Big changes to IFR routes in WA

[White and Fluffy]

Just got the new DAP amendments and next issue charts and noticed that there are some big changes happening all over WA. Biggest changes around Perth, most SIDs and STARs have changed due to all the waypoints moving and also changing names. There is also a large increase in one way routes and many old favorites have completely disappeared.

Should make for some interesting times as crews try to catch up with the new procedures and even more interesting times for those operators that aren't so good at keeping RNAV databases up to date.

I assume this is in response to the reported delays and airspace issues that we keep hearing about.

I guess it’s a bit early but can the crews in WA keep us posted how this one works out and if it helps or makes things worse.

Cheers,
W&F

[Capt Fathom]

An AIC regarding this has been on the Airservices (http://www.airservices.gov.au/publications/aip.asp?pg=50) website for some time!:ok:

[mattyj]

Thats funny..we have huge changes in NZ too. Heaps of new RNAV waypoints and new routes around the middle of the Nth Island.

..actually its probably the king of Taupo again making more room for his skydiving outfit..the new waypoints being called PARRA and CHUTE:O

[Green gorilla]

Cool nothing like changes but it all looks alright to me.

[Capn Bloggs]

I assume this is in response to the reported delays and airspace issues that we keep hearing about.
Why?
- Because most of industry refuses to embrace ADS-B, making the huge increase in jet traffic in non-radar WA not economically or safely manageable, resulting in too-long periods stuck at lower levels waiting for clearances;

- the refusal of too many captains to use off-track departures OCTA, thereby forcing nose-to-nose conflicts in the climb or descent, which is at best a silly idea. At least we won't have to worry about the Virgin E Jet aces trying to climb through other aircraft's levels with minimal nose-to-nose separation...

It won't help delays at Perth much. There will still be 40 jets trying to land on the one piece of bitumen that can only handle 24 per hour.

[westausatc]

Bloggs,

It might not help with delays (as you so well put it, 40 just doesn't fit into 24!) but it will help us controllers as jets and props will be on different SIDs/STARs so we won't have to push planes around to get everything to work. Provided the weather is nice, it will be a big improvement for us doing the radar enroute around PH - when the weather turns to poo though, it is going to be very ordinary!

On the ADS-B thing, even if every aircraft flying through WA had it, nothing would improve with delays as there is no ADS-B feed into the PH TCU for the flow. All the flow sees are squares (flight plan tracks, ie don't know where they are) or circles (radar tracks). Until they equip PH TCU with the ADS-B feed, there will be no improvement. When will this happen? Got a date yet for hell freezing over?

Also, ADS-B was supposed to have been fully rolled out, completed, operational, yaddah-yaddah-yaddah for 5nm separation by now across the whole continent above F300. Ask any manager in AsA when it will actually get to that point and all you will get is a shrug of the shoulders.

Once ADS-B is all done and the feed is delivered into PH TCU, provided there is decent coverage at turboprop levels out to 250nm+ from PH, there should be a big improvement in the service you receive (won't have to use a procedural standard) and delays will be much better handled as the flow will be able to sequence from an extra 100nm+ out. I wouldn't hold your breath on that happening before 2012 though.....

[Dehavillanddriver]

hey Bloggs

No need to display your jealousy about not flying the ejet!

[Nautilus Blue]

Its a bit early to tell at the moment but from what I've seen,


Bad

no more direct tracking (dct HAIGH R21, dct SPUDO R24 etc) when its quiet
more track miles on SID's and STARS's
won't be assigned below A100 til inside 36nm
a certain PJE drop zone more restricted when PH is on R03/06
changes have to align with AIRAC dates – totally new airspace design goes live for the first time on a Thursday morning :eek:
Good

No 52 DME hight requirement :ok:
sperate turbo and jet SID/STAR's so much less likely to be taken off SID/STAR or delayed on climb/descent
inbound and outbound routes mostly separated, more likely to get unrestricted climb straight to planned level without daft height requirements
STARS flow from flight planned route – no more recleared to XXX, YYY transition
all holding points published AND on flight planned track
many STARS have different tracking for different runways only inside 36nm – RWY changes might actually be safe!
racetrack pattern into/out of GEL southbound
NRV inside 125.4 FIA, less broadcasts for PH-NRV traffic
a certain PJE drop zone less restricted when PH is on R21/24
It would be very interesting to hear what the customers think once its up and running.


