Sixth C-17 arrives.

[Cpt_Pugwash]

A little bit of good news (http://www.mod.uk/DefenceInternet/DefenceNews/EquipmentAndLogistics/SixthC17SwoopsIntoBritain.htm) ...

Sixth C-17 swoops into Britain

3 Jul 08


The sixth C-17 Globemaster ZZ176 to arrive in the UK was delivered to RAF Brize Norton yesterday evening, 2 July 2008.



http://www.mod.uk/DefenceInternet/Templates/GenerateThumbnail.aspx?imageURL=/NR/rdonlyres/3E5E28AE-2FF6-4C37-8E10-A254CBB61D13/0/C17.JPG&maxSize=210 (http://www.mod.uk/DefenceInternet/Templates/LargeImageTemplate.aspx?img=/NR/rdonlyres/3E5E28AE-2FF6-4C37-8E10-A254CBB61D13/0/C17.JPG&alt=C-17) (L to R) Sgt Jim Hardwick (Ground Engineer), Sgt T Rossi (Loadmaster), Flt Lt Mike Flynn (Captain), Wing Commander S Edwards (OC 99 Sqn), Flt Lt Charlie Lee (Copilot), Flt Sgt P Harris (Loadmaster), SAC(T) Joe Sproat (Technician)
[Picture: RAF]

Collected from the Boeing Factory in Longbeach, California on 11 June 2008, the aircraft has since been used for essential front-line crew training.
Upon landing at its home base of Brize Norton, the aircraft was rapidly prepared for operations as in only 18 hours after its delivery, it will see its first operational mission in support of Operation Valero, the 2 Rifles depoyment to Kosovo.
As well as being able to carry loads of up to 75 tonnes and fly long distances (up to 2,400 miles) the C-17's ability to land on unpaved airfields in remote, land-locked regions make it a versatile transport aircraft, equally suited for a variety of missions.

Delivered early, the arrival of the sixth C-17 in the UK marks a significant increase in the RAF’s airlift capability. Wing Commander Edwards, Officer Commanding 99 Squadron said:"The C-17 fleet with its agility and reach is absolutely vital to current operational theatres. It is especially important for the support of ground forces and particularly in land-locked Afghanistan. The arrival of UK6 at RAF Brize Norton will bring immediate benefit to UK troops all over the world."
The RAF purchased four leased aircraft and a fifth C-17 in 2006. The arrival of a sixth, will give the RAF a guaranteed long-term capacity in this area. The new C-17 aircraft joins the rest of the fleet at RAF Brize Norton in Oxfordshire.

[k1rb5]

and a fifth C-17 in 2006

And it's been so much fun, it only seemed like a few months ago :)

[The Helpful Stacker]

Good stuff, though a couple more to wear those pre-designated tail numbers would be nice.

[Cpt_Pugwash]

k1rb5,
perhaps you're confusing purchase with delivery:ok:

[MG]

Whilst I understand the whole corporate image argument and am the first to defend the idea behind it, doesn't the 'Royal Air Force' logo, with roundel, squeezed in next to the door look like some 6-year old has made his first Airfix model?

Having said that, a sixth ac is a good win for the RAF; there aren't too many in defence these days.

[Roland Pulfrew]

Great news for 99 and the rest of the military.:ok: I don't suppose no. 7 and no. 8 will be along anytime soon after yesterday's carrier announcement.

'Royal Air Force' logo, with roundel, squeezed in next to the door look like some 6-year old has made his first Airfix model?

Have to agree, particularly as it's just under the whacking great ROYAL AIR FORCE written along the top half of the fuselage; I thought that might be a clue as to the operator. This corporate branding is starting to make us look foolish. Do any other air forces do this?

[k1rb5]

perhaps you're confusing purchase with delivery

You're almost certainly correct mate. Couldn't resist it though:ok:

[tonker]

In line with procurement policy defencive aids like LAIRCM will only be financed when many people are dead, and millions of pounds worth of C17,HMS Sheffield or C130 are lost.

[Green Flash]

SAC(T) Joe Sproat (Technician)

Pardon my rampant ignorance, but what does an SAC(T) do on a C-17? Ground Engineer I can understand, but what does the (T) do please? I'm not digging at Joe (don't know him from Adam), I'm just genuinely intrigued as to what the role is. More, please!

