QF Long Haul Cabin Crew Voluntary Redundacy

[surfside6]

Although oil prices are on the way down demand for travel is softening.
Qantas is currently reviewing its entire operation.
It has already identified "a surplus to requirements number of LH CC".
This is another opportunity for the company to remove those CC from its payroll that it deems as expensive.
The current economic climate will more than likely cause many crew to resist this tempting offer.
Most likely announced in the next few weeks redundancies would become effective in either November or early 2009.
A couple of CC middle management are also likely to be shown the door due to poor performance.

[speedbirdhouse]

Mmmmm.

"Filthy" will no doubt be pleased as with others who have worked with him of late.:ok:

But I for one will be very sad to see so many of the old guard go.

People of the caliber of "Mr Chardonnay" will never be replaced.

Those I speak to who fly [paid] in the pointy end won't be happy either.:(

[stubby jumbo]

......'apparently 2 of the CCM/Visitors have been punted ( and not before time) back to where they belong as "ushers" at the Opera House.

All of these incompetents have done their time.!!!!

This Mark Hassell inspired -CREW CONNECT experiment has been an abject failure from Day #1.

GOOD RIDDANCE............DOPES:*

[cuzzybro]

Could anyone please explain the two types of Redundancy that QF has offered in the past ie VR and VCR, which type the next one will be and will it be both long & short haul crews. Any info greatly appreciated.

[Whenwe]

I would rather fly via the sandpit than on QF direct to SYD. You have the most illmannered cabin crew that I have ever come accross, even worse than SAA. Confirmed as recently as 2 weeks ago.
I hope those are the ones that go first.

[speedbirdhouse]

Mmmmm......

A Yarpie pontificating about manners :confused:

[Ka.Boom]

The newest and most junior crew are usually those on the QF 63/64 to and from JNB

[speedbirdhouse]

Correction.

Always.........

I have found in life that one does, more often than not, get what one pays for...........

[Sunfish]

There are a number of American Companies that have tried the brilliant and obvious business strategy of getting rid of experienced (and slightly more expensive) customer service staff and replacing them with newbies..

I know of two who are now in, or close to, administration after there was a mass exodus of customers in response to non existent, or poor, customer service.

One is Circuit City:

How Circuit City Committed Suicide
Posted by Joel Johnson, December 30, 2007 4:22 AM | permalink

From Prospect.org's Beat the Press, summarizing this piece from the Washington Post:

The basic story is that last March, the wise men who run Circuit City came up with the brilliant idea of laying off their more senior salespeople, who get $14-$15 an hour, and replacing them with new hires who get around $9 an hour. It turns out that this move was not very good for business. One of the reasons that people go to a store like Circuit City, rather than buying things on the Internet, is that they want to be able to talk to a knowledgeable salesperson. Since Circuit City had laid off their knowledgeable salespeople, there was little reason to shop there. ... The Post reports that Circuit City's executive vice-presidents will get retention awards of $1 million each.

The good news is that this will now kill the company, preventing it from happening again; the bad news is that these executives will probably get new jobs at a new company instead of being rousted from their beds by out-of-work salespeople and perforated by pitchfork.

The other is West Marine, that owns 300+ boating stores across America.

But there is the "meta message" (the message management sends when it doesn't think it is sending a message) that such action sends that actually makes matters worse.

And that message is "Your experience is valueless. We pay no premium for experience. Our customers aren't entitled to any service anyway. Anyone can do your job with little or no training. Go away, you annoying, insignificant, little thing."

[Sunfish]

The old boilers couldn't have been nicer in a number of difficult situations I've seen with drunks, late arrivals and suchlike.

[Jabawocky]

I would rather have an articulate oldie who actually enjoys their job than a 23 yr old who is more interested in bitchy gossip in the galley.

They just need to weed out the old and new noxious weeds.....throughout the entire company!

J:ok:

Anybody want to offer me that job?

[Ka.Boom]

Gen Y is now entering the workforce....they are not customer service oriented....but....Qantas is employing them in spades.
When the "oldies"leave and are totally replaced then pax will really have something to complain about

[crosscutter]

I suppose it would be better to employ the long line of baby boomers lining up for the job then?

