Is Eagle really the first step?

[acectc]

I have almost finished my training at CTC and I've heard its pretty easy to get into Eagle from CTC. Im pretty sure I'm earmarked for direct entry soon as a few of my mates have been through with 300 hours and ive almost got 400, they say it is a breeze. Im thinking about Mt Cook because I like the fact you dont have to stand outside in the rain.

Any ideas???

[The Hill]

I'll bite....

Dont like to stand in the rain hey..........maybe you need to get out more...and i'd say eagle is anything but easy.....

[pylet]

Most people consider career progression, company standards/reputation, T&C's, lifestyle, aircraft, route network etc.

Not this clown, he worries about the weather!

This is either a wind-up, or this guy needs to wake-up. Feel sorry for the Captains this guy has to share a small cockpit with.....

[empacher48]

Hmmm kinda explains why my phone hasn't rung from Eagle recruiting for an interview..

I guess they don't want anyone with 1500 hours TT and 200 PIC Multi Turbine.

I suppose guys with less time can be paid less too..

[The Hill]

empacher48....your've got some good experience, recruiting has slowed down a bit now but may well pick up in the new year

[custardchucker]

thats right empacher........you've got too much now it seems... all ya need is a bit of time in the CTC Kingair sim and a CPL and Eagle will schnap ya right up. you also need to be about 17 years old as well to fit the bill??? sorry fella

[1279shp]

There aint nothing wrong with standing in the rain!:p

Nor is there with 1279shp a side!:cool:

[Deep fried dumpling]

acectc.....with your miniscule experience I have just the job for you - sweeping my hangar floor and cleaning the dog **** off my boots.

Mate, with your attitude I think you'll be waiting a long time for the phone to ring.:rolleyes:

GET REAL MAN!:ugh:

[framer]

Don't worry acectc, they give you a good coat. You will definately get an interview with those hours and CTC training. I know people in Eagle and your mates that have gone ahead of you are nailing. They are making the guys that have been there 18months look bad and those guys had SPIFR time before joining. Not sure why, just better training I guess and their minds aren't cluttered up with all that guff they picked up in GA.
When you get there keep an eye on the captains though, most of them haven't had as much CRM training etc as you so they sometimes lose situational awareness when doing complicated approaches etc. When that happens just say "I have control" and fix it up. It's best for everyone.
Cheers.

[The Hill]

thats the best laugh ive had in a long time....priceless framer

[acectc]

thanks guys - yea I think I WILL BE OK THE TRAINING IS REALLY intense and I think I have been set up well for eagle. I heard one of the guys had to correct an eagle captain for excessive bank angle not long ago, must have been scarey.

ace

[FRQ Charlie Bravo]

Gee aviation has got to be the worlds most powerful w@nker magnet. http://www.thepetsforums.com/forums/images/smilies/smiliesII/lamer.gif

~FRQ CB

[Slater]

I heard the cocky little maggot with his 300hrs corrected the Eagle Training Captain for 'bank angle' on a visual approach into AA when the plane hit 25 degrees, while the said maggot was seated in 1F on a famil flight!

[mattyj]

my my how things have changed at Eagle. New Checklists and SOPs, inexperienced recruits, training in the SIM, pay rises..they mustve nailed WTs door closed and cut off his phone;)

[Oktas8]

Three sorts of people here. The ones doing the winding, the ones being wound, the ones laughing.

Framer - best post I've read in a while!

[propaganda]

Excellent wind up boyz - keep in coming. I hear the UK job market has slowed so much the UK CTC cadets will be joining Air NZ as S/O .:E

[Wyle E Coyote]

you're right, you can tell it's a wind up, because with 400 hours you'd be silly not to try for Mt Cook

[Steve Zissou]

:DAcectc - I'm kind of smelling a windup but with your undoubted skills I wouldn't settle at anything less than NASA (I did the ground course but turned them down - wasn't interested in the overnights and I thought a Vref of 400 knots was a bit of a yawn to be honest).

