"OH NO!" The R.A.C. @ JT.....IN 'FREE FALL'??

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

Courtesy of 'Inside Cover' From Fri's 'The West Australian'.... (13/6/08)

Is the RACWA in 'Free Fall'?

According to the article, much, much dissent.... 'exposing a major rift between some members and the management committee'.....re the committee's 'secret' running of the Club business, and its alleged treatment of the Club Staff including the Flying Staff.:(

A call for a vote of 'No Confidence' in the committee!

A 'Special Meeting' is being called for on July3rd.

Is the 'Icon' that is the RACWA about to implode?

One of the few successful 'Royal Aero Clubs' still standing, and a very successful business all round, I would have thought.....:confused:

Why oh why is the question....:sad::sad:

[Awol57]

I don't think there is much to it at the end of the day. Will be interesting to see the outcome of this meeting, however prior to this meeting I haven't heard a single whinge about where the club is heading. Still haven't in fact other than the fact we are having a meeting.

[slice]

I remember there was a bit of a fracas back in the mid / late 90s with regards to RACWA branching out into the charter business more aggressively thus competing directly with some club members own charter companies.

Let's face it, RACWA is far more than a club and maybe needs to be split up so that the 'club' can exist as such rather than be subsumed by the 'business'.

[YPJT]

An us and them between the committee and the staff of ANY club that employs people, not just flying clubs, is normal in my experience! Committees of clubs, whether flying or any other activity, are usually made up of a mixture of people with different agendas. In the end most clubs seem to self destruct when they stop listening to their members, because as things deteriorate, the good guys often walk away. Not saying this is the case with RACWA as I don't know (and don't really care) but a committee is the price any club pays for the tax benefits they enjoy and mean that it cannot (and should not) be run like an "ordinary" business.

As for the article, to the outside world RACWA and WAAC were percieved as one and the same anyway, despite the Pythonesque protestations of “we are all individuals!” they seemed from the outside to be completely co-dependant; students of WAAC were not allowed to fly anywhere other than RACWA, and WAAC's offices were deeply embedded in the RACWA building.

Meanwhile I'm sure that RACWA as we know it will continue on as before!

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

It would certainly seem that -

For 'dedicated' members -

"Now Is The Time To Come To The Aid Of The Party".......CLUB!!

:ok::ok:

[Van Gough]

For a club which is supposedly being run for the benefit of members I found it ironic that the member rates are still vastly higher than everywhere else at JT and the fleet is falling apart at the seams.....I always got the impression that it is being run for the financial interests of the management only

[AirSic]

It appears that the fact of the matter has been touched on in these posts.

2 Facts actually.

1st, Management appear to be in it for them and their family members (I am led to believe that certain committee members' families enjoyed some financial reward for the RACWA/WAAC deal). Hard to believe that the committee is not "at arms length" from the development deals that are floating around with the development of Murrayfield.

2nd, most members don't care....they have had enough! Too many years of an aging fleet, now being treated like sheep through a large corporation. A CEO for a club ! A BDM chasing new business!

RACWA, it appears doesn't have a CFI at the moment after MP left in disgust!!!! Training coming to a halt perhaps?!?!:suspect:

When are RACWA moving into JH's offices? Can see a mile away that JH - Yarpies that want to sell off YPJT are going to get their hands on Murrayfield.....is that for the good of the CLUB?:=

JG needs to understand that the valuation of the property at Murrayfield does not give him or anyone else the right to future business deals that get done without MEMBERS approval. MEMBERS are not SHAREHOLDERS. If they were, they would have sacked this committee (board) a long time ago!!!:ugh:

Most are still trying to ascertain exactly who screwed RACWA with the WAAC deal in the first place, and then to buy it back........the heart of the matter is at what price? MEMBERS ARE NOT BEING TOLD ANYTHING except for JG's pitiful articles in TT that make you feel like you are being pontificated to.:yuk:

Members get a slight discount on the hire rate of a/craft, thats why they are joining, what is the retention level after training is completed? Very small I bet. The members won't know because it is not a matter that gets discussed.....like most things!

JD...hang in there! July 3rd...the day before INDEPENDENCE DAY - perhaps.:*

[Sunfish]

This sort of thing is not confined to flying clubs, and it's relatively common.

