Missing padlocks on baggage [Archive]

Icare9

27th Oct 2008, 22:18

I've done a search but can't find much help on this.

On the last three Monarch flights from Luton to Almeria and return, each time the padlocks on our bags have disappeared when collected from the carousel.
There does not appear to be sufficient time at arrival, so assume something must be happening after check-in.

I have not had a response from Monarch to this question, but as no apparent damage to the bags, clips etc, it would appear that the padlocks have been deliberately cut away.

Can anyone confirm whether this is some sort of standard security measure to remove padlocks? It seems to me to be exactly the opposite, as anyone can access the bags, either to add or remove items!!

Is there any sensible way to ensure that our bags are secure? Surely if there is a need to open a bag, a public address call would allow the bags owner to open the lock with the key or combination.

Hope someone can shed some light on why this is happening.

raffi_a

27th Oct 2008, 23:47

this is how works in the US TSA: Air Travel (http://www.tsa.gov/travelers/airtravel/assistant/locks.shtm)

Probably the same in europe, a post 9/11 thing i guess...

Regards
Raffi

da chief

28th Oct 2008, 12:46

Rainboe

28th Oct 2008, 14:06

Well you've had 2 answers that apply to the US. However, in your case, being the nasty suspicious individual I am, I would be suspicious of a more malicious intention! If security is going to do that, I would have thought they should put something on your bag or a sheet of paper inside notifying you of removal for security checking! I think your bag may have been 'valuables-checked'! So what would they do with internal case combination locks? Easier to saw yours off!

G-BPED

28th Oct 2008, 14:08

Baggage is screend after check-in and may need to be opened to 'check' certain items. . . I suspect that this is where your locks are going missing. The TSA system allows 'security' to open the case inspect it and re-lock it. :ok:

The OP was regarding flights from Luton to Almeria.

Almeria is in Spain not the USA.

I have never had padlocks removed on any flights around Europe.

The only advisory I have heard regarding padlocks has always been for flights into and out of the USA.

Regards,

G-BPED.

raffele

28th Oct 2008, 19:54

Clarification - TSA is American. If you travel to the States the TSA have the authority to search your luggage. This includes cutting away your locks (including the special TSA approved ones - they can't always remember where their master key is after they lent it to their dodgy friend you see...)

As far as I'm aware there is no other country in the world that forbids you to lock your luggage. Seems to me that someone somewhere is trying to be opportunistic. And as your bags were in the care of Monarch at the time, the buck stops with them. Keep on at them till you get a response!

Tigger4Me

28th Oct 2008, 20:15

This is not limited to Luton or Monarch. I work for a major holiday company and an increasing number of pax arriving in resort from Manchester are filing complaints that their cases have had locks removed, cases damaged and items stolen.

call100

28th Oct 2008, 20:20

This may help you...Part of my job entails ensuring the aircraft stands are clear of debris. The object most found are .....You guessed....Luggage padlocks.
They get banged about in the general business of load and unload and as they are totally useless they snap open.
I have a nice collection of combination locks....No one seems to change the code they come with!!!..
When I travel I always use cable ties to lock the case...The only way to get into the case is to cut them so you can be sure someone has been in or not.
On a recent trip to the US I had 3 cases TSA opened one (cut the cable tie) and left a note to say so...
This does not include the obvious few that are broken into deliberately for crooked purposes.
Hope that gives you some clue as to where yours may have gone...

Avman

28th Oct 2008, 23:05

The answer is don't put anything of value in checked bags. Padlocks are an open invitation for crooked ground staff to break in as they, rightly or wrongly, suggest that they may be "securing" something of value in the bag.

Do, however, leave plenty of smelly underwear for them to sort through :E

AMEandPPL

28th Oct 2008, 23:34

an increasing number of pax arriving in resort from Manchester are filing complaints that their cases have had locks removed

Maybe I've just been lucky, but must report no problems at all !

Live in Cheshire, usually fly out of EGCC, four or five mini-padlocks on each of our suitcases, no problems at all in most recent several trips. Europe, Middle East, Canada . . . . . . but NOT America ! !

