'd dual throbbing and thy beat convulsive,
Thy black cylindric body, golden brass and silvery steel,
Thy ponderous side-bars, parallel and connecting rods, gyrating,
shuttling at thy sides,
Thy metrical, now swelling pant and roar, now tapering in the distance,
Thy great protruding head-light fix'd in front,
Thy long, pale, floating vapor-pennants, tinged with delicate purple,
The dense and murky clouds out-belching from thy smoke-stack,
Thy knitted frame, thy springs and valves, the tremulous twinkle of
thy wheels,
Thy train of cars behind, obedient, merrily following,
Through gale or calm, now swift, now slack, yet steadily careering;
Type of the modern--emblem of motion and power--pulse of the continent,
For once come serve the Muse and merge in verse, even as here I see thee,
With storm and buffeting gusts of wind and falling snow,
By day thy warning ringing bell to sound its notes,
By night thy silent signal lamps to swing.

Fierce-throated beauty!
Roll through my chant with all thy lawless music, thy swinging lamps
at night,
Thy madly-whistled laughter, echoing, rumbling like an earthquake,
rousing all,
Law of thyself complete, thine own track firmly holding,
(No sweetness debonair of tearful harp or glib piano thine,)
Thy trills of shrieks by rocks and hills return'd,
Launch'd o'er the prairies wide, across the lakes,
To the free skies unpent and glad and strong.

Evening Star
7th Feb 2009, 17:28
Sounds brilliant rog747, and superb photos BN and JS (good black and white is so crisp IMO).

Where did the stuff about health risk issue spring from? Or is just the journo business where if they cannot create then they have to find something to condemn? What a sad blinkered life these people lead.

we arrived a bit late into kx due the overhead line problems (not us lol)

Saw that in the news reports. Steam train delayed by OHL defect has got to be the ultimate irony.

SMT Member
7th Feb 2009, 20:46
Love it, love it, love it. Apart from the sheer raw power she displays, this kind of huffin' & puffin' mechanical marvel is bound to get some huggy-fluff up in arms - and there's not a damn thing they can do about it!

She seems to be going at a right decent clip. But just out of interest, what kind of speeds is she capable off, and what would she normally be cruising at?

7th Feb 2009, 21:10
She's capable of 100mph plus under the right conditions. I think she's limited to 75mph (might be 70) 'elf & saftey'.

Soemone questioned the efficiency. A lot depends on what you mean by efficiency. At one time, it meant hauling a train of a given load to time. Then it meant coal and water per drawbar horse power. In terms of thermal efficiency, it's about 3% or so. In terms of traffic efficiency, it's way below diesels or electrics in terms of availability between servicing/refuelling - when things work. A nice bit of overhead line failure and the electrics are 100% INeffecient. When the Master Cutler was re-routed in the early 1960s from the GC main line to the GN mainline and dieselised, it was almost a case of a star in the working timetable for engines catches fire at Retford and a dagger for engine fails at Newark.........Of course, another minor point (which Rhodesian Railways carefully omitted) is the use of maintenance skills and fuel available locally. But dieselisation in the third world has frequently been led by political considerations, including bribery.

So highly thermally efficient or highly efficient in terms of availability may not be highly efficient in terms of reliability and providing a service..........but that isn't what the bean counters seem to want. Which is why if all transport systems had to properly recompense passengers when they fail to deliver (except in certain weather conditions) the pax might get better service. When one considers the subsidies the privatised railway companies get for providing a far worse service in general than in BR days, it's time for an overhaul. Unfortunately, no political party since 1914 has done anything other than first rape the railways financially and then screw them up....

Don't forget the GWR instituted an air service in 1930's......

So I look forward to seeing Tornado. And the other preserved locos like Tangmere (Battle of Britain class ) that I haven't seen......I did see a lot of A1s, A2s, A3s and all the A4s as a kid....

B Fraser
8th Feb 2009, 05:53
Absolutely fantastic, who's up for building the next generation of coal fired locomotive ? A colleague organised the purchase of the rusting hulk of the Duke Of Gloucester which was restored to main line condition with rotary valve-gear, "racing" cams, improved ash-pan and other assorted go-faster bits. We did have plans to build the ultimate engine with a pulverised coal feed burning on a fluid bed, a turbine stage with a torque convertor and a condensor to up the efficiency. Oh, and a bloody huge chime whistle.

Who will pledge the equivalent of a bottle of malt a week for the next 20 years ?


8th Feb 2009, 06:40
from me
YouTube - a1 steam loco tornado 60163 departs kings cross after hauling the talisman 07 feb (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UyZUU4t6UyA)

and a different type of view
YouTube - a1 loco tornado talisman run to london overtaken by high speed 225 07 feb (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjNnSVtIv2U)

we touched 77mph, she's max'd to 75 at the mo,
plan to operate at 90mph on mainline in the future,
she did that on a test run in nov 2008.;)

hrh charles and camilla officially name big T at york stn 19 feb:D

71000 duke of gloucester is a bit poorly at the mo, and both trusts involved in her are having tiffs, oh dear,
i went on her last march and she is amazing, bring her back soon please!

8th Feb 2009, 11:07
What I recall about 71000 is that it was a big disappointment in BR service, nowhere near as powerful or free-steaming as it should have been. Then when it was rebuilt from the scrappers the rebuild team found that the firebars, as originally installed, had been wrongly cast and had 'smothered' the fire so they recast the firebars correctly and it ended up a much better engine after the rebuild.

8th Feb 2009, 11:08
Besides Duke of Gloucester being restored again, Betton Grange is basically a new locomotive, as none of the Grange class were preserved. That's under way at Langollen. There's also, I believe, a program at Didcot to turn a Hall into a Saint. What would be nice would be to see the Star from Swindon museum in steam. There are probably enough Kings around that restoration of King George V to steam is unlikely, in the same way that Mallard is unlikely to ever be in steam again while there are three A4s working.

8th Feb 2009, 12:45
This might sound like sacrilege, in this context, but the loco I most would like to see back on the rails is the last surviving Metro-Vic Co-Bo.

There is something about this thing that digs deep into my memory, like the smell of the playtime 1/4 pint of milk bottle....

The reason is that it was probably the thing that sent me into a boyhood of platform-ending. How? As a small kid devouring the Hornby catalogue which had that Terence Cuneo painting - what was it? 'Night Mail' I think, a dark, purposeful bit of industrial art. That painting transported me from an oval of OO into a world of sounds and smells altogether more substantial.

Evening Star
8th Feb 2009, 13:05
There were, IIRC, a number of things that worked against 71000 in BR service, both in terms of design and construction. The design of the blast-pipe was inefficient, and this is one significant change made in the preserved 71000. Principal construction error was the free area of the dampers. As I understand it, by the time the team came to restore they need to fabricate some new dampers but checked the new ones against the rusted originals, only to find a discrepancy. They then checked the drawings and found the original dampers were not as drawn.

I read elsewhere that the two 71000 trusts were having a domestic. What is the story there, or is one of those too delicate situations where you would have to kill me after telling me?