NB

[Snail Dave]

Technically, airspace (procedures) can and does create delays. If we are talking about 'capacity', then the runways/taxiways are generally the limiting factor.

Happy to be corrected.

Snail

[Nautilus Blue]

Airspace does not create delays.

"It's about the Runways (and taxiiways) Stupid"


Perth had to go to taxi slot times because TWR could fire aircraft off one RWY fast enough to 'overfil' the airspace. As soon as it calls DEP an aircraft becomes 3nm long and 3nm wide, radar sectors it's 5nm long/5nm wide, in procederual airspace (160nm PH) it's 20nm long and 28nm wide (GPS) or 10 minutres long and 60nm wide. The fact that 90% of PH traffic is in a 135 degree arc doesn't help.

NB

[myshoutcaptain]

2 days and counting ...

Jepp's seem to have arrived well on time for this update - much appreciated. Now for that RNAV data base .. fingers crossed otherwise I'm off to the lucky shag. :ok:

[Capt Claret]

myshoutcaptain

Have you noticed that the amendment doesn't contain the Flight Planning route requirements? :\ :ugh:

[myshoutcaptain]

Capt - I haven't no , I am just about to look through .. I did see the route planning as a NOTAM last week however on searching it seems to have gone.

Route data is available from airservices (http://www.airservicesaustralia.com/publications/pending/ersa/GUID_ersa-fac-2-2_20-Nov-2008.pdf)

Scroll down , select , 6 - 6.1 Western Australia

:}

[rack 'n stack]

A word of caution - the new route structure and data are firmly established around 'city pairs' planning. Please ensure you pick the right one or flight plan via the correct TMA/ENR gate so that the magic machine will generate your SID correctly.Also - the new routes do not solve the log jam in the TMA. Turbos and jets will join at about 20nm inbound. Be prepared for some serious speed if the winds are strong up top.Runway changes will be a bun fight - expect to hold if you are outside 50nm when we do the change, until the TMA have sorted out those caught inside 30nm. 03 to 21 will be a right royal pain due to the significantally different number of track miles.Above all - please be patient as we are getting used to new conflict points and airspace configurations. We have done 3 simexs covering varying scenarios and are coping with copious amounts of new/altered local instructions, there will be floor walkers in support for the first couple of weeks so we hope that all goes well.

[No Further Requirements]

Floor walkers! Where did you get the extra staff?

Best of luck for the transition - hope it goes smoothly for all.

Cheers,

NFR.

[illusion]

I hope they got rid of that rediculous waypoint called "ALWYN":E

[Capn Bloggs]

I hope they got rid of that rediculous waypoint called "ALWYN"
Perhaps they will when you learn how to spell! :}

Who is that joker Alwyn anyway? Who's she upset to get her name in lights? Dick Smith?

Last day for head-on pics tomorrow troops - take your cameras and don't forget to smile as I go past!

[ER_BN]

Major airspace changes/route structures require an enormous amount of planning, simulation and enthusiasm for change.

Best of luck from BN CTR.....

I know some of my peers in ML CTR especially the BIGHT controllers have a lot of concerns about the changes.

Hope those concerns are wrong??

[west atc]

Good luck from an ex- West Radar controller now training in Ireland, hopefully all will work out for you guys.

Can't say I miss it though. :ok:

[divingduck]

I thought I was already here:E

Although it was called Arrivals when I was doing it in Perth!

[rack 'n stack]

Floor walkers - grabbed them back from the tower for WARRP, going again after successful implementation!!

TCU gains nought from the changes - should make ENR a little bit easier, well in radar airspace anyway. Expect delays as the FLOW tries to work out where you are now coming from/via/to.

ALWYN - he knows who is.

[rack 'n stack]

Early days but from an ATC perspective seemed to go OK. Usual lack of database entries for those that were airborne at the changeover time but all seems good now.