Atlantean1963

29th Oct 2008, 07:57

I've had a bit of trouble with this as well (see http://www.pprune.org/passengers-slf-self-loading-freight/334821-disappearing-tsa-padlocks.html ).

So I've given up on padlocks, and use zip-ties instead - just make sure you have some nail clippers in you hand luggage to open the case at your destination. (Guess how I came up with that handy hint...:\ ).

And, as usual, never put anything in the hold that you're not prepared to lose.

Best Regards,

Atlantean

Katamarino

29th Oct 2008, 11:41

Nail Clippers!? In HAND LUGGAGE? What are you thinking man :p

GwynM

29th Oct 2008, 12:16

I always use cable ties and make sure nothing valuable is in the hold luggage.

Atlantean1963

29th Oct 2008, 13:30

Clippers - not scissors!

The worst I could do is threaten to give the crew a bad manicure...:eek:

Best Regards,

Atlantean.

VAFFPAX

29th Oct 2008, 14:02

Berliner Lufthäfen (the authority managing Berlin's airports) does do secondary inspections. They open combination locks and relock everything afterwards, leaving a piece of paper in there telling you why they had to open your suitcase.

S.

BladePilot

30th Oct 2008, 11:48

If nothing has been removed from the bag and contents show no signs of being tampered with the likelihood is that the padlocks have suffered 'trauma' somewhere in the handling process and parted company with the baggage quite innocently. Even the best designed automated baggage handling systems have gaps / joints / angles / turns / height changes which can and often do snag things like padlocks, straps and unstowed handles. You'd be amazed at the number of 'broken' bits the maintenance crews regularly remove from the baggage handling systems. At best most small padlocks on baggage offer only minimal protection if indeed any. The psychological benefits for the passenger (I've locked it therefore it must be secure and safe) far outweigh the actual pyhsical benefit gained from these 'toy' padlocks. Try busting one yourself and maybe you'll think twice about using one again.
Best use luggage with inbuilt (flush mounted) combination locks, you can now buy luggage which offers both combination and key operated flush mounted locks. Add a combination lock luggage strap for added peace of mind (making sure the lock mechanism fits snuggly against the case/bag) and finally if you really want to truss your luggage up like a Christmas Turkey then use cable ties.
The ultimate 'protection' is the shrink wrap service offered at some airports but you have to ask yourself 'why' and consider your Eco credentials when contemplating covering your luggage in swaiths of plastic.
Best thing to do is use your checked-in luggage to carry only clothes or items of little value and always carry your valuables in your carry on baggage.
Enjoy your next trip:)

Icare9

30th Oct 2008, 12:35

Thanks to all for your responses.
We have NOT lost anything from the cases (except the padlocks!!) and although they are fairly modest combination locks, they clip the zippers together UNDERNEATH the carrying handle. That's why I feel it is a more deliberate action in removing, especially as there is no deformation or other damage to the zippers etc. We do not put into the hold anything we couldn't live without (and only had hold bags this time as we were stocking up our apartment in Mojacar). In fact on our return we had one bag inside the other with just laundry and a few bits and bobs, so the case was practically empty.
I don't have a problem if security need to access bags, BUT if so then at least leave a not or similar. I still feel that if it is security, then surely a call could be put out to go to a specified place where you could unlock the bags for a search. That way everyone knows what is going on.
The suspicion I have is that it occurs in Almeria as there the bags have plenty of time for anything to happen, rather than at Luton where they seemed to come straight off the aircraft and appeared as soon as we got to the carousel. It's just a nuisance, rather than a problem.

PAXboy

30th Oct 2008, 15:25

BladePilotThe ultimate 'protection' is the shrink wrap service offered at some airports but you have to ask yourself 'why' and consider your Eco credentials when contemplating covering your luggage in swaths of plastic
Ever travelled through African airports ...??? Johannesburg is a corker and I pay the £5 every time.

VAFFPAX

30th Oct 2008, 23:13

Shrinkwrap AND padlock it when going through African airports. At least then you know it IS safe, in a way.

S.

