GPS

[Jon181082]

Hi,

Does anyone know of a really cool personal aviation GPS, as I'm not so keen on Garmin.

Which is the best in todays market?

Any advice, thank you

Jon

[g-mady]

Why not keen on Garmin. They make proven quality units. I have always stuck with garmin and have never had a complaint.
Are you thinking dash mount like a 296, handheld or fitted?

MADY

[MrEdd]

For VFR i really liked the lowrance AirMap 2000C. Good size screen, user friendly.

[jemax]

It really depends what you want it for, I have a brillian Fujutsi seimens Loox 560 PDA with memory map software and I bought an extended battery.

So I get half mill, quarter mill and 50,000 OS, with moving map, it's light, slim, (it'll fit in an inner jacket pocket), 3 and a half inch screen, and with an extended battery lasts at least 7 hours, with the original as a 3 hour back up, never had to use it though. Oh and it also has Tom Tom for All North America and Western Europe and all my mass and balance calculators for every aircraft I fly and you can web browse on it.

Had it 2 years now, dropped it a few times in daily use and it's never let me down. It doesn't have the features of the 296/496, but for VFR moving map and route planning in seconds it cant be beat. The gps is integral.

Will cost about £500 all up with the map software. Bit less now it's just been discontinued.

Fujitsu-Siemens Pocket LOOX N560 (DISCONTINUED) from Clove Technology (http://www.clove.co.uk/viewProduct.aspx?product=A6D829AB-509F-4F4E-A839-F851F2A405DB)

The 50,000 OS will cost you £300 extra.

There was a long thread on all this, I had a quick look but couldn't track it down.

[Jon181082]

Hi,

Thanks for the input guys,

"Are you thinking dash mount like a 296, handheld or fitted?"

I was mainly thinking Handheld to use in different aircraft. I just tend to find the Garmin difficult to program, but thats probably just me, basically I'm useless :)

Jemax, that doesn't seem like a bad idea. I wonder if the New Iphone 3G (integrated gps) could be put to any good use for navigating VFR.... or would that be pushing it?

[g-mady]

The iphone has the handy feature of google maps and google earth sat photos. But I wouldn't want to rely on phone signals for that.
Garmin's range of handhelds are really things like the etrex (basic), and then things like the 296 are still very portable and good battery life.

Jemax's Fujitsu is a great bit of kit... definately worth a look for the extra features!

MADY

[Hover Bovver]

Garmin 495 or 496 , absolutely brilliant, super easy to use (easier than a skymap111c) terrain, great mapping and is portable ( comes with everything you could ever need . Take it out of the aircraft and pre program for the next day. Much better than the older garmin stuff.

[g-mady]

yeah ill second that, Garmin have this covered now. The fujitsu is worth a look though.

[Aesir]

Which is the best in todays market?


Uhhh.. Garmin :ok:

If you can fly a helicopter then you can learn to use a Garmin :)

[krypton_john]

Yup.

What they all need to do is reduce workload and come up with better user interface integration with the coolee cyclic switch. Helicopter pPilots need to keep both hands on the controls.

The phone/pda options IMHO aren't usable by a helicopter pilot as they practically require at least one hand to operate, divert too much attention and don't offer any integration to com and nav radios and course/slope/efis indicators.

[Bertie Thruster]

Helicopter pPilots need to keep both hands on the controls.

wWhy do they need to keep both hands on the controls?

[loewy]

Hi fellow pilots,

I am this close to ordering a Garmin 495/496 at Transair - almost ready to press the button and see my bank account tumble !! ;-)

Flying VFR in Belgium only so far. Changing a/c all the time (rental). This product sounds like just what I need, right ?

Question is does anyone around this great forum have first-hand experience with Garmin 495/496 in Europe and is willing to share thoughts ?

Thanks in advance and good landings,

L

[Hover Bovver]

Loewy,
Have used a 496 (comes with street mapping, 495 does not) and it is superb, in the UK at least ! Have used it in France and also has really good depiction of IFR and or VFR zones , topography etc, the Ground prox system is superb(as good as a £25k unit we had before) it can have a traffic input (not tried it) it has a Brilliant Stanby panel (which when you get it you must have a look at , it really is clever with a VSI , Speed, turn and bank etc - all you need as a stby if everything else has gone wrong , and it really works well)

It comes with a cradle for the aircraft and a remote antenna so they can be left in your ac, or it comes with a bean bag mount which goes anywere !.