The solutions range from a "word to the wise" through to an extraordinary general meeting at which you vote to remove your old committee and appoint a new one, or in extremis, it ends up in a courtroom.

After you appoint the new brooms, it's time for some serious house cleaning.

Seen it done three times.

First step is obtaining a copy of the club's constitution and a membership list....and even that can be a battle.

Hint: Your clubs auditors should be an asset.

Good luck, and keep us posted.

[FRQ Charlie Bravo]

It would be a sad thing to see RACWA go under... we'd start having to share the rest of JT with all the wankers who currently get sucked in by the black hole that is RACWA.

Vive la RACWA

FRQ CB

[YPJT]

So if MP has quit, who is CFI? Or are they doing training without one? :confused:

[Awol57]

I believe the manager of VFR is now CFI. I understand that MP has gone to work with RW in his new role in CASA. I could be wrong, not quite as in the loop as I once was.

I sometimes find it amusing how much angst there is on this site against various organisations. Is it tall poppy syndrome or has everyone been burnt somehow.

I don't mean specifically RACWA, it happens all the time on PPRUNE.

[Stationair8]

Is Mary Walton still with the RACWA?

[the wizard of auz]

Strewth!!, Thats going back a bit. Mary hasn't been there for a hundred years.
last I saw her, she was with a bloke that was driving a chopper for CHC in Exmouth. She was the CFI back a hundred years ago when I did my first solo/GFPT. went to Kunnas a few years after that, came back and then left again. She was looking healthy and happy, and was the same Mary when I spoke to her about two years ago in Exmouth. :ok:

[YPJT]

Can someone in the know tell me if the following is rumour or true:

That RACWA borrowed well over a million bucks with a possiblilty of another 200G to buy a business whose only asset is the JAR approvals and some office furniture?

That they hocked Murrayfield as security for the loan

That they project members will only contribute 15% of the revenue, the rest will come from international and WAAC students

That if they hadn't done this purchase the club was headed for oblivion

That their turbo diesel aircraft are now in doubt due to the demise of Thielert but deposits have been paid

Some of it seems a bit far fetched to me, surely? How did it come to this? Think it's time they stopped pretening to be a club and started paying taxes like the rest of us.

[Brian Abraham]

THe word ROYAL in the title of any aero club is a wank from a bygone era. How pretentious
The origin of the Royal Federation of Aero Clubs of Australia dates back to the 25th October 1914, when a group of young officers of the newly formed Australian Flying Corps met at Point Cook, Victoria, and decided that an Australian Aero Club should be formed and affiliated to the Royal Aero Club in London. The Aero Club in London was founded in 1901 and granted Royal Charter in 1909. A Royal Charter is a charter granted by the Sovereign on the advice of the privy council, to legitimize an incorporated body, such as a city, company, university or such. At one time a Royal Charter was the only way in which an incorporated body could be formed.
Rather than bleat about it here derek get onto the Royal Federation of Aero Clubs of Australia and get it changed, or you waiting for us to become a republic? ;)

[slice]

So is Royal as in RAAF RAN RMA etc wank as well ? I believe it is the last of the Royal aero clubs left - all others gone.

[Icarus2001]

A couple of points...

RACWA "management" gave away to AB in the early 90's the right to operate theory courses for the club. AB later created WAAC. Then sold WAAC to MC who was made GM of RACWA but then had the rugged pulled out from under him due to a conflict of interest. MC has now sold WAAC back to RACWA and made a healthy profit and is employed by WAAC to run it. :)

RACWA management let go of their magazine Tarmac Topics to save money, we then had other operators at JT advertising in the RACWA members newsletter, how crazy. RACWA then had to buy back in house Tarmac Topics.

RACWA management started the food operation up stairs when the "new building" was completed. they found this a drain on funds so leased it out, this didn't work so they took it back, then leased it out again. Remember that technically it can only provide service to CLUB MEMBERS. The new food supplier started by the tower and so people voted with their feet.

RACWA now has a CEO, CFO, GM, and two CFI's. Too many chiefs and not enough indians.

As for the commitee they seem to feel all of their photos should be in TT but not the photos of the staff who actually create the revenue.

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

To YPJT et al.....