Cheerio, might the Cuneo painting you recall is this one of the Metro-Vic on the Condor freight?


Remember this on the cover of a Hornby catalogue well back in the last century. Amazing painting of what was in reality not one of the best modernisation plan locos!

8th Feb 2009, 13:17
I did some work a while back with fluidised bed combustion boilers: rather efficient, and with a waste product that itself has value. You don't have to shovel coal into a boiler as random lumps, there are other methods.

8th Feb 2009, 16:27

How do fluidised bed boilers go on for draft? The classic Stephenson boiler requires the draft from the exhaust to pull the air through the coal, but the difficulty is that for cylinder efficiency, you want minimum back pressure on the pistons. This means ideally that the blast provided by the smoke box vacuum is weak, and it's a trade off between blast for the fire and back pressure. Multiple blast pipes such as the Kylchap or Lemaitre help by increasing the area of the steam blast for a given back pressure, but how what does the fluidised bed fire require in the way of blast? Is it more use with a water tube boiler than a classic firetube loco boiler?

8th Feb 2009, 17:12
Cheerio, might the Cuneo painting you recall is this one of the Metro-Vic on the Condor freight?

Spot on! The Condor, I remember! Evening Star, if you ever find yourself in the vicinity of a platform end in Russia, keep a look out for the HS4000 Kestrel prototype. Now that thing put those rotten GM drones to shame nearly 50 years before. It was shipped over there in '71. I wonder if it is still in existence?

Evening Star
8th Feb 2009, 19:37
Thought it was axle weight that did for Kestrel on BR. Never saw it, but from photos looked a mighty beast. Fairly authoritative word is that once in the USSR it was tested and then stripped to investigate the technology. Certainly, it is said that the ТЭП70 diesel introduced in 1973 is Kestrel in a Soviet body shell, and definitely so suspiciously different from the preceding ТЭП60 design that one could have good reason to be suspicious.

How about that for thread drift? New A1 steam locomotive to Soviet diesels!:O

13th Feb 2009, 13:08
anyone wanna watch, sat 14 feb...shes in london....

UK mainline steam rail tours 2009 (http://www.uksteam.info/tours/trs09.htm)

20th Feb 2009, 08:36
RAF Leeming Tornado fly past at york for loco naming
hi guys
big thanks to the guys at RAF Leeming for the fly past yesterday over York station during the official naming of the new steam loco a1 class Tornado:ok:

The A1 Steam Locomotive Trust (http://www.a1steam.com/)

i am supporter of the loco trust and met flt lt Stefan Brown from Leeming who was very amiable, and the RAF band played on too,

met their HRH's charles and camilla who performed the naming ceremony
of the new loco which then pulled the royal train.
"Tornado" with the royal train. - RailUK Forums (http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=22030)

Prince Charles visits York for Tornado's official launch (From York Press) (http://www.thepress.co.uk/news/4139110.Prince_Charles_names_new_steam_train/)

hats off to Tornado and to the RAF for all their support and providing some noise lol:D

20th Feb 2009, 14:32
What a project! Things like this may inspire people to appreciate how we got where we are.

Congratulations to those with the forward vision to pay tribute to the past.

20th Feb 2009, 14:56
rumour has it yesterday HRH charles asked for a steam loco for him
to be built to pull the royal train !:ok:

maybe we can get him to get the vc10 back in the royal use too !;)

20th Feb 2009, 14:59
Rog - you obviously have ambitions to be a fireman. Must be cos you're stoking this thread with all your might.

20th Feb 2009, 15:06
well not really m8,

i think its nice to create some interest apart from the doom and gloom we are fed on a daily basis lol

also it is under jet blast so its upto you whether you wanna read it or not,

i have had so many emails and pm's on here about Tornado from this blog that its obvious the interest is really there, big time !

so i'm happy to update as it seems viable...

i hope you also find it interesting too;)

20th Feb 2009, 15:33
Sisemen, this thread needs no stoking. I for one am happy to see it a long time on the boards with more of rog's updates. Keep 'em coming rog! - this is a superb achievment that says more for Britain (indeed, England, dare I say it?) than any number of politicos/celebs. :ok:

20th Feb 2009, 15:50
Rog - foties of tests, last Saturday, and yesterday sent to Mark Allett

I haven't got a fotopic account or similar so if you want a copy for PPrune - letme know

20th Feb 2009, 16:48
thank you everyone and to frank,
pm sent.

latest royal naming media links and piccies...

In the Media (http://www.a1steam.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=80&Itemid=127)

if you want to see or travel on Tornado ( i can highly recommend it lol ) then she has some trips coming up soon both in the north and from the south on the UK.
(unless HRH prince charles decides he wants Big T all to himself now lol:=)

20th Feb 2009, 19:34
Leo was out waving at Tornado yesterday. Thanks to Janjad (T-Bird) and Grandma for that. :ok:

20th Feb 2009, 20:13
lol cool lexxity

didnt know you liked planes. ships, and steam trains:ok:

February 2009.Mark Allatt,chairman of the A1 Steam Locomotive Trust with the Prince of Wales and Duchess of Cornwall at York station,just prior to naming 60163 Tornado. :: A1naming.jpg (http://www.upmain.fotopic.net/p56500373.html)

"Tornado" with the royal train. - RailUK Forums (http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=22030)

21st Feb 2009, 16:57
YouTube - a1 Tornado steam loco 19 feb 2009 HRH prince charles naming cermony at york (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4VA-NS_fhc)

here is the link to the ceremony at york station which was followed by the RAF doing a flypast with a tornado F3 and 2 hawk jets over the station,
the loco then hauled the royal train to leeds for the royal couple's engagements in the city.

Charles rode on the footplate from york as a surprise and he was overjoyed and acting like a little boy at xmas !
rumour has it he wants Tornado (the loco lol) to now haul the royal train always!

the video clip is quite funny and moving too!
especially as Dorothy Mather, widow of Arthur Peppercorn, the original LNER chief designer in 1948 was present with their Royal Highness's for this ceremony and travelled with them to Leeds.
she is a lovely lady and is president of the The A1 Steam Locomotive Trust (http://www.a1steam.com) trust and
she is a sprightly 94 years old.

28th Feb 2009, 13:10

Not Tornado, but nice anyway!

28th Feb 2009, 13:21
oliver cromwell is into kings cross today and out of paddington sun 1st march...

Tornado is in Edinburgh today and back from there to york next week

Background Noise
28th Feb 2009, 13:23
The real thing this morning.


There were a few enthusiasts down at the end of the platform waiting for the unrestricted view when, perfectly timed, the opposite direction electric version got right in their way:


tony draper
28th Feb 2009, 13:38
That's disgraceful, Steam had to give way to Sail I think it only right that Electric should give way to Steam.

28th Feb 2009, 13:57
excellent pics backgroundnoise
where was that?

Background Noise
28th Feb 2009, 13:58
Moments before they had been standing right on the platform edge, oblivious to the train approaching from behind.