The only downside is that you cant use the aural warning parts as its not connected to the aircraft intercom, but the screen shows any altitude /terrain alerts anyway, and I beleive it is the same with the traffic (not used it myself)

It takes about 10 seconds to disconnect from the aircraft , and is great if you are at home, for planning etc (saves doing it while in th e aircraft)

If I could I would have gone for the 495, as it costs less and doesnt have the street mapping (so you can use it in a car) which I have never used in the aircraft.

All in all it is superb, but you have to remember it is only hand held, and always keep it in mind that what it does for what it costs !!!

Try Mendellhsons (?) they wree the cheapest when i got mine
Regards
HB

[JimBall]

Garmin 296 is a better bet for helis than the later models. Battery life up to 8 hrs if you use the screen backlight sensibly. Easily programmable via USB. And (for the UK) the street map software add-on is excellent. So you have a device which you can use on the road or use to find exact streets from the air.

RAM do a great suction mount and Robin Aviation in the USA supply a nifty R44 mount for the back of the cyclic.

[Jon181082]

Hi,

I've just been checking out the Garmin 496.

Seems like alot of unneccesary features for a chopper? may be I'm wrong. But it would be nicer with a slightly larger screen though, diag (9.7 cm)

Is it possible to get a knee board mount for the 496? Haven't seen anything as of yet through Google.

[EC135CAPTAIN]

Garmin 296, Dual Garmin 430 and a Garming 60csx as a hand held unit with city navigator very useful on EMS aircraft.

[loewy]

Thank you so much, Hover Bovver !

Your comprehensive and clear reply is yet another illustration of the quality of this great forum and its people. I think I will go for the 495.

And now the revelation: only after I had sent my message, I realised I had done so in the Heli forum. This is because I had found the GPS thread via the "search" function. I am just a PPL(A) with no rotor experience whatsoever - an intruder in this section (!). But thanks for your answer anyway.

Good landings (or should I say "good stationaries" ?),

L

[Whirlygig]

wWhy do they need to keep both hands on the controls?

bBecause they might wobble about otherwise and make the passengers feel squeezy? :}

Cheers

Whirls

[O27PMR]

There's no question Garmin make top quality units but if you don't get on with them or don't think they make a model that meets your requirements then there are plenty of other units on the market.

Have you looked at or considered a FlyAngel? There are now 2 FlyAngel models available, the original model based on the Road Angel Navigator 7000 and the newer model based on an HP 314.

Try a few until you find one that you get on with before spending your hard-earned...

PR

[spinwing]

Mmmmm ...

I have just started using the Garmin 495.

Its brilliant and the more I get to know it the happpier I am with it.

New Fast (5Hz) update processor speed ... intuitive use good screen quality.

I use it for about 6+Hrs a day doing fieldwork (offshore) in a Bell 412EP and find for this work its much better than the "Freeflight 2101" as fitted in the a/c.

We work an Oilfield with over 320 wellheads and this device makes the job easy!

Go to the Garmin website ... download the user manual and see what you think!

Garmin IS quality, reliable kit.

Cheers :ok:

[R.OCKAPE]

If you don't like Mercedes you can buy a Jag..

[Hank195]

Bendix King has recently introduced the AV8OR a new non-gramin choice to the handheld GPS market.

https://www.bendixking.com/AV8OR/AV8OR/default.html

Touch screen display and nice form factor (less than 1" thick) full aviation & auto databases for Europe or US, optional weather


In the US the Anywhere Map ATC is another interesting choice but doesn't seem to be available with European data

Anywhere Map - Aviation GPS (http://www.anywheremap.com/anywheremap-atc.aspx)

The Garmin's are excellent products but choice and competition are always a good thing.

[krypton_john]

Looks good. I hope it can be configured to be in portrait mode. More interested in what's coming up ahead than what is off to the side.

[krypton_john]

Burtie_Thruster: By that I mean most of the time. Not good to be distracted operating the unit with left hand for a period of time as the RRPM is dropping, for example.

