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Solid Rust Twotter
9th Jun 2008, 16:57
Not aviation related except that the next Chief of the Air Force will probably not be a pilot. We already know the Chief of the Army hasn't a clue and that the Chief of Police knows all about crime.:ugh::rolleyes:

Cape Argus June 7 2008

Navy top brass don't have to go to sea

A complete joke, says retired senior officer

By CLAYTON BARNES

Serving time at sea is no longer a requirement for a top post in the South African Navy.
Both the Chief of the Navy, Vice-Admiral Johannes Mudimu, and the navy's next Master at Arms, Warrant Officer Pragasen Moodley, who will take up position early next year, were appointed without serving time at sea.
The Master at Arms is the disciplinary co-ordinator for all uniformed staff.
A retired senior navy officer, who asked not to be named, said the fact that the two key members holding these vital positions in the navy hadn't served time at sea was a "complete joke".
He said there was no way anyone could run the navy without serving time aboard ship.
"These guys have no credibility. How can they expect to lead the country's mariners if they have no idea what it's like working at sea? They can't stand in front of a group of senior officers and tell them what to do.
"Maybe that's why the navy is in such a mess."
In response, Defence Department spokesman Siphiwe Dlamini said the fundamental requirement for those appointed into leadership positions in the armed forces was to demonstrate sound leadership.
Characteristics such as visionary thinking and the ability to inspire and motivate members at every level in the organisation were what was most critical.
"In keeping with military norms, we require that our leaders are role models - persons who epitomise the code of conduct and value system of the organisation in which they serve, " said Dlamini.
"Thus they need, first and foremost, to be persons of principle who are able to lead men and women into difficult and dangerous circumstances in a manner that is befitting of our Constitution and of the people whom we serve."
Dlamini said while being required to operate strategically, people placed in senior positions also needed to have a good understanding of the core business of the organisation - which was, in the case of the navy, fighting at sea.
He said both Mudimu and Moodley would need to have "very good insight" into this.
"We are proud to affirm that the track records of the incumbents of both posts bear testament to the fact that they have demonstrated, and continue to demonstrate, leadership of the highest order."
Vice-Admiral Mudimu served witin the ranks of uMkonto we Sizwe from 1975 until the integration of the forces in 1994, serving in broad range of posts across Africa.
Prior to his appointment as the Chief of the Navy in March 2005, Mudimu served in the South African National Defence Force "across the full spectrum of organisational processes, including the inspector general, fleet staff and naval staff process".
"It is such diverse experience, gained in such broad range of contexts, which truly prepares military professionals for positions of leadership," said Dlamini.
"Both Vice-Admiral Mudimu and Warrant Officer Moodley have fully immersed themselves in the sea-going environment, and as such may be held to understand all aspects thereof as may be required of them to execute their leadership positions in the way in which military organisations the world over might demand."
Mudimu has been to sea since being appointed.

airborne_artist
9th Jun 2008, 17:21
Both Vice-Admiral Mudimu and Warrant Officer Moodley have fully immersed themselves in the sea-going environmentWTF is that supposed to mean? :mad:

ZH875
9th Jun 2008, 17:26
Perhaps it's running round the inside of a barrel?

Double Zero
9th Jun 2008, 17:34
Well, for the last quite a few years British Aerospace has been run by accountant types who couldn't tell an aeroplane from an Aardvark ( creature, scuttling type, probably a better choice than bean counter ) - doesn't seem to have bothered their careers, and what the hey, they aren't going to have to fight and try to save their large pink arses ( shudder ) with such products.

On much the same premise, it doesn't seem any recent career ( 'fish head' ) R.N.Officer kept up with flying if he was offered a clear career path as a commanding officer on a ship - possibly another short sighted move as we would have had more FA2's than ships by now, though I know pilots were 'capped' in their promotion ceiling - hell even I can say " slow ahead both" or " we won't bother supporting the RIB, let them surrender" ...

What happened to 'we happy few' ?!

Sitting on massive pensions it seems, BTW I live next door to an ex-Admiral who gave up flying to further his career - hardly red-blooded Nelson stock ??!

beerdrinker
9th Jun 2008, 17:42
Not only that but the CAA and EASA seem to be run by people whose only knowledge of aeroplanes is the inside of the Club/Business Class Cabin.

Sorry Thread Creep

Union Jack
9th Jun 2008, 17:44
" ..... they need, first and foremost, to be persons of principle who are able to lead men and women into difficult and dangerous circumstances ...."

Says it all really - there's a great difference between "into" and "in" ...

Jack

Double Zero
9th Jun 2008, 17:58
Well the Royal Navy has a great tradition of leading 'into' in the past, see ' HMS Gloworm & armed merchant cruisers Rawalpindi & Jervis Bay' - but I have serious doubts about the career minded gits who let us lose our decent warships ( Type 22 & 23 for a start ) & aircraft...

SirToppamHat
9th Jun 2008, 19:33
I am beginning to wonder if the RAF I serve in isn't already being run by bean counters. Sure, we have blue-suiters at the top of the RAF, even winged some of 'em, but even they can only make 'decisions' within a fairly narrow band that is set out by budgeteers.

For example, if money was no object, would we have lost the Jags so soon? Would so many stations have closed? Would we have taken JPA before it was ready? Would we have quite so many contractors working alongside the RAF? The list is not endless, but I am sure there are many more examples.

From what I have seen, the Army and RN are little different.

STH

RETDPI
9th Jun 2008, 19:52
Oh, I guess it will all be justified by the equivalent of the old REMF bean counters shiny arsed argument:

"London Transport isn't run by bus drivers".





But there again -look at the state of London Transport.

exscribbler
9th Jun 2008, 21:20
How very very sad. I can't help feeling someone who served in the ranks of the Spear of the Nation can hardly be qualified in any way to be head of the SAN.

Find out more here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umkhonto_we_Sizwe (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umkhonto_we_Sizwe)

It hasn't happened here yet, has it?

NutherA2
9th Jun 2008, 22:16
have fully immersed themselves in the sea-going environment,Would falling overboard count? http://www.pprune.org/forums/images/icons/icon15.gif http://www.pprune.org/forums/images/icons/icon15.gif http://www.pprune.org/forums/images/icons/icon15.gif

SPIT
9th Jun 2008, 22:48
Hi
Why do most aircrew interviewed for/on TValways say that "The aircrews and aircraft could NOT FLY without the men on the ground " the men and women without wings ???:confused::confused:

Brian Abraham
10th Jun 2008, 01:25
Both Vice-Admiral Mudimu and Warrant Officer Moodley have fully immersed themselves in the sea-going environment
WTF is that supposed to mean?
We've been for a swim I think.