Pictures taken at Northallerton station - it passes here on most of its runs as we are on the main line between York and Darlington.

28th Feb 2009, 14:32
Great pictures, but will it pass its MOT with a defective n/s front lamp?

28th Feb 2009, 14:46
N/s front lamp not defective, just giving as much light as one would expect from an oil-fired bulls-eye lamp. What is worrying is the amount of light from the off-side lamp. It must have just exploded.

Background Noise
28th Feb 2009, 14:58
I don't think that they are original type lamps. The light was like a searchlight (admittedly it was gloomy weather) and incredibly bright from a mile away. But shouldn't it be 2 lights for a passenger express? :sad: One only signifies a light engine - oops, too much knowledge.

28th Feb 2009, 15:26
The requirement these days is for one - in this case - high intensity LED, but as has been noted the correct aspect for an express was two lamps.

Get more out of alignment and the beam from the LEDs isn't half as intrusive.

As to the backs to the line fotters - will they ever learn???

8th Mar 2009, 00:30
So today Tornado was escaping from its first visit to Jockistan.

We went as far as Berwick to watch it come over the Royal Border Bridge but Mrs TBF had forgotten her video cassette. We found a cassette shop and arrived at the "new" 1928 bridge to see her heading for Tweedmouth twenty minutes early!

We could see the line striding out over the horizon, just as you can see Berwick from the train, so decided to catch the local bus up to Tweedmouth.

The very friendly south London driver - you couldn't write it could you? - told us he would find us an outlook and then about bunking sheds out of Waterloo!

Shots duly collected we had a pint in The Castle Hotel and headed for Darlington to watch her roll in.

Here she was slightly late, and with no timetable information to hand it made sense to get to York as soon as possible.

With a non stop steam express to York in the station it made sense to waggle the old thumb,and in response to coin of the realm we were soon winging south at max permitted speed.

Tornado is one impressive loco!

I am an inveterate window hanger - goggles on bonce and scarf over the top, away we went. She accelerates like the wind and sounds like a turbocharged A4 until she reaches cruising speed, at which point all becomes silence and she cruises along - master of the job supreme.

Can't wait to get her into the hills and listen to her roaring against the grade now!

8th Mar 2009, 08:05
you really are hooked lol well done:ok:

i missed the EDI trips
sadly i had prior stuff,

alexa (the secretary of the trust) had a footplate ride over the Forth bridge
last week, i am seeethingly jealous lol

big T is in york and NCL next thurs 12 march...

Krystal n chips
8th Mar 2009, 09:24
A quick query please. Is she going to be making runs purely on the East Coast, or are ventures to say the North West / Midlands planned at all ?.

Love the, ahem, "accurate" yellow line in the photo though. :D:E

Dan Gerous
8th Mar 2009, 12:16
At last I got the opportunity to photograph a Steam Train, and caught the Tornado last week and yesterday between Berwick and Edinburgh. A few pics...

Sat 28 Feb




Sat 7 March





8th Mar 2009, 12:24
Have any of the Tornado crew seen this on Military Aircrew? Footplate ride?


8th Mar 2009, 14:19
Take it up with the A1Trust direct :-

The A1 Steam Locomotive Trust (http://www.a1steam.com/)

They are a bit good with publicity, so may well take you up - especially when Tornado is on the North Yorkshire Moors Railway in May, where life is a bit more flexible than the main line.

10th Mar 2009, 18:07
A historic former locomotive factory on Tyneside is being closed to the public.

Stephenson's Works at South Street, where the Rocket locomotive was designed and built, was restored in 2003.

The Robert Stephenson Trust, which carried out the restoration, said it had given up its tenancy after a failure to agree terms for a new lease.

Artefacts, including the original steam engine that powered the 1823 factory, will be displayed elsewhere, it said.
More at:- BBC NEWS | UK | England | Tyne | Historic railway factory to close (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/tyne/7933903.stm)
and:- BBC NEWS | UK | England | Tyne | Plans to transform historic area (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/tyne/7730155.stm)
The site includes the offices at 20 South Street where Robert Stephenson's engineering works gave birth to the railway age.

10th Mar 2009, 18:39
The site includes the offices at 20 South Street where Robert Stephenson's engineering works gave birth to the railway age.

This seems a bit extravagant, considering that another locomotive manufacturer, Fenton, Murray and Wood, (where David Joy worked when he designed the famous Jenny Lind loco) was around before Robert Stephenson and Co was founded.

10th Mar 2009, 18:52

or maybe this...


10th Mar 2009, 19:07
Much of Stephenson's achievement (in becoming the so-called father of the railways) is attributable to his undoubted abilities as a publicist. Timothy Hackworth can be traced through the early days (as can Richard Trevithick) and Stephenson lived alongside a colliery that had a railway some time before he 'invented' a similar arrangement at the colliery where he was employed.
The Rocket only 'won' the Rainhill Trials because the other (more successful) machines failed during the trials, therefore, according to the rules they were disqualified.
However, History relates that Stephenson managed to pursuade investors to back him in his endeavours.

Sorry, this wasn't meant to divert from the original topic of this thread, it just seemed the most appropriate location (where rail enthusiasts gather). We have had this discussion in the past on the TRRAB/PSOI thread in one of its manifestations.

tony draper
10th Mar 2009, 20:33
Yer but wwasn't it Geordie Stephenson persuade the companies to go for moving steam engines rather than stationary ones,thus giving them the name Locomotive.
PS when they re ran the Rainhill trials a while back with exact replicas did not Rocket win again?

Captain Speedbird
17th Mar 2009, 15:28
Here you go Drapes. Another nice pastoral scene with a bit of heavy engineering (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgds_mKzs4w) thrown in. :ok:

17th Mar 2009, 15:36
Blackbirds and sheep . . .

. . . then the magnificent sound of a steam train under load . . .

17th Mar 2009, 15:51
When it`s done right, a steam railway can enhance a landscape.....funny that. This is how our Canadian friends do it, at an already impressive location.

YouTube - CP 2816 at Morants Curve Canada (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NFGVMKDflEw)

tony draper
17th Mar 2009, 15:57
Great clips chaps thanks,railways and canals seem to fit the landscape,unlike they horrible feckin newfangled motorways ,they are the work of the devil,no good will come of them, mark my words.

17th Mar 2009, 16:08
That was a fair old drag up that hill for the old girl!
Wonderful to see!

17th Mar 2009, 19:25
Nicholas Morant was the official photographer for the CPR - hence the curve getting its name as his most favourite location


If you like Canada his books are a must.

Ticked all the boxes did CPR


18th Mar 2009, 05:56
Somewhat irreverently, the above led to these lines coming to mind:

If youve ever seen the pistons on a giant C.P.R.
With the driving force of a thousand horse-then you know what pistons are.

18th Mar 2009, 07:43
As an avid spotter back in the fifties I left school(1957) and worked in W.G.Bagnells of Stafford just in time to see the last steam train finished and the first of the Brush Bagnall deisel/electrics roll out!That Deisel(D5500) is now in the national Museum in York!!I gave the museum my Brochure which I received on applying to work there so if you see it you know where it came from!Train spotting was not just about numbers but an interest in Engineering and the industry in general,I visited many loco works on open day to see how things where made ,not just to collect numbers,Still have Brochures for Derby and Crewe!!

