Flying School in Indonesia - advice please

[Islander Jock]

I have had a few enquiries from some fairly well off expats regarding starting up a small training operation in Indonesia.

Is the process likely to be too full of obstacles to make it worthwhile?

Does Indonesia operate on a similar AOC system to that in Australia?

Assuming a single aircraft operation like C152 or C172 was to be used, what would the maintenance situation be like?

Are there many qualified expat or Indonesian national instructors likely to be interested in such a venture?

Finally, does Indonesia cater at all for GA?

I am a director of an AOC holding company in Australia but have not had a great deal of contact with the aviation industry in Indonesia.

Any comments, including telling me to "forget it" or advice on who to contact including current training organisations would be greatly appreciated.

[Hermie]

Hi Islander Jock,

I think it'll be a brilliant idea to start a flying school in Indonesia. Why not consider Singapore or even Malaysia ? There are quite a number of flight schools in Indonesia.

The best (and the biggest) is SPL Curug in Curug, Tanggerang. Just in the outskirt of the Jakarta. It is owned by the goverment (hence it's cheap), and it has its own airport (Budiarto Airport) with all the facilities. It offer a wide range of aviation dicipline, namely Pilot School, ATC, and Aircraft maintanence.

I do not know if you have heard of Angkasa Magazine, the BEST Indonesian Aviation Magazine. I'm sure that they have all the info that you want. You can contact them and maybe gather more information. I'm sure they'll be more than willing to voice out their opinions. This is the website : www.angkasa-online.com (http://www.angkasa-online.com)

I wish you All the Best and update me on your thoughts and decision. I hope I was able to help you in certain areas.

Best Regards,
Herman

[boeinglover]

Hi there,

You have a wonderful idea here but would you please also consider setting up the flight school here in Singapore. Singapore has a good facility GA airport that is Seletar North east of Singapore Island and the great potential for pool of students here are fantastic. Many locals have long wish for a recognised local professional flight training school to be set up here inorder for them to fulfill their childhood dream of being a pilot.

Although there are a few flying clubs locally, they only provide training up to the PPL level. Say for instance, if a local wants to do a CPL or ATPL training, they would have to venture overseas to flight schools in Australia, US or the UK. Which in turn incurred high cost of investment. But if they could do it locally back in their home country, they save up tremendously on unnecessary expenditure.

Perhaps you could check up with CAAS on that issue.

Their website is at www.caas.gov.sg (http://www.caas.gov.sg)

Cheers,

[anito4a]

Boeinglover,

Only problem is, no airspace laaaah to do the nav sorties! Malaysia put an end to this in the early 90's! Hence the move to Parafeild and then Jandakot for SIA cadets.

[Hermie]

Anito4a,


So Islander Jock, cater for Singapore students by opening a small company here, where students can enquire more information before going to do their training in Malaysia. Have the flying school like a 40-45 mins drive from Singapore ! I'm sure you'll see wannabes flocking there.

Good Idea too boeinglover !

Cheers,
Herman

[This message has been edited by Hermie (edited 10 April 2001).]

[PILOST]

Hermie, you are the selfish suckers.You've been draining our water resources & charging us a bundle by selling it back to us with a nearly 1000% increase (maybe more)!Not to mention the other 'neighbourly' issues that we have.

Keep your KIASU mentality in your own backyard.No wonder our two countries ties have been like this.With people like you & your statements we'll never be able to mend the fences!

What we do with our airspace is our concern.With an attitude like yours, I wouldn't like to share my airspace with you!BTW.....if we really don't like you.....we could just turn the tap off..... http://www.pprune.org/ubb/NonCGI/tongue.gif

Remember....treat your neighbour as you would like him to treat you.

Safe Flying.
http://www.pprune.org/ubb/NonCGI/cool.gif
PILOST

[boeinglover]

Hermie: Thanks for the positive feedback.

Anito4A: We can always work out with the Malaysian authorities regarding flight training airspace. Look at SIA's cadet pilot training on Learjet 45, they too fly to JB Airport for NDB practices and landings.

If necessary to consider other alternatives, local authorities can help to negotiate with their Indonesian counterpart for permission to use Batam Hang Nadim airport for training purposes too. Say for example, for cross country training, fly from Seletar to Batam and back etc.

