Jetstar applicants

[blueside^]

From Australian Federation of Air Pilots Communications

To all Members

This is an urgent message to find out if you are an Airbus Captain who has applied to Jetstar or you know of a pilot who is an Airbus Captain, are an Australian citizen and has applied to Jetstar.

You maybe aware that the Company has Federal Government approval for up to 75 non Australian citizens to join Jetstar as Direct Entry Captains.

The Federation needs your help to identify any Australian pilots who have applied and hold Command on an Airbus type such as 320/330/340.

We need to know that the pilot has applied is prepared to return and work under the Jetstar Enterprise Agreement 2008.

Our position on this that we would prefer Australians filling the jobs but in the event there are none available we will continue to work with the Company to minimise the numbers of non Australian citizens needed that provide the experience base for the existing and future First officers to get their experience hours up on type to take future commands at Jetstar.

Many if not all of these will be drawn from the Regional's and General Aviation and our commitment as an organisation is to ensure that they have the maximum career opportunity available in Australia as part of the Company's rapid expansion.

If you know of any one in the above category please contact them and provide us the information that we can get to the Company and Government quickly.

If any member has question on this topic please contact me through the Melbourne office (03) 99285737 or email [email protected].

[botaxgendeng]

its not equal opportunity:bored:

[kit330]

well said botax:ok: and you get this aussies bit*%%*g about equal opp here!! what nerve...:yuk:

[jackbauer]

It's equal opportunities only when an Australian is applying for DEC in your country.

[Black Stain]

You are a dumb ass colonial Blueside^. That is possibly the most ill-conceived post ever on this site. Grow up and delete your naive question.

Let the Irishman fill Jetstar with DEC.

[NoJoke]

Dear BS. Although you may not be an Australian you must know that they, the Australians, are the most Xenophobic bunch of morons this side of the black stump. So I am sorry to say you are wasting your well intended efforts. It is sheer hypocricy that they deny entry to qualified people. Most of them are there because they had a long distant Granddad that had the impressive criminal acumen to Steal a Sausage in Southend!

What fun!

Dons steel helmet. Lights blue touch-paper and retires to safe distance to watch the fireworks.

[woodja51]

Hey Guys - I am Aussi pilot with EK, did the Jetstar dec 330 thing - for a month - then came back.

Still have mates there as DEC's - its a job but they don't like it much...some looking for other overseas options again... I did Virgin OZ DEC interview the other day ( now on 777) ... withdrew application after interview in DXB just not enough cash... I made more in real terms my last year as an Ansett 146 F/O ( in real terms ten years ago or so) and they want me to push a 777 around in the the LHS for the same amount!

Then EK gave 14 weeks profit share and now a 12 % or so pay rise with a little more to come with the utilities ( accom) allowance shortly.

Just spent a week in Melbourne having a good time visited great malaysian restraunt called little Malaysia which all you ex RAAFies will know of.. and a week in Perth doing the same...
... but after it cost me $100 to fill up my Z06 corvette the other day at BP in South Perth( those 427/7 litre motors burn a bit of gas!) when I can do it for 100 dhs in DXB (@ 3.5 Forex) ....how much do I really want to come back to struggle??

Bottom line .... grass is not greener at home ( it just grows taller over the septic tank) ....

So I say.... come on down to the yarpies/POMS etc... and any one else who wants to come and join a low paying hard working job to live in Australia and continue to fund the Rudd system of communist equality ...good luck to you as it is a great place to live - just ****ty to work there!:bored:

I feel sorry for the guys that want the job to head back home and missed out... but really need to make sure that you are prepared for the return as after almost ten years out of the place it is not the same as it was when I left......

Just my 2 cents, less tax input.... am happy to take any flak... hit me... go on ... you know ya wanna...

[Rabbitwear]

Well you are honst woodja, but Jetstar may be the last chance to go home in a reasonable position. 20 years in the dessert will certainly cause Damage. You had home on a platter and threw it away. Money is not everything you will have lots more than the Jetstar guys but you will always be an EK slave.