Coming from the "generation" who sold the juniors out?? Sounds very 'what's in it for me'. Remind me who Gen Y is again. :ugh:

As for service quality.........person dependant i say.

[argus.moon]

Those who are in their late twenties and early thirties.
Those that have some life experience and skills
A nineteen year old who kinows everything because they read it in a book.
A ninteen year old who is only going to be around for a few years and really doesnt give a toss.
A no brainer if you want service ,loyalty and a work ethic.

[DEFCON4]

The Average Australian Wage is now $58388.40.
This about what a 20 year Qantas flight attendant receives.
QAL CC are therefore not overpaid according to the ABS.
QCCA are,however,grossly underpaid.
According to Dixon QAL CC are expensive.
They receive an average Australian wage BUT are expensive.
The only person at QF who is bloody expensive is bloody Dixon.

[mrpaxing]

there are many who disagree with your assessment,defcon4, but why did you as union official sell out the QCA so cheaply?
incoming:eek::oh:

[Machinegun Fellatio]

Defcon4 was an official in the early nineties.
Still keeps a finger on the pulse.
Had nothing to do with the last EBA except for voting like any other FAAA member

[lowerlobe]

The majority of people who post on PPrune allow themselves a veil of anonymity......

Why then do I get the impression that a number of people who post on Cabin Crew matters are in some way directly linked to the union and that they know each others identity?

Machinegun.....Are you Defcon's pa or something?

As has just been said....incoming:eek:

[argusmoon]

You are impressionable.
People tell each other about this forum.Ergo there will people on here that know each other.
You love a good conspiracy theory.
Dixon has never missed an opportunity to dismiss staff...911,Sars,oilprice ..you name it he uses it.
This current round of redundancies is a perfect example.
Mind you some of the people who will go/have gone should never have been employed in the first place....the four visitors.
Group General Manager is an other person who has ouststayed their welcome.
Next stop for them ....retirement

[lowerlobe]

Argusmoon...No arguments about the office dwellers and I hope they get a taste of their own medicine but as far as a conspiracy theory goes ....

I don't think it's a surprise that the union has it's own spin doctors as well as the company and that the boys in the bunker use PPrune as a media outlet.....No conspiracy there......just an observation....:oh:

I agree with you about impending change of scenery in the office and to be honest that usually happens whenever the job at the top changes as well...

[Ka.Boom]

Will there be a stampede for this offering of VR?
Good time to retire if you are around 60yrs old....all that super and no tax.
Must be tempting

[teresa green]

Give me the Boilers anyday, at least they are not in the galley lining up their SMS'S to be hit the moment they are off the A/C, they are actually conversing and taking care of the PAX, and whilst on the subject, exactly what are the Cabin Managers actually doing these days? In my day you actually saw one (if only a fleeting glance) I have not seen one on my last four trips. Have they been hunted to extinction? I was used to the days where they were all over the ship. Those older pilots will well remember the likes of Pat Mcgann, Peter Owens, and their ilk. Top Operators who whilst cared for their crews, did not put up with any bludgers. The sharp end never had to worry about what was happening up the back with those blokes in charge.

[packrat]

You are 70 and still flying?
Hooley Dooley

[mrpaxing]

cabin managers are pinned down in business class these days.
apart from fixing broken seats, ife's in p/c,j/c there is also the never ending paperwork. time permitting they might find time to have a peek down the back. i feel sorry for them as they are jack of all trades these days and have to put up with all the s*&(,courtesy of many failures in the chain.

[teresa green]

No, only a Bonanza these days packrat, no, I did a trip to Europe recently, must say the C/C were great on all sectors (4) and no complaints but never laid eyes on a manager. I see as you say they have no time, being part time engineers etc. that explains it.

[indamiddle]

something with wings.
any crew over 55 and not taking a TRP is missing out on boosting their super. if not, see your financial adviser.
current union mgt post under guadian 1, pegasus 747 and one other with a number in it i have forgotten.
age has little to do with work ethic, experience comes in handy when things get difficult or complicated

[Ka.Boom]

Confirmation posted on company website today confirming impending VR.
It will be for all bases and all categories.

