Tiger standing down pilots

[BPA]

Tiger are currently standing down or asking pilots to take leave without pay. Some senior FO's have been asked if they would go to Singapore.

Looks like the fuel costs are starting to hit them.

I also hear Lion have delayed their plans to enter Australia.

[flyer_18-737]

I do wonder when Tiger will Fold, they just cant keep operating with $40,$50 airfares, no matter how low the operating costs are

We'll continue to be able to do consistently low fares because our cost base is much lower than everybody else's," says Tiger spokesman Matt Hobbs. Even with very low costs, they still would be hurting.

For example
TT MEL-OOL 49.95
JQ MEL-OOL 99.95
Even with a lower cost base, how can they survive like this?

[rescue 1]

And Tiger could use the current economic woes of high fuel costs, reduced demand have changed the business case, and is the reason for their exit from the Australian Market.

How quickly aviation can turn :sad:

[flyer_18-737]

I can say that TT are doing much better than TR, I mean alot better. If anything, they would exit/massively reduce out if SIN and just focus on Australia/Korea.

Four planes for their Aussie opeation isn't enough, they need at least 20 to start making some real $$$. If they can provide 12 destinations with only 4 aircraft, imagine 20 A320's, they could fly to every damn airport in the country

[Jenna Talia]

Aviation - a rooster one day - a feather duster the next day. :{

[QF22]

I suspect SQ only ever started Tiger in Oz as a backdoor way to the USA ala Virgin flying 773s to the west coast later this year.

[FGD135]

Aviation - a rooster one day - a feather duster the next day.
Does this surprise anybody? - it shouldn't.

Goodbye pilot shortage - it's been nice knowing you.

[tiptoeturkey]

http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,23823471-664,00.html

[spabath]

TIGER MEDIA RELEASE


TIGER WILL KEEP AUSTRALIANS FLYING AT LOW
FARES
Airline to seek international air access for its Australian based aircraft


Singapore – 6 June 2008. Tiger Airways is waiting with bated breath to pounce on the routes
suffering under higher fares, or simply abandoned by, Virgin Blue and Qantas/Jetstar.

The duopoly airlines in Australia are blaming the price of fuel as the reason they are increasing
fares, cutting routes and reducing service, when really they should be having a long hard look in the
mirror.

While fuel price is an issue for all airlines, it is the airlines that have lacked discipline to keep costs
low that are going to hurt the most during times of increasing fuel prices.
Speaking today, Tiger Airways CEO, Tony Davis said:

“The price of fuel is the canary in the mine that has simply highlighted the lack of cost discipline of
our competitors. Tiger Airways is clearly now the undisputed low fare leader in Australia and we
are determined to give even more Australians access to genuine low fares.

Whilst other airlines are busy increasing fuel surcharges, cutting routes and scrambling to reduce
wasteful expenditure, Tiger is busy, simply providing the lowest fares and best value for money
across Australia. We are also keen to use our Australian based aircraft and crews to mount
international services to fill the gaps left by Qantas/Jetstar as soon as we can convince the
Australian government to allow Tiger Airways Australia access to these routes.

Do yourself a favour Australia– don’t pay for the mistakes of the other airlines. Come to xxxxx.xxx for the lowest of low fares, all the time.”

Tiger airways will soon be taking delivery of additional aircraft, both A320 and A319’s, and will be
ready to pounce.

[bogan mover]

For an airline that truly does operate on the smell of an oily rag if Tiger end up going to the wall then QANTAS et al have got no f@#%ing hope.

[F111]

I know two Tiger FOs who have been asked to take leave without pay.

[flyer_18-737]

Surely those ex-Australian international destinations that TT are talking about in that Press release is NZ, or pacific islands...

[Metro man]

Surely a sensible business practice, moving resources from where you have an excess - pilots in Australia, to where you have a shortage - pilots in Singapore.

Weren't Jetstar recently talking about having the ability to move pilots between their operations in Australia and Vietnam ?

QANTAS wanted a pilot base in Singapore also - blocked by the unions.

For the single guys already holding Singapore licences, surely going back there for six months until the new aircraft arrive in Australia beats LWOP or a C402 job.

