QR late rosters [Archive]

QTRminator

25th Sep 2008, 19:17

So now its Thursday-evening the 25th of sep and still no roster for oct. Nothing tomorrow or sat because its the weekend, so earliest sun the 28th.
They sure know how to build a positive opinion of the new rostering-system...
This is crappy! :*
Oh, I forgot we have to be patient since its new, right?

Lulu qatar

25th Sep 2008, 19:54

Roster is not out !
A330 Mr . R. P is out of game .
A320 Mr Mohamed is in the sky .
777 D.P is under pressure from Khartum beauty .

Only god can help us with roster !

skya320

25th Sep 2008, 20:06

I don't know about other fleets, but it's NORMAL for 320. Our roster always come out at the last min. :ugh: (Thanks to Mr. MHD):yuk:

P.Clostermann

26th Sep 2008, 11:40

Who needs a published roster anyway, if they change it continously after the second day of the month!

:sad:

Ronaldo 330

26th Sep 2008, 11:48

A 320 roster is done by Mr. Mohamed who got promoted due to good performance on A320 roster . While A330 guy was offered termination instead .

Which roster is better A330 or A320 am not sure if we are in same airline with Mr Peter chief of rostering or he is so smart . Lets see new roster .
:D

loc22550

26th Sep 2008, 16:18

The best roster(most stable) must be the 340..
With only a couple of aircraft and 3 destinations(LHR-CDG-HKG)to deal with, our professional roster team is still able to control the situation for this fleet!
:hmm:

Qatari515

26th Sep 2008, 17:04

Now I am flabbergasted....

So R.P. was fired and Mhd can stay????

I thought the guys on A330 where more or less happy with their rosters while all A320 pilots are complaining?

Or does it have something to do with the allegged bribes being offered in return for a nice and gentile roster?

Lulu qatar

26th Sep 2008, 21:45

A320 :
CEO if you read this: terminate that INCOMPETENT idiot who make you lose over 60 pilots from one small fleet in less than half year .
If a Capt make mistake and do not comply with OM part ( A ) he gets warning letter and its in his file . IF ROSTER IS ISSUED ON 29th will you do the same to people responsible for ROSTER as part ( A ) say it should be out by 22nd .
We want to see termination in that department as well .
Start with A320 guy follow by there mananger who just continue bad job as his ex boss C.Cary .
Rostering is mess just mess and no one manage to fix it till now .

oryxbollocks

27th Sep 2008, 06:43

It is said that in his previous company the pilots AND management, were happy to see the back of our new rostering manager. Now we have him trying to introduce a low-cost carrier rostering system into QR as his big contribution to coming here.
Wow! What with WW introducing low-cost carrier 3 star hotel accommodation down route our CEO has no need to start such an operation. He already has one!
Lulu is correct. These fools should be fired but unfortunately they know how to cover themselves. Ask yourselves why is RP in the office 24 hours when he only has 3 more days to go before his termination from that office?
They want him to solve the problems they have caused or take the responsibility for the mess!
GB

P.Clostermann

27th Sep 2008, 13:26

Spot on!

Didnt the new rostering manager come from Virgin Blue in OZ?

5 star airline is quickly degrading to a sub-low cost carrier kind of ops!

Minimum rest, low quality HOTAC, super crew efficiency, bare-minimum fuel planning,....

And dont think its only flight deck, the cabin crew is litterally being worked to death these days! Surely this must be reflected in the quality of treatment our passengers are getting these days!

Same for maintenance and engineering!

So there we have it, the three groups of people on the frontline are being pushed to the limits. Swiss cheese with holes anyone?

I just met a crew on A320 who did this new DOH-BAH-DOH-TRV-22hrs rest-DOH-BAH-DOH thing!
If this is the way they want to push us in the future, I am afraid that will be the end of it!
Maybe this new rostering manager should come and fly with us for a week or two. He is welcome on my flightdeck, all he has to do is stay awake and read a newspaper. Lets see how he feels after a rotation like that!

Many years ago they pushed us into doing TRV turnaround flights, leaving at 2330 in Doha and back 11AM next day. We massively started filing ASRs on this flight, after which they changed it to a layover!

I would STRONGLY suggest these practices to be started again when needed!

Bonne chance!