[Sal-e]

Good spot for sure, the ole GFA. In fact the best in the world. When the next coalition party runs the place, maybe I will reconsider heading back. Meanwhile, a dole-bludger-loving, socialist government ain't seeing a cent from me. And porn*/death*/shet* ain't the job to be earning crap yet still with a big tax bill to fund more dole bludgers and a socialist government.

[woodja51]

Rabbitwear - just trying to put some balance into the argument about heading home and the fact that it is not that bad in the Gulf ( OK some might disagree with that and it is not all beer and skittles) ... I guess I am lucky as I have the option to head home at almost any time and rejoin the RAAF as they are pretty happy to have ex QFI's back .

Maybe not just yet and if and when I do it will be on about half what I am on now and less tax.. so just trying to say that money is not my primary driver but I dont want to work for organisations like a dog to make other folks rich ( unless I am getting a big share myself).

Tell me how Geoff Dixon can jump up and down about the engineers wanting a 5% rise and yet look at his payrises lately? I know it is not that simple but
don't really see much equity there?

As far as throwing away home on a platter - I left of my own accord to come to the gulf and it was the best move I ever made really. As when I want to head home now I can do it on my terms due to the leaps and bounds of the income stream/property bubble/minimal tax that EK gave me the opportunity to exploit (but still keen to see them throw basings up one day - then how would the nay-sayers react?)

Granted I don't get to vote for how what fees, charges , SALIK etc I get gouged for - but it seems that even if you live in place where you do get to vote ... it doesn't make much difference anyway you still get gouged...so much for democracy eh?

Anyway, just like to point out the pros and cons of living/working in OZ vs the Gulf.

[theidler]

Woodie - Let's take a look at your history.

Left for Oz and Jetstar eighteen months ago, but came back after a few weeks.
Interviewed with Virgin six weeks ago.
Now thinking about the RAAF.

But still writes that 'it is not that bad in the Gulf'. Are you trying to convince the audience or yourself?

You're giving a fair impression of a one man escape committee that won't commit.

[woodja51]

Fair enough Idler - I guess what I have been doing is looking around to see what the options are ... so I do take your point about the commit thing...

I have been living in hope that the deals that get put forward are actually worth taking ...but after several 'look sees' I think the best place for me is to stay put.....for a few more years then chuck it in and take it easy.

But it certainly doesn't hurt to have a listen to what they have to say in the interview etc. I think that for the right folks either of the options would have been great... just not me...

Sorry if I am a floosie...its just after years of prostituting myself I dont know when to stop..:}

[sispanys ria]

What is this post doing in the ME thread ? As far as I know, Middle East is not yet part of the commonwealth...

[Wiley]

AND, sispanys, I think if you read really, really carefully between the lines in at least one of the posts above, someone may have slightly inferred something vaguely demeaning about women.

[Black Stain]

Can you wankers read english down there? Or did you suffer a trailer park education in the bush? Maybe you are just slow from an iodine deficiency and miss the point completely?

The point, is that a Trade Union openly representing thousands of Australian Pilots is fishing here for legally useful data regarding the closed Australian job market when many hundreds of other Australian pilots prostitute happily and profitably on the relatively open global job market.

You cant enjoy it both ways for long. Woodya and your AFAP mates should give it some thought or bugger off. How many careers has advice from the AFAP already destroyed? Hard to imagine how that committee of fools still has a registered telephone number? This thread is proof that they are still way out of touch.

[sispanys ria]

Wiley, what are you trying to demonstrate ?

[Wizofoz]

relatively open global


Hi Black Stain,

Kindly name one developed country with the ability to train sufficient pilots which allows non citizens/residents to take jobs in prference to its own people.

[Wiley]

Kindly name one developed country with the ability to train sufficient pilots which allows non citizens/residents to take jobs in prference to its own people.Since August 1989, Orstraya.

sis, the fact that you ask that question means I would have no chance of explaining.