"Your ego's writing cheques your body can't cash. You're dangerous Iceman..."

[TinDriver]

Steve, for the 2nd time in as many days, it IS you I can smell:8

Best thread laugh I've had for a while....Onya Ace:ok:

[50cent]

na bo,why do you wana go and fly props anyway cuzz, with your expereience and skills props are not good enough bro, ring up air nz or qantas and see if they let you touch their rides?

eagle is kind enough to give GUYS LIKE YOURSELF an opportunity to fly a good machine, and now you come here with your f :mad:ked up attitude and say is eagle really the first step?how dear you!:=

[FRQ Charlie Bravo]

I've been had? By a Kiwi? That's it, I'm going home and I'm taking my ball with me.

:suspect: FRQ CB

[headwires]

whoaaa dudes, steady on aye fellas, I hear that the 2 hundy hour pilots are da bomb bro, they got da mean as silky skills man, its so choice dat u dont have to go thru 2 years of GA flying iced up bricks in da middle of da nite to score a flying gig anymore. That GA stuff dont teach you nothing man. All ya need for Eagle is to practice on a flight sim and know how to say "bank angle" every now and then :yuk: I hear those experienced captains and even air force guys dont have the S.A. and hands that these new fellas have got. These guys gonna fly through and deservedly so. They got da right stuff and da right attitu.. attitu.. attitu... bank angle! :E

[Split Flap]

Remember to bowl that ball underarm.... :p

[Propstop]

acectc, I remember back many years ago when I looked after the maintenance for Eagle at Auckland before the 1900D days, we had the odd pud puller like you.
One of my colleagues put a cocky young f/o straight one day and he complained to me asking what does X know about flying. He shut up when I told him X had more hours and experience than he had and in worse conditions than he could dream of. Do not try and show your superiority to an engineer either, most of us are experienced pilots too!
Generally the know alls were sorted out very quickly by the other pilots who were 100% professional and top people as well. They were good days in the 90s!

[haughtney1]

Do not try and show your superiority to an engineer either, most of us are experienced pilots too!

Ha! thats the funniest thing I've heard in ages! a spanner monkey thats been sniffing a bit too much skydrol. Stay away from the flying talk spanner monkey..you might do yourself an injury :}
Engineers in general are smelly, opinionated, and mostly wrong. How many on here have witnessed the line spanner monkey scratch his arse at a snagged item..then mutter that well worn phrase "well I dunno whats wrong with it...its probably f****ed"

:}

[Propstop]

My oh my haughty one, we do have a chip on our shoulder. It is said one can train a monkey to ride a bike but he can never fix a flat tyre so obviously that is you.
I have been in aviation possibly double the time you have been on this earth as I assume you are still pubescent and shaving only once a month to get rid of the unsightly bumfluff ,or maybe I am thinking about the other face.
Sadly it is people like you who do the rest of the very professional pilots a major disservice, as where I work we have the utmost respect for each other in the somewhat trying conditions where I work.
Please haughty, please. crawl back under the rock from where you came from and please listen to what your parents try and tell you as you may grow up one day.

[haughtney1]

Please haughty, please. crawl back under the rock from where you came from and please listen to what your parents try and tell you as you may grow up one day

Thanks for the advice Propstop :D

I didn't even have to put bait on the hook :p

I should probably add that my input to this thread is in keeping with the rubbish it was started with.

Propstop, my most humble apologies....(most engineers both at home base and outstations are top draw)..just like pilots there is the odd feckwit, most also can spot a wind up and have sense of humour about it.

[Propstop]

Haughtney 1 Apologies accepted. Just had a bad day at work and only a week to go before the end of my rotation and I can then come back home for 5 weeks to normality and a decent glass of red.