18th Mar 2009, 08:19
Photo taken last Friday at York...Tornado side by side with the Brush diesel:


Diesel Fitter
18th Mar 2009, 09:08
It was 10 years ago this week that Nicholas Morant left us. Perhaps in his memory this example of his work from 60 years before that - way back in 1939 an eastbound CPR train of heavy steel passenger cars negotiates the curves and grade between the lower and upper Spiral Tunnels east of Field, BC.
http://www8.cpr.ca/cms/NR/rdonlyres/ex7jmcoag5zu55ijn66iju6sbb2cdsuqnfuegd7zdru7k6wcqedxnmhu43c2 ew5a33qjfe3dzor3bh/m2079.jpg

18th Apr 2009, 06:28
hi guys
t0418c.htm (http://www.uksteam.info/tours/t09/t0418c.htm)

Tornado today sat 18 apr will depart kings cross to york and back,
she will haul the VSOE Pullman coaches, 1930's restored vehicles.

look out for us !:ok:

18th Apr 2009, 21:49
RMweb • View topic - Tornado today from KX with pullmans (http://www.rmweb.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=43046&p=654180#p654180)

18th Apr 2009, 22:50
look out for us !

Mate, do you work on it then?

19th Apr 2009, 06:24
yes im a volunteer to help fund raise
The A1 Steam Locomotive Trust (http://www.a1steam.com)

have a peek !

ps thanks to the poster who told us about HM service forces family charity...heroes
thanks !

25th Apr 2009, 22:00
bbc top gear show race
gauntlet to the a1 steam trust to see who would win the fastest run LON-EDI

1949 steam train v 1949 jaguar xj120 v 1949 motorbike

YouTube - 60163 @ Dolphingstone (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwhYIaKMyPU)
A1 60163 ''Tornado'' heads WB past Dolphingstone with the 1Z63 London Kings Cross - Edinburgh Waverley private charter..60163 came to Scotland as part of a race for BBC's Top Gear..Jeremy Clarkson was on the train, James May was driving an old 1960 J (http://jack.prentice.fotopic.net/p57772013.html)

YouTube - Tornado (Top Tornado) 1Z63 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ucvgFBZ8t-0)

25th Apr 2009, 23:43
Good to see she ran so well - but was the secrecy really necessary?

I had certainly predicted the water stops and most times to within minutes - but wasn't chasing on this occasion

Also - I believe the train was full - who were the mystery passengers???

Airey Belvoir
26th Apr 2009, 02:04
:zzz::bored: The "Rog747 thread" is giving gricers a bad name.

26th Apr 2009, 06:23
quote The "Rog747 thread" is giving gricers a bad name. unquote:sad:

why ?;)

ps gricer is a train spotter anorak i understand...:ouch:

the sercrecy was what Top Gear wanted

we were almost full and there are some great pics here of the lads,
Top Gear Tornado. :: Fotopic.Net (http://jonathonag.fotopic.net/c1687900.html)

Golden Ticket
26th Apr 2009, 08:46
Quick question. When you see two steam engines working together how is the power between the two balanced so that one isn't working harder than the other?

26th Apr 2009, 08:48
oh lord...

you will have to ask an engine driver....

suggest you look at this site and ask away
National Preservation • View topic - Tornado (http://railways.national-preservation.com/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=11655&start=1395)

Golden Ticket
29th Apr 2009, 13:54
Had a look rog747 in the end looked on wikipedia and it appears it is just very good cooperation and knowledge between engine crews. That must have taken some concentration.

29th Apr 2009, 14:15
Quick question. When you see two steam engines working together how is the power between the two balanced so that one isn't working harder than the other?

Assuming you mean a 'double-header' (two engines at the front of the train, both pulling) rather than a 'banker' (one at the front pulling, one at the back pushing). I recall being told the physics of the setup was that none of the enrgy ('pull') from the lead engine in a double-header could be passed to the train of carriages but the front engine would pull the second engine of the pair so all the energy of the second engine was used to pull the train - it didn't need to pull its own weight as well as that of the train.

I think that makes sense.

1st May 2009, 21:28
Our MP went to Welwyn GC station to watch Tornado pass through.
Here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n856mSobBrs) is the video of his experience...

1st May 2009, 23:53
Understand will be working near me this Mayday weekend

North Yorkshire Moors Railway

NORTH YORK MOORS RAILWAY - WELCOME ABOARD (http://nymr.co.uk/news/spring-steam-gala)

PZU - Out of Africa (Retired)

2nd May 2009, 16:49
sorry u missed filming us at welwyn GC...
the hst was nice tho lol:ugh:

re NYMR i'm not there this weekend as i'm watching Tangmere and Manston and Eddystone at the swanage railway (bulleid pacifics):rolleyes:

sorry to have missed it

3rd May 2009, 12:27
Golden Ticket,

depends on how hard each one wants to work, and the relative sizes. A 4F and a West Country on the Pines Express for example, couldn't provide the same horsepower at speed. A pair of B1s on the Grimsby to Swindon fish in the 50's (via Annesley, Rugby, Woodford Halse and Banbury) would probably spread the work fairly evenly - but it would depend on how well each loco was steaming and/or riding, and how hard the driver wanted to work it. It's said that some of the drivers on the Glasgow and South Western in late 1890's practically shut down when they had a pilot, because of a bonus for saving coal! (Tales of the Glasgow and South Western Railway by David L. Smith)

3rd May 2009, 13:10
How did they communicate (before the days of mobile 'phones or walkie-talkies)?
What happened if they met an unexpected danger signal?
Which driver was 'in charge' - for example when restarting?
Who decided what speed they would travel at (and, again, how did they communicate)?

3rd May 2009, 13:25
Two cocoa tins and a piece of string :}

But seriously folks, I think they arranged a system of whistles to communicate the essentials.

PS Did we really want to know which locomotives Rog747 was looking at today???? :ugh:

4th May 2009, 07:19

PS Did we really want to know which locomotives Rog747 was looking at today????


well, and today i'm eating muesli:O

4th May 2009, 10:30

Apparently the important thing was to decide who was taking charge of the braking. There's a number of stories in books about the results of not deciding that before hand.........

The GWR approach was that the assisting engine was the one nearest to the train, even though that was messy and time consuming in changing round and apparently not always followed. For example, when assisting from Severn Tunnel Junction through the tunnel to Stoke Gifford (now Bristol Parkway) or even up to Badminton, where quite often a big prairie tank was attached in front.The idea was that the train driver, as opposed to the assisting engine driver was in charge and on the front. There were a number of whistle codes used for communication, some of the un official ones of which were rather rude! You must remember too, that the drivers had a very good knowledge of the route, and would know pretty well where they would be working hard, and where they would be running downhill with a just a breath of steam to prevent the exhaust being sucked into the valve chest - and to keep the cylinder lubrication going. The real skill was in handling a loose coupled freight train with no continous brakes - had there been a continuous brake in use on 48188 and its train, John Axon GC wouldn't have died. The use of the Westinghouse brake in other countries led to situations on hot days of the crew climbing round to the front buffer beam going down long hills, and using the front Westinghouse shut off cock to regulate the speed,

Another trick used, especially with a banking engine in rear, if it was thought that the crew weren't doing their bit, was to get into a tunnel and then urinate on the shovel and throw it into the firebox!

