Buying Hong kong property

[Happydays]

If you buy hong kong property is it a 99years lease or title dead (yours forever)

[Ballistic Amah]

Happy,

In my experience, there is no freehold in HK any longer. When you do the property search a part of the legal aspect of the purchase you will see the original lease and how much time is remaining on that lease. For example you may buy a property that is on a 75 year lease but the lease is already 25 years old hence there is only 50 years left on it. They don't start over when you buy.

BA

[trevfly]

whateve happens you will make 30-35% a year if you buy now. No? Ask your mates, you cannot loose (at the moment).
I suspect the momentum will continue

[Dan Winterland]

Heard of sub-prime? Hong Kong won't be immune to the credit squeeze.


HK Trivia: the only non Governement freehold property in Hong Kong is St John's Catherdral.

[FairlieFlyer]

witness the sales of pilot owned prpperty as people head for the door (and canada)...

[Busbert]

The lease on all leasehold property in HKG (i.e. all except St Johns Cath which is the only privately held freehold property in HKG) expires on 30 June 2047, i.e. 50 years from the handover. That is the provision in the basic law and joint declaration.

No guarantees after that date :)

[Happydays]

So if all lease expires in 2047. Who will buy a place then in the last 20 years (If it takes 20 years to pay it off) ? Or am I missing something ?

[anotherbusdriver]

That's not true. My last property was bought new from the developer and came with a 96 year lease. Renewable.
I don't think the perpetual lease is a problem, it's more than likely to be renewed by the Government on expiration - if you're still here after 20years or so.

I would not consider the land lease a reason to buy or not to buy....

Now the economy, and the issues with sub-prime, FCY and oil prices...
One may be prudent to hold off a bit I should think. I believe prices will come down a ways.

My two bobs worth anyway.

[SIC]

Lets see - China is all into private property now - so I figure you will be able to renew the lease no problem.
However seeing how Hong Kong government derives a big part of its income from property I have a feeling you might have to pay a hefty premium to renew that lease.....if you are still around in 2047.

[kluge]

And remember the gweilo always gets f...ked.

[trevfly]

My place in Midlevels was 1000yr lease from the handover, so had 990 yrs left or there about.

History lesson: Brits owned HK Island, so property there has much longer lease. North of boundry road, was leased from the mainland. After handover, all NT became 50yr leasehold (as part of basic law agreement)

in '97, Britain gave HK island to the chinese and returned the leased NT. Hence the Island property is a much better proposition than NT.

You may have mates with the odd village house. Well they will have a lease of 39 yrs left. After that , who knows. For HK and south of boundry road, its more protected. For now.

In London, leases of less than 30yrs tend to devalue the property significantly, as there are no guarentee of the lease renewal terms. The owner may want the land back! (NT case with the hk gov?)

As for prices, they will rise n rise. For once the stock market has had zero effect on prices, due to the mainlanders throwing their money over here.

Great!

[404 Titan]

trevfly

A little economics 101 lesson:

1. Interest rates low = Property prices rise.
2. Interest rates high = Property prices fall.

We are and have been for the last five years in 1. We are about to go into 2 and in a very big way. If you haven’t already noticed inflation is on the rise world wide but is particularly bad in Asia. While currencies like the HKD are pegged to the USD inflation will become a very very big problem here, but once interest rates start rising in the US (probably late this year or early next) they will rise very quickly to try and put the inflation Jeannie back in the bottle.

For once the stock market has had zero effect on prices,
Historically property prices benefit from a falling equity market. So do commodity markets. Property prices in HK over the past twelve months reflect this relationship.

Based on historical precedence, property prices in HK have probably reached or about to reach a crescendo with only one place to go. Down.

[Charliethewonderdog]

In Aus... interest rates are going up... around 9% property going up by about 10-15% still, on the back of 4.2 % inflation... HK is still a bargain.


500,000 loan at 9%... = 4200 a mont over 25 years,

at 2.5 % is 2200 a month. join the dots.

[404 Titan]

Charliethewonderdog
In Aus... interest rates are going up... around 9% property going up by about 10-15%
Horse S**t it is. Most of the Australian property market with the exception of SE QLD and Darwin has been stagnant or in decline for the last 12 months. I have property on Sydney’s Northern Beaches and while “Domain.com” will tell you that prices where I live have gone up 31% in the last 12 months, the reality is I couldn’t get much more for my property now than what I could early last year.

