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WorkingHard
27th Aug 2008, 22:07
Now I understand some may think this is of no importance but when asked to state your nationality on government documents we can no longer use English or Scottish or Welsh or Irish or even British. It is now deemed to be UK. Yes UK.
This from an official response to my very direct questioning
"Having checked with the Ministry of Justice, I can confirm that the use of the term ‘UK’ as nationality on forms, is in fact the most legally correct terminology to use – standing as it does for the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland

The term GB is on the other hand a geographical expression and often used in sporting and mapping context"

I am livid to say the least. Who and when decided I was no longer BRITISH

Checkboard
27th Aug 2008, 22:11
I use "Australian" :ok:

Have to apply for paper pomship in December. :{

Whirlygig
27th Aug 2008, 22:13
It may be legally correct but it's not grammatically correct! I am British (not English or Northern Irish, being 50/50!) but how can I be UKish? The English are from England, the .... (what?) are from the United Kingdom!

Cheers

Whirls

tony draper
27th Aug 2008, 22:17
I always put White Anglo Saxon Protestant.:rolleyes:

goudie
27th Aug 2008, 22:20
Whirls is right. Americans don't say I'm USAish, saying I'm UK. is nonsensical. I'm British and reside in the UK.

I bet that stings Mr D!

selfloadingcargo
27th Aug 2008, 23:20
Given that the 'Ministry of Justice' is a contradiction in terms, it is no surprise that they (it?) would commit the solecism of suggesting that one should define one's nationality as 'UK'.

'British' is correct - whatever the PC, common sense-challenged numpties in the aforesaid Ministry may think.

603DX
27th Aug 2008, 23:42
Agreed. My passport states my nationality quite clearly as "British Citizen", and that's good enough for me. I shall ignore this nonsense. I wonder whether Jack Straw, whose department this is, would support this piece of incompetence from one of his minions.

con-pilot
28th Aug 2008, 00:21
A pet peeve of mine is when people from the United States when asked nationality reply "American". Well, I'm sorry, but everyone from North America, Central America and South America are technically all Americans.

We are from the United States, that is our nationality.



(Of course folks from Texas are exempt from this. "Madam/Sir what is your nationality? Why I'm from Texas!" I actually have heard this, for some strange reason about every customs/immigration agent around the world accepts this answer. ;))

galaxy flyer
28th Aug 2008, 01:33
C-P

Don't tell a South American that he is an American, might think you mean norte americano and NOT like it much! :eek:

However, I do like the Texas answer!:E People, here in New England, often express horror at GWB, I answer he is like all Texans. Get over it! Baja Oklahoma!! :ok:

con-pilot
28th Aug 2008, 01:41
Don't tell a South American that he is an American, might think you mean norte americano and NOT like it much!

Too true, but once in Colombia my dear wife replied "American" and I corrected her (paid for that later :ouch:), however, the customs agent look at me and thanked me.




(Oh, my wife forgave me,,,,,,,,,after I bought some really inexpensive, but very high quality emeralds while we were there. :ok:)


(Yes, she took them a jeweler here in the US and had them appraised. ;))

Rush2112
28th Aug 2008, 03:16
I'm English, so that's what goes on the landing cards, official forms etc. "UKish" looks as daft as the idea is.

llondel
28th Aug 2008, 03:48
Doesn't the US form ask for "Country of Citizenship"? I put UK because it's only two characters to write.

Load Toad
28th Aug 2008, 03:52
Human; everything else is bureaucracy or the accident of birth.

ZFT
28th Aug 2008, 04:23
I'm English, so that's what goes on the landing cards, official forms etc.


Likewise, but at LAX the immigration officer was not amused and made me redo the form with Britain.

(He then rejected that form as it stated my country of residence as Thailand which couldn’t be correct as I'm English!!!!!!)

Charlie Foxtrot India
28th Aug 2008, 04:39
Your nationality and your citizenship need not necessarily be the same. Here's an example of how...though I think the daft law that said a wife
HAD to take the nationality of her husband no longer applies..

My maternal grandfather was from the US, and when he married my English born grandmother in 1920-something they settled in England, yet she and all their english born daughters were automatically US citizens - though none of them had ever been out of England. Grandfather did a bunk back to the US in the 30s leaving them all in England, so during WW2 they were classed as "Stateless aliens" and my grandmother had to report regularly to the police, while mum and her sisters were made wards of court. The only way they could get a British passport was to marry a Brtish citizen.

Me I am ENGLISH though my passports are Australian and British (Jersey).

Caractacus
28th Aug 2008, 07:34
"Having checked with the Ministry of Justice, I can confirm that the use of the term ‘UK’ as nationality on forms, is in fact the most legally correct terminology to use – standing as it does for the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland

They are talking out of their bottoms as usual. My passport says 'British Islands - Isle of Man'.