[Black Stain]

Resident status granted by a government to foreign workers, whether it be a passport or permit, is a separate issue to an employment contract offered by a business, and irrelevant to this argument.

But whilst we are here, if you purchase a property during your stay in the UAE or Qatar dont you also get a residence permit, so you can live there forever if you chose to? Are you saying Wizofoz that Dubai and Abu Dhabi are not developed cities?

You ask where Wizofoz? I can think of many mostly happy semi-permanent expatriots serving out their careers in Singapore, Hong Kong, Japan, Taiwan & Korea. Are these not developed nations Wizofoz? And if not happy I am sure they would have already applied to Jetstar. Are you suggesting Wizofoz that an airline be ordered to employ an Australian that it has previously rejected, over a suitable foreigner?

Having said that I am sure you are happy to see foreigners driving cabs and serving at 7/11. You guys just can't stomach the thought of a foreign pilot, and for that reason No Joke criticism is fair.

To wrap this argument up what we now need is for one you colonial patriots to step up and state that there are plenty of qualified pilots in OZ looking for a job. Please.....

[Wizofoz]

Nice "Straw Man" argument, Black stain. Take a part of what I said and pretend it was ALL I said- Care to have another read of what I said and actually respond to it, not what you choose to pretend I said?

Kindly name one developed country with the ability to train sufficient pilots which allows non citizens/residents to take jobs in preference to its own people.

Now, take a slow read of the bold writing, and get back to me...

To wrap this argument up what we now need is for one you colonial patriots to step up and state that there are plenty of qualified pilots in OZ looking for a job.

There are plenty of qualified pilots in OZ looking for a job, and plenty more Expat Aussies who would return for a half reasnoble package. Do you somehow dispute this?

[ACMS]

I am absolutly sick to death of seeing all the rubbish written in this topic.

The ONLY reason Australians ( or Brits or Yanks or Kiwis ) are working in EK, GA, CX, KA, KE, SQ etc etc etc etc is because those Airlines CANNOT find enough locals to FILL the seats. END OF STORY FULL BLOODY STOP.

As soon as CX figure out a way to get enough locals ( a believe me Mr Chen tried damn hard ) to fill my seat I'LL BE GONE.

As an Australian I CANNOT work in the EU or the U.S. unless I have already have a visa. I CANNOT get SPONSORED by ANY employer as they cannot prove to their immigration department they need me. ( they don't, there is enough Locals to fill the positions )

All of the Australians working in the UK ( for eg ) since 1989 had right of abode or passport through family BEFORE they got their jobs and they were NOT sponsored by their employer.
Let me say that again............WERE NOT SPONSORED BY THEIR EMPLOYER


So stop all the anti-Australian BS being written here ok?

There are plenty of young qualified Australians IN Australia that can fill any Pilot seats. So the Australian Airlines DO NOT need to look overseas.
IF there were no Australians available then I would have NO objection to 457 Visa's being granted.

The AFAP was perfectly justified and correct in asking the question in the middle East forum.

[msn]

I have a Australian friend with no family ties or right of abode in the UK who was sponsered by his employer, Dan Air, in the late 80's.

[2dotsright]

WELL said ACMS!!!!! The most sensible thing I have read here for some time .
And Woodja, some people would give their left test1cle to go home, wherever that may be for them. Maybe the Poms don't want to but then you can't really blame them can you.
I'm HOME and won't leave again for a million dollars, you can have your 14 weeks pay mate, I just came home from the footy a while ago, maybe go bush tomorrow for a bit, oh whatever, aaaaahhhhhh, enjoy the sand there , I'll think of you. Everyone to their own hey

[Dixons Cider]

Here here ACMS, and thats from a non Aussie!

Now, how many more posts before some d!ckhe@d pipes up and says "plenty of Ocker's come here and take jobs".

