NEW runway operations at Abu Dhabi OMAA

[ATSI]

When the NEW runway 13L/31R at OMAA is operational during DAY VMC, ATC is NOT permitted to accept requests for arrivals or departures to/from the OLD runway 13R/31L since it is closed for urgent repairs (will commence after 2 weeks or so).

So please don't even ask...

[Che Guevara]

So please don't even ask...

Sorry, but I do have to ask...what kind of approaches will be available?

Thanks

[ATSI]

Ok then...

CAT I

(without PAPIs I believe)

[Togalk]

I will ask this though.

Why do you need 10 miles separation on final? I was 5 miles behind a guy (double what you get in LHR) , not gaining on him, and was given a 360. Actually it was more like a tour of Al Ain.

[ATSI]

Correction to my previous post : CAT I with PAPI lights only.


Why do you need 10 miles separation on final?


Did you land on 13L? If so, movement restrictions are required for taxiing aircraft to the holding point due to lack of SMR coverage in that area. That might have been the reason. You might have been vectored too close to preceeding, even though 5 NMs spacing is normally fine, but during North runway operations ATC is limited to few ground operations and your landing could have passed the approaved limitation. So should APP have vectored you 10 NMs behind instead, probably yes, but I haven't seen the situation so cannot give you a complete and correct reason. Hope this explains it, somehow at least.

[ATSI]

(double what you get in LHR)


I know, but you cannot compare EGLL and OMAA (for many reasons...). The criteria for 2,5 NMs spacing on final is not that simple, the whole airport layout, weather conditions etc must be taken into account. At OMAA we have minimum 5 NMs spacing (perhaps in the future will be able to reduce this to 3 NMs when we move to the new control tower)

[throw a dyce]

When is the new tower opening? You must need good eyesight to see aircraft on the north runway,from the old tower.

[Bredrin]

Actually, it is sometimes impossible to see the new runway, have the cameras been installed yet. Yes, as they call it in the Uk, CCTV is supposed to be installed so the tower guys can see.

[ATSI]

When is the new tower opening? You must need good eyesight to see aircraft on the north runway,from the old tower.


throw a dyce,

Well, if you're a regular at OMAA then you'll see that the new TWR building still need some attention... Installation of equipment and training will take some time too. My guess 2010++

Good eyesight yes, but not THAT good. If I remember correctly I think the distance between the current TWR and THR 13L is 4,8 kms!!! Our SMR nearly gives us 100% coverage, but in shadow areas we must use CCTV. Consequently ground movements have been restricted.

--------------

All,

This is new for all of us. New taxiway designators, stand numbers, north runway procedures etc. It takes time, and remember that 80% or more of the ATC group have never worked parallel operations before. Please give them some time to adapt (its not as simple as it seems suddenly to include LEFT/RIGHT to the runway in use).

Happy flying (and taxiing...)

[BladePilot]

ATSI,

I just love your original post! Abu Dhabi finding a new (maybe more efficient) way to promulgate critical Ops info rather than the standard methods:) brilliant.

Reckon you'll be lucky to see your new Tower by end of 2010, ADPi you gotta love them!
How are you monitoring runway for incursions surely not relying 100% on SMR? Have they actually installed CCTV to cover the thresholds? and how do you manage around all the construction traffic that's still rumbling around in the new midfield area between the runways? Your new Tower will need to be up and operating before they start putting up the Tower Cranes for the new Terminal or you'll most definitely have a few big shadow areas.
When are you expecting to achieve full CAT III certification for the new runway?


Best of luck with it all you have a huge challenge ahead.

[ATSI]

BladePilot,

CCTV covers the THRs but otherwise SMR and a pair of binoculars is doing the job as our extended eyes :eek:

Construction workers/equipment are fenced off, so they shouldn't be crossing taxiways/runways during north runway ops.

CAT III.... Heard a few dates but can't comment. It is planned for 13L/31R and eventually 31L. 13R will remain CAT I only.

[BladePilot]

Reckon you should build a 'tank trap' ditch around all the vunerable bits. I have this horrible image of some poor dehydrated underfed expat worker falling asleep in the 40degree heat whilst levelling the ground in some mammoth Caterpillar machine, or maybe he just can't read the big sign which says STOP:eek:

No doubt you'll have a few challenging months ahead, best of luck.

PS. Bad news about the fog again today pity they hadn't delivered that new runway fully capable to you.

[Farrell]

Are you still closed due to fog?

Have a mate stuck in Al Ain having diverted in from MCT.

Does it really get that bad up there?

[fractional]

Al Ain was busy this morning. FTs are bit better today, but you never know.
Abu Dhabi's temps are a bit too close despite de northerlies and the FT not saying anything abou FG. Dubai looks more promising.
SA OMAA 161800Z 02006KT 7000 SKC 29/25 Q1011 A2986 NOSIG

[geo7E7]

The temp variations in AUH is so unpredictable nowdays and we will see a lot of disruptions in flight schedules as we speak. Most of the inbound flights (esp in the morning) need a CAT III capabilities or we're as good as to land somewhere else in the Gulf except in AUH...unless the airline reschedules your arrival....!
I'm sure most of us have had our fair share of a/few diversion/s from AUH everytime during these transition of seasons. Runway closure due to fog is quite common now but having to divert to your planned alternate and finding out "it cant accomodate your arrival due congestion" is another issue now. We've heard of some aircrafts that had to park on the taxiways just to wait for a slot for refuelling and etc. Some even spent most of the time trying to contact NOC to find out how many flights being diverted and where so that they wont get stuck there behind others...that's another issue too...!!!
I'm sure the CAT III topic had been discussed from way back and hopefully it'll come into operations as soon as practicable and I'm sure AUH ATS understand the urgency of the capabilities on 13L/31R...and why we all really need it.

Thank you for viewing guys...and I'm open for debate...:E

[27Foxtrot]

It is about a 12-15 min taxi to the new runway, without inbounds isn't it?

[Bredrin]

12-15mins to the old runway, add an additional 10 mins to get to the new one.

[ATSI]

Time flies when you're having fun....

I don't agree with 12-15 mins taxi time to the OLD runway. A normal scenario looks something like this:

Requesting start-up/pushback until completion = 5-7 mins
Taxi to holding point 13R or 31L = 5-7 mins

If you're not ready when reaching the holding point only adds on... Or taxiing behind BA at night :}

Rule of thumb from an ATC point of view : 12 mins from pushing back to reaching the holding point, during normal conditions. I agree, you probably need to add another 10-12 mins to the NEW runway though.

I timed an inbound EY A332 landing 31R from touchdown until parking on stand 112 = 12 mins (no conflicts really).

Time is money I know, but I've seen a few taxiing with very high taxi speed, which could might be a concern to focus on. Seen a DH8B on TWY E doing something like 80-100 kms! I'm not sure what the maximum taxi-speed is for different types etc. but that just seem to be unsafe. Did I shout at the pilot? No, just told him to contact radar when airborne :E

[fractional]

Seen a DH8B on TWY E doing something like 80-100 kms!The guy thought he (she?) was on the Shk Zayed Hwy. It would be interesting to name the TWYs with some names to keep us is sync with the what's happening on the roads.

[Gulfstreamaviator]

Put speed cams on the TW, then just see the skid marks.......


or perhaps a SALIK gate.


I prefer to use Abu Dhabi South.

or is it 13S/31S

glf