Virgin ponders Bali

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Two foreign airlines to serve Bali

Ni Komang Erviani , Contributor , Badung | Thu, 09/04/2008 10:18 AM | Bali
Two more foreign airlines have been scheduled to provide direct flights to Bali in the near future said Heru Legowo, general manager for airport operations at Ngurah Rai international Airport on Wednesday.
"The two airlines are Hong Kong Express based in Hong Kong and Virgin Blue in Australia," Heru said, speaking for the state-owned firm PT Angkasa Pura I, which manages the airport.
He said the two airlines would start offering direct flights to Bali later this month: Hong Kong Express to begin on Sept. 11 with four flights from Hong Kong a week and Virgin Blue would fly in 11 times a week from Cairns.
"The start date for Virgin Blue flights has not been set yet, but they have been scheduled to start within the month," he said.
The two airlines will raise the number of foreign airlines serving Bali directly to 26.
Heru expected more foreign airlines will help increase the number of foreign tourists visiting the resort island, especially from Hong Kong and Australia.
As Hong Kong Express also flies to South Korea and Taiwan, "we hope the new services will significantly raise the number of visitors to Bali", he said.
Aloysius Purwa, chair of the Bali chapter of the Association of Indonesian Tour and Travel Agencies (ASITA), hailed the planned services by the two foreign airlines.
The rising number of foreign tourists visiting Bali reflects rising international interest in the island, Purwa said.
"This will ensure Bali remains one of the favorite tourism destinations in the world," he said.
"Bali needs still more foreign airlines to enable foreign tourists to go there."
Purwa added the number of foreign airlines serving direct flights to Bali is still too small to attract significantly more visitors.
Based on figures from the Denpasar office of the Central Statistics Agency, the number of foreign tourists visiting Bali from January to July 2008 reached about 1.11 million, an increase of 21.64 percent compared to 912,270 tourists during the corresponding period last year.

[Eastwest Loco]

Not a bad "look at" for DJ - the Island of the Gods.

The place is vastly under capacity and Garuda has chucked everything it can at Australia with its A330s, but is still under capacity to hell.

They simply do not have the bucks top buy the birds to service the market.

JQ is frowned on by most of our passengers who prefer to get a Bintang (dingin sekalih) delivered for free along with free edible tucker.

I personally do not think that a new carrier, albeit a fluffy wuffy fun one, offering a buy everything you want service on DPS will cut the mustard, particularly on a run where Garuda is very kind on sporting equipment such as surfboards.

All DJ will do is dilute the JQ passenger revenue IMHO.

A BNE DPS nonstop may be the only logical run, as it is not covered unless over SYD and would attract some of the budget concious younger traffic from MCY to OOL.

Just my 2 bobs worth.

Best all

EWL

[Yusef Danet]

Duh, Pacific Blue will operate.

11 a week out of Cairns?

Nah.

11 total from Per, Bne and maybe Drw and Cns.

Pac Blue will soon have to work out what to do with 11 738s.

Per-Dps is an obvious route, once they can work out how to crew it so far from CHC or AKL.

I would suggest a pairing like:
day 1: Akl-Bne-Dps
2: Dps-Per-Dps
(optional) 3 :Dps-Drw-Dps
3rd or 4th: Dps-Cns-Akl
and vice versa

(but what do I know)
(edited to remove some dumb auto smiley)
YD

[topend3]

maybe Per-Dps with an E-190 could be more likely...

[Dog One]

Released today, JQ to operate BN - DN - Bali and return, starts 3rd Dec, 7 days per week. Wonder if QF will continue code sharing with Airnorth, or swing back to JQ? Fares are $249 ex BN, $199 ex DN

[captaintunedog777]

Gee eastwest

With your valuable insight and knowledge into the airline world. One does not wonder why you were not given the head gig at Q.

Damn those fools delivering a billion dollar (ok nearly):ok:

[nick charles]

DJ intend to operate BNE - DPS direct.

