Cadet Pilot Program of Emirates

[Speedy Gonsalez]

Emirates has yet a Cadet Pilot Program for UAE citizens, but not for foreigners. Does someone know if/when this will change? It´s clear that they need foreigners and so it should be the best way to open this program also to foreigners, isn´t it?

And if you make this program (in case you are UAE citizen) you will fly for about 1 year abroad. For another airline, and if so please tell me which, or as a training of Emirates.

Many thanks in advance!

[.Aero]

EK sponsored cadets are sent to Flight Training Adelaide (http://www.flighttrainingadelaide.com/), Australia. Six months ago, Emirates agreed to extend their partnership with FTA to train their cadets well into 2009.

Once they've completed their ab-intio training abroad, they start their Type Rating with the Emirates/CAE TRTO back in Dubai.

Good bunch of people @ FTA. Give them a call and ask them about EK cadet opportunities for non-UAE nationals. You can always get in touch with EK but I doubt you'll get a response.

[Wizofoz]

It´s clear that they need foreigners and so it should be the best way to open this program also to foreigners, isn´t it?



EK need foreign PILOTS, of which they have applications from thousands who make the minimum experience (4000hrs TT, 2000hrs Jet). They don't NEED to pay to train Cadets of any nationality, but choose to give cadet-ships to suitable UAE nationals.

Sorry, but there hasn't been any prospect of non-emiraties getting cadet-ships in the past, and there is much less so given the current climate.

[Payscale]

Agree with Wizofoz. Dont get your hopes up.
Etihad has a cadet program for foreigners. Better use your
energy there.

Good Luck

Payscale

[sispanys ria]

Wizofoz it would more true to say that some lucky foreign EK captains' kids have been sent for Emirates cadet training. Good for them.

[dubble_dubble]

that --- is called 'wasta'

:rolleyes:

[baob2oba]

Training lasts for 18 months between UAE and Australia, Flight Dispatch sometimes welcomes those who couldn't achieve the program.

Yeah wasta system is a reality here, but much less than in Abu Dhabi.
A look at the Internal Vacancies on the intranet now clearly shows that more and more opportunities are tailored for UAE nationals only. It took time but the Gov is now well determined to empower emiratization.
I wouldn't bet on the EK cadet program unless you're damnly well connected.

[Payscale]

Name me ONE foreign cadet? GCC maybe?

[Speedy Gonsalez]

But they will need thousands of new pilots to hire within the next years, so that it could be usefull for them to train also foreigners?

I mean it´s nearly impossible to receive enough captains/first officers from other airlines to fly their planes if they will gtrow like expected. And according to rumors it´s even today difficult - but I don´t know if I can trust that.

[Wizofoz]

Sorry, Speedy, you can think as wishfully as you want, but even during the hight of the pilot shortage, it meant it was a little difficult to get enough guys with 4000hrs total and 2000hrs jet.

If worst came to worst they might have to take guys who only have thousands of hours on turbo props, though at the moment we have plenty of experienced (but recently unemployed) jet Captains training as FOs.

There are very few major airlines around the world who take ab-initio cadets, and most that do charge for the privilege (And even THEN usually only to people who are nationals or residents of the companies home country!!).

I wouldn't be holding my breath waiting for EK to hand out cadet ships to non-nationals.

[sispanys ria]

Of course I won't name the non GCC cadet that I know...
Anyway I suppose there are not so many lucky foreign pilots' kids in cadet program so what's the point ?

[EGGW]

No you Won't Sisp, or you will be banned, permanently!

No naming allowed.

EGGW

[alufthansa]

Where did u get this " wasta" Term from? You must be egyptian ! :ok:

[SilveR5]

The other day I was talking to a couple of expat FO,s...they have been speaking in decent manner while sharing some stories about work and news of airliners..and while we were discussing the plans for local cadets programs, all of a sudden, tough crosswind has totally changed course!

I don't understand why some people get pissed off when they hear the word "nationalization"! it's like stepping on their fingers with a heel of steel!!

If you hate it, unfortunately you don't really have anything to do about it ..except if you wanna leave it all for good! even this option, not many who will dare it..because those folks inherently want it all until the very last drop of it!

Cheers

[.Aero]

I don't understand why some people get pissed off when they hear the word "nationalization"

Because discrimination is a by-product of nationalization. You cant discuss nationalization without going into local politics, which, as you know isn't something you can freely debate living in a sandbox. Airlines are naturally resistant to nationalization legislation when it is forced down their throats by government.