I would be interested in feedback from crews on the new SID/STAR package. All comments, constructuve is good, will be welcomed. PM or on the site is fine.

[Capn Bloggs]

Good good good!

I even avoided a kamikazee Skygod by being on a segregated root! :ok:

Well done PM and GW. :D

[Capn Bloggs]

Xatrix, you are joking, aren't you? I suggest you have another read of AIP/Jepp about the changeover time for AIRAC changes.

[Checkerboard]

Well I flew this moring and I thought it all worked very well and quite smoothly.

We departed out of Barimunya and having our own route meant we avoided a step climb with the 2 aircraft out of West Angelas.

Only comment was we were advised quite late of a requirement to be below FL310 30nm before Renop ( or whatever it is called) which required the use of the speed brake.

[ITCZ]

why does ATC begin using the new procedures before the effective date?
AFAIK, they were right on time. From AIP GEN (http://www.airservicesaustralia.com/publications/current/aip/gen/3_1_1-6.pdf) 4. AIRAC SYSTEM

4.3
Documents and charts issued in accordance with the AIRAC cycle become effective at 1600 hours UTC on the day prior to the nominated date unless otherwise notified;

[Capt Claret]

Had my first experience today, a BEVLY One to RWY 24. With only 6 waypoints in 44.6 track miles, I thought they could've added a few more. I mean, BEVLY to BOOKA is a whopping 16nm! :{

[Cravenmorehead]

Alwyn I think was a certain NJS Captain's Dad who flew for Ansett MMA. A good bloke me thinks.

[B767MAD]

Anyone know why most departures from Perth on Thursday morning were Radar? Seemed to work pretty well with direct on release much appreciated.

[FL400]

ATC system upgrade on Wed night didn't work so the new SIDs/STARs weren't loaded until Thu night. NOTAM was issued amending validity of new DAPs to Thu night/Fri morning; can't fly SIDs that don't exist yet :p

[illusion]

Who is "Alwyn".

Is'nt he the bloke the DCA was chasing for flying inverted over the harbour bridge at 500 kts??:cool:

[Bug Smasher Smasher]

Capt Claret et all,

Yeah, there are quite a few waypoints on the STARS but if you look closely you'll notice a lot of them match up with the CTA steps. Hooray! :D

[Capn Bloggs]

Is'nt he the bloke the DCA was chasing for flying inverted over the harbour bridge at 500 kts??

http://i521.photobucket.com/albums/w334/capnbloggs/OverSydney.jpg

They made a big mistake trying to catch him in their Aero Commander...:}

[LeadSled]

Bloggsie,

Maybe the waypoint was named after the Alwyn Award, a very special award conferred, annually or more often in exceptional cases, by AOPA Australia, until some years ago ---- and, no, not when Dick Smith was President.

However, about the same time the Casawary column, the chronicle of the adventures of a boneheaded flightless bird, first appeared in the AOPA magazine. The column masthead was a masterpiece by a very talented young cartoonist.

Alternatively, maybe she is a he, located no entirely unadjacent to the YPPH area.

Tootle pip!!

[LeadSled]

Folks,

PS the the previous post, over the years, the yanks (before political correctness set well and truly in) were far more imaginative with names.

For those of us who worked in the area, who can ever forget the successive position on one airway from Reno (?) into KSFO, the positions being successively -- Hairy, Horny, Bushi, Mary.

Or the boundary positions around Diego Garcia-- Wotta, Bumma, Mumma.

The nearest I recall to such names here, was the well chosen GAFFA, a perfect description of the area.

ALWYN is a bit tame.

Tootle pip!!

[CaptainMidnight]

I suspect ALWYN is so named because Alwyn Adkins, National Jet was the RAPAC convenor for W.A. for many years, and did a lot of good work for the industry.

He may have received an Australia Day Award for his work, but I'm not positive re that.

[Capn Bloggs]

A380-800,
Bloggs- Was that a result of your instrument scan? "Recover now"
I think he must have slipped into Alternate Law for a short time!! :}