[SilverSleuth]

Trip already put together I believe.
BN - DPS (overnight)
DPS - PER - DPS (overnight)
DPS - BNE
will be done by PB in 738s

[tinpis]

BNE-DPS overnight.....Rumah Sakit with Bali belly :uhoh:

[wirgin blew]

Done by PB in either PB or VB painted planes with either VB or PB crew as both EBA's permit it.

A long way in a 737 but then again BNE-PER is not much less and crew have been doing that for a long while.

Wonder what will happen with catering in DPS?

Would be a nice overnight for whichever crew get to operate it.

[Skystar320]

Any ops would be by the 737's doubt we will see the EMB's transfered to PB any time soon to operate international

[kotoyebe]

When you have been in the "industry" and run and owned a successful business on the waifer thin margins available, for as long as Loco has, then you can start being a smart arse. How dare you ridicule the experience of such a well liked, and respected member of the travel industry. Your M.O. is to stir people up. You must like the attention. Go and get some help.

[blokehostie]

My understanding is that the flight will be capped at approx 140 pax!

[walaper]

Skystar 320 nothing has to be transfered anywhere to operate international as long as it says "PACIFIC BLUE " on the outside and not "VIRGIN BLUE" it can go . Several Virgin Blue aircraft have Pac Blue name on them and have VH Rego.These latest routes (Port Morbid and Bali) will be operated by VH registered 737-800's and crewed by virgin blue crew and using the Pac Blue call sign.

[captaintunedog777]

Kotoyebe

Relax a little son. Running small business does not give you auomatic knowledge of the overall industry and does creates bias when you have dependancies. If I disagree with what is posted ill will damn well post it. Historically if you look at Loco's posts he is damning of the big Q and Jetstar. Why. Because JQ and Jetstar do not want to pay commission fees to travel agencies. In other words big guy the motives of the big airlines is to have everyone booking online which would save airlines countless millions. This inturn will lead to lower costs. If I were Loco I would do they same but to vent your frustration on PPRUNE and poison the Q and Jetstar brands.

I would rather see people book online on an ozzie airline rather than one of his favourites Garuda since they wouldhave to pay more commission to travel agencies. Remember this airline is banned from flying into the EU. I can only imagine how poorly paid their workers are and their appalling safety record speaks for itself. Who the hell would stick their wife and kids on Garuda? Not if my life depended on it.

I wish all the Airlines in OZ every bit of success and it is about bloody time we started being more supportive of our industries rather than support Singapore or Cathey when the Q product is just as good if not better. Sadly enough the old tall poppy syndrome is alive and well in Oz.

Do I need help? Where do I start. So run along and dream of handling the big jets.:=

[KittyBlue]

There has been discussion of Bali returns (seperate negotiations for the wet lease setup, so overnights are probably not going to happen). Of course things change.

[Soulman]

rather than support Singapore or Cathey when the Q product is just as good if not better

Bwahahahaha.... Best laugh I've had all morning. :ugh:

[Ex QF]

In regards to DOGONE.
Released today, JQ to operate BN - DN - Bali and return, starts 3rd Dec, 7 days per week.

We (family) go up twice a year - now before people start knocking the place - it has improved and is great value for money but what is the QF Group doing?

The ABS state that: The number of Australians travelling to Bali in the first quarter of 2008 increased by more than 57% against last year, with larger percentage growth from Perth and Darwin (75% and 71% respectively), 44% from Victoria/Tasmania an 49% from NSW/ACT.

So Garuda add triple daily PER-DPS from 3 Sept, JQ 3 per week,
Garuda added a 3rd DRW-DPS 25 Jun, JQ the daily from Dec,
Garuda added their 5th from MEL-DPS 02 Sept, JQ 2 a week of which one starts in SYD.
Garuda added 6th SYD-DPS service 02 Sept, JQ has 4 direct and 1 via MEL.

Garuda addresses the market - the QF Group does not.
Look at PER-DPS these peole love Bali - it's closer and cheaper than say the Gold Coast but QF is just handing the $$'s over to Garuda.