[skytrax]

EK was short of pilots 18-12 months ago. They were thinking about opening the cadet program for foreigners but things changed. A lot of pilots came from US and South America, as you know the industry is not doing very well there. They have enough now, especially on the B777 fleet.
So, no chance in the near future.

[SilveR5]

discrimination is a by-product of nationalization


Aero..I respectfully disagree with you mate..because when the country is offering a privilege for citizens, this is not discrimination...it's just what is expected. And remember that we are talking specifically about creating jobs for some "national carriers" in the region.

Another argument would go like this...a newly licensed pilot with an average of 220 flying hours and most likely still non type-rated...what are his chances to work for an airline like Emirates or Gulf Air unless he is a citizen?? who would ever grant him a decent chance to join in as soon as he gets the license? and what are his chances in general to get a job with a respectful airline? how soon he can expect that to happen?

the fact of the matter is that many examples in many regions in the world are there & can support this concept with regard to cadets programs...isn't it a logical approach to invest in suitable candidates and qualify local cadets for a national airliner career?

It happens once in a decade, or maybe lesser ratio, to witness a company like Etihad launching the evenful global cadets program (even this thing is happening due to certain circumstances where there are no many local candidates that can supply the high demand at both Etihad+Emirates!! nevertheless, positioning themselves as the multi-national/multi-cultural company that is seeking higher ranking)..

anyway those who can join any cadet program are really lucky...and I sincerely wish that you can be one of those

[flyingdyson]

Dear Payscale & Others,

I just read you mentioning that there is a Cadet program for Etihad for non UAE nationals. Would you be able to tell me where you found that information as I can not find it anywhere on their website apart from their own national UAE cadet program.
If this program is still active I would very much be interested in applying.
Or would you (or anyone else on this site) know about any other cadet programs which are open to foreigners? (My nationality is Dutch by the way.)

Hope to hear from you soon.
Many thanks.

[nicky7789]

If I have a CPL, can i apply for direct entry as a first officer? Or do you need to train again to get ATPL?

[Chandler Bing]

You must be kidding right ??
Go and check the entry requirements on their career website.

[snaproll3480]

Aero..I respectfully disagree with you mate..because when the country is offering a privilege for citizens, this is not discrimination...it's just what is expected.Actually that is exactly what discrimination means. Let me quote the definition for you.

dis⋅crim⋅i⋅na⋅tion
1. an act or instance of discriminating.
2. treatment or consideration of, or making a distinction in favor of or against, a person or thing based on the group, class, or category to which that person or thing belongs rather than on individual merit:

The very act of giving citizens rights or distinction based solely on their status rather than individual merit is precisely the definition of discrimination. It is part of the way of life in the middle east and has been for a long long time. Here is another definition for you:

Wasta (Arabic: وَسْطة) is an Arabic expression that loosely translates into ‘who you know’ or 'clout'. It refers to using one’s influence or connections to get things done, such as quick renewal of a passport, waiving of traffic fines, and even garnering prestigious jobs. Wasta is deeply ingrained in Middle East culture, having been the de facto way of getting things done for decades.

You simply can't deny the facts. It is all known and understood to be the way things are here and those of who are visiting understand this and live with it, just don't try to sugar coat it. I personally don't have a problem with it but it is what it is.

[SOPS]

I have a CPL..can I get a direct entry FO position??? Lord..give me strength!!!

People..please listen...pleeeasseeeee......

I flew with an FO last week..with over 4000 hours on 747s..and he is at least 3 years away from his upgrade because of the new upgrade rules..as for intake policy..please read the web site.

Although some want to believe differently..we do not sit here and make this stuff up..these are facts!!!:ugh:

[mach10]

Just for the record - there have never been any lucky EXPAT EK captains kids getting onto the program - it is however possible to PAY as a PRIVATE student to attend the course given in Dubai and at FTA - that does NOT mean they are an EK Cadet entitled to a F/O position within EK after completing the program!!

[trimotor]

It must be rumour season...one of the latest rumours to hit the streets is that EK Cadets will spend 2 years at Fly Dubai...personally, I see thata s a step in the right direction..

TM

[YYZguy]

Agreed. It would be a step in the right direction. These kids need sectors under their belts, not sitting in cruise for 8 hours at a time.