A320 Man

27th Sep 2008, 16:38

The 320 crew is practicing the new low cost operations: DOH-BAH-DOH-TRV-22hrs rest then TRV-DOH-BAH-DOH.

Wait till the new low cost carriers roster is implemented, I guess we will suffer, but I think the next period is a "testing" period for all of us, if things go that bad, i.e. no fleet transfers, bad rosters, max work/min rest cycles….then it is time do go somewhere where you do the same job for the same money, but with better days off offer. E.g. commuting contract of 6 weeks on/ 2 weeks off.

As you said earlier guys: we are going to watch interesting times in the flight operations.

loc22550

27th Sep 2008, 17:13

Low cost operation..??:=

-If the roster continues like that, i will rather go and fly a low cost carrier in europe: 5 days on-4 days off, and in my bed everynight,not seating on board of the A/C.

-Qatar airways 320 roster:
7 days on-1 day off-4 days on-2 days off and so 7 days on...(the minimum legal days off)
A lot of night flight with minimum rest.(worse than low cost operation!)

I'm agree some people seating in the office should be offer such a roster for a while..and than we will check their reaction.....!

Even some of our "freshly" upgraded Cpt are resigning...

MigratoryBird

27th Sep 2008, 22:09

Max Flight/Min Rest: this is the trend everywhere in the world. I have friends flying in Asia, and they max out every month and every year. They eat, sleep, fly, sh.t, eat, sleep, fly... :yuk:

I guess that the good times are over. I will find a nice job as a garbage man, and watch as the aircraft crash around me...

loc22550

28th Sep 2008, 08:53

October roster definitly not better than the september one!(at least for 320)
Jeppesen one..??! i doubt!!Otherwise where are the Promise made to the pilots for a better roster??(like avoiding coming back in a morning from a night flight and fly again at night the same day with minimum rest!!), it's getting worse and worse!
Ooh i see,i'm so naive, i forgot that in Qatar airways the favorite job of the management is to agitate the carrot in front of the pilot's nose!!

Mr Ho

28th Sep 2008, 10:44

My Rooster very good. 2 bottle john walker. King robert no good now :8

loc22550

28th Sep 2008, 11:13

...Anybody knowns when the liquor shop re-open in doha...?:}

tcas II

28th Sep 2008, 12:14

LOC22550
it too late for Oct roster, maybe on Nov.:ok:

Mr Angry from Purley

28th Sep 2008, 17:39

oryx
Might be the other way around, Carmen is high cost and auto rosters.
AIMS is also high cost, but has difficulty auto rostering, most airlines don't use it to autoroster. A (state) Airline such as Qatar with it's size needs to autoroster with as little human input as possible.
Easyjet tried to tag Carmen into AIMS a few years ago and had disasterous results. They bought it in too quickly, didnt understand it's complexities etc. You need serious top end Crewing folk with good understanding of optimisation etc. Sorry to say this but it won't happen overnight, but, subject to crew numbers, the correct decision has been made.:\

Doha_Airbus

30th Sep 2008, 12:55

Well my roster is not what I was hoping for, but I been through this before and changing roster systems is never smooth. Wait a few months. The new system is good but needs lots of tuning and smart roster staff to do it. I got 2 days off out of base, but I still got 9 days off in base too.

It is the staff that make the system settings to produce the Carmen roster. Do you really think we will get a good result from rostering staff that don't want the new system and will do anything to make it fail? The corruption and money-making cannot continue for them if this system is a success! I'm sure they will do anything they can to harm progress.

Speak to Roster Manager about what he is trying to do and you will see he is pulling hairs out battling his own staff and trying to do it alone. I am still positive but only for reasonable time. Progress and change is always slow here!

I think all rostering staff lost their jobs except B777 and A340. The A320 and A330 were problems (except for those who had a deal with them). Breaking up the mafia is not easy but these people are being moved to other areas and waiting on new people with experience to start. Maybe time to balance the nationality swing away from India?

Get out the whole department and replace them I say! Let the new manager have freedom to find new peoples.

ramiyns

1st Oct 2008, 17:55

My Oct roster is good infact very good.
I got my requested flights and off days and a fair hours.
I hope this will continue.