Cheers,

[Hermie]

Pilost,

My sincere apologies. Well seriously speaking I don't really mean what I say. Besides, I'm grateful what Malaysia has done for us, no doubt. In fact what more can we ask.

Yes I was wrong in saying that, but, seriously I don't see the point of not allowing Nav sorties considering we don't have much space. WHY ?

Deepest Apologies in my past message to all Malaysians !

Best Regards,
Herman

[greybeard]

boeinglover, as to the L-45 doing NDB's and landings at JHB, you really are short on facts.

All L-45 ops are REQUIRED to land at JHB to clear CIQ for ALL destinations in any part of Malasia. As for an NDB approach, only in the rarest of cases as it is time and fuel consuming considering the traffic and airspace restrictions, ILS or if half lucky a visual is the normal.

Malasia do not blanket approve these operations, they are negotiated at regular times as training does not have any contra deals as to commercial operations.

In the early stages NO Lear ops were allowed in Malasia and the aircraft had to go via Rista or similar to get to HDY to fly in thailand.

No lear ops are now permitted in PEN for traffic reasons.

SO, one could say that any airspace use might be a matter of "Negotiation" and suitable "ARRANGEMENTS" in the usual manner of these things.

As to starting a flying school in S'Pore with its attendant costs, Why when the rates are SO much cheaper in Aust and USA


Sui Generus

[FlyingCrew]

pilost,

i think hermie is an expat and not a singaporean. even if he is, his view and speech does not represent all singaporean. pls dont jump on all singaporean. both countries already have enough misunderstanding. if you allow me to say, what you have posted was quite unnecessary and not quite professional especially for a pilot. I know both countries are not in very good terms but some of my very best friends happens to be malaysian and i have no problem with that.

cheers!

[Islander Jock]

People,

Can we please get this topic back on track instead of a Malaysian vs Singaporean slanging match?

Hermie and Boeinglover, thanks for your thoughts but in case you misunderstood me, it is not my intention to creat a flying college to prepare people for work with major airlines. Rather, a smaller operation to get pilots up to say, PPL day VFR.

Does anyone know how supportive the CAAS is towards GA operators?

Regards

IJ

[anito4a]

Hermie,

Good to see you've applied reverse thrusts ... we don't need another International incident here ;)
... I thought the cold war was over !

[Hermie]

Islander Jock,

My apologies for astraying from intended course.

The lads in Angkasa Online might be able to help you out.

Nevertheless, All the Very Best in opening a Flight School ! Do update all of us, especially the people in Singapore / Malaysia if you choose to open a Flight School in this areas in the future !

Best Regards,
Herman

[anito4a]

IslanderJock,

... getting back on track ..

Boeinglover mentioned Batam as a destination for flight training ops. Not a bad suggestion I guess, since it is near enough to Singapore if you need access to a greater pool of resources (LAMES, spares etc). You might find this article useful about the Batam Flying club;

http://www.angkasa-online.com/09/09/ordirga/ordirga1.htm

Although my Indon is a bit rusty, the gist of it says that the Batam Flying Club was originally established by three foreign nationals operating microlights, and now offers joy rides to both tourists and local members. It has an airstrip of 250 meters which can be extended to 600 meters to cater for light aircraft.

It appears to me from this article that what you're proposing to do in Indonesia is possible and has been done before, albeit on a smaller scale with microlights.

Good luck!

BTW, IJ, there are a number of these flying clubs around Asia. The following links might be of interest to you just to get a feel of the GA scene in Asia;

Brunei Flying Club (http://www.geocities.com/rbfc_bn/)

Hong Kong Flying Club (http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Cockpit/1828/index.html)

Thai Flying Club (http://www.thaiflyingclub.com/)

Singapore Airlines Flying Club (http://www.sia-flying-club.org/about.cfm)

ESB Flying Club, Malaysia (http://www.esbfc.com/)

Sabah Flying Club, Malaysia (http://members.nbci.com/_XMCM/sfclub/act/index.html)

.... BTW, the Thai flying club website offers some great info on International private operations and procedures.

Cheers!

[Islander Jock]

Thanks Anito4a for the advice and to everyone else who offered suggestions and encouragement.

This project is very much in it's infancy, however I will keep you informed through this thread of how things progress.

Regards

IJ