Grasscarp

30th Oct 2008, 23:37

Last 3 trips, 1 British Midland and 2 British airways, have lost the handle of the trolley, a wheel and a zip. British Midland quite inefficient in handling but British Airways very slick and quick in handling any complaint. Never used to have any problem so I dont understand why it is so common now.

jetset lady

31st Oct 2008, 12:59

We have NOT lost anything from the cases (except the padlocks!!) and although they are fairly modest combination locks, they clip the zippers together UNDERNEATH the carrying handle.

Icare9,

The fact that you put the padlock under the carrying handle could be the reason they are being removed. I spend a fair amount of time chatting to our baggage handlers when hanging around waiting for flights and one of their biggest issues is with padlocks and the catches for straps being hidden under the handles. When loading an aircraft, they often don't see them until they pick up the bag and catch their fingers on them, often resulting in cuts and, in at least one case that I know of, a broken finger. These padlocks may seem very small and insignificant, but when you consider how many bags they handle in a day and the speed they often have to work at, you can see how these accidents happen.

I'm not saying this is definitely the case, but it could be a possible reason as to why your padlocks keep disappearing.

Jsl

Icare9

1st Nov 2008, 13:27

jetsetlady: Appreciate the comment, but on the bag in question, the zips are well away from the handle itself. The way the zips work we may be able to link them away from the handle area, but then they'd be more exposed. As there is no damage to the zip loops or any deformation, it looks more like the padlock has been "snipped" off, rather than torn off whilst on carousel or loading. I'm of the opinion that it is deliberate removal, and am interested to know of any legitimate reason, rather than someone idly snipping them off!!
I see that someone with a sense of humour is also displaying an advert for padlocks at the bottom of this thread!!!

call100

1st Nov 2008, 23:55

They don't wrench off. The problem is with banging about they just pop open. So no sign of damage would be seen.
If Security opened them you would have a note.
If someone had raided your bags something would be missing.
Doubtful that someone sought out three of your bags just to snip the locks for a laugh.
Use cable ties as suggested. At least then you can be certain of what is happening.

Lantern10

2nd Nov 2008, 01:45

Yes, it's cable ties for me too. Never had a bag opened.
I keep a stanly knife blade wrapped up in a business card in the pouch on the checked in luggage where the ID tag goes.

beamender99

2nd Nov 2008, 18:53

I agree cable ties are the easy option.

I always use a strap in the event of a burst holdall /case.
With my simple fabric straps I knot them.
With my snap together straps ( all originally found circulating on their own on carousels) I always loop heavy cord between the two halves.
I also tie holdall handles together with cord to reduce the risk of "handle strain"

On my return trip last week I thought my black Delsey had gone AWOL as I was left alone staring at an empty carousel.
A crew member had removed it at the other end of the belt (as it had a yellow label on it) and rather than put it back on the belt had left it lurking out of my sight.
Just as well as I was killing time awaiting family transport to arrive.

BEagle

25th Jan 2009, 15:26

I arrived back at Birmingham on Sat 24th 2009 to find that, somewhere between Friedrichshafen (where I checked in), Frankfurt (where I changed flights) and Birmingham, the lock of my checked-in Rimowa AirLight trolley case had been broken and the suticase contents sorted through - there were tell-tale signs. On arrival the case was insecure and there was no note inside to identify whether some Sicherheitsdienst incompetent had damaged it during a security check.

Fortunately nothing was stolen (or added). But it's buggered now - so I have demanded that Lufthansa replace it as the damage occurred whilst the case was in the care of Lufthansa and/or its appointed agents; whether this was due to attempted pilferage or lawful, but incompetent, examination is immaterial.

call100

25th Jan 2009, 18:14

Security checks always get a note left in your case......(bound to be someone who has experienced something different along soon:rolleyes:).
I think your case has been broken into...

VAFFPAX

25th Jan 2009, 22:41

Sounds dodgy to me... from Berlin, suitcases are checked and notes left as appropriate. Hamburg ditto.

S.

nicolai

26th Jan 2009, 22:57

Security checks always get a note left in your case......(bound to be someone who has experienced something different along soon

Glad to oblige!