[Sonique]

Incorrect.

VR expressions of interest open from 20 AUG for 2 weeks for Qantas LONG HAUL crew only.

[Pegasus747]

YOu have two weeks from 20th August to put in an initial expression of interest. It is from this that the company will produce a calculation of what you are worth in terms of redundancy.

During this two week period 99% of crew that are over a "certain" age become tyre kickers and request the "info"

Following this period of tyre kicking..those that are serious about redundancy will go to seminars at the FAAA, QANTAS and get independent advice.

Then they will put in an "Irrevocable" application which will be actioned by the company depending on the number of slots available etc

Sadly some of the "experts" that crew ask for advice are in the back galley and this often leads to "poor" decisions.

I recommend that no one applies for redundancy unless they have got seriously good advice. Super is down atm, and you also have unlimited access to Part TIme and if over the appropriate age, access to transition to retirement plans via super.

Get good advice and for those considering it good luck to you as you have earned it :)

[packrat]

In essence you are renting a $250million aircraft for 24 hours to transport you to a destination and back.
Like most who sit in the pointy end it is doubtful you are paying the freight out of your own pocket.
If you are then there is most likely a tax break available that reduces the cost considerably.
Now then this thread is about Longhaul Cabin Crew VR.
If you want a bitchfest about Cabin Crew start a thread of your own.

[prunezeuss]

Qantas has announced today that it is extending the offer of VR to domestic flight attendants.
Sonique the little hedgehog jumped too soon with his/her pronouncement of incorrect

[YONLY]

Gosh you lot get easily riled! Who cares about hot towels... I thought this was about LH VR?

[Tidbinbilla]

INDEED!

Some people may actually be interested in gathering information about the alleged topic.

The rest of you who want to carry on like a bunch of school kids - take it to Jet Blast!

TID

[lowerlobe]

Does anyone know what would happen IF the company does not get enough applications from existing or original crew?

Is there a stipulation in the EBA regarding VR allocation?

If not completely subscribed will the company then have to take the remainder of the required number from the latest (QCCA) crew or can they take them from either group regardless?

[L5Brassco]

EBA 8 Section 2.17 Compulsory Redundancies.
Stipulates reverse order of seniority.
QCCA and mohicans are grouped together in this reverse order,therefore it will be QCCA first off for compulsory redundancies

L5B

[blackguard]

Most of those who wanted to go have already gone.
Part time is available.
Transition to retirement pension is available.
The economy is flat
Why leave?
Unfortunately if the company doesnt get the numbers there are those that may have a very short flying career.

[L5Brassco]

So what sort of package can our QCCA colleagues expect after 6 months with QF?
Wonder what the $ are for both voluntary and compulsory redundancy for
QCCA.
Then in 6 months with the A380s arriving apply again (with "experience":rolleyes:).

L5B

[domo]

Unfortunately if the company doesnt get the numbers there are those that may have a very short flying career.

Its only Vr to get rid of people
jeff said that they would minimise Cr
If they dont get the numbers then they sit on their hands and talk to the union to go to CR

ps what are the numbers

[packrat]

The bad economic news just keeps coming.The full impact of the sub prime meltdown and the interest rate rises of the last two years have not yet been fully felt in Australia.
Unless you have no mortgage and plenty of income generating investments now is not a good time to consider leaving a relatively well paid and secure job.
See a financial advisor or a very good accountant before jumping ship.
There are alternatives.

[QFUKflyer]

hi just needed to post something after reading the full thread...

im really discusted with a few of the comments about age of the crew. I work out of the LHR base and we have a wide range of uk and australian crew and big range of age and there is not any difference to how we all work and are with the pax. Infact we get so much feed back about the difference it is to see involved crew enjoying our work and smiling crew compared to the previous sector. That say's alot to us... and the the australians that hare here working love the fact they work with younger crew as they now notice how backwards syd lh is in ways when it comes to issues..

and just my last rant the thing about young crew in galleys bitching etc... listen to what you are writing you are bitching and moaning just as much !! look in before you look out guys its the attitude like this that brings the moral down in your work place.