Unexpected danger signals meant the best approach to an emergency stop. Again, with a loose coupled freight, that needed very careful doing, because uncontrolled braking could lead to buffer locking and a derailment. That's why distant signals were so important for freight trains, and why there was so much of a problem during WW2 with signal women who couldn't manage to pull off the distant signal: that meant a freight had to crawl along to the home signal to be ready to stop at it. Especially with the London and North Western G2 class, which had a brake that lost effect when the whistle was blown, because the steam manifold supplying both was too small!


What went wrong this weekend to need a repair? According to BBC News, it needed emeregncy repairs on the NYMR.

The radengs are going from Gloucester to Cardiff and back to Bristol behind it in a couple of weeks....looking forward to that. Haven't travelled behind an A1 for almost 50 years.......

Evening Star
4th May 2009, 18:02
From the 2005 edition of the rule book:

11.3 Trains hauled by locomotives in tandem

If you are the driver of the leading locomotive, you are responsible for:
observing signals
working the brake.

If you are the driver of the second locomotive, you must:
observe all signals affecting the working of the train, where possible
observe any signals given by the driver of the leading locomotive
apply the brake if it becomes necessary
temporarily isolate the train protection and warning system (TPWS)
take any other action that you consider necessary.

Other than the requirement with regard to TPWS, IIRC this is similar to the former BR rule book.

15th May 2009, 08:00
extra last minute trip
tornado will be leaving LON KX sat 16th at 0725 to york arrv 1120,

mon 18th leave york at 1620 arrv kx 2055
all times approx.

and 23 may leaves lon kx am to york (times tba)

30 may gloucester-BRS-taunton-Minehead WSR
then until 17 june on W.S.R

18 june back to london from minehead,
21 june and 15 aug 2 trips each day from london to kent/surrey/hants/sussex

15th May 2009, 09:56
Yes, but the trust is sending her down to the West Country while I'm in the UK and the west is not on my itinerary :{

15th May 2009, 10:09
oh no sisemen

is there no way you can get down to one of the prettiest lines in the uk to see us?

15th May 2009, 11:28
That won't do! The boys are going to York on SUNDAY!

15th May 2009, 11:38
That won't do! The boys are going to York on SUNDAY!

well the loco maybe at york nrm on sunday,

it arrvs on sat (tomorow) at 1126 and leaves monday at 1626

so she maybe kept at york

15th May 2009, 11:44
Rog please could you find out for definite because the reason they are going to the NRM is that we have a house guest over from the US who would love to see Tornado. Thanks.

Said house guest is going back on the ship BTW, lucky, lucky nugger.

15th May 2009, 11:46
radeng. An aside but, as I recall the event, the steam pipe on 48188 failed on the climb up to Bibbington's Sidings. The brakes being off, they were still off as the train passed the summit and remained "unavailable" all the way down to impact at Chapel-e-F. As you say, a continuous "fitted" train would have braked the train immediately. http://www.railwaysarchive.co.uk/documents/MoT_Chapel1957.pdf

Para 40.

The song "The Runaway Train" was popular on Childrens' Choice (BBC Home Service) at the time and I was banned from singing it. A fair point as Jack Axon's widow worked in our local corner shop.

Anyway, back to Mr Peppercorn's Pacific and double working.

15th May 2009, 11:49
Daughter of mine - I think she will be in the annexe where working locos lay over between turns - I'm not sure if you can see into it from the viewing gallery, as its not really part of the public museum

Tornado was a good crowd puller on the NYMR but I think the concensus is that she's too powerful and fast for preserved lines - she looked good on the Teaks and suitably dirty by last Saturday

GBZ - you aren't a native of southern parts then - was a 9B spotter myself when a kid - one of those who helped "hide" 5596 behind the shed until we had the money to buy her.

15th May 2009, 11:50
Maybe we'll just have to talk very nicely to someone then.

15th May 2009, 23:06
LNER engines have never really inspired me. Parallel boilers and non Belpair fire boxes always seemed rather primitive. The building of a replica of Mr Ps A1 did catch my imagination, though. So much that I looked at the opportunities for riding behind it. Accordingly, I came across this; http://www.past-timerail.co.uk/index.php/the-golden-hind (http://www.past-timerail.co.uk/index.php/the-golden-hind) At 90, a bit expensive but, hey, what the hell; I cant take it with me. In the process of poking around and pressing buttons, though, I came across http://www.past-timerail.co.uk/tl_files/Resources/TourPhotos/TorbayExpress.PDF (http://www.past-timerail.co.uk/tl_files/Resources/TourPhotos/TorbayExpress.PDF) Sorry, no contest; even if it was the same 90 and not the published 55, Gods Wonderful Railway with one of Gods wonderful engines must win me every time. I then remembered something that still annoys me. In the same way that none of AHPs A1s survived, none of FWHs County Class survived. The most powerful truly "mixed traffic" engine ever built (6MT) must deserve A1 treatment? Anyway, sorry for the drift but RADCO have a special offer on Youngs Special London Ale!

If only someone had been as foresighted as TBirdFrank and his pals were with "Bahamas", an A1 and a County could have been enjoyed at a fraction of the new build cost. TBirdFrank, we must have met on the cinder path from Booth Street. I feel guilty now that I made no effort for 5596 but, in mitigation, I was mostly in Bournemouth and everywhere but Stockport at the time.

The building of "Tornado" has nonetheless been a tremendous feat and I have every admiration. Perhaps I will find some gash cash and see first hand how a Peppercorn handles Whiteball and Rattery!

15th May 2009, 23:49
GBZ - just do it - she's awesome!

We hitched a lift from Darlington to York - Tornado accelerates, and sounds like, an A4 on speed - then 75mph and silence! Choost superb - master of the job!

Mind you - Whiteball behind 71000 in 96 was fun 80+ round the back of Taunton station - I can still visualise the people on the station jumping up to watch us fly by.

Then the climb - all you could hear was cinders bouncing off the wind baffles on the opening windows - 67 over the top - what Bank????