I've several times in the last few years had my bags arrive opened with no note inside - the cable ties broken back when I used cable ties, the "TSA key was used" indicator showing on the locks I use more recently. Whenever I notice this before leaving the airport, I look in my bag to check for anything lost (or added!!) and complain to the airline's baggage handling desk that my bag has been opened.
The response is can always be summed up as a polite shrug and response similar to "The TSA are supposed to leave a note but they often don't".
I have noticed nothing gone missing yet from inside the locks, but the contents of my bag are not usually especially valuable.
Some thieving bastard did steal my very nice Swiss Army Knife multitool from the front (unlocked) pocket on a bag once, after I tucked it in there at checkin. I have learned my lesson and now nothing goes in an unlocked pocket.
If you get the "TSA locks", get the ones with an indicator only you can reset. You might be surprised how often your locks get opened!
I've never lost a lock, though I do try to tuck them under a strap (not a handle) to avoid them flapping about too much, and I buy the more expensive ones.

Final 3 Greens

27th Jan 2009, 08:09

If you get the "TSA locks", get the ones with an indicator only you can reset. You might be surprised how often your locks get opened!

Having just recently bought a case with one of these security nightmares fitted, the first move was to fill the keyhole with epoxy resin :ok:

Ten West

27th Jan 2009, 09:02

I fasten the two zips of my one together with a keyring. Not the whole thing, just the actual 'ring' part. Secure, but needs no tools to get it off. Easy.

call100

27th Jan 2009, 10:02

It's been said before......but....Don't use locks. none of them are any good....Cable ties done up tightly.....If security need to get into them they can. Keep spares inside the case. Don't use cases with zips...
YouTube - Opening Baggage Without A Key (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=vVf80-kzvDs&feature=related)

nicolai

8th Feb 2009, 12:40

Having just recently bought a case with one of these security nightmares fitted, the first move was to fill the keyhole with epoxy resin
Prepare to have your locks broken open by the TSA then!
My bags don't have built-in locks but have a point where you can insert your choice of padlock so I use a TSA-lock when travelling by air. I can see the point of having locks without a backdoor for non-airline travel, however if you have locks on your bags with no backdoor for them, the TSA may well break them, and then your bags won't be locked against any other thieves (or even just to hold them closed!).
This state of affairs does not make me happy, but until I have my personal aircraft to take me around the world, I'm stuck with it. I just complain every time I see a deviation from procedure so that they get some hassle.

virginpaul

23rd Feb 2009, 13:28

My blokes remove damaged naff suitcase padlocks by the shovel full from the holds of our and our customer's aircrafts - not to mention the ones we pick up from the apron prior to aircraft arrival, and from around the hold door areas before push back. Rubbish they may be, but they still cause nice dings and nicks to engine fan blades.

Icare9

23rd Feb 2009, 17:36

Fragman88

24th Feb 2009, 07:19

A Chap I flew with in the late seventies had done quite a while as a baggage handler whilst paying for his flying training. Then as now, theft was rife. His advice was that the only way to make it even moderately difficult for the bad guys was a broad strap, KNOTTED. The reason was that the guys only have a few seconds to get in and out and resecure the bag. No time to undo and retie knots, and cutting the strap is too immediately obvious to the receiving pax, which points the finger at that particular handling crew. Padlocks could be twisted off, and the chaps knew how to drop the integral lock types in the right way so as to spring the locks, so the strapped cases tended to go in the too hard file. The straps have worked for me ever since.

On a lighter note, one for the conspiracy theorists. On the TSA site linked in a post above, check out the combination on the Fly Safe Padlock, (if it were upside down!). Lunatics in the asylum?:confused:

F88:E

call100

24th Feb 2009, 10:23

Virginpaul: So why are all these locks NOT still attached to their cases? It seems as if there is a physical action that breaks them off, as they can't all be in exposed places? That was the point of my original post: Why are so many padlocks "lost"?
I don't believe there is some magical cause or metal fatigue that spontaneously causes all the padlocks to pop open and fall off without any human interaction. How is it that so many padlocks are broken?
If I were aware of any good reason for a security search, then simply ask me to open the bag BEFORE it gets loaded.
What I am concerned about is that anything can be taken (or added!!) to an unlocked bag. i hand it over locked and get it back unlocked, then Customs stop me, what defence have I if there is something added?
What you also imply is that the padlocks are broken at the DEPARTURE airport, rather than by your guys unloading the bags.
Don't the security implications of something nasty being added to a bag before flight cause you (and every airline) any concern?
The locks take a lot of punishment as the bags are thrown into holds onto baggage trucks. They bang around the automated carousel systems. Yes all locks are in an exposed area of the bag.
They are picked up on loading and unloading from the ground around the aircraft. The fact is they are not up to the job.
As for something being taken or added to your bag.....watch the video in post #32
You may not agree that the locks just fall off, pop open. break etc. but you will have to accept the fact that they do.