I cannot use the terms English, Scottish, Welsh, Irish or 'UK'.

I am a British Citizen.

Diatryma
28th Aug 2008, 07:55
Nation - "a large body of people, associated with a particular territory, that is sufficiently conscious of its unity to seek or to possess a government peculiarly its own" (Dictionary.com)

Doesn't Texas have it's own government? I think the Texan might have a point!

Di :cool:

Whirlygig
28th Aug 2008, 08:18
Aren't we technically British subjects? :}

Cheers

Whirls

jimma
28th Aug 2008, 08:29
I consider myself to be English, not British, or UK(ish). Thats what I put on all my forms.

WorkingHard
28th Aug 2008, 09:18
The replies are what I expected and what everyone, outside officialdom believes, BUT with more and more goverment forms on line we are not being given any options other than UK. So if you need to complete a form then unless you select UK you cannot continue.
How do we stop/change this anyone?

Scooby Don't
28th Aug 2008, 09:42
The Thatcher government did away with subjecthood and made us citizens. No wonder the queen never liked her....

G-CPTN
28th Aug 2008, 09:56
What will they do when Scotland gets independence?

Flap 5
28th Aug 2008, 10:11
We will end up going the way of the USA. Now what are people from the USA called? Americans? Er no. US Citizens?

So - UK Citizens? We started off as English. That had to change to British. Soon we will be just Earthlings. :rolleyes:

WorkingHard
28th Aug 2008, 11:45
Yes Flaps5 but that is citizenship NOT nationality.

Argonautical
28th Aug 2008, 12:51
Not sure how widespread this UK nonsense is, because I have just received my Voter Registration Form which states "British" in the Nationality column.

Nick Riviera
28th Aug 2008, 13:24
Following the complete bollox of a marketing man's brand naming of our Olympic squad, I shall now define myself as a citizen of Team UK.

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh!
28th Aug 2008, 13:38
Likewise, but at LAX the immigration officer was not amused and made me redo the form with Britain.I'm surprised because over here, they generally use the term UK for citizenship.


I gave up using the term British years ago after realising that the Scots would never use it so why should I? I never used UK unless I had to because, well why would you? For I while I've used the term English, but I think I'm going to add a modifier, so that I can say "English (Northern)"




In fact they have these pointless EEOC forms over here associated with any job application. EEOC stands for Equal Employment Opportunities Commision and you get to (voluntarily) fill the thing in with every job application. It's supposed to simply track what races are applying for jobs and they say it'll be separated from the application and not used to qualify an applicant, but I don't really believe that. So if I fill them in at all, where it says race, I put English ;)

Davaar
28th Aug 2008, 14:06
The sign on the big building reads "British High Commission".

Load Toad
28th Aug 2008, 15:08
I was born in the Fanny Deakin ward at the NSRI Stoke-on-Trent. I'm proud to be Fannyish.

makintw
28th Aug 2008, 15:14
Mams a Finn and me dad's English.

So am I Finnglish?

Evening Star
28th Aug 2008, 23:04
Marvellous makintw, you have just made me Germlish and my daughter Ruslish.:ooh:

Widger
28th Aug 2008, 23:11
Me I am ENGLISH though my passports are Australian and British (Jersey).

Actually CFI..you are Crappo!

Loose rivets
29th Aug 2008, 00:03
Thread creeping as I'm prone to do, I was asked by the US immigration what race i was. I didn't know, and she said leave it blank.

Years later, when getting involved with a much stricter US immigration office, I was finally given my official racial status. "White, non Hispanic." So, that's a White, non Hispanic English person then.

Race? We were sitting round a dinner table late one night in Austin, and there was a charming Jewish young lady who was speaking passionatley about her religion. When I mentioned race, she protested that it wasn't race but religion. The Maitre de was also Jewish, and he protested that it was indeed a race...clearly, and by definition. So, Gentileism makes me what...Gentilish? Gentilish English?

I want to be a number!!!! Six will do -- if it's not still taken. Soooooo much easier.

Load Toad
29th Aug 2008, 00:48
Does it matter what race you are? Why do they need to know - they can see your picture, they know your name, where you live etc. If you are mixed race how mixed do you have to be before they can't work out what you are? Why do I have to have a nationality - can't I pick the bits of things I like and support or identify that way? I'm British, English, Stokeish...do I identify with my street, house - the fact that I was born down me muthers birth canal? What did I ever contribute to the UK apart from a bit of tax?

G-CPTN
29th Aug 2008, 01:20
I want to be a number!!!! I think the Nazis already tried that . . .

If you are mixed race how mixed do you have to be before they can't work out what you are?I don't think that half-cast is PC in these enlightened times.

