EC135 for Devon AAT

[Cpt_Pugwash]

Whilst down in Devon at the weekend, I heard some news about this, subsequently confirmed by the report here (http://www.daat.org/site/1/news.html?&nv_item=21) . I have no comment on the purchase vs lease issue, but I was not aware of the issue regarding the use of the Bo105 for EMS after 2009.

Presumably this will apply to the Wales Air Ambulance too.

Probably old news, just me behind the curve as usual. :hmm:

[Helinut]

Captain,

As you say an interesting press release. It is also not clear who they will get their pilotage from nor whose AOC this will operate under. It almost sounds like the D&C police are looking to provide pilotage too. That would be an interesting departure, if it happened. :ooh:

In the police world, the UK requirement to go to autopilot machines arises from night flying requirements. What is the HEMS requirement to get rid of Bo105s, (as UK HEMS is day only)?

Nuts

[bolkow]

I belive its Jar3 regulations about ability for single engine operations.
All bo105's going around the end of this year and yes, Wales are currently fundraising to replace all the bolkows with EC 135's. I do know the police in bridgend recently got an ex135 all up cost circa over 4 mil, they have it for 7 years on a ,lease all in at £1000 oper flying hour. Makes me wonder why anyone would wish to actually own it.

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Ah Sid, does that mean you are going to be a neighbour? If so you'll have to pop in for a cup of tea:ok:

[PEASACAKE]

bolkow

Based on your statement of Bridgend Police paying £1,000 per hour all in for an EC135, why is anybody purchasing an EC135. Surely everyone would lease at that competitive price.

My own calculation (very accurate based on Eurocopter stated figures)) make it greater than £1,000 per hour to operate including all components, engines and avionics on pbh. Is servicing and all components included in the £1,000 per hour price.

I am sure there are quite a few Police ASUs watching this post.

[Helinut]

Interesting how arguments are circular. The Devon AAT is extolling the virtues of ownership as the way to go, at the same time that it is obvious to others that leasing is the sensible route.

I am not sure whether Bond would offer the same rates to everyone else as they have for SEWP. Perhaps they did the South Wales thing as a loss leader. If you believe some of the figures quoted in the press from time to time, Bond charge considerably more than this for some of the HEMS aircraft they provide. The 2 competitors for the South wales contract were much more expensive (allegedly).

My experience is that the managers of ASUs have fairly entrenched positions. Some think leasing is the way to go (those who lease)- others vote for ownership (the ones that own). It is pretty difficult to change mid-stream so to speak. Presumably the Home Office would want their capital grants back if the police forces wanted to sell the aircraft, which would suddenly reduce the attractiveness of leasing as a way of saving money.

[bolkow]

I do know that locally when they collect for the air ambulance (bolkows) they quote a ruinning cost of £1000 per hour also or £15 per minute.
Apparently the EC 135 though a bigger machine with more powerful engines apparently uses less juice.