Tiger Singapore are adding flights on routes to Australia and North Asia and planning on expanding flights to China, India and the Philippines. Tiger Korea due to start by the end of this year. "Tiger won't be grounding any of it's planes ." said Chief executive Tony Davis

[Tangan]

Tiger with such a low cost base in all other areas must feel the increase in fuel prices more than the other carriers. While they have cut the cost of labour, terminal access etc, the common cost for all operators is fuel (give or take a few dollars saved by hedging). Fuel must present as a much higher percentage of operating cost for Tiger that it does for QF and to a lesser extent VB and so would have more detrimental effect on Tiger's bottom line.

[Keg]

QANTAS wanted a pilot base in Singapore also - blocked by the unions.

Hate to ruin what is obviously a fascinating tale...actually, scratch that. I absolutely love it when I can put a falsehood firmly back it it's box.

A SIN pilot base for 744 crew was not blocked by unions. It was in fact OK'd in EBA7- although I and about 43% of my colleagues voted 'no'. The reality is that QF couldn't get the numbers to work for them. Whether they choose to re-visit it again in the future is unknown. They can start the base tomorrow if the economics work for them.

[Capn Bloggs]

For an airline that truly does operate on the smell of an oily rag if Tiger end up going to the wall then QANTAS et al have got no f@#%ing hope.
It depends on how high a percentage of your costs is fuel. If it is high (ie the rest of your costs are low) then you're going to get hurt more by high fuel prices than others because it's percentage effect will be more.

Why don't they ALL just put up their fares 10%? Peter Harbison has the right idea.

[Eastwest Loco]

From the coalface, Tiger is about as popular as herpes.

Two hour checkin behind a blade of grass in the cargo terminal at Tulla, with no backup aeroplane if yours craps itself. The punters simply are not wanting it. I am not crying a negative here for the sake of it but that is the way it is.

Tiger do not make themselves easily accessable to the lower socio economic groups, as they insist that if a booking is made by credit card, the card holder must be travelling and be able to produce said item.

With DJ and JQ if the client does not have a card (and a lot do not) we put it on the corporate Amex and the client pays us cash. Tiger doesn't play UNLESS we have deposited $5000 with them - then we have a line of credit.

I don't think so!!!

They seem to be a null treg - a copy that does not compute. If SQ wants to take on the world, they need to have the Tiger model looked at by someone other than management trainees.

Best all

EWL

[Binoculars]

The negatives of low cost airlines are always trumpeted, and they are genuine, but surely it all comes down to Caveat emptor.

I travelled from Mackay direct to Melbourne with Tiger, the return flight cost me $150. A taxi to my accommodation at Wheelers Hill would have come to about $100 so I hired a car online for about $40. Unfortunately I had such a good time at the wedding I travelled to that I overslept and missed my return flight, the result being a $400 flight to get back to Mackay. Hey, my fault, not theirs.

Jetstar charged me $40 on top of my $69 fare from BNE to MKY because my onboard luggage was 13kg instead of the allowed 12. Tough **** for me.

You pays your money and you takes your chances. It's still cheaper than driving.

[Thylacine]

Why didn't you just throw out a couple of pairs of jocks and leave them on the counter to save the excess or do you wear designer jocks?:O

[Thylacine]

A browse through Tiger's website shows airfares BKK/PER as low as $88 + $185 departure tax but no mention of fuel surcharges and PER/MEL $170 + tax, again with no mention about fuel surcharges until presumably you get into payment section. How sustainable can these fares be?
With only one flight a day from LST and a ridiculous check-in cut off time I recently saw a group of 4 turned away for arriving 5 mins late when the flight had not even arrived. In the end it departed 30 minutes late minus 4 disgruntled passengers who will no doubt spread the word about their shabby treatment. (not me BTW)
Whether they are too cheap or too fascist with the treatment of their customers is it surprising Tiger, with fewer flights to defray fixed costs, may struggle to survive in current or future environment of higher fuel prices?
A half page ad in today's local paper, paid for by Launceston Airport, heralded Tiger's achievement of operating for 6 whole months.

[Dropt McGutz]

They'd have to be subsidised by SIA wouldn't they? It will give them the opportunity to operate over the Pacific I'd imagine.

[silversaab]

Why don't they ALL just put up their fares 10%?

They will. And I'd bet my house on it starting to happen in the next few months.