[edwardspannerhands]

Pardon my rampant ignorance, but what does an SAC(T) do on a C-17? Ground Engineer I can understand, but what does the (T) do please? I'm not digging at Joe (don't know him from Adam), I'm just genuinely intrigued as to what the role is. More, please!


He is basically the GE's 'biatch'. Large types (Vicky 10, Tri* C17) tend to take an additional mechanic to assist the GE when down route.

[Flyingblind]

Firstly, good news to all those involved.

Secondly,whats with stopping at 'only' Six? RAAF and the Canadians are receiving Four each which makes the UK total seem a bit 'light-on' given the UK's war and peace keeping commitments seem to be far an above the other two.

Some kind of promise by Blair prior to his exist for UK to buy the A400M when shes out and ready for delivery?

[Green Flash]

Ed

Thanks; I did wonder if he was some sort of devils apprentice!:} Do GE's/Techs stay with one particular cab (to get to know it's foibles, lims, etc etc) or are they rostered to the next avbl aircraft?

[edwardspannerhands]

GF,

If they are under the same manpower constraints that we are all suffering, I would guess they can't afford to leave the same team on the same frame.

ES

[Green Flash]

Ed

As you say :(

ta.

[Kitbag]

it will see its first operational mission in support of Operation Valero, the 2 Rifles depoyment


No wonder the transport fleet is suffering, isn't one C17 a bit of overkill to move 2 rifles?, would have thought sending them FedEx would be more efficient;)

[back end o' the bus]

Well, that means two more aircraft for the Masters to "go West" in, whilst the rest of the boys "Go East!"......Or am I being cynical...or just realistic!!!!!!:ugh::D:= but I'm sure "Spoons will have have a grip of that!"

[flipster]

Hi Pal,

Good to see you are still around, old bean. I agree that another such ac is definitely a step in the right direction for UK PLC but it is a bit p1ss poor for our newest toy to arrive figuratively 'naked'. I can only presume this ac will only travel west and go nowhere near where it is actually needed until it is suitably defended?
We've all seen mission creep before!


Fly safe! Fight safe!

[mr fish]

is it just me or does she look like thunderbird 2

[flipster]

"She" being the aircraft or the co-pilot?

[airborne_artist]

The aircraft or the co-pilot? :E

Note how the jocks stand there with there legs thrust apart - the more stripes, the further apart the jocks' legs are, except the co., who's just thinking "Lets get this over with".:ok:

[dum_my]

The photo on the RAF website has the legs sliced orf:

http://www.raf.mod.uk/rafcms/mediafiles/ED1CAAB8_1143_EC82_2E7546434282DD7D.jpg

[flipster]

RO,GO

The photographic equivalent of the lady "laying back and thinking of England"?

I must say that 'growbags' do few favours to the 'lumpy-front' variety of aircrew - but I would say F/L Charlie looks quite respectable - even without her legs!

One can only presume that, in RAF tradition, she's going to have them replaced .......upside down!?

[StopStart]

flip, you're looking for a problem where there isn't one.

[flipster]

SS

I would say that having no legs is a mighty big problem - unless you are a slug!

[Winch-control]

So they are all girls then?

[airborne_artist]

Limbs now re-attached:

http://www.mod.uk/NR/rdonlyres/3E5E28AE-2FF6-4C37-8E10-A254CBB61D13/0/C17.JPG

[Roland Pulfrew]

Apart from the legs spread bit, any psychologists out there comment on why the two pilots either side of the Boss are the only ones to have their arms crossed right over left? Is it a left-handed / right-handed thing?

I know, I'll get my coat!:}

[k1rb5]

Flip, just put one in yer box!

[flipster]

Thanks K1rb5,

Sorry, if I got the wrong end of stick. I am just a bit sensitive on safety matters! I am sure that the new frame will catch up quick. Previous post modified.

flip

[k1rb5]

BEADWINDOW!!

You can't go giving away my identity like that. No-one would have got it otherwise:ok:

[flipster]

JTO

Yep, got that one!! Oops and humble apologies.

I must stop seeing 'reds under the beds' - it is just that I have had previous experience of the hierarchy saying one thing, then doing another (as you well know) - which colours my view on occasion!

Good to hear from you all the same,

flip

[flipster]

Not a lot on this forum makes much sense anyway (see Nimrod)!!




K!rb%

Is that better?

[RAF_Techie101]

Ref the groundie and crew chief in the photo, and given the current state of affairs, I suspect they are in fact 99 Sqn's groundcrew...