16th May 2009, 03:45
The most powerful truly "mixed traffic" engine ever built (6MT) must deserve A1 treatment

GBZ - already underway - link below

County (http://www.gwcountyproject.org.uk/) Project

Although why one would want to create another GWR example that looks the same as all the rest .......:E

16th May 2009, 08:39
just seen BIG T off at KX this morning, she looked great with the royal scot coaches. so evocative leaving KX at 0725.
i am not travelling today, but i am on monday.

i forgot to ask where she is stabled tonight and tomrrrow,
but they are calling me back in abit so i will know later

16th May 2009, 08:42
they just called me from the train
she is at NRM but dont know if she will be on display
but you should be able to glimpse somehwere


16th May 2009, 14:02
YouTube - 60163 Tornado "The Coronation" at Burton-le-coggles 16/05/2009 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LVInKVeOx40)

16th May 2009, 21:07
Thanks Roger. :ok:

17th May 2009, 21:48
Roger, they got to see Tornado. Our visitor from the US was very pleased. :ok:

18th May 2009, 07:51
Looking forward to 30th May, should be coming through here about 17.45 en-route to Minehead so a stroll down to the railway bridge is called. I will probably go to see her working over the WSR but I do want to see her on the mainline - and it's the old GWR 'Racing Ground' past here. Worked out that it is 47 years since I last saw an A1.

(And keep telling people about it - it will look like the Rookery at Retford in the early sixties if everybody turns up).

18th May 2009, 08:11
yes i think its going to be crazy when BIG T comes down to the West Somerset Rly via gloucester-BRS-taunton-minehead on the 30 th may...

i should be on that day and will try to do a few days in june on the WSR too then back to london from minehead on 18 june.

today the 18th she is out of at york about 4pm or just after and into london maybe by 830pm

29th May 2009, 07:26
she's in the west country sat 30th may GLOS-CDF-BRS-TAU-Minehead
then until 18th june on the WSR west somerset railway

t0530c.htm (http://www.uksteam.info/tours/t09/t0530c.htm)

30th May 2009, 17:14
Tornado at Dunball, Somerset, 17:40 today.


Thanks, Rog & TBird & Driver.

31st May 2009, 11:55
Radeng and Mrs Radeng went from Gloster to Cardiff to Bristol behind Tornado yesterday. Sadly, wasn't able to get through the crowds at BRS to photo Oliver Cromwell, which was there at the same time.

Very enjoyable, but although there was a good speed going into the Severn Tunnel, it didn't work as hard going up through Pilning as might have been the case - apparently, there was a service train in front. A friend took his boys to see it, and they've seen it in quite a few locations, and he said the same thing. I did note the beat was very even, which you didn't tend to get with Gresley pacifics with conjugated valve gear. The run from Gloster to Lydney along the Severn is very picturesque: I often go to Caldicot for work, and go by train just for the view.

Mad's Dad - I travelled to Retford every day by train for school from '58 to '64, and went to the rookery a lot in the 55 - 58 period. Saw all the A4s and most of the rest.

31st May 2009, 15:33
So what's she doing between 24 Jun and 26 July??

31st May 2009, 16:01
Itinerary (http://www.a1steam.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=154&Itemid=149)

glad you got your pics and whistle pete !

and the rads did i see you?

31st May 2009, 17:07
BBC NEWS | England | Somerset | Locomotive steams through tunnel (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/somerset/8075156.stm)

1st Jun 2009, 08:22
>and the rads did i see you? <

Maybe - there was a big enough mob everywhere! I splashed out and we travelled in First Class Dining Car - superb breakfast, on the lines of the old British Rail breakfast.

20th Jun 2009, 10:56
tornado will be out of waterloo to hampshire at 1037
and out of victoria to folkestone 1755

www.a1steam.com (http://www.a1steam.com)

also watch top gear sun nt 21 june 8pm uk time:ok:

tony draper
20th Jun 2009, 11:02
One shall be watching,can't see Clarkson being very good wi a shovel though.:):ok:

20th Jun 2009, 13:31
i think jezza will surprise you !;)

30th Jun 2009, 10:02
Where to travel (http://www.a1steam.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=47&Itemid=148)

this sunday then every sun to kingswear until aug 9
(and sat aug 8 to plymouth)
cheers rog

30th Jun 2009, 13:10
Maybe Concorde next?

30th Jun 2009, 13:15
to fly again?

well i've heard the froggies keep theirs in 'flying condition' all the time and perform run-ups etc,
is that so?

we don't, do we?...grrrr

went over the BA one at the USS Intrepid exhibit in NYC in march,
you can still smell the brand new leather seats...
she was spotless.

4th Jul 2009, 05:51
sad news indeed to hear of the loss of a RAF Tornado jet and the 2 crew from RAF Leuchars killed.

condolences to all.

4th Jul 2009, 08:15
As far as I can tell, there have been some 5 or 6 locos called Tornado over the years. The first was a GWR broad gauge 4-2-2.

7th Jul 2009, 14:21
Whilst on the subject of Tornados and trains . . .

American railroads are in the process of equipping locomotives with forward-facing video cameras to, among other things, record errant pedestrians and motorists as they flagrantly violate various traffic laws. It makes things easier to present such evidence in court when the injured parties (or the surviving relatives) are suing the railroads. A video camera seldom lies.

The video link below shows a Union Pacific freight train that had an encounter with a tornado near Lawrence, IL. The camera is videotaping out the windshield of a rear-facing unit that's coupled up against a covered hopper car.

After the hopper cars tip over and the locos stop, note how the rest of the train, including a tank car carrying ethylene oxide, continues to barrel down onto the front part of the train and then smashes into it.

YouTube - Train vs. Tornado - Spectacular! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azV5bC2br-Q)

By comparison, I guess wacking trespassers and autos isn't so bad! :ok:

31st Jul 2009, 04:02
Now escaped from the British summer (???) and back in the land of sunshine. Unfortunately didn't manage to get down to the SW to see Tornado. However, did manage to get a "help with the firing" trip on 60007 from Grosmont to Pickering and back! Eat yer heart out steam fans!


31st Jul 2009, 06:50
lovely! and sunny too
unlike the SW:bored: yukky weather for the Torbay's sadly...

on 8th aug T is also going down to Plymouth and Torbay on the 9th aug

back to london on 15th aug for 2 kent trips...

1st Sep 2009, 09:38
on the 70th anniversary today of the outbreak of WW2

time to remember over 600 children who were evacuated by train across Europe from Prague to England fleeing from the Nazis.

the children were able only to escape with the help of the British stockbroker Nicholas Winton...he is still alive at 100!
he is knighted now.

that famous train is being re-run this week to commemorate him and those children,
many of whom never saw their country nor families again.

?D Winton Train - Intro (http://www.wintontrain.eu/en/site/nicholas-winton/nw-intro.htm)

Tornado the new steam loco will haul the UK portion of the train from Harwich Quay to London this friday arrvs 1037 at Liverpool st where sir nicholas will meet his children he saved...his daughter is on the train too.

Latest (http://www.a1steam.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&layout=blog&id=1&Itemid=123) news from A1 Trust/Tornado loco

and times here
t0904b.htm (http://www.uksteam.info/tours/t09/t0904b.htm)

no doubt it will be a very emotional run for the people returning over the journey that gave them their freedom to escape the horrors that befelt their loved ones.