[ops.normal]

a shame acectc can't look forward to the same...what with the drinking age these days...:rolleyes:

[DeltaT]

Had a chuckle to myself on Saturday, when I was at the Auckland Careers Expo, and overheard 2 pilots manning the CTC stand telling a interested young guy the salary for Eagle was 70k :}

[cjam]

That is quite funny. Do you think that they were telling tales or that someone has told them lies? My understanding is that if you hold a command there you might be getting close to that by including allowences etc. The problem with that idea is that CTC chaps wouldn't be able to get a command because they don't have the pic for an ATPL.

[kiwi22]

It's a wind up, 400 hours is too much experience for someone leaving CTC course.

[Chips]

wow ACECTC you havent been talking to the same 200hr guys that i have! they said its fun but by far the hardest thing they've ever done...so with an attitude like that it sounds like you'll be going nowhere fast.

p.s this must be a wind up right?

[captncannot]

That is quite funny. Do you think that they were telling tales or that someone has told them lies? My understanding is that if you hold a command there you might be getting close to that by including allowences etc. The problem with that idea is that CTC chaps wouldn't be able to get a command because they don't have the pic for an ATPL.

No worries there cjam, the PIC requirement is 150 hours, no way around that unfortunately (ICAO requirement is 100). So if they've done a bit above the CPL minimums (eg C cat or whatever) they'll be fine. But because of the silly 50% rule they will need 4 years on the line to get the ATPL. Flight school to part 125 command in 4 years isn't bad for NZ!

[XRNZAF]

Any news on how those first few CTC guys went on line training? I can think of at least 2 C&T captains there who would be wondering what the hell the world has come to when they're getting 200hour pilots being handed jobs they needed more like 4000 hours to get their interview in the late 80's..... Is it just me or does it seem like the industry is in dumbing-down mode? Everything is about reaching the bare minimum standard of skills knowledge and experience and moving on.... :(

[always inverted]

Ha ha, was wondering when someone would ask or post that. Seems that those cocky little P@#cks, well at least one of them, FAILED Bwaahahaha, maybe they said bank angle on their checks. No, it's a shame when people miss their checks but I think that is what most were thinking, going by some of the comments I have heard.
At least that delays me having to fly with them. Maybe, no, hopefully they will pull their head from thy arse and eat some humble pie if they are still around in a months time.

To true, the captains that they fly with WILL put them in their place but will probably get told off after he little "kids" run to the boss with tears running down their face and a wet patch on their pants.:{ This is after the captain had to take control cause they stuffed up an ils with max x-wind. Couldn't teach it that real in the sim eh boys??

Funny that they call the captain on b.a. and then brag about it, shows that they know nothing, thats what sops are for, and thats why there are 2 pilots in the seat. The one into Auckland was the second time it was said, that was a test because they could not believe that they said it and wanted to see if he would do it again...
Not being part of the operating crew and all, I think I would have shut the doors or turned the little :mad: off. :ugh:

Just goes to show the value of some life skills and reading situations.:hmm:

[DeltaT]

Ever thought it could be a trial run of things to come, aka the Air NZ cadets that may well come from CTC in the future (if they get the contract)

[TeHoroto]

Christ you guys make flying sound difficult, for crying out loud it is not rocket science. Any skipper worth their salt will realise that an FO is there to learn and that you are their mentor, what in Gods name do you think they are going to learn with your aggressive attitudes. You should be endeavouring to pass on as much as you can as it won't be long until these 'upstarts' are commanding aircraft that members of your family may be paxing in.
Find some maturity pills or get out!!

[always inverted]

When they get commands I want to be far away. Also, you cant teach someone who knows all there is to know... Not refering to the ctc guys now.
You are right, flying is not hard, monkeys can do it, so why then do they fail. Could it be that people who mouth off about it dont realise the standard that the c and t have, but they must be lacking in something to fail an "easy" flight test:oh:

Maybe they are not ready for it at 200 hrs. My guess is that the 200 hr guys that go fly for easyjet etc loose that chip on the shoulder as soon as they pass thrugh nz customs. From the comments passed round the crew room, these 2 think that it's piss easy to do what we do and will shortly learn that it is not as easy as they may think.