The airlines are just circling around at the moment, trying not to be the first to make the move, but once one of them does, the others will surely follow after a respectable period of oh, say, 3 or 4 days. ;)

[porch monkey]

Hey EWL, are you saying you have to deposit 5 gorillas with them, then they'll let you have a "line of credit" with your own money? :eek: Sounds like a debit account to me!!! Wonder if they'r registered as a bank here? :suspect:
Also sounds like a good way to subsidise costs with the interest.........:mad:

[Eastwest Loco]

Indeed Porchasaurus.

It would seem the best way I have ever heard of to get your yellow and black paws on unsecured interest free cash flow.

Call me cautious, but they can blow their partial airline up their fundemental. I aint playing.

As we are a licenced and Travel Compensation Fund approved Agency, we have a $10,000 line of credit with DJ, and often turn over in excess of $100,000 a week through IATA/BSP - but this upstart wants our money up front despite selling near half a million a year on one of their parent companies. Then take onboard the restrictive Credit Card rules. They are just too much work.

This little black duck is not playing, and they will not be mentioned in our office - why bothyer if they want to make themselves inaccesable.

Best all

EWL

[windytown]

Tiger do not make themselves easily accessable to the lower socio economic groups, as

I agree with your sentiment and would extend it to the middle classes who have credit cards. Tiger seem to have done Jetstar a favour by positioning themselves below Jetstar and hence making Jetstar and Virgin look more reasonable.

How Tiger position themselves on their Website make them look less appealing than other LCCs. Several statements on their website could be annoying to someone who isn't paying the lowest possible fare (ie the fares they need to sell to make a profit) and seem aimed to make you pay extra or put up with unneccesary inconvenience.

Examples are:

* Seat pitch of 29 inch versus 30 on J* or 30/31 on Virgin (so they can get a few rows of premium seats (I'm not sure how many people willing to pay the premium would choose them over QF economy).
* Suggesting on their website that families who want to sit together should buy seat select. Virgin, Jetstar (and Freedom) all usually put famlies together for free. To me keeping families together is sensible for the family (they are buying multiple seats so good revenue potential), other passengers and the cabin crew.
* 45 min checkin close off time -
* From recollection (can't see it on their website anymore) not allowing you to bring your own food on board, while having a limited buy on board menu (can't see a menu on their website so even if they do the lack of info on the website works against them). Hardly appealing when combined with the 45 min checkin or the idea of travelling with children who travel best on healthy food and not BOB junk food.

All up a list of things which are annoying to customers who are prepared to pay a small premium to avoid some stress and in short a list of things which would annoy my wife to the point she would pay extra for Virgin or even Jetstar.

[767moose]

I agree buddy. The merchants of doom always like to stick the boot in.
I hope that all the airlines in OZ prosper and that they can't get enough Pilots.
Hey Slacky Pants send us your new Email address. I'm off to Melbourne next week so give us a call.
I'm off to the A330 next month. Your notes will come in handy thanks mate!
How are the T&C's at Tiger. Still**** I hear is working hard at J*. My other mate is clearing $12,000 OZ a month as a Captain but working F*******G hard.
Say hi to to the family.
Cheers:ok:

[TheFamousOne]

Most nights I pass Go-Kat! (a cereal wot I feed my feline) over Timor. When I leave DRW with abt 15 tonnes fuel, 155 pax in A320, I'm FKD if I can get to FL320. They go over me @ 380. Do the sumz - about 20 pax.

Not sustainable, moreover a waste of aussie talent!

[DutchRoll]

Dammit Keg, there you go again.

Wrecking another perfectly good "pilots union is the evil scourge of all humanity" story with ill-timed facts!

Shame on you. ;)

[BPA]

Today they can the MEL - NTL route, yet yesterday their CEO said;

Speaking today, Tiger Airways CEO, Tony Davis said:

“The price of fuel is the canary in the mine that has simply highlighted the lack of cost discipline of our competitors. Tiger Airways is clearly now the undisputed low fare leader in Australia and we are determined to give even more Australians access to genuine low fares.

Whilst other airlines are busy increasing fuel surcharges, cutting routes and scrambling to reduce wasteful expenditure, Tiger is busy, simply providing the lowest fares and best value for money across Australia. We are also keen to use our Australian based aircraft and crews to mount international services to fill the gaps left by Qantas/Jetstar as soon as we can convince the Australian government to allow Tiger Airways Australia access to these routes.

Do yourself a favour Australia– don’t pay for the mistakes of the other airlines.
Perhaps people in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.