Win95 to Win98 with CD for distribution with new computer??

[Bollocks!]

I want to update a second machine from Win 95 to Win 98, however I only have a Win 98 CD for installation on a new machine. Is there an easy way to stop it recognising that Win 95 is already installed or do I have to re-format completely and re-install everything (groan)..?? Any suggestions appreciated (other than go and buy the upgrade CD!)

[matelot]

Microsoft were a bit crafty here. Do you have your hard disk partitioned? That would allow you can move personal files to a back partition, and then trash C:\

Assuming not, back up all personal stuff, then try and install Win98 from within 95. If not, boot to DOS A: with the 98 boot disk(don't reboot to DOS prompt from Windows - use a boot floppy) and then run setup from your CD.

On the odd occasion one of them has worked, but in reality Win 98 likes a clean partition!

If you really don't want to trash 95 because of what's on it, try a disk-partitioning system like Quarterdeck's Partition-It. Sometimes it's free on cover disks, or you may know a source.

Come back if stuck :-)

PS - from A:\ on boot-up, rename your windows directory to something like windows.000. I've known that fool 98, but not every time.

Cheers

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Me, sweat? I'm that cool, it's condensation.

[This message has been edited by matelot (edited 18 September 2000).]

[fobotcso]

I've done this kind of thing - rebuilt Win 95 over Win 95, but on the advice of Dell I used the "deltree" command at the true DOS Prompt to get rid of the Windows Directory and all its sub-directories. You should check this out first using the "help deltree" command at the Command Prompt.

If you are going to install from the CD you must make sure that the CD Drive will still work after you have cleaned out all the stuff that you don't want. So preserve your Autoexec.bat and Config.sys files and the CD drivers that they load.

As already advised, preserve the stuff you want to keep. Using Deltree will allow you to do a clean install without having to reformat etc.

[ExSimGuy]

But doing the above won't preserve all the stuff in C:/windows98/program files/ etc - like my MS-Office, and worse - all the other programs I've downloaded! I have the same problem on one of my computers!

I'm interested in a reliable fix for this too!

(Can't find a Win98 "update" in the market here - everyone wants to sell me 2000ME and I have some specific drivers and patches for 98 that I want to be able to use!)

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---- "Per Ardua ad Mixas" ----
(Through hardship to the bars)

[fobotcso]

ExSimGuy

First the easy part. Windows 98 SE is still available here from suppliers like Simply, Action, Dabs etc at about £70 plus carriage. E-mail me if I can be of any help on the spot. Not surprising you can only get ME where you are! (Ha Ha, bad joke!).

You're right that, as you describe your system, DELTREE would not be suitable for you in the way that I suggested. In my Win 98 istallations, Program Files comes straight off the root directory (ie C:\Program Files) and the C:\Windows directory is solely for the system.

Its true that when you do DELTREE on C:\Windows you lose Cookies, Desktop, Favorites, Start Menu and lots of stuff you're used to seeing and you do have to reinstall all main programs. This is to do with Registry entries. But if there are applications or support folders/files you don't want to lose, try copying them to a safe part of the HD(s). Hide them if you want to put them out of harm's way.

But if your current Windows system directory is called Windows98, why not re-install to a directory called Windows and copy over your Favorites etc? If this is no help, maybe I need to know more.

[DreamCatcher]

Oh, Bollocks

Granted a lot of software programmes (programs) come free, so you should be able to re-acquire them. Genuine progs can be re-installed from your disks.

In a situation like this, take the opportunity to start again, and completely clean off your hard drive (after backing up personal data and noting ISP connection settings etc.), then re-partition and start again with a clean install of 98SE or ME.

It WILL be worth it (and virtually everything will be auto-detected).

Come back if stuck.

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PistonBroke

[Bokkerijder]

I read this in a computer magazine :

1) Launch the Windows Explorer
2) LOcate the file "win.com" (usually in C:\windows)
3) Rename "win.com" into something like "winold.com"

Now the new Windows 98 CD ROM will not be able to locate the win.com file and assume that there is no other OS installed and will install Win98.
Good luck !

[Bollocks!]

Dear Bokkerijder, Tried this - CD still said Windows already installed! Thanks for the sugggestion anyway. For everyone else that replied, I am still evaluating whether to totally trash my disk and start again - if
it all goes quiet from me fear the worst! I still think there must be someway to convert the "new PC" CD to an "upgrade" which ofcourse would save my registry entries and allow all installed programmes to continue to work?

[Ausatco]

Bollocks,

I had the same problem - an OEM WIN98 that wouldn't upgrade Win95. After trying to find a way around the problem like you're doing, I gave up, re-formatted and started afresh.

Suggest when you do this, if you have a big enough disk, you create a number of partitions and try to keep just system stuff on your C drive. It minimises the pain if you have to format and re-install in the future.

Eg, I have 3 physical drives. One is the C drive and I never install anything or keep data files there, just Windows.

A second, larger drive has 4 partitions. The first is where I install all my applications. (I always over-ride the default location of C:\Program Files that many installation routines use). The second is where I tell the applications to keep their data. The third is where I keep all my downloads, each in a folder of its own so it's easy to find and re-install if necessary. In the fourth I keep a current back-up of the C drive (system disk) and the data partition.

The third physical drive is an old, slow one which I use as a scratch pad for temporarily keeping things of interest until I figure out if I want to keep or dump them.

This all probably seems a bit anally retentive, but I've had to format and reinstall Win98 and apps a couple of times and this method makes a big job a bit easier, plus data files and downloads are kept fairly well out of harm's way.