[jmc_757-200]

Hey,

I just wanted to say how sick I am at having to listen to some crew, notably older Australian crew, moaning and whining non-stop and talking about how 'it used to be' - just in case you weren’t aware things do change and for a company to survive in the current climate these changes are absolutely necessary. If you have such a problem with it and dislike your jobs so much so that everytime I enter the crew room in HKG and BKK all I hear is incessant moaning; then leave and get a new job and do us all a favour!

Having worked L4A many, many times I worked as L1P for the first time last week and on both sectors it was great to hear from passengers how they felt they had received the best service they have ever been given...the service came from me, a 19 year old crew member so that just goes to show that age means nothing when it comes to service!

jmc_757-200

[argus.moon]

This is about Redundancy.
Give the Base comparisons a break.
Start a thread about it if you want...dont make anymore comments here.
Its about redundancy...get it?

[speedbirdhouse]

Yes.

We all know that the excellent survey results that have seen Skytrax rating Qantas as third best airline in the world was solely a result of the efforts of our illiterate 19 year old English flight attendants.

Just imagine.

When the last career flight attendant finally leaves Qantas imagine just how fantastic the service will be given that management will finally have exactly what it wants.

Skytrax will be surely be voting Qantas number one..........

[stubby jumbo]

just had a chat wih my friendly manager re:"package":}

The advice was " this will DEFINITELY" be the last package on offer.

Oh yeah.

Like .....this is the 4th offering in 5 years. Pull the other one you clown !

Maybe we can talk the Leprechaun into offering ALL cabin crew managers "special packages"........we could save over $30K per person in wages-chumps.

Pllleeeeeeeeeze:oh:

[QFUKflyer]

yes i get it i am not stupid , but i was doing a highlight to what has been said in the full thread here already so do you get it ?

end of conversation!

[speedbirdhouse]

Riiiiiiiiiiiiight...........:}

[stubby jumbo]

.....like ,you all kno me bruvva's up here in dis base are all pridy young and that ....like....all them in sydlh....like they are old and that ....and but yeah but....like i wish they wud all take the pakage and like leave so that we can win more skytrax medals and like......it wud sow that mi and mi mates up here are the reel spirit of quantas.

wat do youuse all fink:hmm:

[capt.cynical]

QFUKFLYER, Do you have a cousin in Australia named "GIGGS" :E:D:ugh:

[lowerlobe]

Nice one Stubby.... oops I mean......like rooly noice wun bro....:E

[indamiddle]

i,for one, will not be taking the package. i have been so inspired by 'QFUK...' that i am now going to apply for the next london posting available. to be able to work with such magnificent people is beyond my wildest dreams. of course i will have to take a pay cut to $28000 base p/a, live in a squat,won't be able to afford a couple of pints in the pub a week, put up with the pommy weather, buy my veggies etc in hkg sin and bkk.... on second thoughts, has VR closed?

[lowerlobe]

Now there's a thought indamiddle...

Is this VR package limited to Australian Cabin Crew or is it available to Australian crew who applied for and are resident on the LHR base at the moment as well?

[indamiddle]

in the last package lhr crew could take it. #2 (c.e.) was in london base when she took vr

[outandabout]

LHR Aust based crew can take the package, but they work out their contract with Qantas UK.

[QFUKflyer]

.....like ,you all kno me bruvva's up here in dis base are all pridy young and that ....like....all them in sydlh....like they are old and that ....and but yeah but....like i wish they wud all take the pakage and like leave so that we can win more skytrax medals and like......it wud sow that mi and mi mates up here are the reel spirit of quantas.

wat do youuse all finkhttp://static.pprune.org/images/smilies/yeees.gif



this made me laugh lmao... as people from london do sound like that... but me on the other hand like more than half the base are not come from england and not london lol but thanks for the laugh .... small country big difference in where we all stay lol you guys crack me up !!:ugh::=:D

[lowerlobe]

as people from london do sound like that
Cockney must have changed since I was last in London....

but me on the other hand like more than half the base are not come from england and not london lol but thanks for the laugh
Sounds more like Yoda talking than Cockney....

Do the PA's made by the crew out of the LHR base come with subtitles on the IFE screens?

....:eek:..If so what happens if (when) the IFE system is down?