If someone wants to learn I will teach them all I can but there are those here that think that they are just passing time till there command comes up. Little do they know that they are FAR from ready.

[Chips]

always inverted....... you sound a little intimidated if not alot, you afraid these ctc cadets gonna show you up, i mean it must be difficult to fly the ils with max crosswind whilst monitoring your little pprune comments, shot

[pyote]

I would rather fly a 1900 based in Mogadishu, getting shot at by the locals. I would probably have more chance of getting "chopped" for my command interview at eagle than get chopped by a local...

[waren9]

For someone with a shiny new CPL, you seem to have some fairly strong opinions already.

If I were you, Id listen to what people like Always Inverted and others have to say. He sounds like a trainer whos seen a few things. He might actually be on the interview panel by the time you want one. Suck it up buddy and when you've done a year or two as some ones F/O have a re-read of your posts and see if you still think that way.

The flying at Eagle isnt easy, especially in winter, and the thought of some of these jumped up cadet school students with thier shiny new shirts and platinum eppaulettes with little real GA time I suggest, would make most of the Eagle trainers shudder.

[always inverted]

Chips, you are an idiot and it that type of ignorance that I am thalking abot.

Um no, I am not worried about the ctc guys showing me up, I fly just fine and safe, thats not just from me either.
I agree with warren9, stop posting for a minute and think about your posts, and if you have the ability to see that you look like little kid spouting opinions that they have heard said by others that also know nothing.

If you get off your soap box and actually listen to the others that you will fly with at eagle then you will learn ALOT.

Back to being shown up by ctc. Everyone has bad days... it will be on that day that I will expect my f/o to do his job, not take the piss and laugh. It comes down to being professional and recognising that whoever may be not quite on their game. It's something that you cant be taught at ctc in a module. :=

Remember that the captain is ultimately in charge of the a/c and the f/o is there to assist the captain by doing those duties that they are required of them as a part of the crew. It's a raw definition but that is how it used to be, not so now with the introduction of multi crew ops and crm, but under all the smoke and mirrors that is still the basic concept.
You are not proving anything by telling the captain that you could have done it better except making your life more difficult, think bout that comment for a second and see if you can understand what I mean.;)

[waren9]

Hey Pyote

Why the sudden change of heart? I thought you were chasing an interview a few months ago? You make it sound like you've already been "chopped" by Eagle before you even got in.

Might wanna do something with those sour grapes, mate. You wont find many takers.;)

[mr.tos]

Ahhhh... the golden boys do it again aye :ok:

[mattyj]

heh heh heh!

Just off track for a moment..To the two Gis Boys out of EAH this morning, thanks for lending us one of your Seatbelt extensions..you restored my faith in the Eagle..we had an excess of fatties on the flight. I hope the belt found its way back to you..I left it with Ramp.:ok:

[Steve Zissou]

Awww, you've restored my faith in the human race MattyJ, that's truly touching:ok:

[mattyj]

Steve you are always touching things..keep your hand to yourself:=

[hershey_86]

ha quality post. I think if i'd jumped straight into eagle from leaving training I would have missed out on all the cool tricks GA has to offer. instead of complaining about what you wanna fly just be thankful you have the chance at all. as far as im concerned even a day stuck in a something as small as a cresco is a joy. atleast im in the air. im in no rush to jump into eagle but when I do I hope im ready, but attitude is a huge part of the game. especially for an FO who is there to learn from experienced captains instead of trying to show them up.

[always inverted]

Finaly someone with a brain. It's a shame that "bank angle" sidn't adopt that philosophy. Oh, thats his new name aparently...

As I have said before, if someone wants to learn I will go out of my way to help them, if they want to be a shyt head, then I can be a bigger one.
There are things that we as captains can make them do as f/o's that would make their day really shyt and long, but who benifits from that ?
The captain does of course, but only if they are quietly making them pay for being a smart arse. Remember that.
It's not about me having my head up my arse but also the fact that what you guys complain about we have all done in the past, and respect is very important given the space between us up the front.