I understand that the 'Special Meeting' is scheduled for
7pm Thursday 3rd July - at the RAC, I would expect.

SHOULD get all / some (?) answers then?

Regards To All:ok::ok:

[Capn Bloggs]

The spill got voted down 2 to 1. :ugh:

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

Additionally, for those interested parties, JD's position is 'safe', and,
'he can remain employed by the RACWA for as long as he chooses to do so'...
(contract pending...)
or words to that effect.:ok::ok:

I feel however, it was apparent from the meeting that there are many 'outstanding issues' which do need to be addressed - between now and the next committee election in September??

Regards to all.

[Biggles08]

Is it just me who thinks RACWA buying WAAC was a big no-no? With the euro side of the course, they lost the JAA intergrated ATPL title and are advertising it as something else on their website (AITP = CPL/IR Rating??)

And the track record of the students not great - students leaving, or them dismissing students, huge instructor shortage, all courses delayed minimum 2 months so I've heard. I think they just lost another euro kid last week so another $100k walking away?

I reckon they bought into something which will fall on its face soon enough.

[Capn Bloggs]

Biggles, are you referring to this:

European pilot training industry 'heads for paralysis' (http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2008/07/10/225169/european-pilot-training-industry-heads-for-paralysis.html)

Sounds like there will be some ducking and weaving if the European training falls in a heap. Or perhaps WAAC knew what was coming?

[FokkerInYour12]

For years the RACWA aircraft were $40 per hour below the rest of the country in comparable (city) locations. Who did this hurt? Everybody else at Jandakot.

That the members now complain that the aircraft are now overpriced is astounding. It's also plain wrong too.

Here's some comparative rates obtained recently:
172: (~110 Knots) $195/hr
172RG: (~120 Knots) $219/hr
Mooney: (~165 Knots) $238/hr
182RG:(~ 150 Knots) $280/hr

Air Aust:
172: (~110 Knots) $185/hr
177RG: (~130 Knots) $220/hr

Min:
PA28 Archer: (~115 Knots) $227
PA28 Arrow (~ 125 Knots): $254

That RACWA are now charing what appear to be reasonable market rates must be a breath of fresh air (to those schools/clubs that haven't gone bankrupt in the meantime trying to compete with RACWA)

[the wizard of auz]

182RG~ 150 Knots) $280/hr

Bwaahahaha....... down hill with a tailwind and heavy on a good day maybe. :}

[Biggles08]

Fokker - also never known an aeroclub to maintain their aircraft so badly.

[Magarnagle]

Hey Fokker, you may want to have another look at those prices, I suspect you may have thrown in some pre-GST prices with some post-GST.

[FokkerInYour12]

Not that I'm aware - they were apparently asked explicitly whether the prices include gst.

Given that avgas is $2.07 per litre from air bp for entire month of august at jandakot I think there will be a outfits losing money on those rates anyway

[Islander Jock]

Fokker,
You might want to check those figures. It isn't even that expensive in the Pilbara.

[Fred Gassit]

165 kts in an M20J? What are you smoking?

[Charlie Foxtrot India]

Air BP PAP at Jandakot for August is $1.876

[FokkerInYour12]

Did you add GST? Air BP quoted me $1.88 ex GST for Jandakot on the phone 15 days ago for the entire month of August.

[FokkerInYour12]

Fred - the Mooney doesn't have the load carrying capacity I typically require so I've never got the check ride.

What cruising TAS speed do you reckon the Mooney actually does? At which power settings and altitude and OAT? And what fuel burn? How many of such a type have you flown (one or several)? Enlighten us.

[MACH082]

lol @ 165 KT Mooney M20J

Those RACWA Mooneys have been crashed and rebuilt more times than JT wears gold bars! Im highly surprised they even fly straight (well someone enlighten me cause i have never flown a RACWA mooney)

A mooney is a dinky little toy, NOW a Bonanza :ok:(especially of the A36 variety) is where its at!

[FokkerInYour12]

Any Bonanzas for hire at JT?

[MACH082]

plenty of barons if you need the second engine :P

Bunbury aero club has one for hire along with Geraldton Air Charter and Shine Aviation Services in Geraldton. They would be the closest bo's i am thinking.

[Led Zep]

Heliwest will rent you a nice IFR F33 at a reasonable price.