Any one care to clarify the message from rostering regarding the standby,
They say every standby is going to be useable.I do'nt know how will that happen?

Happy flying

NoJoke

1st Oct 2008, 18:07

One of the things that never ceases to amase me is; How do these people justify not paying ANYTHING for deadheading. It is the norm in a lot of Companies to pay 50% flight pay and take into account duty time. (I appreciate DH before and after etc) We have to sit in uniform, representing the Company, doing a essential part of the operation i.e. if we don't go, the A/C will not come back! Yet we get paid the square root of zero.:ugh: Next time you get rostered for DH, go sick. Give them the message. It seems to be worse for the longhaul guys, FOs especially. Yet another rip off. Good old WW and no payrise. What an ar*e.

loc22550

2nd Oct 2008, 02:38

-D.H= UNPAID duty for Qatar airways.(it's well known that we are travelling for fun...)
-Standby duty= UNPAID duty for qatar airways (used to be paid before)
-Ground time duty; Excpecially on 320 =
UNPAID duty for qatar airways.(no special 320 allowance any more as before).
Here you got paid for what you perform, no less and definitly ..no more!

Ramiyns;good for you that you have a nice roster.

It's not the case for everybody(excpecially on 320), in the mean time and in the benefit of the company,shall i strongly recommend the roster team to undergo a full human factor/performance course before a serious incident happens related to crew's fatigue and sleep deprivation...

A330 man

2nd Oct 2008, 09:11

loc22550

The way this airline thinks about crew payments is unique, I suppose they believe that every penny paid is a penny lost!!

That is why companies like EK make profit, since they pay well for the crew (profit sharing, provident fund, STBY duty…etc.) in the other hand they save millions by avoiding the high turn over of the pilots.

A question: How many pilots resigned from EY or EK to join QA ?? I think none.
On the other hand, how many left QA to join EY, AA, EK ???

That is what I call: lost money from QA.

Some clever guy told me if they pay us any decent fringe benefits, they will not be able to pay W.W. and I.M. their QR 137.000 and QR 90.000
Maybe that will let you understand why W.W cancelled any expected salary raise.

A320 Man

2nd Oct 2008, 17:47

It's not the case for everybody(excpecially on 320), in the mean time and in the benefit of the company,shall i strongly recommend the roster team to undergo a full human factor/performance course before a serious incident happens related to crew's fatigue and sleep deprivation...

May I add: irregular sleeping pattern?

Check the words of the NSTB:

Was the crew legal to fly? Unfortunately yes, but doing so proved to be nearly fatal. The NTSB accident report states, "Probable Cause: The impaired judgment, decision-making, and flying abilities of the captain and flightcrew due to the affects of fatigue."

I hope we will not reach that level of danger because of the rostering "Legal" max. duty time/min. rest pattern.

The world is talking about this problem are we listening?

Check the links below regarding pilots fatigue:

Pilot Fatigue, Accidents and Airline Safety (http://airlinesafety.com/editorials/PilotFatigue.htm)

ALPA News Release (http://www.alpa.org/DesktopModules/ALPA_Documents/ALPA_DocumentsView.aspx?itemid=13655&ModuleId=12567&Tabid=73)

PILOT FATIGUE (http://cf.alpa.org/internet/projects/ftdt/alpmag/augrest.html)

Pilot Fatigue Spurs Calls for New Safeguards - WSJ.com (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122117729872125851.html?mod=yahoo_hs&ru=yahoo)

tcas II

4th Oct 2008, 04:39

what is W W and I M?

AirbusMaster

4th Oct 2008, 20:20

Capt. W.W. or sometimes called B.W. and Capt.I.M. are managers in my airline.

Mr Ho

6th Oct 2008, 10:55

NoJoke, wen deadhead no drinking wit mouth allow, is rule. Drinking only wit eye on fat girl bum at trolly. This your deadhed pay :8

Haywood

6th Oct 2008, 11:25

I have heard there are new managers around - but they never introduced to the people - I wonder why this is. We see the results of those managers - and again I wonder who selected them.

Rumour goes that the CEO wants to reflect his airline - he has VW Polo engines installed in his BMW - outside 5 Star - inside Junkyard.

It's not the system that creates problems - it's the incompetent people tinckering with the system.

But be patient - what goes around comes around