BBC TV news link
BBC NEWS | UK | Retracing a life-saving journey (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8227929.stm#down)

1st Sep 2009, 13:43
btw re the winton train

it is being followed on BBC TV news 24

BBC NEWS | UK | Retracing a life-saving journey (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8227929.stm)

today and everyday to friday when it arrives at london hauled by tornado

if you want more info tune in !

or click links in the big post above

1st Sep 2009, 13:55

this is a link to my main post,

perhaps the mods can please kindly link it up for me?

thanks ever so if you can,

the winton train is running this week to remember 669 mainly jewish children who escaped from prague to england 70 years ago today with the help of nicholas winton, the british diplomat.

Der absolute Hammer
1st Sep 2009, 17:41
I think he is still alive today and is being celebrated in person. He is now Sir Nicholas Winton and he was only about thirty when he done what he did.
A stout fellow..Ra RA!!

1st Sep 2009, 18:01
Nicholas Winton - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicholas_Winton)

2nd Sep 2009, 07:16
yes he is 100 years old

his daughter is travelling on the train from prague to liverpool st london and Sir Nicholas will meet the survivors off the train there on friday.

i will be meeting Tornado as she is pulling the UK portion of the train from Harwich docks.

after watching the bbc news this morning (they have a reporter on the train coming through from prague this week with the children, now grown up)
its going to be highly emotional...

i shall probably need a hankie

lots of info here re the the winton train and links to bbc and times etc

3rd Sep 2009, 16:20
Video: Tornado train steams through Ipswich - Evening Star 24 (http://www.eveningstar.co.uk/content/eveningstar/news/story.aspx?brand=ESTOnline&category=News&tBrand=ESTOnline&tCategory=xDefault&itemid=IPED03%20Sep%202009%2016%3A32%3A10%3A657)

4th Sep 2009, 10:45
BBC NEWS | UK | Czech evacuees thank their saviour (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8237231.stm)

4th Sep 2009, 13:54
Shame the continental carriages couldnt have been electric hauled through the tunnel and brought to London by Tornado, but no doubt there were reasons to do with loading gauge etc which prevented this. Anyway, fantastic to see the arrival on the lunchtime news and so impressed by Sir Nicholas Winton. The affection and respect which everyone on the train had for him was unmistakeable. What an achievement.

4th Sep 2009, 17:31
Shame the continental carriages couldnt have been electric hauled through the tunnel and brought to London by Tornado, but no doubt there were reasons to do with loading gauge etc which prevented this. Anyway, fantastic to see the arrival on the lunchtime news and so impressed by Sir Nicholas Winton. The affection and respect which everyone on the train had for him was unmistakeable. What an achievement.

thanks tanker,
however the idea was to recreate the trip through europe to the ferry port at hook van holland just like the children did 70 years ago...

YouTube - Tornado hauls the Winton Train sept 4th (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihsDA76s70Q)

YouTube - Tornado hauls the Winton Train sept 4th (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKiuieY-lUw)

YouTube - Tornado hauls the Winton Train sept 4th (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KVf8e6cOYdk)

some little clips i took today,,

the big emotional bit was when tornado left after an hour, it all went quiet and she blew her whistle continuously as she pulled out and the echo through the high arches of the old station was haunting and very moving, everyone started to cry.

4th Sep 2009, 18:10
And the press call cricketers and footballers heroes, and for what......

...it's people like Sir Nicholas Winton who do heroic deeds.

Sir George Cayley
4th Sep 2009, 21:43
It has always puzzled me how a number of individuals saw the future of Europe at Hitler and the Nazis' hands, spoke up against them and did something about it.

Winton was one, RJ Mitchell too. A Swedish diplomat whose name escapes me and an English industrialist who flew a private Lockheed on photo recce all come to mind.

I'm sure there are others and now is the moment to remember them. So if there is a lesson from history, who is telling us the likely future in the middle east and are the Govt of the day listening?

And give Sir Nicholas Winton an award for his efforts, only 70 years late.

Sir George Cayley

4th Sep 2009, 22:06
Perhaps they could change the name of the steam engine.

The Sir Nicholas Winton would do the trick. Much better to have it on a new steam train than on a Class 37 diesel or some such.The Sir George Cayley has a certain ring to it as well.

5th Sep 2009, 07:59
thanks for the comments
it was a very moving day yesterday for all concerned...and me

re changing the name of the loco, well Tornado was named just that to honour the service of the RAF Tornado fighter/bomber and her crews in the Gulf War campaign 1991. so very poignant there.

a loco called Sir Nicholas Winton would be great of course...

which one? which type?

his train of course came from prague to hook van holland then a steamer took the children finally to harwich parkestone quay thence to london liverpool st 70 years ago.

5th Sep 2009, 08:29
What motive power was used on the continent? Steam?

5th Sep 2009, 08:54
Yes there were some good air to ground shots on the news which showed the train double-headed by steam somewhere en route from Prague. Large impressive locos, but I am not up on continental types, so couldn't identify them.

5th Sep 2009, 10:09
there you go
Winton Train - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winton_Train#Motive_power_and_rolling_stock)

6th Sep 2009, 09:13
Perhaps they could change the name of the steam engine.

When steam really ruled the rails locomotives had, with a very few exceptions, their allocated names until the day they were scrapped.

Nowadays it seems that a locomotive is called "The 18th Congress of Local Government Street Sweepers" one week only to replaced by "Jim Scroggins Electrical Engineer 1983-2009", or "Tesco - The Price is Right", the next.

Name changing is a modern habit that ought to be stamped out now. So none of this talk about changing the name of Tornado my good man := With care and attention it should still be up there for the next 200 years or so - if not running then in a museum.

6th Sep 2009, 09:18
BBC iPlayer - Our World: The Winton Train (http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00mqd3h/Our_World_The_Winton_Train/)

also on tv
freeview cable sat at 1030 1430 2330 today sunday
bbc news 24 channel

6th Sep 2009, 09:43
And, Siseman, one of the exceptions was City of Truro (the first 'hundred mile an hour' engine; and arguments about that can be conducted behind the bike sheds later). The original was pretty well scrapped before anyone thought to preserve her for hisatory so a rebuild was made, the current City of Truro actually being most of the bits from City of Bath (there are some original bits there but it's a bit like my dads axe, marvellous old thing, only had 4 new handles and 2 new heads).

6th Sep 2009, 13:52

A lot of Great Western Castles got renamed, some several times. The 'Windsor Castle' that pulled King George VI's funeral train was actually Bristol Castle, as the real one was in Swindon works at the time. It never got changed back. Then there were Hurricane, Lysander, Blenheim, Spitfire etc, all renamed after WW2 aircraft, and of course, 5017 St. Donats Castle which in 1954 was renamed 'The Gloucestershire Regiment 28th 61st', in honour of the regiment's exploits at the battle of the Imjin River, and was, unusually, shedded at Gloucester thereafter. Cardiff Canton depot was always known for the immaculate turn out of their Castles, and it was a pity they were never given 4037, 'The South Wales Borderers' - it would have been well looked after!

The GWR seemed more inclined to rename locomotives than the other railways, though. But at least 'Sir Daniel Gooch' and 'Isambard Kingdom Brunel' never had that indignity forced on them.