YouTube - BLUE MINK '1969, live' - Melting Pot....$ully (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HK0ne7I9YgQ)

con-pilot
29th Aug 2008, 02:35
I want to be a number!!!! Six will do -- if it's not still taken. Soooooo much easier.

Sorry, I already have 6, you can have 7, I think it is still free. ;)

James 1077
29th Aug 2008, 05:25
If you are mixed race how mixed do you have to be before they can't work out what you are?


Well my blonde haired, blue eyed children are 1/4 Vietnamese (Chinese), 1/2 NZ European (Pakeha) and 1/4 White per the various race classifications of their parents' home nations.

Its all bollox anyway - why is it anybody's business what racial classification I associate myself with - and why do they assume that I care anyway?

CUNIM
29th Aug 2008, 15:19
My number is 666:E

sisemen
29th Aug 2008, 16:05
Must be a bit of a devil getting into church

MagnusP
29th Aug 2008, 16:20
Well, the legislation that defines this is the British Nationality Act 1981, and the main categories are "British otherwise than by descent", i.e. born here or born to parents working overseas on crown service, and "British by descent", e.g. born overseas to parents who are in the first category.

The Act is available online at: British Nationality Act 1981 (entry into force on 1 January 1983) - Legislationline - free online legislation database (http://www.legislationline.org/legislation.php?tid=11&lid=3866)

CUNIM
29th Aug 2008, 16:23
Nah I go in as a hoodie and stay off the Viagra:ok:

ORAC
29th Aug 2008, 16:56
ICAO 9303 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Machine-readable_passport) has the codes used in Machine Readable Travel Documents. These are basically those from ISO 3166-1 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISO_3166-1_alpha-3) with some additional codes for international organisations such as the UN, Red Cross etc and for nations, such as GB, where they others to distinguish UK citizens from others who have GB passports but no right of residence etc.

One of the banes of my life at the moment, along with codes for document types...

United Kingdom:

2 letter code: GB, (Code taken from "Great Britain", part of its official name "United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland", UK also exceptionally reserved* (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISO_3166-1_alpha-2#Exceptional_reservations) on request of the United Kingdom)

3 letter codes:
British....
GBR: Citizen
GBD: Dependent territories citizen
GBN: National (Overseas)
GBO: Overseas citizen
GBP: Protected person
GBS: Subject


*Exceptionally reserved alpha-2 code elements are reserved permanently at the request of national ISO member bodies, governments and international organizations because they are needed for particular purposes. ISO 3166/MA only authorizes their use for the particular purpose for which they were established.

UK: Reserved on request of the United Kingdom, used for the Internet ccTLD .uk, and by the European Commission.

selfloadingcargo
29th Aug 2008, 21:05
makintw....actually that makes you an Engine...

Gargleblaster
29th Aug 2008, 21:37
To escalate the confusion, to which continent do the British Isles and the peoples living there belong ?

The "Brits" go to Europe for business meetings, sun, drinks, disco and what's even more entertaining, but where are they coming from ?

A piece of Earth that doesn't belong to any continent ?

I have worked for both USAean and British companies, I'm trying to figure out who I like worst. Leaning towards the Brits for the silly obsession with a dress code !

Drink, uzi, hat, coat, I'm outta here...

tony draper
29th Aug 2008, 22:17
"A piece of Earth that doesn't belong to any continent"
Thank **** for that, God knew exactly what he was doing.:E
Now we have discovered Truffles growing here we need have nowt more to do wi that bloody continent.
:)

boredcounter
29th Aug 2008, 23:58
Now where's the box to advise 'by how many generations' and 'Where born'

Until such time, I shall be English, my place of birth is a Town in a County in England.

Therefore English.

All Other 'UK' Countries want their own identity, I will stick to mine thanks.

merlinxx
30th Aug 2008, 05:41
Well Con, Texas did have an Embassy in St. James St. in London from 1836 to 1845. Texas was recognized as an Independent Sovereign State before they joined the Union.

merlinxx
30th Aug 2008, 05:49
I'm going to tell Alistair C. about you, nicking his monica will get you :E:mad::\

WorkingHard
3rd Sep 2008, 21:15
I am amazed that the consensus on here seems to be the civil serpents can do as they please with our birthright and no one seems to care. Please tell me I have misunderstood the mood.

merlinxx
3rd Sep 2008, 22:06
White Welsh Dwarf, thus I is a Sussex resident British (I think) person. Want to argue, I'll get the Sussex Taffia after yers!





I'm Welsh born, but Sussex adopted and proud of it, a British patriot through and through!! If you don't like it, go self abuse!

G-CPTN
4th Sep 2008, 00:36
Is Scotland still part of the Commonwealth? :confused: