View Full Version : Royal Air Maroc flight concern

17th Jul 2008, 22:06
A concern about a domestic passenger flight in Morocco with RAM. MoroccoBoard.com reports the following in an email newsletter:

According to a bulletin printed at Wednesday, July 16th, at Morocco daily L'Economist,a Royal Air Maroc flight between Agadir & Casablanca, the plane made a brutal change of course that caused a big freight among the passengers.
During the plane descent towards the Casablanca Mohamed V Airport, suddenly, the pilot changed course and pointed the plane towards the sky in a sudden maneuver to gain altitude.
the frightened passengers thought that the pilot has just missed hitting something and that they were in danger.

The plane later made a second attempt and landed safely.
As usual, and in line with Royal Air Maroc's notorious "customer service", the pilot did not bother to offer any explication to his passengers and remained silent during the rest of the flight.
When exiting the passengers complained to the crew about the lack of explication.
the crew replied that the passengers can write about the incident if they want to.
"Go ahead, write about it" was the disdainful answer from the pilot!

This makes one wonder about the internal labor relations at Royal Air Maroc and its incidence on company operations safety.

Is there any truth that this occured? Does anybody know what could have made the flight crew make such a manoeuvre?


17th Jul 2008, 22:22
Go-Around to me.

17th Jul 2008, 22:23
Pick any one of:
maybe to avoid a bird/cloud/another aeroplane if airborne alert sounded/unable to land for some reason.
maybe to climb if they had descended too low.
maybe a bit of rough hand flying.

Nobody was hazarded. The pilot probably quite rightly felt that an explanation was not due on demand. Sometimes you just have to place your trust in other people, and not try and look over their shoulder at everything that happened. Don't worry, this has not be learned by everyone in Europe either. An excuse for every event inflight is not necessarily due!

17th Jul 2008, 22:28
No sensational reports in the UK media?
Disaster averted, misses school,orphanage etc etc.

17th Jul 2008, 22:29
Nobody was hazarded.

I know how some people hate the grammar/speeling police but I'm driven to ask what on earth that is supposed to mean?

17th Jul 2008, 22:30
Alright then, try 'nobody was placed at any risk'?

17th Jul 2008, 22:33
See? Wasn't difficult was it?

As for the OP's question, who knows? I seriously doubt however that the pilot of anything bigger than a C152 would take violent evasive action to avoid a bird.

Then again...north Africa :suspect:

17th Jul 2008, 22:46
You seen the size of the birds down there? Big? My God they're big! They're bigger than a very big thing on a biggish day. The ones that fly in the air are enormous too.

17th Jul 2008, 22:47
Thanks for the responses guys. As far as I'm aware this was only reported on in Morocco but picked up by Moroccans in the USA. All Moroccans hate RAM for one reason - price. So any ammo they can find to bash it they'll use. I must say since liberalisation of the skies prices have either stayed as they are or gone up, and BA went and sold GB Airways which served Morocco in the summer. Only RyanAir and Easyjet have entered Morocco - no Monarch.

17th Jul 2008, 22:53
Abdel, you can take it that it was nothing really unusual. If you are going to travel by air, you must expect some uncomfortable things sometimes. People get to think turbulence should not happen, 'it is the fault of the pilot'!

I regard any flight I survive (when someone else is flying) as a plus. I have once again beaten fate and lived to pay even more tax. So I am grateful. I don't go demanding explanations for any 'events' I am not happy with. Now with 31 posts under your belt, you should have learned by now that this section was not the right place to post, shouldn't you?

18th Jul 2008, 01:59
....caused a big freight among the passengers.

Wasn't aware that big freight was carried in the cabin on RAM flights...:rolleyes:
Being Africa...anything is possible, I suppose.:}

18th Jul 2008, 06:30
Pilots - It's all your own fault! If you wern't so good at landing at the first attempt then the odd go around wouldn't get so much press attention. I suggest you throw in a few go arounds on flights at random...say one or two a week and... oh well perhaps it's not such a good idea. We'd probably see headlines like "Pilot lands plane without a practise go"..."Passengers surprised by sudden landing"..."Terror on the ground" etc

18th Jul 2008, 06:35
Hi, Rainbow and Flintstone. If I remember correctly, a B727 had a head opn with an eagle [feathered variety] in that area a good few years ago. The bird smashed through the nose cone, and penetrated the flight deck with enough force to break one of the co- pilots legs!!!!! Sounds far fetched??? No. Absoulutely true, remember seeing the photos of the dead bird ON the flight deck. Nasty.

18th Jul 2008, 06:47
If I remember correctly, a B727 had a head opn with an eagle [feathered variety] in that area a good few years ago

It was actually at Khartoum, yes I personally saw it, and it was definitely not a pretty sight.:yuk:
The airplane was doing 340 knots indicated at 4000 agl....
Not an especially bright idea.

18th Jul 2008, 10:47
With 2,027 posts, you should be a lot nicer to new posters.:)

Which forum should it go in? The SFL one seems to be the best one for passengers to post in, without getting in the way of these self important people who don't like their main forums polluting with the ignorance that the wage payers want answering.

Have a beautiful day, and if there's a better forum to post these questions in, feel free to let me know:confused:

Pax Vobiscum
18th Jul 2008, 15:32
My guess is that it was originally posted on R&N, then moved here by a sharp-eyed mod. If you post stuff like that on the main board (no matter how inexperienced) you can expect a few prickly comments :ok: (and even if it was posted directly on SLF, there are plenty of threads plus the FAQs covering standard go-arounds, which is what this looks like to my untutored eye.)

18th Jul 2008, 16:06
Gwyn- it was posted on Rumours and News and moved here. In no way can a subject like this be posted there, especially by someone with a bit of posting history! I take your point about wage payers, but this is actually a forum for Prof Pilots to discuss aviation, with access open for all. When it becomes a forum for ungruntled passengers to demand explanations for their flights, I, along with most other pilots will leave (to great applause, maybe). BTW, my wage payer is actually my employer, who has my loyalty. Any issues passengers have with their flights are better addressed to their airline, not to the generic staff group who had the responsibility to transport them!

18th Jul 2008, 16:46
Guys relax,

I posted it there (R&N) to get a response from pilots, however I have no issue with it being moved, I wasn't too sure where to place it initially.
My aim in posting was to try and see what could have caused the pilot to suddenly pull up and then have RAM not explain the reason to passengers, though I appreciate the incident only took place a few days ago. I'll save my thoughts to attitudes contained in some posts however!

18th Jul 2008, 18:17
Hi Abdel,
As a pilot doing a go-around is no big deal, sort of like a takeoff starting in the air, however it can be a bit disconcerting to those in back. Even the cabin crew gets a bit uncomfortable, all have a mental picture of a routine landing and just when they are expecting a touchdown, the power increases and the nose pitches up. I've had a few go-arounds in my career and when it does happens, once the aircraft is setup, we have spoken to ATC and the workload allows I make an announcent to reassure the passengers and to let them know what has just happened.
Seems the RAM crew made no effort to communicate with the passengers(customers) and have unecessarily upset them.

22nd Jul 2008, 00:24
We are almost 400 pilots, that makes around 180 copilots.Those 180 are all nationals and have upgraded for 99% of them from the national school of aviation: ENPL Ecole nationale des Pilotes de Ligne. Now RAM is hiring pilots from "eagle jet". There are as of now around 35 of them. I do not know there back ground. But what i do know is that they fly with qualified instructors. The same guys that qualified me on type some time ago.

"Just so passengers know, your co-pilot on a Royal Air Maroc flight is usually NOT a professional pilot! They have handed over a large amount of money to the company for the "experience" of sitting in the right hand seat"

So just chek your files before throwing something like that.