6th Sep 2009, 15:13
Agreed. And then there was the renaming of various A4s, some at the start of the streamlined era and another at war's end to commemorate the likes of Eisenhower.

However, my point is that that the names weren't being changed on what appears to be a weekly basis to next highest bidder as seems to be the fashion nowadays.

6th Sep 2009, 20:26
What do you expect from a set of dunderheads who get taken by surprise when they tell drivers that instead of being paid double time on Sundays, they'll only be paid single time, and then expect them to volunteer for work, as they are not contracted to do so?

This shows a degree of stupidity amazing even for management grades!!

The railway management of these days appears incapable of arranging a f**k in a brothel, let alone running a railway. Changing loco names is about all they can manage. It is a moot point as to whether, if they were even less competent (if that is possible), they'd be invited into the present government.

6th Sep 2009, 20:27
But I was amazed to see Princess Elizabeth running smooth and straight YouTube - 6201 Princess Elizabeth (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgds_mKzs4w#) in that truly awesome video I was waiting to see where the camera was and then the track curved off to the right.

Obviously this smooth ride is due to the continuous rail and the track is much better laid/maintained now. All of my male relatives were either engine drivers LMS/BR or engine builders Dubs/NB Loco. I have had lots of fun on the footplate from about 10 years old but I remember it as a bucking bronco ride. I also loved a little bit of wheel spin but got a severe talking to for that when I got my hands on the regulator. Some wonderful videos of wheel spin on YouTube too - this thread has got me spending too much time on the PC and YouTube. My hands on time on the footplate was mostly on Black Fives, Royal Scots or Jubilees on the single track into and out of Stranraer. Also I was told stories of defeating the Tebay banker on the way north up Shap apparently the trick was to whistle late and the banker which was on a parallel track doing a standing start on your whistle would not catch you until you were over the top of the Shap summit. Serious mortgaging of the boiler required as well as keeping up speed round the curves before Tebay. Truly these people were artists something like the early days of flying before SOPs took over. I do have steam in my blood and it is interesting to see so many pilots with the same interests. I had a dabble with 7 1/4" Gauge live steam a number of years ago and that was real fun too.

6th Sep 2009, 20:49
My Son has a book, it is called "On the Railways" from the Ladybird range from the '60's. It includes phrases such as "the rails have to be kept in first class condition" and "the trains are cleaned everyday". It would make an excellent guide on how to run the railways for today. If you don't have a copy of this book I suggest you go out and buy it. :ok:

With regards to renaming locomotives you can buy "The Commenwealth Games 2002" from sheffield railwayana auctions next week.

7th Sep 2009, 02:15
you can buy "The Commenwealth Games 2002" from sheffield railwayana auctions next week.

Why would you want to??? I recently spent 600 quid on a replica A3 nameplate - much more satisfying even though it's not the real thing.


7th Sep 2009, 06:04
another ladybird which is an excellent read is
''in the train with uncle mac''

the front cover depicts ''balmoral'' which is tornados' sister engine,
an A1 pacific.
uncle mac was a BBC radio childrens presenter in the 1940-50's

every chav now should read it and see how we behaved back then lol!

heres one...easily available on fleabay
Ladybird Series 455 IN THE TRAIN with Uncle Mac on eBay (end time 09-Sep-09 18:41:02 BST) (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Ladybird-Series-455-IN-THE-TRAIN-with-Uncle-Mac_W0QQitemZ250492226142QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Books_Childre nsBooks_ChildrensBooks_GL?hash=item3a52800a5e&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14)

sorry about thread drift, we should be on about Tornado here, but i didnt start it lol!
re sundays' fiasco on london midland with no drivers wanting to work for no extra overtime and not contracted to work on sundays anyway...
this franchise LMR
No trains on 6 September (http://www.londonmidland.com/your-journey/journey-planning/no-trains-on-6-september/)

this train company should lose their franchsie at once...

its time the railways be put back into public ownership

its a mess...
its also time to get rid of this government...

7th Sep 2009, 11:56
Captain Kirk

Its steam, but not as we knew it

There was one weekend in August when we could travel on the main line behind a Jubilee (5690) on the Thursday, a Princess (6201) on the Saturday and a Scot (46115) on the Sunday.

On the 9th the Scot and Jubilee actually crossed on the S & C - awesome!


41 years after it all ended that is progress!!!

Rog - Oi!

The savverners have had enough of that A1 - it needs to remember where it belongs again!!

Would it go round the Harrogate Loop - and would it have to be Brunswick Green before the man from Carnforth "He Say yes"?

7th Sep 2009, 12:02

TPExpress DMU 185113 converted to steam.

YouTube - 185113 Preston August 2009 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AEWYJSW0OtA)

7th Sep 2009, 16:20
Rog - Oi!

The savverners have had enough of that A1 - it needs to remember where it belongs again!!.......

oi TBFrank... u leave Tornado alone...lol

i am a suvvener too (and an eastender lol so u best watch out!)

i am a Bulleid man but i have fallen in love with A1 Tornado,
you cant help it, shes's a marvel !

fondest rog:ok:

15th Jul 2010, 14:10
Please forgive the blatant Thread drift but I nearly saw something unforgettable yesterday.

Yesterday, while walking under Bath Spa station towards Widcombe, I glanced up at the platform and saw shiny chocolate and cream coaches. "Steam special" I thought, so nipped up to the car park for a look. There in the sunlight, all green, black and sparkling brass was 6024, gently breathing wisps of steam and smoke into the damp air of the Up platform. On the the Down platform and in the adjacent car park were hordes of enthusiasts and other assorted goofers; many with very expensive cameras and video gear. There was a ripple of excitement as King Eddie was given starters orders. Then, just as one of the footplate men (4 of them) sounded Eddie's whistle, it happened. A Down 1st GW train drew in to occupy the entire platform and a bit more; so nobody could see a bloody thing! What timing! Still, the sound and sight of smoke and steam from an invisible engine blasting into the sky was very emotive. :{

15th Jul 2010, 14:44
Do ypu mean "Blood and Custard" coaches?

15th Jul 2010, 15:58
Do ypu mean "Blood and Custard" coaches?

Nah. Chocolate and Cream. The GW were always a law unto themselves.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/de/GWR_coach_E164_BCK_7377.jpg/220px-GWR_coach_E164_BCK_7377.jpg (http://www.pprune.org/wiki/File:GWR_coach_E164_BCK_7377.jpg)

15th Jul 2010, 16:07
Sorry, looked more like green and cream


16th Jul 2010, 07:19
Tornado update (http://www.a1steam.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=627:tornado-update&catid=1:latest-news&Itemid=123)

The Tornado Telegraph (http://www.a1steam.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&layout=blog&id=54&Itemid=228)

hopefully we will be all fixed by august


12th Sep 2010, 23:45
At last!


West Somerset Railway (Bishops Lydeard), 11 SEP 10. She was in competitiom with a beer festival on Minehead station. A whole new meaning to steam beer.