Icare9

24th Feb 2009, 22:32

call100: You imply that the padlocks simply fall off due to the stresses of being shunted around as "they are not up to the job"....
Yet the post immediately before quotes:.......
Then as now, theft was rife. His advice was that the only way to make it even moderately difficult for the bad guys was a broad strap, KNOTTED. The reason was that the guys only have a few seconds to get in and out and resecure the bag. No time to undo and retie knots, and cutting the strap is too immediately obvious to the receiving pax, which points the finger at that particular handling crew. Padlocks could be twisted off, and the chaps knew how to drop the integral lock types in the right way so as to spring the locks, so the strapped cases tended to go in the too hard file. The straps have worked for me ever since.
Quite a different explanation and one that you do not even contemplate.
it simply defies belief that so many padlocks "fall off" without any human interference. I think we should agree to disagree as I know which I chose to believe.........

call100

25th Feb 2009, 10:53

Your theory doesn't tally with the amount of reported theft (Only know from my airport obviously) with the huge amount of padlocks collected.
Padlocks could be twisted off, and the chaps knew how to drop the integral lock types in the right way so as to spring the locksThis alone shows that the locks are not up to standard.
FOD on the ramp also includes...Case handles, Baggage labels (Leather and plastic types), Metal case logo's, Baggage straps. (Tie them don't click them), Case 'feet', etc etc. All from the general bashing they get in transit.
I have no doubt that the odd criminal mind would be working at any airport. However the sheer amount of lost locks means (according to your theory) that virtually every baggage handler rifles bags........Which of course is complete nonsense. If you believe that then give up flying. Certainly take the advice given and don't use padlocks.

Gytha Ogg

25th Feb 2009, 18:39

Hello all, occasional lurker here. :)

In 2007, when picking up our bags in Leeds Bradford after returning from a trip to Amsterdam (Jet2 flight), both me and my boyfriend noticed our padlocks had been torn off our cases - the zip tabs were actually twisted and the ends were snapped off. It looked like they had been pulled off by pliers or something. Luckily nothing had been taken - I try not to put anything valuable in there anyway - but it's not pleasant thinking of someone ripping your bag open and rifling through your personal stuff! There were no Jet2 staff in the baggage hall to ask, and being knackered and wanting to get home, we decided to leave it. (We did have cheapo cases and padlocks, so it was a lesson for us really - will invest in something better next time!)

I know a few people have recommended cable ties - but couldn't they be easily cut off if someone wanted to open it?

call100

25th Feb 2009, 20:23

b737800capt06

26th Feb 2009, 10:39

On flights in Australia I have not found the locks messed with, then again my undies and shaving gear is not cause for to much alarm.........

Gytha Ogg

26th Feb 2009, 12:23

Cable ties show you that your baggage has actually been entered and not just the padlock falling/being wrenched off.
The point is that you are making it difficult for would be thieves. Look at the zip video and you will realise that the thieves do not even need to take off the padlocks.
The fact remains that the vast majority of lost padlocks are because they have not really manufactured one completely up to the job.

Ah, I see. I'll definitely get some for next time. :)

Any recommendations on luggage? I was thinking of getting one of the hard type cases instead of a fabric one, or does it make no difference security-wise?

blackace

18th Mar 2009, 22:59

I work in baggage systems and to be honest the padlocks are too small and too weak, they break far too easily and get snagged on the conveyors. I see them strewn all over the place.

In the UK no one is allowed to open a bag without the police present, and to be honest I have never seen anyone do so without them there. It is just not worth the risk, if anyone did open a bag there are plenty of people around willing to report the fact.

Soft luggage is best, some of the systems are very violent and use pushers that I have seen completely smash a Samsonite case, They may be hard, but they are no good at taking an impact. Soft bags take an impact quite well.