[jimshutt]

There is no doubt that CTC has a real slick marketing strategy which is aimed
at wooing the egos of the self styled egotistical corporates into believing that their own image will be further enhanced if they follow CTC`s lead.
It amazes me how much that line appeals to us and it works too.
I am of no doubt that the 200 hr pilot would make the grade flying wise and become a totally respectfull person if they were taught by the old grizzly faced "son of a bitch" that has been there and done that. Starting life as a loader driver and retiring as a 747 Captain Those people do not take any nonsense. Their life experiences alone would quieten and mature most of the whipper snapers.
It was only tonight that I watched a little girl of about 17 - 20 walking back to her base, having left her student to do some solo work and I couldn`t help thinking, man, and they are training people to go to eagle.
I have to say too to the jaunty newly and not so newly appointed Eagle Captains that that slow talking old bastard in the PA31 making an approach into an uncontrolled Airport 15 miles ahead has your number too.

[always inverted]

Remember also, the time spent in ga- not instructing so much, plus the flying you will do at Eagle (in my case) is probably the best you will ever do, if you miss out on the ga stuff then you really miss out on a bit of a childhood so to speak.

[always inverted]

Was she hot, post a pic...:cool:

[hershey_86]

ive just passed 1000 hrs and before applying to any airlines im going to be heading off to PNG hopefully to gain some valuable experience and have some fun. should be good. for my flying and learning life skills blah blah blah. but i agree with inverted. post a pic :ok:

[Wyle E Coyote]

That's a dangerous move! If you leave NZ you'll realise just how sheltered and incestuous the NZ aviation industry is and you'll never go back.

Enjoy PNG.......and beyond :ok:

[pyote]

No sour grapes at all. They called me for an interview last year some time, they were very unprofessional to me on the phone and I decided that I wouldnt go for the interview. simple!

At the time it was a 30k bond for 3 years so I decided it was a bad idea from day one, I didnt want to waste their time and I didnt waste mine either. Got a good contract job where I got given the rating, I work 5 weeks on 5 off, and get paid a wack to do it. life couldnt be sweeter. Maybe a few more women in deepest darkest, but loving life these days!

[always inverted]

It has lately but not from me. Like I said, thats how it used to be before the crm intergration...

Do you not agree tho that the captain is ultimately responsible for the a/c?
If you had flown with some of these really excellent f/o's you would see that they think that you are sitting in their chair and that they are ready.
What I am trying to say is that there is no respect for the position of a command anymore. Not that captains should be worshiped.
The new ones comming through have not had t work hard for anything cause it can be put on the student loan tab, therefore no appreciation of what it takes to get there.

[always inverted]

Back to the original post, as this has really gone up the road.

Yes it is for those lucky enough to get in with low hrs. No if you arn't on a special course like the ctc one, then some instructing or ga charter/ freight running is the first step.

[hershey_86]

I wasnt on any ctc course so I had to work hard for what I got. and I think thats done me more favours then anything because of all that hard work I think along different lines. as far as im concerned a new grad has a licence to learn, nothing more and therefore nothing is "owed" to them. any job flying is a good one be it flying a paradrop plane or instructing in tomahawks. those lucky enough to jump straight into eagle arent necessarily any better then any other pilots. attitude (from my some what limited point of view) is more important then where you trained. but then again of course im bias! (and had a rather lot to drink)
:Dchooooiicee

[propaganda]

This post started off funny- a wind up, but has turned into the usual rubbish.
PPRune at it's worst - just a complete load of twaddle. It's ill informed and full of egotistical jumped up prima donna's....shame it was funny.

Mod's where are you -

[acectc]

Hi guys been a while...... Ive been building my twin hours.

How many more do you guys think I need before the Eagle or Air Nelson.

I know mr Bank angle and I think Im probably doing better than he did at his internal assesments so hopefully Ill know when to point out a captains error or just when he is doing it for a joke.