And then they compete with the parent on the HNL run? go figure.

[Sunstar320]

Yeah, but thats Garuda.....Garuda are just :oh:bad:oh: At least there is another carrier challenging Garuda there.

[another superlame]

Captaintunedog777, the Q product used to be good. Now it is a shell of its former self with, with self centred egotistical CC who think thw world owes them a lot.

I agree that it is good to support the home grown product, but when Qantas shafts everybody from the pilot to the passenger and all in between, it is time to move on and fly with SIA or Cathay.

It is a strange feeling to be served bt CC that are genuinely nice and helpful. QF CC lost these 2 traits years ago.Now they only have time to bitch to each other in the galley rather than deliver customer service.

[Mstr Caution]

Ask Ralph Fiennes about the outstanding service MC:8

[ebt]

I wouldn't knock Garuda, personally. Just went up to indo and back on them, and really couldn't fault it. Would even fly them again. Good flight, good onboard product and great service and very few problems at a price much cheaper than on QF.

On the safety side, they've learnt a lot from Yogyakarta and have best practices safety systems in place. The real problem is the Indonesian authorities which is why all Indonesian airlines are not able to fly to Europe.

Also, the reaction of GA to put more capacity on Bali seems to indicate that people are still willing to fly them. Good on them for meeting the demand, I say. It makes good business sense.

[Yusef Danet]

Good service does not equate to a good airline.

I am quite sure that Garuda haven't finished crashing just yet. They still haven't got the safety culture lesson.

I would steer clear of them, and as it is now Ramadan, doubly so.

Indonesia has been averaging one airline prang per month, two in Ramadan. We just had a 737-200 off the end at Jambi, we are due for one more before Eid.

[Eastwest Loco]

I couldn't get that gig at "Q" tunedog.

I know to much about what some of the seniors did when they were still wetting their pants at TAA.:suspect::suspect::=

The stains never come out.

Best all

EWL

[Sunstar320]

Good service does not equate to a good airline.

I am quite sure that Garuda haven't finished crashing just yet. They still haven't got the safety culture lesson.

I would steer clear of them, and as it is now Ramadan, doubly so.

Indonesia has been averaging one airline prang per month, two in Ramadan. We just had a 737-200 off the end at Jambi, we are due for one more before Eid.
And after that Perth Incident with Garuda, I think its starting to say something.......I would also be worried about AirAsia. There has been quite a few covered up incidents, mainly to do with the minimal training of A320 Flight Crew who have just come from 737...

[max autobrakes]

The season for the mad ayatollahs to teach us infidels a lesson is soon due!:bored:

[barrybeebone]

AS stated previously by others, GA is servicing the market by increasing services, QF is not. Bring on VB and introduce more competition to the market, that is what we need.

There are not too many markets departing Australia that don't have more than two carriers (QF and the airline of the country it flies to). To have QF, VB and GA all competing will ensure that us travellers get to have a decent choice. If GA is crap then people will vote with their feet.

VB would be smart to start up a BNE service, there is none at present and the JQ attempt will probably lose out as people will probably prefer to fly direct rather than via DWN. VB should also consider Adelaide. No Bali services since GA pulled out in 06. First mover advantage will ensure VB have the market.

The other good thing about VB starting Indonesian services is that I think it won't be too long before other Indonesian carriers start exploiting the bali - Australia routes. Air Asia and Lion Air all have plenty of aircraft on order and will be looking to tap into the most lucrative routes between Indo and Australia.

Someone else posed the question about AirNorth services to Bali from DWN. I do wonder if QF will continue codeshare and I also wonder how pissed off AirNorth are if Jetstar are competing direct with them.

[topend3]

i think airnorth will do well to compete on this route now that jetstar are on it

[Mr.Buzzy]

Still don't understand why so many people travel to Bali....... Must be missing something.