[hongkongfooey]

Hey Chuck, unfortunately ( as usual ) 404 is correct, enjoy the 2.5% rates while you can.
Whilst I do not agree HK is a bargain, I think apples for apples it is not bad buying.
Australian property is less affordable now with 9% than it was in the mid 80s with around 17% interest rates.....fact !
To back that statement, take the average mortgage V average income 20 odd years ago V now, not good.

[propje]

Australian property is highly over priced and I also would like to mention that soon there a lot of households struggling when their 4% fixed mortgage interest rates end (typically 3-5 years)and suddenly they have to pay 9%........

[Charliethewonderdog]

404... I dont know much about the syd market but I can tell you that melb market is still increasing at a reasonable rate around 10-15% and in 2007 it went up 25%.... so clean you're s..t up... . Have you been to Perth Lately?? Australian property all over is going up.... except where you bought.

Melbourne house prices may rival Sydney after 25% rise | Herald Sun (http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,23104728-2862,00.html)

I'd still take 2.5% interest in Honkers.... especially when Cathay or Dragon pays the Mortgage..

Maybe you didn't do your research and pay too much.

[404 Titan]

Charliethewonderdog

No, I think it is you that needs to do a little more research. Most of the price rises you quote are from the first two quarters of last year. If you look at the property price rises for the Dec - Mar quarter by the Australian Bureau of Statistics i.e. since interest rates started their latest upward spiral, you will see a definite trend of the property market prices cooling off, stagnating or even going backwards and that is only till March. There have been several interest rate rises since then and a definite indication the Australian economy is slowing. Let’s see what your Melbourne property prices are doing in twelve months time from now. Personally I think some people that have recently purchased there are going to get their fingers burnt. Even your premier said in that Herald Sun article that the price rises in Melbourne aren’t sustainable and quite frankly the figures below clearly show that.
Have you been to Perth Lately??
Yes I have and nothing it happening with property prices there.
Australian property all over is going up.... except where you bought.
No it’s not. Again the figures from the ABS clearly show that. By the way thanks for your concern about where I have bought. The reality is that I am actually sitting on a large capital gain right now and considering it is a long term investment, what happens over the next year or so doesn’t concern me.


AUSTRALIAN BUREAU OF STATISTICS MARCH KEY HOUSE PRICE FIGURES

Dec Qtr 07 to Mar Qtr 08
Established house prices % change

Weighted average of eight capital cities 1.1
Sydney -1.5
Melbourne 4.1
Brisbane 2.8
Adelaide 2.1
Perth -0.6
Hobart -0.7
Darwin -1.3
Canberra 1.0


Mar Qtr 07 to Mar Qtr 08
Established house prices % change

Weighted average of eight capital cities 13.8
Sydney 7.1
Melbourne 25.9
Brisbane 20.8
Adelaide 21.6
Perth 0.6
Hobart 8.2
Darwin 4.9
Canberra 14.4

[anotherbusdriver]

Three months later, and how things have changed.
Reviewing this thread was an interesting walk back in time.

[404 Titan]

anotherbusdriver

Yes it certainly has. With the huge mess that exists in the US the days of easy and cheap credit there are over. Unless HK removes its currency peg to the US$, which I doubt it will do any time soon, cheap credit here is also a thing of the past.

As for the property market in Australia, high interest rates there are taking there toll. I personally can see prices in Darwin and Perth which have rode on the back of the resources boom and enjoyed substantial price rises over the last few years most affected as the global slow down effects the resources sector.

AUSTRALIAN BUREAU OF STATISTICS JUNE KEY HOUSE PRICE FIGURES

Mar Qtr 08 to Jun Qtr 08
Established house prices % change

Weighted average of eight capital cities -0.3
Sydney 0.3
Melbourne -0.3
Brisbane 0.6
Adelaide 0.4
Perth -2.4
Hobart -2.0
Darwin 1.9
Canberra -1.4

[Fly747]

HSI down 4.3% today largely on property stocks because interest rates up. People queuing to get their money out of BEA. There is now only one direction for HK property prices. Will mean good buying opportunities for some.

[claire40]

Guys why not take the discussion over to
Hong Kong Property (http://www.852realestate.com/propertynews/)

blatant plug but wider audience
We pilots dont know everything:O