[spierpoint jones]

ACMS is right on the money.!! On ya...

jones:ok:

[ACMS]

MSN:

What was the situation at the time in the UK? Dan Air should have been required to prove to the UK Immigration dept that they could not find a local to fill the seat. Maybe there were some backdoor deals taking place with the Govt of the time? maybe it shouldn't have happened?
I know several friends that worked in the UK after 89, they all had right of abode before they left. I looked at going too but couldn't.

Try getting a work Visa now, it's impossible. ( and rightly so )

This is exactly my point, the Australian Govt is allowing the Airline Managers to bring in foreign labour to fill the seats Autralians could and would fill. ( Some back door deals taking place ) There is no shortage of Australian Pilot's willing to work, only a shortage of Australian Pilot's willing to work for Peanuts

[Rabbitwear]

One thing is for sure there is no pilots leaving Jetstar to go to SQ, EK , CX but there is quite a few leaving those airlines to go to Jetstar.
There is more bitching in the middle east forum than anywhere else on PPrune , i think guys are trying to justify there existence in the ****hole the middle east is , and its really not for that much extra cash. A big sacrifice if you ask me. So much so I rang Jetstar and have an interview in June good riddens to the sandpit....................

[Wizofoz]

One thing is for sure there is no pilots leaving Jetstar to go to SQ, EK , CX

Ah, Rabbit,

As is your great gift when contributing to these forums, you are, once again, totaly and completely wrong!!

Hope you're happy, in your new life, but why do you need to keep justifying it to yourself?

[Ramboflyer 1]

Whilst I think the Rabbit has finally freaked out, long term he may just be making the right move. Otherwise how the hell do i get out of this place!!!!

[Scooter Rassmussin]

I left a while back to go home and it was the best decision i made. I talk regularly with friends in the pit and it sounds worse all the time the last screw up is the six day rule. I feel bad for the commuters. I earn more after tax than an EK junior Captain. I dont have a free house but mine is nearly paidoff . I see no reason to stay in the sandpit.
Can anybody give me a reason why it is better to live in the sandpit than Australia, because I cannot think of 1.

[Bombay HF]

Wizofoz, i have a good friend down in Jetstar, in the last 5 months they have had join them 3 from CX ( 2 330/340 guys and 1 747 ) 2 from EK ( 1 330 Capt and 1 777 Capt ) several from Dragon and several 340 fos from SAA.

[fatbus]

I think those that bitch the most are just money hungry, the guys that have left and are leaving are doing so for over all QOL. The sand pit is not home. I know of one guy going to VA for the simple reason its home and not the pit, the money will pay the bills and he will be happier.

People get very angry here, I dont hear anger from home

[Wizofoz]

Bombay,

No dispute and there will be more.My point was it's two-way traffic. Several from VB, QF mainline and J* (both Aus and Asia) have come to EK, and more are on the wqay.

fatbus,

Have you ever READ Dunnunda & Godzone???

[8888]

Several from Dragonair? Of about 10 that went to investigate by way of an interview I know of 2 that have since joined. Given the general intent of most AU nationals to return at some stage surely that is indicative of something is it not? I would suggest that the average experience level and background of those recently employed by Jetstar (not including those returning from O/S employment) would contribute to the lack of significant traffic from there. Perhaps things will change as experience builds and frustration levels down there reach an higher orbit. Swings and roundabouts... horses for courses... call it what you will but aviation at home or abroad both come with serious compromises nowdays.

[2dotsright]

Hey Muttley, I don't need therapy mate, got HOME before I needed it. As far as looking at Prune, just cos I live in good ole Aus, doesn't mean that I have to forget about the rest of the planet, besides I like to see comments from lots of unbalanced humans , good for a laugh :0)))

[Sal-e]

Jet* is primarily targeting Australians abroad who have made their money and are now ready and willing to come back home. Some have made their fortunes and will happily do just that. Other's who have just started out may stay put.

[Ramboflyer 1]

Wiz the recent total form EK to Jetstar is 4. 2 capts from Airbus and 2 from 777.