If your bag (and its contents) can take a 3 foot drop onto a solid floor it will survive any UK airport.

Worst issues are.

Wheely type cases. Wheels roll on conveyors, handles that fall open and get snagged. Make sure your handle retracts properly and please make sure the check in desk puts it on the conveyor wheels up.

Soft round bags, roll all over the place.

Steel Camera bags, always end up in Level 3 and hence get damaged, inspected more.

If your worried about the bag, put it into the out of gauge line, these bags are looked after a little more than those that go straight through the system.

StillPhil

19th Mar 2009, 10:00

Reading Call100's post and viewing the YouTube video - YouTube - Opening Baggage Without A Key (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=vVf80-kzvDs&feature=related) - was quite scary - particularly as someone might use the method to stash something in your case, never mind stealing anything. I also saw this - Luggage Security Tags, Luggage Tampering Prevention, Luggage Security Products, Luggage Tampering Protection, Security System (http://www.telltag.com/) - there which, although quite pricey, seems to get around this zip opening scam. While on YouTube have a look at some of the other lock-opening methods. The combination one in particular.

Tigger4Me

19th Mar 2009, 10:10

Thanks for the detailed post and useful info Blacklace. For the uninitiated can you explain what you mean by Level 3 please? :confused:

Ex-RN

20th Mar 2009, 01:11

I have used small cable ties for years (small size about 3" long) When Flying Man to Antigua recently 3 were found in my hand baggage and removed "as they could be used as a restraint" Yeah - for a ball point pen !! anyway they missed the 20 I had in my jacket pocket !! Even I didnt realise they were there till I was on the aircraft.:)

blackace

21st Mar 2009, 20:04

Thanks for the detailed post and useful info Blacklace. For the uninitiated can you explain what you mean by Level 3 please?

Tigger4me.

There are 5 levels of security check on baggage. All after the bags are checked in and away from the passenger.

Level 1. This is an automatic decision by an x ray machine. These are not the kind you are used to seeing, but are very expensive and accurate machines, they x ray the bags very quickly and make an automatic pass/fail decision. These machines consider anything a fail, the bag has to be 100% clean to get past it. Any explosives/metal/biological material will cause a fail, including the wires on bras. If your bag passes, it goes straight onto the plane.

Level 2. The image from a failed level 1 bag is sent to a control room where an operator gets to view the image to see why it failed at Level 1. Normally the fail was because of things like wires in bras etc, so the operator can make a pass decision before the bag reaches a certain point and without interrupting the flow of bags. If he makes a pass decision the level 1 decision is considered overruled and the bag goes on the plane, if he feels the bag needs further inspection he makes a fail decision, the bag is then diverted off the main line and into the Level 3 area.

Level 3. At this point the bag arrives at a second X ray machine, a bit more powerful than the level 1 machine, here an operator has no time constraints, he can x ray the bag as many times as he wants and take as much time as he needs to make sure the bag is clean, if he passes it it goes on the plane, if he considers it needs further investigation he will fail it and then it goes to Level 4.

Level 4. Now the police are called and the bag is opened with the police present, if the item was an innocent mistake or an object was harmless when in fact it looked suspicious then the bag is resealed and a label added to inform the passenger that the bag was opened and inspected with the police present but was found to be harmless. The bag is then put on the plane. If there is a definite threat then the bag is considered a Level 5 bag.

Level 5. A definite threat has been detected. The passenger is removed from the plane and taken away to be questioned by the police. He is not going to fly on that day.

minstermineman

21st Mar 2009, 20:59

I fasten the two zips of my one together with a keyring. Not the whole thing, just the actual 'ring' part. Secure, but needs no tools to get it off. Easy.

If its easy to get off then why bother - seems to defeat the whole object of you supposedly securing it in the first place :confused:

Tigger4Me

22nd Mar 2009, 12:16

Thanks for the detailed reply Blackace. With all that going on mutiplied by the number of bags being handled, it makes me wonder how any flight gets away on time.

