Integrated training in OAA and CTC..

[DeltaSierra2804]

Hello everybody,

My name is Damien, I am 18 years old and I would like to become an airline pilot. I am french, and I live in France. First, excuse me if my english isn't very good.

In september, I am going to England for 4 months to improve my english.

Then, I would like to integrate into Oxford Aviation Academy or CTC Wings, and if possible, APP first officer or CTC Wings Cadets.
But I have a question.

If I can't integrate these programmes, I am interested by the programm iCP in CTC for an integrated training.

But, in OAA, apart the Waypoint programme which is a modular training, is it possible to have an integrated training like iCP in CTC ? or is it just possible to have an integrated training with the APP first officer ?

If can't integrate APP, I am obliged to do the Waypoint programme, so a modular training ?

I am sorry again for my bad english.
I work it and I hope to improve it in speaking with you.

I appreciate your understanding. ;)

Thanking you in advance.

Damien.

[clanger32]

Hi Damien,
Firstly let me say your English is pretty flipping good, so don't worry about that too much, particularly with your plans to keep learning -very impressive

Secondly, on the schools you have asked about, firstly OAA. OAA, you are right has essentially two offerings, the first is the APP first officer course. This is a full time (integrated) course designed to take you from 0 hours to the frozen ATPL. The course is the main profit centre for OAA and as such they will take anyone on who can meet the funding and has the aptitude (although some will argue this - I'm only trying to state the bare facts) to pass the assessment days. There is plenty of information on here and on OAAs own website if you do a search about what to expect on the assessment days. Therefore a reasonable percentage of those that take the assessment get in - but not all as someone will undoubtedly use this thread to tell you.

Waypoint is Oxfords other offering, which as you correctly note is modular. There is no assessment to get on this course, just the requirement to have 150 hours TT before commencing the flying and the money to pay.

Where OAA and CTC differ is that as I understand it CTC Wings is basically a "pre-selected" scheme whereby acceptance onto that course means you will be given a cadet position with one of CTCs partner airlines. This means that selection is a LOT tougher and I believe the success rate is ridiculously low....a figure of 2% springs to mind...i.e. 98 out of every hundred applicants will be rejected. The ICP scheme was brought out relatively recently to compete more directly against the APP program at Oxford (and the similar schemes run by FTE in Jerez and Cabair). Currently no-one has graduated from this scheme so I don't think you can really gauge how successful this route will be. I would expect that acceptance onto the course rates are similar to Oxfords - but I don't have any direct knowledge here.

So, in short .... the CTC iCP scheme and the OAA APP scheme are very similar and are the two you should compare directly. The CTC wings scheme is effectively a cadetship, offering an excellent (none better?) chance of a job at the end, but is very hard to get into and Waypoint is purely modular.

I hope that helps...
Bon chance!

[Adios]

To state it more succinctly:

CTC Wings compares to OAA's NetJets and other airline cadet programmes, including similarly low acceptance rates in the 2-5% range.

CTC iCP compares to OAA's regular APPFO course where no job offer is attached to the course seat.

CTC has no counterpart to OAA's Waypoint modular course.

[DeltaSierra2804]

Thank you for your answer, which is very clear.

At the beginning, I though that APP and CTC Wings Cadets were an identical programme, but I note it's not case.

In France, you have just a test in maths, in physic and in english, but it's not very difficult, whereas in England, it looks harder..

The problem for me is that I have not 150 hours, I just have 75 hours.
And I don't have the time before my departure to England to do 75 hours more.
So, if I can't integrate OAA as an APP, I will opt for the CTC iCP scheme.

Bye.

Damien.

[jaimz1982]

Hi Damien,

Just to throw a curve ball.

The CTC ICP scheme does potentially have a job offer at the end of it.

You have to re-take the assessment which you failed on first time round in order to get onto their AQC course. If you pass you become a cadet and hopefully get a job (after......Hold pool type rating line training etc oh and interview!)

I say I hope I have my facts right as I am on the CTC ICP scheme and that is exactly how it was explained to me!

Me, I would say go for CTC every time, but I'm not about to start a debate over the best FTO, ill let someone else start that thread, if it's not been done already!

Best of luck, and your english is 'tres bon' with me!!

[tupues]

AQA is closed due to the hold pool being full to the brim of drowning fATPL holders from the Wings courses. And if it ever opens again and you fail to get in then you need to shell out another £2k on an MCC before you can apply to any airlines.

[jaimz1982]

Not quite how it was explained to me, but understand where you're coming from. I heard the same about the hold pool. I just hope its a tad more empty in a couple of years! Thats when ill be popping out!

[Adios]

AQC, AQA, Wings ATP, whatever the heck you want to call it, is open to all fATPL holders who pass the entry assessment, no matter where they trained. I know a recent OAA APP graduate who is treading water in that hold pool right now. This job opportunity is not attached to iCP, but I would put money on the eventual iCP graduates as being favoured above other FTO graduates for admission to the pool!

Damien,

You don't need 150 hours to enter ATPL theory, which must be complete before you can enter a CPL flying course. All you need to enrol on the theory course is an ICAO PPL and a Class 1 Medical. You will need passes in the ATPL theory exams plus 150 hours to enter a CPL flying course, but you can get the hours and the theory in any order you wish. OAA require that you do the theory with them in order to enrol on Waypoint for the flying portion of the training.

[saintexupery]

Damien, it is also worth trying the ctc cadet scheme. don't be discouraged by the low acceptance rate. there are very good threads here on the selection.