[Scooter Rassmussin]

A320 of course

[Black Stain]

name one developed country with the ability to train sufficient pilots
Wizofoz and friends, I think you have been away earning money in another mans country for some time. LCC have drained REX to the edge. REX is now leading the way by training it's own pilots from abinitio. But yes of course Australia is a country that trains sufficient pilots?? Inspite the nervous applause given your rants, the basis of argument is still hollow like a didgeridoo.

[hot tuna]

What a great thread - all you Ozzzzzzzzmates crack me up.:}:E;)

[c560xl]

Hey Gentlmens,
lets stop arguying about why to come back and what for?

I am a qualified A320 skipper with 1000 + hours a s PIC and 2500 + time on A320.
Get me a job on A320 and I will be the first one to come back home.

I have applied so many times through PilotstaffCV but no joy.

Yeah, I don,t wanna live in the sandpit but I have got a family to feed.
I am living here cause I am earning good enough money to support my family.

You fi nd me a respectable job and I will come back tomorrow.

looking forward to hear soon from any one?

happy Landings:ok:

[ACMS]

c560xl...........you need to contact the AFAP. The real purpose of this thread.

HOT TUNA:.........go back and read my posts again, now explain what part was wrong? Double standards? Not even close pal.

[pool]

.... and of course everyone is going back and joins as FO at the end of the queue ....

No?? It will be as DECs?
Not that i would blame them myself, but some of them will have been endlessly complaining about DECs in the middle east and suddenly it's ok, mainly when the fourth stripe replaces the chip on the shoulder.
How's that for a double standard, but i think down under the water spins the other way around.

[ACMS]

It's your head spinning up your rear.

[Rabbitwear]

Well the Rabbit thinks waiting for things to improve in Aus may take many years. Not wanting to waste the best years of my life in the Dessert im going for it and the wage from my calculations is not much less than EK after tax.
Best to go now because next year the rest of you may finally wake up to yourselves and there will not be enough jobs for all of us............

[Ramboflyer 1]

Your finally making sense Rabbit whos the contact at Jetstar............

[Dixons Cider]

Hey Rabbit, do you have a link to the new EBA?

the old one was available, but cant seem to find the new one anywhere. Just wanna see with mine own eyes what the deal is..
Cheers

[woodja51]

Hi ya Brett la!! unless you are really unhappy at EY , stay where you are... there is a perfect storm brewing and Ozz Aviation is not going to be pretty in the long run!!

Just my 2 bits worth ... and VOz wanted to offer me the same real salary I was on 9 years ago as a 146 F/O with AN to be in the LHS of a B777 now... hmmm just seems wrong but then depends how much ya wanna go home..

Hows the pistol shooting going!!
Woodj

[Rabbitwear]

Sounds like lifstyle in Aus will be way better than the sandpit although the job not quite as good. We seem to spend more time at home than at work so it makes sense to go for lifestyle. Unless the EK boys spend more time at work than in the pathetic city of Dubai.............

[Rabbitwear]

Got the yes, so long suckers....................

[Dixons Cider]

Woodja!! Howzit

Just wanted to see for myself what the Jetstar numbers are, always good to keep an ear to the ground! :}

Pretty surprised to hear what VOz put on the table for you, but then as you say, depends how much you want to go home..Tis a personal call as to what value one puts on getting out of our lovely part of the world!! :ugh::ugh:

I see our man rabbitwear is pulling the pin - good luck to ya :ok:

[ShockWave]

Sounds like Rabbitwear will fit right in at Jetstar! They deserve each other.
Six months of being treated as one of their pilots and I'd bet he'll be back on the net posting his cv out to all.
However anyone who has done their time hard as an expat deserves to at least re-learn why they left in the first place. Good luck to those who need the change.
I too am leaving the sand pit but rightly or wrongly still have to much pride in my profession to beggar ( or should it be bugger?) myself for what they and Voz offer.
The guy who wrote that pride is a sin would probably have made an excellent airline executive in OZ! Be meek and humble and accepting of the wisdom and judgement of your new masters, you would have at least learnt that from being over here.