Ruby01

12th May 2010, 10:46

Those cheap combination padlocks (http://www.sourcingmap.com/padlock-c-1150_1586.html)can be easily opened and i noticed a guy who can do the trick in 90 seconds. Besides, the TSA is not easy to use. And I just bought a suitcase with TSA lock. I tried to reprogram the 3 digit code from it's default 0-0-0 code. I thought I already followed the instructions but it couldn't open. I have tried all the combinations but still could not open it. I nearly get crazy about the lock and decide to change a robust padlock that won't get lost or opened at ease.

call100

12th May 2010, 19:47

As I said in the earlier post the padlock makes no difference to the security of your baggage from organised theft...It just makes it difficult for opportunists......

glad rag

12th May 2010, 21:45

In the UK no one is allowed to open a bag without the police present

well there must be a lot of thieves in the Met then........;););)

PAXboy

12th May 2010, 22:06

Thank you very much Blackace, most informative and appreciate the trouble you took to explain the system. Whilst I'm sure that TS (doffs cap) is busy, it's the kind of info that might benefit the FAQ.

mutt

13th May 2010, 04:06

and consider your Eco credentials when contemplating covering your luggage in swaiths of plastic. Considering the risk on someone placing something in my bag, especially in countries with automatic death sentences for drugs, I consider my eco credentials to be the least of my worries :)

Mutt

scr1

13th May 2010, 05:37

In the UK no one is allowed to open a bag without the police present

sorry but you are wrong

customs can. they can even enter your house

at our airport untill recently when they got a new scanner they had to hand search 1 in 10 bags

PAXboy

13th May 2010, 11:28

I think that what Blackace meant was:

In the UK no one is allowed to open a bag without a statutory body being present.

HMR&C are, of course, a statutory body.

Snas

13th May 2010, 13:49

I have long ago stopped putting items that give a good x-ray image of themselves into hold luggage, cigs and booze being the main items of concern for me – the chances of them not making it home with me in my experience are best described as good.

It’s become a fact of life for me (based on my own costly experience) that valuables are all too often nicked.

TightSlot

13th May 2010, 15:20

Now added to Forum FAQ (http://www.pprune.org/passengers-slf-self-loading-freight/318080-forum-faq-welcome-passengers-slf-forum.html) as suggested.

PAXboy

13th May 2010, 16:28

SnasIt’s become a fact of life for me (based on my own costly experience) that valuables are all too often nicked.

As Blackace said: In the UK ... :E

Union Jack

13th May 2010, 17:22

A Chap I flew with in the late seventies had done quite a while as a baggage handler whilst paying for his flying training. Then as now, theft was rife. His advice was that the only way to make it even moderately difficult for the bad guys was a broad strap, KNOTTED. The reason was that the guys only have a few seconds to get in and out and resecure the bag. No time to undo and retie knots, and cutting the strap is too immediately obvious to the receiving pax, which points the finger at that particular handling crew

And for those of you who like the knotted strap or cord solution, here's a little extra and easily applied security check from the days of sail:

Thief knot - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thief_knot)

Jack

MPN11

13th May 2010, 18:47

Lucky me - I have a reel of ParaCord that will do nicely! And that takes a LOT more than a quick slash with a craft knife to cut.

Great post!

bedsted

14th May 2010, 09:13

Ex US, I have had my checked bags searched by TSA. I always leave them unlocked for this eventuality. TSA leave a note saying they have been searched but in my experience they do not latch them properly afterwards.
Only a very loosely replaced strap prevented all the contents spilling out on the tarmac. They won’t replace a cable tie either.

call100

14th May 2010, 19:45

Was trying not to post this, but, it's out there already and it illustrates my point....
YouTube - Open Locked Luggage (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kd3-639OG_E)
Look at the videos to the right and see how to open a baggage lock.

Basil

18th May 2010, 20:00

Some people do use totally sh1tty quality baggage.
Yes I know how to open and close an Oyster without touching the lock but some of the stuff you see :yuk:

alcockell

29th May 2010, 15:14

I'm a bit concerned about all this. IT appears that in all cases, it's possible that valuable stuff could be lost at any point on the transit chain....

If I was ever going to go on holiday to the States, say.. and i wanted a bit more security around my gear... would freight be safer? Less need for Customs to break open the bags if they've got a green form on the front?