Any ideas as to when they are hiring again because it would be good to get this job lined up before the summer kicks in so I can organise my leave for xmas and NYs

Cheers

ace

[hershey_86]

and so it begins again
*bump*

[cornelious-rinitus]

FACT.. ACECTC.... YOUR NOT A CTC CADET....

so why do you feel the need to post these comments, anyone who has a bit of sense will know this is just set up for people who want to see these boys fail and not make the cut and in general make themselves feel better knowing that they have a few virtual friends who share the same mindset.... is it really necessary!! maybe they have made a few errors but instead of writing about it why dont you tell them so they can learn, it just seems a bit ridiculous and unprofessional!! YES

[empacher48]

AceCTC I hear Eagle are running interviews every two weeks from now until August '09.. They have another B1900 joining the fleet. If you have more than 10 hours ME time then you'll get in.

According to a mate of mine, he said the CTC guys like you are so good, that in 18 months you'll be having your command, and they'll also waive the bond when Air NZ give you the call after 24 months as a DE 777 captain too..

Good luck! :ok:

[diseasel]

Ahh the sweet stench of bull****. It wafts around these forums like a fart through a 172. :yuk:

It's rather obvious that the CTC cadets are here, posting in this thread. G'day lads, sorry to hear about your checks.

I don't think anyone here with a 'real job' can deny they would have jumped at the chance to fly a 1900 when they were back on 200 or 300 hours, but I can imagine that most if not all would have the utmost respect for the chance and the people already doing it. That said, GA teaches you how to get out of bed early, work on min rest, and drink like a fish. Rather important skills for your budding airline career.

You never own your job - your only as good as your last check. Your not going to get anywhere showing captains such little respect. That's life, and seeing as your a few years ahead of where the NZ industry traditionally would have placed you I suggest you learn quickly.

[Split Flap]

GA teaches you how to get out of bed early, work on min rest, and drink like a fish. Rather important skills for your budding airline career.

Never a truer word spoken. :ok:

[Hanz Blix]

I really do hope this is a wined up :ugh: otherwise the state of NZ aviation is much worse than allot of us thought it was.

300 hours..........sorry fella you will not get your little toe through the door at Mt Cook with those hours, let alone that attitude! No plonkers welcome:=

[Cloud Cutter]

Oh dear :(

To be honest, I feel sorry for the guys at CTC (or those that care), I think this has been blown way out of proportion, and have to agree with cornelious-rinitus in some ways.

I dunno, maybe I'm just too soft, but I think there's a lot to be said for giving people the benifit of the doubt before dining out on their fcukups. Particularly where youth and inexperience are involved. I can't help but think some of this is driven by jealousy? Just my thoughts anyway ;)

[DeltaT]

<sigh> 300hrs gets some lucky guys on the right seat of a jet in Europe.

Some people here are taking the thread too seriously.
The same kinda attitude that will keep NZ aviation the way it is.:}

[framer]

sigh> 300hrs gets some lucky guys on the right seat of a jet in Europe.

Lucky??? Stuff that, I'm in a jet and it's ok but if I had a few million in the bank I would be back in G.A. aircraft or a 1900 like they have at Eagle. Enjoy it while you're there and then leave a slot for me when I come back:)

[bin b'archin]

400 hours in a 200 hour course? haha sounds like quite a bit of remedial training going on there buddy... maybe you aren't as sh1t hot as you think. I did hear cook are looking for ramp crew. Maybe with those extra hours you'll have enough to apply for a baggage boy. W@nker.

[Cypher]

http://www.improvresourcecenter.com/mb/images/smilies/popcorn.gif

[Water Wings]

I hear calls went out today for the interviews in late November. Anyone know who got the nod? Have heard that at least two of them are another bunch of 200 hour CTC Cadet's. Anyone confirm this?

[Inspector G.]

No doubt they will be destined for the lucrative Masterton-Auckland route. :E

[horserun]

When Do the MS-AA runs star?
Will it be an AA crew overnighting in MS??

[6080ft]

MS runs start in feb so I am told. will be done by akl crew who will overnight.