[bolkow]

yeah, but at 50 plus years of age I have trouble seeing the garmin!

[Hover Bovver]

If you struggle to see a Garmin 495, how did you pass the eyesight test:}

[Bilbo Bagover]

I would go for any of the colour 296/496. Fantastic if you are jumping in out of different aircraft in Europe. Excellent if you need a quick frequency or an unfamiliar SID.

While the terrain feature will seem a little gimmicky in Belgium, it is worth its weight in gold when flying in the Alps.

I know of somebody who had a multiple screen failure in IMC and got himself out of potential trouble using the 296. Although I now fly a machine with multimple moving maps it still goes in the navbag just in case.

Once used you will rarely leave home without it.

Bilbo

[SASless]

eLoran is the wave of the future....much more accurate and more reliable than GPS. USCG is pouring new money into the Loran system. Perhaps Decca can be revived in the UK as well.

[spinwing]

""eLoran is the wave of the future....much more accurate and more reliable than GPS. USCG is pouring new money into the Loran system. Perhaps Decca can be revived in the UK as well. ""


Mmmmm ...

Sassy ... that might be fine for those who work/fly where there is a LORAN or DECCA chain they can access....

:)

[Helikopter]

Would be nice to get some review from someone using the Bendix Kingt AV8OR ? Talking about Loran, isnt that something in a museum :O !

[Blade Wake]

Yes, it would be nice to get more feedback on the AV80R. I played with it at the shop this week-end and I have to say it's going to be a hard product to beat. Resolution was far superior to the Garmins. The unit is quite slim but most of all I loved the touch-screen. I could scroll through the user-defined fields in the side bars with my finger. One tap on the screen and zooming buttons and other menus pop up. Any other time you're operating with an uncluttered screen.

Overall it was a pleasure to use and it definitely fits in the pocket. It doesn't boast an HSI display and there are
software bugs in the first batch but these should be fixed with the next release due out in a matter of weeks.

[Sy Clic]

Has anybody tried out the Flymap Flyman? I'm deliberating (having a minor faff) over which heldheld to buy. I've read threads on the Garman selaction & AV80R but have just seen the Flyman online.:bored: Help is required!
Thanks.

[WSPS]

Anyone got anything to say about the AvMap EKP-IV PRO?

It does look quite capable. But might be too big for helos?

Any real life experience would be greatly appreciated!

AvMap EKP-IV Pro (http://www.avmap.it/index.php?swt=12&sec=1&ipr=9)

[ThomasTheTankEngine]

Hi WSPS

I used the AVMAP lll in the past found it to be quite good, could store 3000 way points on it, then another 3000 on each memory card you had for it, so it was good for things like pipe lines (Could store the whole of the line) I use to mount it on my leg like a knee board which worked well, had enough room and that was in a 22.

The only draw back was the batterys didn't last to long so you had to plug into the power supply. I don't know how the Avmap lV compares.

TTTE.

[WSPS]

Thanks T.

How long is not so long?

How did you attach the thing to your knee?
I understand it is quite on the large side.

Cheers

WSPS

[ThomasTheTankEngine]

Hi WSPS

As far as I remember it had a back up battery and we just pluged into a 12 volt powersupply on the aircraft, it was over 3 years ago.

The base of the system was was curved like a knee board with a velcro elastic, so it sat quite secure on your thigh.

I would have thought the Avmap lV would have improved on the lll that said I wouldn't buy an Avmap now, I've been useing a garmin 295 for the last few years which I'm really happy with.

[enstrompilot]

I need a new GPS moving map for a Heli

there are new(er) devices available

using skyforce 3c as a bech mark

how do others rate, any experiance of

day light readability
functionallity
reliability
ease of use
customer service
map updates


I have used Skyforce 3c for years, excelent, but smallish I like the cursor and goto function on the 3c, only one key press


I have used Garmin 296 - found it fussy, cluttered and more key presses than I have time for

what is the experiance of :-

small skyforce (av80r) - small display ?
AVmap EKP4 ?
Avmap geopilot II ?
Lowrance 2000c ?
garmin 696 (price !)
flymap (price !!)

do I fit another 3c (good kit) or go for a bigger display ?)

thanks

[biggestboy]

Garmin 496 - fantastic....but not if you didn't like the 296.

