British Sovereign Territory?

[Wyler]

My eldest daughter was born in Cyprus at Akrotiri which is British Sovereign Territory. I got her Birth Certifictae which states quite clearly that she is a British Citizen.
Being 17 she has just got her Provisional License which states that she was born in Cyprus. Having used this recently for ID purposes she was held up for ages so that checks could be done regarding her Nationality.
Now, before I go windmilling into the DVLA could others out there just confirm that I am correct in stating that RAF Akrotiri is part of the UK in the same way as an Embassy is?

Thankyou.

[Jimlad1]

I believe that is the case - when the Island gained independence in the 1960s, the SBAs were retained as UK territory and not given to the Cypriots and leased back.

[minigundiplomat]

I believe that to be the case.
The problem is that all these public bodies now contain a fair percentage of retards, and it is easier for them to slavishly follow a list than exercise any common sense or free thought.

Good luck.

[goudie]

My middle daughter was also born at Akrotiri and we/she never had a problem. You are correct, your daughter has same status as if born in U.K.

[Tiger_mate]

...and my daughter was born at BMH Rinteln, which despite being in Germany is also Sovereign Territory. However she does not have a Birth certificate as we know it, but a photocopy of an entry into an official document of the British Consulate. Despite this, we have never had any problems at all with her integrity as a British National. It sounds like you got an ignorant jobsworth at the wrong time of the month. Doh! Am I allowed to say that nowadays?

[Jackonicko]

Are you allowed to say that?

I don't know, but I would..... but then I have little patience with PC

and if anyone picks you up, you can always point to dear old MGD's pejorative use of the term retard which even makes me uncomfortable.

[minigundiplomat]

Apologies if I have made you uncomfortable.

To sum up my understanding of the EO brief, it is fine if you apply things uniformally (or equally hence EO). It is when you single people out because of their differences.

Should I point out that Dept A contains a high percentage of jobsworth/retards/obstructive or recalcitrant individuals, then that is fine. Should I say that person X of Dept A is a retard, that breaches EO guidelines.

All hypothetical so no harm done. Anyway, if I can put my life on the line for oil/US Foreign Policy/Drugs, then I have no problem calling things exactly as I see them.

Enjoy the rest of your Sunday.

[rogerk]

I thought that after registration of the birth with the British Consulate in Germany you forwarded the registration certificate and obtained a Birth Certficate "proper" from UK ??

[Chugalug2]

you forwarded the registration certificate and obtained a Birth Certficate "proper" from UK ??

That's certainly the way of it (or was) with Marriage Certificates. I married overseas and we received a "Lex Locii" certificate from the British Embassy. That in turn produced a UK Marriage Certificate from Somerset House (in those days) on return to the UK.

[November4]

I was born in BMH Steamer Point, Aden. Left there at 6 weeks old. First time I applied for a passport got asked about dates of naturalisation, immigration status etc. Sent a copy of my birth cert (British) and after a long wait finally got my passport and not really had any problem since. If asked normally just send a copy of the birth cert and that suffices.

[bjcc]

I was born on the other SBA, at Dhekalia, and I'm afraid she'll just have to grin and bear it. Although yes, she was born on 'British' Soil, that happens to be on Cyprus.

There isn't anything she can do about it, it can be a problem on occations, insurance companys for example have difficulty understanding it, but you get used to it.

On thinking about it, there is one thing that helps, I usually put in large letters 'BRITISH MILITARY HOSPITAL' Dhekalia as place of birth. So try RAF Hospital, as TPMH wont make sense to most poeple.

[ShyTorque]

and my daughter was born at BMH Rinteln, which despite being in Germany is also Sovereign Territory. However she does not have a Birth certificate as we know it, but a photocopy of an entry into an official document of the British Consulate.

My son was born there too (1983) and he does have a UK birth certifcate. My daughter also does, having been born in the far east.

[Tiger_mate]

Ref: BMH births & Birth Certificates.

It looks like my daughter who does have a Passport & Driving Licence and has never had a UK Birth Certificate should perhaps apply for one. 26 years late is better then never I suppose. A productive Pprune thread in the mil forum; how unique!!

[Green Flash]

Now, I may have been victim of an urban myth but I'm sure I heard a story in BFG in the 80's. A service man's son turned 18 whilst in the FRG. The son had been born in Germany during his dads first tour, had been registered at the BMH (Wegberg?) but had not been registered at the British Embassy (not too sure of the details here). Anyway, the FRG authorities knew all about him and he recieved an invitation for national service in the Heer! According to them he was German and despite being aware of the circumstances they played hard ball. He did, however, get a few breaks. A crash course in German (one to one) and a posting to the local Pioneer Battalion (the boys in blue). They put him through lots of driving courses and he got a trade (sparky/plumber/brickie) and then released him after about a year in time for his dads tourex.