[Pluto's gone]

Bali = Cheap holiday for the family. Where else can one go and sit on a tropical beach, drink $1 beer, eat very cheap and very good food and have a great vacation? The local Balinese are great and rely on our $$$.

No matter what you want to do you can do it in Bali, from the romantic holiday, adventure holiday, trip with the lads, diving, surfing, etc. You name it you can do it.

max autobrakes I hope you are wrong.

[Chocks Away]

"I think airnorth will do well to compete on this route now that jetstar are on it ."

Yes, especially with another Bunsen-burner on the way for them shortly, it's good to have a choice of product and frequency flexibility.

[apacau]

I don't get you sometimes, Skystar. The E170 is a lovely aircraft to fly from a pax perspective. All the punters I speak to prefer them over 737s/F100s and they sh** all over Dash 8s/F50s!

[captaintunedog777]

Topend

Come on son. Jetstar will snuff them out of the market. But hang on doesn't Air North operate a wet service agreement for Q. Anyone?

[Skystar320]

I don't get you sometimes, Skystar. The E170 is a lovely aircraft to fly from a pax perspective. All the punters I speak to prefer them over 737s/F100s and they sh** all over Dash 8s/F50s!

I just dont get the US$34million price tag that attracts this aircraft.

Give me a 146 anyday :ok:

[Dog One]

I would think that AN aren't silly enough to compete with J* on the route. There will be a few moans from the regulars, especially in regard to seating, the E170 has plenty of leg room compared to the A320/B737.

Its strange isn't, the NT Government are pouring taxpayers money into J* to help it set up, while AN has successfully financed its aircraft without going to the Government for assistance.

The government aviation advisor has done well, Virgin were paid to start the ASP service, which ceased when the money ran out, then Tiger collected more cash and forced Bruni to cease services. When competition came from J*, Tiger quickly pulled out.

[8888]

Yet another political frustration for Airnorth but I wouldn't worry too much about their future. They've been battling the oppositions mysterious contract tenders well before even National Jet managed to undercut Airnorth's Metro 23 submission with a Dash 8 -300 on a particular route many moons ago. They'll fight on. It's surprising that the general public don't kick up a fuss though. If, as stated above, their tax contributions are only retaining these LCC until 'the money runs out'. As for Guruda being rated as a good airline because of its 'good service'... Well, I'm one of the minority nowadays who puts most of the credence of a 'good' airline in what's going on behind that locked door up the front. The rest is mostly window dressing.

[Skystar320]

Wow - thats an expensive Metro 23 if a Dash 8-300 was undercut!

[ebt]

Good service does not equate to a good airline.

Of course not, and I wasn't suggesting that it was representative of their safety approach.

The whole safety culture thing will take time to work through, but full credit to the current CEO who made the safety policy his first priority when he was appointed. Sure, Yogya happened on his watch but that was down to the pilot of the day, and the copilot should have followed precedent and made the go-around. They've now put in place stronger procedures and training to ensure that PNF's do actually take control when the aircraft are not stabilised below 1000ft.

Point is to say, compared to Lion or some of the other airlines - and yes I have flown within Indo - I'd rather go with Garuda, not only for the service but for the stronger safety standards there than elsewhere.

[barrybeebone]

EBT you are correct. I have flown quite a bit within Indo and believe me Garuda is one of the better ones. Sure it has its problems but trust me no one is really watching the other airlines. Garuda is being watched closer than ever by foreign regulators. Garuda knows this and they are responding....taking time but still rsponding.

[Skystar320]

Airnorth has quitely dropped the DRW-DPS route, running cold on Jetstar?

[topend3]

passengers booked beyond their shutdown date (Jan '09) have been reaccomodated on JQ...

[topend3]

also, captaintunedog777 i think you misunderstood me. i was trying to say with the arrival of JQ that yes indeed AN would struggle to compete. now they don't have to.

[Dog One]

Bit like the old days of the two airline policy. East West developed the SYD - ASP route initially with the F27 and I think the F28. Once the route was developed,both TAA and Ansett moved in and took over the run.