I think it would be worth your while to set up something like the above - just use partitions if you have only one hard disk - then bite the bullet and do a clean install. Good luck!

AA


[This message has been edited by Ausatco (edited 19 September 2000).]

[ORAC]

If the full install says run "install", look at the CD root and see if you have "setup" etc. I have had the odd CD which could be used for either upgrade or full install depending on which command was used.

[matelot]

Bollocks

If you want to upgrade 95 to 98, you'll end up with 98, and a bit of other mish-mash with odd and ends of 95 lying around.

Don't be paranoid about 95 - when you think about software and hardware, it's a wonder computers work at all!

Seriously, trash it and start again - you'll learn in the process, it won't take long, and you'll have a CLEAN install ;-)

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Me, sweat? I'm that cool, it's condensation.

[fobotcso]

One more idea. Did once get into a panic when I couldn't boot an NT installation after trying out Partition Magic. Rushed out and bought a cheap second HD (£50-60) from PC World. Unplugged the HD containing the precious data and did a clean install on the new HD. Got everything back no problem but did have to reinstall Office. Otherwise, I tend to go with the others. Trash it. But if you're going to trash it anyway, you can't lose anything by experimenting. If you discover a way to do without losing all your Office stuff and downloads, please come back and tell us.

That was the doorbell. My Windows ME Promotional Step-Up has just arrived - really. It was cheap at £35 odd (+VAT) from Jungle.com. I'm going to try to install it over Win 98 (Orig Ed) one of these days. Wish me luck. Another thread here suggested it works well.

[pilot999]

Bollocks - if you are eligible get the MS Student Windows 98 upgrade from Jungle.com - as well as upgrading from W95 to W98 it comes with a FREE upgrade to Windows ME. All for £38+VAT (ie only a few quid more than the ME promotional upgrade mentioned above).
To be eligible you need kids over 5yrs at school/college/uni. Lots of other student offers at jungle.com as well! And it saves trashing your hard disk! :) :) :)

[JamesG]

Bollocks

I agree with Matelot - you're never quite sure how an upgrade from 95 to 98 will work as it leaves a mess behind.

Much better to trash and start again. You're registry is probably pretty tatty anyway and you may be surprised at the performance increase from clearing the detritus.

[fobotcso]

That last point from JG is a good one. I've heard it from more than one authoritative source - including MS themselves at one of their TechNet briefs - that if your PC is used a lot you should do a clean reinstall annually to clean out the Registry rubbish and "wrong" versions of DLLs etc. I keep putting off the moment and will now wait for a winter's day; but I know that the Registry of my busiest PC (NT4) is now about 10 MB compared with about 4 MB for a new installation. Most of the rubbish is legacy stuff and fragments from programs loaded temporarily and then deleted.

It is often said that Win 95/98 should be rebooted once a day and Win NT(WS) every few days or so just to clean out the RAM. If you do this, you may avoid random crashes.

[Bokkerijder]

Bollocks,

Strange that the renaming of win.com to winold.com doesn't do the trick for you.
It sure worked for me !

Did you reboot the system after changing the name ?

[fobotcso]

Bollocks!

What Bokkerijder says is true. It worked for me just now after several other tries, but the nurse has just come to tell me its late and I must get to bed. I'll make a full report in the morning.

Basically, while you are running Win 95 rename the Windows directory to something useless. Then rename Win.com to something else. Winold.com will do. (You may have to be at the DOS prompt to do this.) Reboot either from a boot floppy and Run D:\setup(where D: is your CD-ROM drive) and away you go. Or in your BIOS setup, change the Boot order to put the CD Drive first.

I've just done this on a fresh HD by first installing Win 95 and then installing Win 98 over the top of it. It works - trust me!

More in the morning.

[fobotcso]

Bollocks!

Worked Okay again today.

Both my W95 and W98 CDs are OEM, are not Boot CDs and don’t have dedicated start-up floppies. This means it has been mandatory to have a Boot floppy with CD-ROM enabling drivers.

Trashed 6GB notebook HD, repartitioned three 2GB partitions and reformatted as FAT.
Booted to DOS with floppy. Ran “SETUP” from W95 CD root and installed clean W95 in directory C:\Windows accepting all defaults.

So far so good.

Then installed Word and Excel from Office 97. Tested OK.

Using Windows Explorer, changed Win.com in C:\Windows to Win.old and closed down. Rebooted with floppy and ran “SETUP” on the W98 CD-ROM. The installation found C:\Windows and offered to install W98 in C:\Windows.000, but I changed that to C:\Windows and let it rip. No problems. All config files in C:\ were overwritten and C:\Windows now containes W98. When done, Word and Excel still worked fine.

So it can be made to work and that can be a way of keeping your Apps working because all your shortcuts and App specific DLLs will be intact

Hope this is a help and sorry if it is a grandmother/egg case, but I wanted to be more safe than sorry; it has been useful Continuation Training for me.

I shall now try out my Student Pack Windows 2000 on that HD. :)

PS. After all that, I found the origial W98 Installation Floppy! If you have lost yours and would like a replacemant, I could e-mail the 18 files to you. Biggest is 272KB.

[This message has been edited by fobotcso (edited 23 September 2000).]

[Bollocks!]

Fobotcso - thanks very much. I have taken the plunge...and...an hour and a half later here I am on Win 98!! No problems so far, very painless and far better than starting from fresh (I'll leave Norton Utilities to tidy my registry as necessary!) :)