[Sheikh Your Bootie]

Did anyone hear the recent story about the 6 or so Cadets down in Adelaide caught hacking in to the CASA website and downloading their exams. AAR brought the whole course back and bollocked them ( or similar) and sacked the 6 or so guilty cheaters. No wonder some students struggle on the line training :=:
Also been a tidy up outside the old training building of all the students cars, whoops....

SyB :zzz:

[nicky7789]

Is there any ATPL (Airline Transport Pilot License) course/training in Dubai? I was thinking to have my ATPL course done there cuz in Perth, they only train pilots up to CPL level.

And one more thing, even if Dubai has ATPL course/training, where is it held? do they accept foreigners? and even if I pass my ATPL, will I become a second officer of flying emirates or first officer?

[trimotor]

Emirates Cadet programme for locals only. If you find somewhere to train in DXB (unlikely), you will still need 4000, plus all the other ticks on boxes to join Emirates.

No second Officers in EK.

[nicky7789]

one last thing, if i have a CPL with a total of 200+ flying hours and done my ATPL , and i wanna work for emirates, what do i do? go for a direct entry or what?

[fjordviking]

You windup artist. You had quite a few going for a while. Now go back to your homework and later mum can tuck you into bed.

Fjordviking

[CAVnotOK]

Yep, but not Direct Entry Capt, or F/O, but Cabin Crew FG1.
This is your way of fast tracking to fly an EK Heavy.

If I were you I would be applying now!

[nolimitholdem]

Did anyone hear the recent story about the 6 or so Cadets down in Adelaide caught hacking in to the CASA website and downloading their exams. AAR brought the whole course back and bollocked them ( or similar) and sacked the 6 or so guilty cheaters. No wonder some students struggle on the line training :
Also been a tidy up outside the old training building of all the students cars, whoops....

All correct.

I simply can't imagine where a bunch of young Emiratis would pick up such attitudes of smug, arrogant self-entitlement...I mean really, where does this come from?!? :}

It made me laugh out loud though...you offer a bunch of spoiled brats free training and jobs on widebodies that most people spend their career working hard towards...and they STILL screw it up. Amazing. Great culture.

[disconnected]

As I am often training EK cadets, I think I should offer a word in their defence.

Yes they are lucky their country gives them this golden opportunity. I wish my country had done so. However the cadests are not responsible for the cadet program, they have only taken advantage of this offer. Who wouldn't?

Yes they are young and occasionally irresponsible. But if any of you lot were not similarly so at the same age, I suggest you are delusional.

While occasionally I meet one with a bit of an attitude problem, I find this is soon corrected by the EK training establishment. They do not get a lot of slack in this area and are quickly brought to size.

For the most part the cadets are humble, courteous and try very hard. The demands placed on them are not easy. If anyone thinks it is a walk in the park then I suggest they actually find out about the cadet program - from start to qualified FO.

Inexperienced? Definitely. They miss a lot not going through the usual channels. They know this, and often express the wish to have had the chance to do other forms of aviation before being committed to simulators and wide-bodies.

There is not a pilot I know who hasnt at one stage or another been arrogant and not know what he did not know. Some are dead because of it.

It is encumbent of every other EK pilot who comes in contact with the cadets before or after training to instill the values that we all claim to aspire to. To draw divisions and opinions at the outset, is discriminatory and does nothing to promote a professional aviation culture in future generations.

[Wizofoz]

40&80,

I think the award for most incoherent, unitelligable and completely off topic post in the history of every, MAY have a new contender.....

Disco,

Agreed,

The ratio of sub-standard, bad attitude Cadets is certainly no higher than in the rest of the pilot body, and probably less.

Some really good guys amongst tham, and they tend to end up as above average candidates come command time.

[trimotor]

..and they still can't land without drift in a mild crosswind..

[trimotor]

'They'd soon nail it'.

Possibly, though the bigger concern I have when I see cadets or FO's who have been cadets, and many FO's from all over the place for that matter, is that they often don't actually appreciate the drift they have when the drift angle is relatively small, hence they do nothing about it.

A nice big stiff crosswind gets more notice.

[speed168]

Hi all

Does anyone know how to apply for the Emirates cadet pilot programe?

Do you still have to be from the UAE to apply.

Thanks

Speed.

[Wizofoz]

Do you still have to be from the UAE to apply.


Yes. It is even called the "National Aviation Cadet Program".

There is no real prospect of it being open to non Emiratis.