[JTobias]

Skymap IIIc - Great, screen size is decent, but not as easy to see airspace as on the 496. I use both and would reccomend both highly.

Flymap is absoluteley great, good screen size, touch screen and uses standard CAA maps (1:500k or 1:250k - and you can have street level gazeteer too if you want) there is a very handy forward looking terrain feature which will indicate if your current flight level is sufficient. Also has the Pooleys airfield database loaded. - Pricey though!! - Used one of these in my last machine.

Joel

[krypton_john]

Anyone used the EKP-IV? Nice large screen and it can be used in portrait mode. I think that landscape mode is silly for a heads-up moving map - I'm usually more interested in what's ahead than to the side.

[JTobias]

Just checked out the Garmin 695 - looks nice.
I've always said that the 496 just needed a bigger screen - and now they have.
Might be worth going to see one in the flesh.

Joel

[nigelh]

Be very careful with the flymap . I may be wrong , but i was told that they now no longer have a deal with the caa for maps so in future all the maps will be jeppenson . A new one is coming out which will have caa maps but also an artificial horizon ontop of synthetic vision ( i think ). This gives you a picture of the view in front of you and everything within say 100ft is in red !!! These can ( not recommending this ) be used giving you all the info you need for instrument flight ( already used in gliders) AND will have a new TCAS based on satellite . Not a good time to buy imho as this new gear coming out in new year.

[Firefly01]

I have used a 296 for years and think it is great, would like to upgrade to the 495, but can not justify the cost for what is basically just a faster update speed. I also had a friend make a knee board for it and it works exceptionally well. Nice when jumping in and out of different aircraft.
FF01

[EN48]

Just received new Garmin 696 and "installed" today in the helicopter. Large screen is great improvement over 496, as is completely revised user interface. Very intuitive, especially if one has any 430/530 experience - possibly the easiest to use GPS available. So much so that many will not need to look at the manual. Most impressive in terms of features and overall quality. Highly recommended. Expensive compared to 495/496 but cheap compared to 530, and with a larger screen.

I found that by mixing and matching various parts in the RAM mount product line, using some in a way not originally intended, it was possible to construct a mount that attaches/removes to/from a seat rail in the Enstrom 480 in seconds - very slick and easy, with no holes to drill, nothing permanently attached to the helo. The same RAM fitting which attaches to the seat rail also carries a mount for a satellite phone.

http://i306.photobucket.com/albums/nn264/sharkattack2347/CIMG0300smla.jpg
http://i306.photobucket.com/albums/nn264/sharkattack2347/CIMG0298sml.jpg

[FLY 7]

Anyone mounted a GPS (ideally Garmin 296/496) on the cyclic of an Enstrom 480/B, or similar, (see cyclic on l/h PIC side, in top photo above) ?

The idea is to have a second GPS in line of sight, and easily reachable to input info. Question is - how to locate it ?

[Flying Bull]

Hi all

http://we-travel.co.cc/joomla/index.php?option=com_content&view=frontpage&Itemid=1〈=en (http://we-travel.co.cc/joomla/index.php?option=com_content&view=frontpage&Itemid=1&lang=en)
works with open source maps.

Evenso there are no flying maps availabe yet (have to check, if you can create your own maps), its a nice little program for the new mobile phones with inbuild or via bluetooth coupled GPS.
Different to most GPS-programs for mobiles, it works totally offline, that is without downloading maps (you have to have them on your phone)
So when abroard you won´t be surprised by the bill from your provider.
Nice back-up, when installed on you phone ;-)

Greetings Flying Bull

[toptobottom]

I've used the Flymap L for just over a year and it works great - and I've just uploaded the latest Jeppeson and CAA 1/4 mill and 1/2 mill maps, so I think they still have the deal with the CAA.

Flymap fell out with its UK distributor, Wills Engineering, last Autumn but Wills has subsequently developed its own version called Airbox which has just been launched (I think); I've seen adverts on Transair's website. Anyone got one? What's the verdict? I notice it's a fraction of the price I paid for my FlyMap (£4k :eek:)