OutsideCAS

29th May 2010, 16:42

not sure if it's been mentioned, but at least in the UK (too my understanding), if baggage is required to be opened after various levels of screening, then the pax. will be summoned to be present at opening of said baggage, therefore removing the "theft" issue for the pax. concerned at least !

call100

29th May 2010, 18:38

It's not at the searches things go missing....:eek:

radeng

29th May 2010, 21:47

If the bag gets to level 5, is opened, and found inoccuous, is the PAX still removed from the flight? And if so, who picks up the tab?

Sonorguy

7th Mar 2011, 14:39

Quote:
I fasten the two zips of my one together with a keyring. Not the whole thing, just the actual 'ring' part. Secure, but needs no tools to get it off. Easy.
If its easy to get off then why bother - seems to defeat the whole object of you supposedly securing it in the first place http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/confused.gif

Because they're fiddly and take time to undo, without being impossible (well if you're wearing gloves they are impossible). I've used them for years. They make the lock into a 'not worth the bother' deterrent.

Espada III

7th Mar 2011, 15:40

For many years I have travelled with my family and not bothered with locks on our suitcases. We are insured, we usually only take clothes, books and toiletries etc. in the cases and anything expensive comes as hand luggage. Don't have to remember codes or keys.

My experience of putting expensive items in the hold is that they don't get stolen but the bags end up in a different airport to your destination. And its usually these expensive items that you want/need immediately - I can buy a shirt anywhere, but if I need my laptop with data on it...............

GrahamO

7th Mar 2011, 16:13

KGAD1uTR1SY

Dawdler

7th Mar 2011, 19:49

I have just watched a TV documentary about Stansted, during which a (perfectly legal) gun was found in some checked in baggage. It was properly packed in a hard gun case and packed within softer articles in the case. The owner of the bag was called down and his already open bag was displayed to him. The only reason that the (unloaded, gas powered) gun was highlighted was that although legal in both UK and the destination country, the airline had a rule about not carrying guns. How I wonder, was the owner supposed to transport his sporting gun to his destination if airlines won't carry them?

I gave up locking my suitcases years ago on the premise that luggage padlocks are useless anyway. I simply use a keyring to secure(?) the cases.

TightSlot

8th Mar 2011, 08:34

How I wonder, was the owner supposed to transport his sporting gun to his destination if airlines won't carry them?
Freight? Sea? Doesn't really matter - the point being surely that he shouldn't have done what he did

radeng

8th Mar 2011, 11:38

I've seen people checking guns in cases in as checked baggage with BA. They had a heaps of paperwork, though, and the airline had been informed prior to the flight. So some airlines will carry guns in the right circumstances.

Dawdler

8th Mar 2011, 13:20

Freight? Sea? Doesn't really matter - the point being surely that he shouldn't have done what he did

I suppose shipping companies could invoke the same policy.

BTW I have seen rifles checked (in cases) in at the check in desk previously and that was also at Stansted.

I would have thought that enclosed in aircraft baggage would have been the safest place. Even more than a ship.

radeng

8th Mar 2011, 16:17

I suppose it's one way of making sure that the gun doesn't fly, and likely, neither does the pax ever bother again with that airline.

The Real Pink Baron

9th Mar 2011, 14:28

If you notice that your bag has been tampered with, do not try to go through customs, it may be full of drugs!!!! Leave your bag where it is and call a security person. This could save you a long prison term! And in some countries a death penalty.

vanmunchen

9th Mar 2011, 15:28

ConstantFlyer

11th Mar 2011, 13:39

I'm surprised that there is much concern expressed about securing luggage because I've been travelling extensively for very many years and have never ever bothered about locking luggage. For one thing I've always thought that security might need to open it when it's outside my sight and in any case I can't be bothered with messing about with locks. On the other hand I don't put anything of high value in checked luggage. Any valuable items I keep with me as hand luggage.

Quite agree, vanmunchen. I can't speak for others who take vast quantities of luggage with them or why, but for myself, I prefer to go hand-luggage-only and send anything really vital or valuable by a reputable courier. Many years ago, a sage traveller gave me this advice: When packing for a trip, lay everything out on the bed. Then put half of it back and take twice the money. It has proved to be sage advice indeed.