[bjcc]

Green Flash

Something similar was doing the rounds at Kings School at Gutersloh in the 70's. It did cause sharpe intakes of breath, as a large number of kids there, being of army origin, had been born in and always lived in Germany, it being an army home posting.

Anyway, although the story was going round, apparently about someone who'd been at Kings, no one seemed to know anything about him, so, I doubt there was any truth to it.

Although having said that, apprently, so my mother told me, ladies, with child in Cyprus, who's hubby were stationed at Nicocia, were put into hotels in Larnaca, when nearly due, and then rushed blue light style to the BMH at Dhekalia at the first sign of labour. Apparently, this was because the Cypriots would lay claim to any babies born in the Republic, not on the SBA. So I guess if it didn't happen in Germany, it could have in Cyprus.

[Shackman]

Both sons born in Cyprus - #1 at BMH Dhekelia, #2 at TPMH, whilst I was serving at Nicosia just after the Turkish Invasion. Both were issued Birth Certificates under the special provisions Act 0f 1957 - should have a Form ORS 7. Applied for passports for both as soon as 16 - son #1 had no problems as Nicosia was still RAF, and BC clearly stated British Military Hospital and RAF Son#2 had more problems as BC just said TPMH and by then we were UNPA Nicosia, but eventually granted and has had no problems since. It seemed to be luck of the jobsworth at the time.

IIRC at the time there were lots of problems with very large Turkish women trying to get through the fence into SBA North so as to be rushed into BMH and thus claim British Nationality for child!

[Green Flash]

bjcc

It was indeed in the Gutersloh area I heard this story, but in the mid 80's. I believe the dad was RAF MT or something related and his first tour had been in the Clutch. Maybe one of those old mil chestnuts that occaisionally did the rounds.

[bjcc]

Having thought a bit more, I guess if mum was a German, then there is every chance it could happen.

[Green Flash]

The story I heard was that both parents were from Scotland

[charliegolf]

Golf minor was born at Rinteln in '84, and i got the birth cert from the retired major in one of the families' offices on the base (Gut). I asked about dual nationality (out of interest), and was told that there was no problem- except for the national service committment.

CG

[Wyler]

Thankyou one and all.

Both arms to ramming speed.......:E

[teeteringhead]

Maybe an urban myth, but I did hear tell of a problem with a couple of army families.

Two army brats, who were both born in Germany, got married. Neither were service themselves, and their issue was duly produced in the UK. However, there was some problem with the child's passport, as neither parent had been born in UK.

The Passport (of the child) stated that they were a British Subject rather than British Citizen, which meant some places wanted visas when they didn't normally for Brits...?

By the bye, the senior teeterette was born in BMH Rinteln, and has had no problems - well not with passports, birth certs etc :ouch: - she has a rather grand birth cert from the consulate in Hannover, all fancy writing and headed "Her Britannic Majesty's Consul-General in Hannover". In fact, she thimnks it makes her more important than her siblings.....

[Beatriz Fontana]

Ex-mother-in-law was born in Palestine during the British Mandate. All sorts of issues with passports and naturalisation, but it was all sorted back in the 1950s. So the Cyprus problem, er, shouldn't be!

[Shadwell the old]

Wyler,

Check your PMs. (but give me time to write it!)

Shadwell

[GreenKnight121]

A family I am close to had 3 daughters born in Germany (to an American mother & German father).

Thus they held dual citizenship, but through the years have had intermittent problems going to Germany to visit their father. It was made clear through numerous visits to various embassies, etc. that their German citizenship was only due to their father's citizenship, and had nothing to do with place of birth.

Their father even had to write a letter declaring he had not disavowed them (at the divorce) before they would be granted entry as German citizens.

So I really doubt the legend of conscription due to place of birth.

[sparkie]

My Daughter was born in Singapore (RAF Changie Hospital) in 1968, we were issued with 2 birth certificates, 1 British and 1 very nicely laminated Singapore version. When she reached 18 she received a letter from the Singapore Government stating she was eligible for National Service if she so wished! she didnt.

She now lives permanently in Gibraltar with our 4 Grandchildren, and has never had any problems obtaining a British passport.