[Gainesy]

Nerd Mode: "ON"

Hmm, have we really bought it?
Why the USAF stylee serial under the ZZ176?:suspect:

Nerd Mode: "OFF"

[Green Flash]

Factory serial number? Date ordered?;) Charlies phone number!!!!;):ok::}

[flipster]

Nope, not her phone number (I tried it - bugger)!

[MarkD]

Secondly,whats with stopping at 'only' Six? RAAF and the Canadians are receiving Four eachBut CF aren't getting A400Ms too - and we're supplying 2,000 in Afstan from almost than twice as far (measured BZZ-KDH and YTR-KDH) even before idiot ministers promise the UN one to shift helis around when they aren't available. Plus they are NOT cheap at C$1.8 billion + C$1.6bn in support for 20 years (http://www.sfu.ca/casr/doc-acp-s-c17contract.htm) for the four CF frames.

[Could be the last?]

Well at least Toni R will be able to give Bomber guidance on how to off load the mighty Merlin!!!! OOOps

Watch out for those styrene balls Toni!:ok:

[Geezers of Nazareth]

MoD announces disbandment of 'Red Arrows', and replacement with ...

http://www.mod.uk/NR/rdonlyres/3E5E28AE-2FF6-4C37-8E10-A254CBB61D13/0/C17.JPG
'RAF arm-folding team'.

(I'll get my coat ...)

[9.81m/s/s]

There have been a few too many Beadwindows in this thread and for some reason back end o the bus has issues about Masters flying west!!!

[k1rb5]

I think back end o the bus flies west to go east now.........if you know what i mean:rolleyes:

[9.81m/s/s]

Greetings K1 !!! Hope you are ok.

I think I get where you are coming from........85% there I think......not enough time analysing the movements of my betters ( not in a toilet context you understand ) to make it to 100%


http://www.pprune.org/forums/images/smilies/cool.gif

[k1rb5]

you got a pm and e-mail mate

[9.81m/s/s]

Got it.......and now that I think about it..........I think you are right.

Well done Lewis......now mine's a pint of ale.

[Warmtoast]

'RAF arm-folding team'. Seven crew?

I thought the C-17 only need a pilot, co-pilot and a loadmaster.

[dallas]

Collected from the Boeing Factory in Longbeach, California on 11 June 2008, the aircraft has since been used for essential front-line crew training.
I'm told this 'essential front-line crew training' involved carrying bags around North America for a famous red formation as they toured the region. Suppose it's Arrows front-line...

Not that I begrudge the C17 crew by the way, they don't often see much more than HERRICK and TELIC.

[Flight Detent]

I'm just totally disappointed they don't carry a Flight Engineer, which is much more efficient than carrying ground maintenance engineers, always has been!

Sometimes I just wonder!!!

Cheers...FD...:ugh:

[herkman]

The purchase of the C17 by the RAF RAAF and RCAF, has to be one of the smartest moves made sine the purchase of the C130.

THe introduction into service likewise.

A good job all around

Regards

Col

[k1rb5]

I'm just totally disappointed they don't carry a Flight Engineer

It has been known :ok:

[flipster]

FD,

I have some symapthy with yr comment re efficiencies of FEs vs GEs. However, there are clear reasons why GEs are more common in aviation these days. It is the civvy world that mostly drives AT ac design and the level of in-flight automation now mostly absolves the need for FEs aboard modern mil ac like the C17/J Herc.

In the civvy world, many if not most, airlines contract out the engineering element for when things go 'ping' down-route. In these airlines, the route structure is well known and contracts can be let to cover most eventualities and so ground-based engineering bods are, in theory, cheaper.

However, in the military, there is little chance of contracting out the ground engineering as few other countries operate the C17/Tri*/VC10/J and, where we go sometimes, one has to fix the ac in 'austere' circumstances!

Therefore, it makes sense to carry GEs and, on occasion SVCs. Either way, there is at least one extra pair of eyes and ears aboard - which always comes in useful when things get a bit 'hairy' - especially 'in theatre' or even down the strip at Limassol!

I am glad and proud to have served with both species of 'spanner monkeys' who, on more than occasion, have dug myself and my crew out of a hole. Great people, one and all.....even Lima Echo!

flipster

[animo et fide]

Ahh, an extremely rare picture of Mr Harris in work and uniform!!!!!!