No doubt, the wheel will turn a full circle and J* will pick up any other international route AN develop once it will sustain an A320.

[tourismman]

The same with Flightwest BNE-CBR with the Brasilia and then the big boys came in.

[Ex QF]

And a quick look at the airline web sites reveal:

ADL-DPS Virgin 2 p/w & JetStar nothing direct.
PER-DPS Virgin 4 p/w & JetStar 3 p/w.
BNE-DPS Virgin 5 direct p/w. I say direct because the new Jet* service from BNE is daily via DRW - why would anyone want to endure a 3 hour wait?

Virgin from BNE 6 hours 15 minutes & JetStar 9hours 20 minutes.

Assume the NT Government is paying heaps of incentives as surely no one from Brisbane is going to fly JetStar?

[TMAK]

Cant say I am keen on a 3 hour wait...although could stand the thought of 6 hours non stop in a 737 with limited leg room either. Whilst JQ seem keen on creating a hub through DRW, I think its also important to conisder the A320 wont make it non stop....hence the stop is a must for them.

[Dog One]

The other reason for the stop over in DRW is that all flights to DRW are domestic, which is the reason for the 3 hr stopover. You have to collect your baggage, then re-check in and then go through Customs. The same applies on the way back from overseas, you have to collect your baggage, go through Customs, and re-check in again. Having done this off a Singapore flight, I can only say its a real pain in the butt.

[Pluto's gone]

3 hours would be just enough time to clear customs in Darwin to make the connection :E or have things changed?

[Skystar320]

3hrs **** that - gimme SQ

[TMAK]

Yep better to go SQ from BNE...8 hours to SIN, at least 3 hours in transit if not overnight, then 2.5 hours to DPS....hmmm...actually that makes the 4 hours to DRW...stop for 3...then 1.5 hours to DPS actually look quite good! You will be arriving in DPS in about the same travel time you would otherwise be touching down in SIN.

[ditzyboy]

You have to collect your baggage, then re-check in and then go through Customs.

I thought that, outbound, the bags are tagged through? Does JQ not interline bags domestic to international? They do between JQ and QF (dom to int). Obviously on the return EVERYONE must clear customs with their bag if going from an 'international' to 'domestic' service.

[Kanga767]

TAMK, I would guess that Skystar320 was talking about going to SIN not DPS with SQ, rather than the current JQ stopover in DRW enroute to SIN, which is ex CNS and MEL.


Yes I know the thread is DPS...


K

[TMAK]

Kanga, yes I guess its possible...but its a HUGE drift is he was. I guess Sjystar will tell us!

SIN is nothing like DPS...and we were discussing pros/cons of getting to DPS.

Cheers

[Skystar320]

Sorry, my mistake....... Got to get my head checked :ugh::ouch::ugh::ouch:

[Dog One]

The International departure lounge in Darwin is a mess. With the checking of pax bags for fluids etc never been catered for in the design, there is only one x-ray machine, so every one has to line up and wait there turn, one by one. Then Customs usually only have 4 points open which further slows down the queue. I would imagine that with the prospect of 3 A320's departing within the hour, things are really going to get pretty tight, and three hurs might not be enough! I would imagine that the proposed terminal upgrade will improve international departures

[Dog One]

Just had a phone call from a colleague in Darwin. He said that Garuda Bali flight didn't operate today, the aircraft went U/S for the 0730 departure and is still parked on Bay 10!

[Ex QF]

And now Garuda are back on the BNE-DPS run in time for the summer school holidays.

e-Travel Blackboard: Garuda Indonesia resumes direct Brisbane Bali flights (http://www.etravelblackboard.com/showarticle.asp?nav=2&id=82471)

So, the punters from SE Queensland have the choice of:
- JetStar with a 3 hour stop over in DRW and the Darwin International Terminal issues as mentioned above,

- Virgin and
- Garuda now.

Surely someone within the Qantas Group is telling someone within the Qantas Group that they may lose out big time with the BNE-DRW-DPS service?