Get the beers in boy

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

"Quote:
I'm just totally disappointed they don't carry a Flight Engineer
It has been known :ok:"

It's a modern aircraft and therefore does not need a Flight Engineer. Any engineering is carried out on the ground hence they carry a Ground Engineer.

K1rb5

You are obviously more gifted with foresight than Flight Detent as you are now an ALM so stop looking back young man and relish the future.............. :ok:

[k1rb5]

It's a modern aircraft and therefore does not need a Flight Engineer. Any engineering is carried out on the ground hence they carry a Ground Engineer.


I fully agree with the above statement. I can't see how anyone could complete the ground servicing requirements of the C-17 whilst supervising the off/on load in the time frame required. The GE and SVC are essential for our type of Ops.

Couldn't resist dangling the hook in the water though. FD may well know another FE who now operates as an ALM. Say hello to M & K from me if you do please.

Bit of thread creep here. Soz :rolleyes:

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

Our ex FE is also doing extremely well and has already made the jump to the Dark Side, so for the grumpy ones out there..............:ok:

[k1rb5]

I hear there are more making the move too.........:ok:

[youngskywalker]

Why they wearing US style growbags then? Do they come with the aeroplane if you buy one?

[dallas]

Why they wearing US style growbags then? Do they come with the aeroplane if you buy one?
I believe it's a 'warranty' condition, along with the need for the ALM to be there for the loading, which reduces the whole crews duty day. Don't know if there are plans to change SOP now we've bought them, but the danger of that re: flying suits is Boscombe will want one for 'what bits of a C17 does our flying suit snag on'-type trials, which we really can't afford, despite our official position of 'stretch, not overstretch'.

[k1rb5]

Do they come with the aeroplane if you buy one?

YSW

No need to buy a whole jet dear chap. Couple of quid on fleabay if you really want one.

[Hueymeister]

They make the girlies and K1rb5 look better than they would in a standard MOD issued suit.

[k1rb5]

They do have a bit of extra room for the 'fuller' figure which helps me out obviously. :rolleyes:

However, in their defence, all our 'girlies' would look good in any type of flying suit. Not a single 'pillow smuggler' amongst them. :ok:

I think it's part of the selection process. :D

[VinRouge]

no upside-down legs or Kankles then?

[Hueymeister]

No Vin not one amongst them. They're absolutely lovely. Aren't we lucky?:E

[ShangriLa]

I don't know about that.... I've seen one who could eat an apple through a tennis racket....

[k1rb5]

I don't know about that.... I've seen one who could eat an apple through a tennis racket....

Here we have post number one from THREADSTOPPERS.COM

Line, crossed, too far, to$$er.

Get a SOH or don't bother :mad: jockey.

[moosemaster]

They were all Ok in my day, and I can't see that having changed in the years since I left. I will take K1rb5 at his word that I am correct in my assumption.

Glad you guys have your new jet at last, just a shame it was sent operational quite so soon.

I believe it's a 'warranty' condition, along with the need for the ALM to be there for the loading, which reduces the whole crews duty day. Don't know if there are plans to change SOP now we've bought them

Doesn't reduce the day as much as you'd think, being as an 18 hours day is standard!! Also, the addition of the second ALM means 1 can go straight into crew rest, while the second does the off/onload.

Why change the SOP just because we buy them. The system has worked fine for the last 7 years or so. Are you sure you're not an accountant!!

The US kit is not a warranty thing, it was a contract t'ing. If we had wanted UK kit, it would have had to have gone through the USAF flight test process at MoD expense. As it was only originally a short term contract, there was no point spending the money. (A good decision for a change!) Now it is a long term thing, there still isn't any point as the US kit has already been accepted into UK service, so again there is no point spending the money. (Another good decision!)

There is always the point that they are better for the fuller figured among us :8

[moosemaster]

http://www.mod.uk/NR/rdonlyres/3E5E28AE-2FF6-4C37-8E10-A254CBB61D13/0/C17.JPG

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a59/jarotoouk/Espana/DSC_9416a400M.jpg

A bit of thread creap I know, but can anyone spot the similarities here :D

[BigBusDriver]

How different would you expect it to be? Flippers and a steam funnel?

[Green Flash]

A bit of thread creap I know, but can anyone spot the similarities here

Yes. Both are quite capable of bringing me home from somewhere hot and sandy. Do I win a prize?

[moosemaster]

I thought coming home from hot sandy place WAS the prize!!

Anyway, only the top one is currently capable of such a feat :}

But in general, I'll get me coat!!:sad: