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garp
21st May 2008, 14:48
Young daughters that is...
Rule One:
If you pull into my driveway and honk you'd better be delivering a package, because you're sure not picking anything up.

Rule Two:
You do not touch my daughter in front of me. You may glance at her, so long as you do not peer at anything below her neck. If you cannot keep your eyes or hands off of my daughter's body, I will remove them.

Rule Three:
I am aware that it is considered fashionable for boys of your age to wear their trousers so loosely that they appear to be falling off their hips. Please don't take this as an insult, but you and all of your friends are complete idiots. Still, I want to be fair and open minded about this issue, so I propose his compromise: You may come to the door with your underwear showing and your pants ten sizes too big, and I will not object. However, in order to ensure that your clothes do not, in fact, come off during the course of your date with my daughter, I will take my electric nail gun and fasten your trousers securely in place to your waist.

Rule Four:
I'm sure you've been told that in today's world, sex without utilizing a "barrier method" of some kind can kill you. Let me elaborate, when it comes to sex, I am the barrier, and I will kill you.

Rule Five:
It is usually understood that in order for us to get to know each other, we should talk about sports, politics, and other issues of the day. Please do not do this. The only information I require from you is an indication of when you expect to have my daughter safely back at my house, and the only word I need from you on this subject is "early."

Rule Six:
I have no doubt you are a popular fellow, with many opportunities to date other girls. This is fine with me as long as it is okay with my daughter. Otherwise, once you have gone out with my little girl, you will continue to date no one but her until she is finished with you. If you make her cry, I will make you cry.

Rule Seven:
As you stand in my front hallway, waiting for my daughter to appear, and more than an hour goes by, do not sigh and fidget. If you want to be on time for the movie, you should not be dating. My daughter is putting on her makeup, a process that can take longer than painting the Golden Gate Bridge. Instead of just standing there, why don't you do something useful, like changing the oil in my car?

Rule Eight:
The following places are not appropriate for a date with my daughter: Places where there are beds, sofas, or anything softer than a wooden stool. Places where there are no parents, policemen, or nuns within eyesight. Places where there is darkness. Places where there is dancing, holding hands, or happiness. Places where the ambient temperature is warm enough to induce my daughter to wear shorts, tank tops, midriff T-shirts, or anything other than overalls, a sweater, and a goose down parka - zipped up to her throat. Movies with a strong romantic or sexual theme are to be avoided; movies which features chain saws are okay. Hockey games are okay. Old folks homes are better.

Rule Nine:
Do not lie to me. I may appear to be a potbellied, balding, middle-aged, dimwitted has-been. But on issues relating to my daughter, I am the all-knowing, merciless god of your universe. If I ask you where you are going and with whom, you have one chance to tell me the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. I have a shotgun, a shovel, and five acres behind the house. Do not trifle with me.

Rule Ten:
Be afraid. Be very afraid. It takes very little for me to mistake the sound of your car in the driveway for a chopper coming in over a rice paddy near Hanoi. When my Agent Orange starts acting up, the voices in my head frequently tell me to clean the guns as I wait for you to bring my daughter home. As soon as you pull into the driveway you should exit your car with both hands in plain sight. Speak the perimeter password, announce in a clear voice that you have brought my daughter home safely and early, then return to your car - there is no need for you to come inside. The camouflaged face at the window is mine.

Binoculars
21st May 2008, 15:26
An oldie but a goldie, and oh so true!

Rule Eleven: Do not under any circumstances think that you can get away with doing to my daughter what I did to many old farts' daughters in the 70's. :E

cats_five
21st May 2008, 15:33
Surely young daughters are too young to be dating? Teenage daughters I'd say. And rule 8 underestimates the ability of a teenage girl to wear almost nothing in the middle of a cold snap, in winter, with a brisk easterly wind all the way from Siberia.

Binoculars
21st May 2008, 15:43
Surely young daughters are too young to be dating?

Good heavens, man, you have to move with the times. I'm a very hip, modern parent, and once my daughters get to 25 they can date whomever they like. You should try to be more liberal.

goudie
21st May 2008, 16:12
10 Rules etc
Just sent this to my son-in-law in Ca. He's trying to come to terms with the fact that his 'little girl' is now a teenager. Having brought up 3 daughters I know how he feels. They now take great delight in telling me how they outwitted me most times when it came me doing the 'and where do you think you're going young lady?' bit' and 'what time do you call this?

BlueDiamond
21st May 2008, 16:26
I'm a very hip, modern parent, and once my daughters get to 25 they can date whomever they like.
Allowing your offspring such liberties will only end in tears, Binos. Shame on you!

Beatriz Fontana
21st May 2008, 17:25
My dad's fantastic. He gave me my passion for all things historic and my appreciation for art, music, politics, the military and what's right in life.

He still picks me up from the railway station when I come home, calls me with dodgy jokes when I'm on ops, and has always quizzed me about potential boyfriends. Even now I get the Spanish Inquisition!

Solid Rust Twotter
21st May 2008, 17:43
I didn't expect the Spanish Inquisition....:}

BlueDiamond
21st May 2008, 17:51
Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition ... their chief weapon is surprise ... :uhoh:

'Chuffer' Dandridge
21st May 2008, 18:12
...surprise and fear.... .

.....Amongst our weaponry are such diverse elements as fear, surprise, a ruthless efficiency and an almost fanatical devotion to the Pope:D

Evening Star
21st May 2008, 18:17
... and nice red uniforms ... :eek:

Taildragger67
21st May 2008, 18:18
Surprise...yada yada yada... and an almost fanatical devotion to the pope, etc.

Now, can we get back to the topic? I have friends with a young (still in single figures) daughter and it has recently dawned on him that it's not too many years until pimply scrotes start eyeing off his first-born in the same way that he eyed off older mens' adughters when he was a pimply scrote, and it's scared the bejeezuz out of him.

So he's suggested to me and another mate that we might be called upon to come over and clean the guns & hunting knives when the boys come a-callin'... :}

Dammit, Chuffer, you got in ahead of me!

Radar66
21st May 2008, 18:43
Friend of mine's father used to leave his FFL kepi on full view on the hall table when various 'young gentlemen' used to come knocking.


He never seemed to have any trouble... :E

Rossian
21st May 2008, 19:30
Friend of mine went into the full harrumphing mode when his daughter proposed going touring round Scotland staying in B&Bs with the then boyfriend. Really worked himself into a lather, until SWMBO said "Well, it didn't do US any harm did it dear?? All those years ago?" Collapse of stout party.
The Ancient Mariner

Blacksheep
21st May 2008, 20:31
Daughters are people too, you know and my own experience is that they are much more sensible than the majority of fathers, me included. Lay down a few basic rules such as when to be home and how much their allowance is and leave the rest to them. Ours taught me about as much as I ever taught them and like most young women, they've turned out as beautiful, sensible and well adjusted as their Mum.

Parapunter
21st May 2008, 20:38
Yeah well, I love my daughter more than anything & while it's easy to say leave them to it, I know what a terrible fanny rat I was as a teenager. Still am, truth be told. So forgive me if I polish the purdeys & the axes when she brings Derek back here.

Boys will be boys & therefore I will be nemesis if any one of those herberts gets ideas above their hormones.

Blacksheep
21st May 2008, 20:49
A more effective (and unlike shootings or axings, perfectly legal) way of getting rid of unwanted boyfriends is to ask them in, sit them down, pass them a tinny and talk about football and cars etc, while dear daughter makes impatient faces in the background.

Then, for the final nail in his coffin lid, tell her what a great bloke you think he his.

Juud
21st May 2008, 21:04
As usual,The Blacksheep has it.
Perfect words of wisdom & truth in both those posts. :D

PS: You steaming dads are forgetting 2 things:

Your daughter has hormones just like those boys. Talk to her about what's good for her and what isn't. Rather than behaving like a Cro Magnon scaring off suitors.
If you scare her off sex when she is young, how will she ever enjoy it as a grown up woman?



Oldie but Goldie garp. :ok:

Parapunter
21st May 2008, 21:36
I hope not, she's 18 months old - I'm just staking the territory.:E

ShyTorque
21st May 2008, 21:51
sensible and well adjusted as their Mum.

Now I'm REALLY worried. :eek:

I'm coming around to this arranged marriage thing. If I'm paying, why shouldn't I choose what I'm buying?

BlueDiamond
22nd May 2008, 02:31
I know this thread started off as a funny one (which it certainly is) but it never ceases to amaze me ... the complete about-face that men do with regard to girls/women. The attitude ranges from trying to get into the pants of anything that has a pulse, to complete puritanism ... and men have this magical ability to hold both of those attitudes at the same time (as per Parapunter's post.)

A daughter is a daughter, guys. If she's not your own much-loved child, she's someone else's. So how about a little consistency in your thinking ... it's the old "do as you would be done by" thing. Oh, and once she's past the age of consent (whatever it may be in your country), what she chooses to do with her own body is nobody else's business. Including yours.

FakePilot
22nd May 2008, 02:37
I hope my daughter is very homely. Because otherwise she'll have a different boyfriend coming around every week and well, ammunition is expensive.

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh!
22nd May 2008, 03:03
That's why you should have sons, because when you have a son ...


...you only have to worry about one penis :=

notmyC150v2
22nd May 2008, 03:07
Hear hear.

And boys can't get pregnant.

If any slut beguiles one of my boys into the sack and falls pregnant as a result I will ban them from seeing her ever again. My boys shouldn't have to associate with such cheap floozies.

AAAhhhh the joy of boys. Of course my brother has different views but that is his fault for having a daughter. Never was very smart :}:}:}:}

Parapunter
22nd May 2008, 07:20
Hey Bluey, I'm joshing dontcha know. I actually think my job is to send off a well rounded young lady into the world, equipped to make her own decisions. What would kill me however, is if in that nether world between a child & all growed up , she made the kind of mistakes that can reverberate throughout a lifetime - that's when I would get stuck in - you only get one go at life & my kids'll get all the help they need.

IRISHPILOT
22nd May 2008, 07:46
BD, what if that age of consent happens to be 12, as in some countries, or 13 or 14 as in some EU countries and some States in the US? You'd just say "t'is all right, you're over the age of consent, t'is your body now. You sure you want that Barbie for Xmas?"

BlueDiamond
22nd May 2008, 09:15
Yes, Para ... I absolutely DO know, darls! :ok:

IRISH ... the fact is that it is ALWAYS her body whether her parents like it or not. Their job (as parents) is to educate her so that she knows how to make wise choices once she does reach the age of consent. It is also the parents' job to educate their children right from the start that it IS the child's own body and no one else's and that nobody, but NOBODY, has the right to touch inappropriately unless (and until) that child is old enough to consent.

Once any child reaches the age of consent, he or she is free to make their own choices legally. Many choose to do so long before they reach that age which is why we have the tragic situation of children impregnating/becoming pregnant. We decide what is an appropriate age of consent in our own community and enact laws to reflect our feelings on that. Different communities (countries) have different ideas and it is not for us to decide on their behalf what is appropriate or not.

It is not all that long ago that girls were expected to be married by age twelve or thirteen and have produced several children by the time they were out of their teens. Many of them died doing so as did their children. Some communities have learned from that, others have not
so discrepancies exist between what different peoples feel is an appropriate age of consent.

But regardless of our personal feelings, if our child has reached the age of consent (in whatever the country), she can legally say "yes." This is what we have an age of consent for.

alwayzinit
22nd May 2008, 10:32
Whilst transporting 6 barely clad 16 and 17 yr old young ladies( MY GOD.I have hankerchieves with more material!!!)\

Approaching said party I asked my girl if she had her condoms!!! Her friends went into complete OH MY GOD mode.

My girl in a very tired and bored voice: " Yes DAD I've got my condoms!"
"Good, those of you who don't have any Amy will have plenty!"

More OH MY GODS!!!!!!!!!!!!!I CAN"T BELIEVE YOUR DAD etc

My reply? "Right as you all have condoms! You can have as much S#X as you like ................ But No Drinking or Smoking!!!!"

Much squeeling, more Oh My Gods and much laughter..............!

Now we have a fantastic open grown up relationship with No1 girl and her buddies without any silly awkwardness...............................

That said I still keep my shotgun handy!

Alwayz:ok:

garp
22nd May 2008, 11:36
Whilst transporting 6 barely clad 16 and 17 yr old young ladies( MY GOD.I have hankerchieves with more material!!!)\

Approaching said party I asked my girl if she had her condoms!!! Her friends went into complete OH MY GOD mode.

My girl in a very tired and bored voice: " Yes DAD I've got my condoms!"
"Good, those of you who don't have any Amy will have plenty!"

More OH MY GODS!!!!!!!!!!!!!I CAN"T BELIEVE YOUR DAD etc

My reply? "Right as you all have condoms! You can have as much S#X as you like ................ But No Drinking or Smoking!!!!"

Much squeeling, more Oh My Gods and much laughter..............!

Now we have a fantastic open grown up relationship with No1 girl and her buddies without any silly awkwardness...............................

That said I still keep my shotgun handy!

Alwayz

Good post, I like the shotgun bit. I have two boys and a girl, the youngest. Still some hope left that her brothers will grow tall and strong so they can impress/chase or anihilate potential candidates.

BlueWolf
22nd May 2008, 11:36
One has been blessed with the honour of being allowed to raise five stepdaughters.

I have said 'one' thing to all of them, above all other things, and it is this;

*Don't ever feel that you have to do anything you don't want to do, just because someone else says you should.

*Don't ever feel you shouldn't do something you do want to do, just because someone else says you shouldn't.

*Whatever you do decide to do, do it carefully.

*If you ever need anything, help, advice, a shoulder to cry on, a big ugly bastard to come rescue you, you know where I am.

*Always keep your phone on. I don't care what time of night it is, or what town you're in, if you need me to come get you, I will. Trust me that I will bring firearms and / or dogs if I believe such to be necessary.

*When you bring them to visit, the ones who bring a box of beer will be viewed most favourably.

*If they stay two days or more, they will be assigned duties.

I have said only one thing to my girls' suitors.

*If you hurt my little girl, I will cut off your balls, and feed them to my dogs.

It's worked so far. One grandchild, two good relationships, one who's still too young, one asshole who won't come near the place, several boxes of beer, and no cutting.

And the dogs are making do on dogroll. For now. :E

D SQDRN 97th IOTC
22nd May 2008, 11:57
BlueWolf

that made me smile....

Reminds me of a friend who told me he once that went to visit the folks of his new girlfriend from Texas. The father was a senator. After dinner, the senator took him outside for a brief talk....he said:

"John. I just want to clear on one thing. The way you make my little girl feel - that's the way I'm gonna make you feel. Do we understand each other?"

goudie
22nd May 2008, 12:08
Back in the 50's there was a story doing the rounds about a woman who claimed to have had a 'virgin birth'.
I was about 17 at the time and whilst waiting for my girlfriend to get ready her father said to me 'do you believe in all this virgin birth stuff then'?
'No, I replied, he looked me straight in the eye and said 'neither do I'!

Binoculars
22nd May 2008, 12:42
Nice post Blue Wolf. :ok:

Most of us fathers have one thing in common; we love our little girls to bits and would willingly die if it meant sparing them anything nasty. No matter our beliefs in anything else we post on here, that is a bond that only those with daughters can understand. And of course it doesn't matter how old they are, they are still our little girls.

Avtrician
22nd May 2008, 12:58
Daughter is pretty choosy, ditched her last boy friend cos he moved to melbourne. She didnt go cos it was too far away.

Current boyfriend has her confused cos he has nothing going for him. His name is the same as my Son, and my first name (Yeah I know, I was feeling lazy at the time of naming). He is a Yank, lives in yank land , and is a Marine.

On a recent bonding session the Bastard shot me in the right kidney three times and once in the head. (He did say sorry later, he thought he missed :bored::bored: ) I told him he was fired:rolleyes::rolleyes:

Oh it was paintballing by the way.

He has been warned, make my girl unhappy, and I go hunting.

Strange how things happen tho, I met my wife in thailand 25 yrs ago, and brought her here. Now daughter is doing a similar thing:ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::\:\

Oh well.:(:(

frostbite
22nd May 2008, 13:00
Take it easy you guys!

Several decades ago, I went on a first date with a girl. Her father subjected me to a fifteen minute lecture on how wonderful, innocent and precious she was before I was allowed to take her out of the house.

I was so narked that I then subjected her to several hours non-stop groping and general unpleasantness. Rotten, I know, but I would have treated her with much more respect had I received some from him.

sillypoint
22nd May 2008, 13:50
frostbite your post tells me all I need to know about you...

Juud
22nd May 2008, 14:33
Frostbite, your posts reminded me of something I haven't thought about for years ..... sillypoint, I do believe your username explains that post of yours ;)

When I was a teenager, I brought home a wide variety of boyfriends. My Dad treated each and every one of them as if they were respectable pillars of society in whose integrity he had the greatest faith. This surprised the heck out of some of them. :ooh:

Tall black bloke dressed in white soul clothes with matching white boots, heels higher than my Mum's. He also had a gold front tooth and a white wide-brimmed hat. My Dad, conservatively dressed MD from a strict christian background.
"Welcome young man, have a seat, would you like something to drink? What is it you do for a living? You study do you? What are you studying for? Ah, to become a carpenter; splendid profession, a good honourable future for you then. My daughter tells me you have a mother and 3 sisters here in the country? Which makes you the man in the house; a heavy responsibility isn't it lad?"
Ivan couldn't agree more; keeping track of his fun loving sisters was a chore.
"So you are taking my daughter dancing, all the way to the big city? Jolly nice I am sure. What time did you think of having her back here then? Would midnight be good?" (I almost choked righh there, NOBODY was ever home by midnight except me!)

The dancing was great, as was the exotic company. Ivan wasn't known for his punctuality, but by 23.30 he marched me off to his American floater and drove me home.
"Your Dad is a gent, I want to keep my word". My protests fell on deaf ears.
Ivan and I didn't last long, but for years, long after I had left home, my Mum's friends always wondered how on earth my Mum knew the tall black guy who always waved so enthusiastically whenever they met in the village.
My Mum just smiled and waved back happily.

****

We had a small summerhouse on the shores of Lake Como in Italy. A Dutch enclave of about 45 small bungalows. Its adult inhabitants generally frowned on fraternisation with the locals, while us teenage girls loved nothing better. This meant that the local lads generally only entered Parco Sole Mio under the cover of darkness, and quite a few of them were still chased off by angry Dutch dads.
One evening I was standing behind the house chatting to Luigi, a young engineering student. (stil dream about him at times now 35 years later, that's how much in luuuurve I was ;) ) Suddenly Luigi jumps into boxing postion, both fists raised. I turn and see my peaceloving Dad standing there. Who completely ignores the pugilist stance and says "Luigi, why don't you and my daughter take a seat on the terrace, much more comfortable than standing here in the wet grass. And by the way lad, I have made some enquiries about you in the village, and people tell me you are a fine young man. So my wife are happy for you to date our daughter"
Luigi, who previously had been chased off at gunpoint by another Dutch father, was stunned speechless and almost ran. He didn't and we had a great summer together. Unlike some of his-friends-dating-my-friends, he never pressed me into anything I wasn't ready for.
Pretty sure it was because my parents treated him the way they expected him to treat me.

airborne_artist
22nd May 2008, 14:53
I have three daughters - aged 20, 17 and 14. Boys have been coming back here in ones, twos etc for the past four or so years. I've tried hard to be like Juud's Dad, and it's worked so far. They all are well-mannered, considerate and pleasant. One lad who came here quite early on has lots of metal in his face, but is no different to the others. He's worked in Halfords for quite a while, and is always happy to help with bikes and cars.

Another one is a superb pianist. I have a happy memory of listening to three of them (daughter on sax, another lad on guitar) jamming really well.

The middle one has a regular boyfriend who regularly stays over. Comes from a slightly messed-up family background, but he's planning to join the RAF as non-commissioned aircrew, is an Air Cadet, and always very neat and polite.

We've always encouraged our kids to bring their friends here (and who wouldn't want the place full of young ladies?) and the end result is that they come here expecting to be treated with respect. They always return the gesture.

We've had big (100+) parties here with no problems - except huge piles of bottles afterwards :E

So far it's been a success. The eldest wants to study medicine when she completes her Anatomy degree, and the middle one wants to fly in the Services, preferably the Navy. That'd make her the third generation in the Dark Blue :ok:

radeng
22nd May 2008, 16:23
I was told that you should show any prospective boyfriend the photos of her sitting on a potty or running round the garden naked or whatever when she was about 18 months old. This embarasses her so much that she drops them (prospective boyfriend, that is) straight away!

Not that I would know, not having any kids that I know of.

S'land
23rd May 2008, 01:02
One did take a photograph of one's first niece when she was nearly three months old having her nappy changed after a particularly nasty moment with the intention of showing it to her boyfriends in later years. One occasionally tormented said niece by showing her the photograph and explaining what it was to be used for. This went on until she was about eight years old. After which one could not find said photograph. One managed to forget about it until last Christmas when one stayed with same niece and her fiancÚ for Christmas (she is now 28 years old). Whilst sitting drinking a glass of Christmas cheer niece pulls out the photograph and gave it to one saying that she had saved one the bother of showing it to her fiancÚ by showing it him herself. She showed it to him before they got engaged, so embarrassing photographs don't always work.

pablo m
23rd May 2008, 03:13
Garp,
I needed a laugh to get my mind off the stuff happening at the big red 'roo hangars, with 3 teenage daughters I need all the help I can get!
lets keep 'em flying:)

chuks
23rd May 2008, 05:43
I too am part of this demographic, with a 19 year-old daughter who is attracting a certain amount of attention.

Well, should I wish for a wall-flower or put her in a convent?

I probably do come off as some sort of maniac to some of the locals but nothing much will scare a teenage male under the control of his hormones so that I think we can forget threats, all of this faux-hillbilly, "Boy, you gunna be in a whole heap o' trouble if'n Ah see Lurleen cryin'." That BS won't fly, since the yoof of today are 100% aware of their rights to misbehave free of retribution, plus what am I supposed to do, sit in the back seat of the car whenever my petal goes on a date?

I remember an incident from my own youth that refers.

My father was Stone Age, raised in an old-fashioned Catholic family in a small town in Oregon, two of his sisters became nuns. Modern morals circa 1965 were nothing he wanted to know about, with sex and sex education being taboo subjects around the cave.

My next oldest sister chose to simply fly below the radar, where I was always kicking against the Spanish Inquistion. That worked out pretty well for her, when she was taken to be some little beacon of purity, at least until the morning Father found a diaphragm she had forgotten to take with her when she left the bathroom.

Poor old Father's fantasies led him to leap into the family chariot and career across town to confront the father of the boyfriend over the way his son had polluted our little Catholic pond.

That was one encounter I would have paid money to witness, actually, but I was otherwise engaged saving us from Global Communism on the other side of the world. Father shouting at this little Jewish man about... what, exactly? Modern times, the youth of today? I don't think he really knew, there.

To my mind that epitomised a failure to deal with reality, so that I don't even joke about this approach to ensuring my daughter's happiness. All we do is put sex out there on the table as one more aspect of life rather than a veiled mystery. I mean, a bird lands on your head and nine months later: Jesus! (Don't start with the theology lessons: this was my father's take on things, it is not mine!)

The funniest aspect of things for me is that my daughter is a raving prude when it comes to the idea of her parents having a sex life. Where does she think she came from, anyway?

stellar
23rd May 2008, 06:02
Garp,
Think u have very unhealthy interest in daughter's(') social life - go get hobby or something!!

cats_five
23rd May 2008, 10:58
Chuks, *all* young people are prudes about their parents having a sex life. One definition of middle-age is that that bit of prudery has gone.

sillypoint
23rd May 2008, 13:32
Juud sillypoint, I do believe your username explains that post of yours ;)
I don't believe my username does explain my post, I believe the content explains my post.

(I would use sensiblepoint, but I don't think Wisden covers this position)

ShyTorque
24th May 2008, 21:49
I too am part of this demographic, with a 19 year-old daughter who is attracting a certain amount of attention.
Well, should I wish for a wall-flower or put her in a convent?
I probably do come off as some sort of maniac to some of the locals but nothing much will scare a teenage male under the control of his hormones so that I think we can forget threats, all of this faux-hillbilly, "Boy, you gunna be in a whole heap o' trouble if'n Ah see Lurleen cryin'." That BS won't fly, since the yoof of today are 100% aware of their rights to misbehave free of retribution, plus what am I supposed to do, sit in the back seat of the car whenever my petal goes on a date?


I think you might find a use for one of these:

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=vuOCxO1C2Xs

Bonkers99
2nd Jun 2008, 08:21
LOL. Loved 'em!

I found lots also at http://www.forcesreunited.org.uk/forum/displayforum.asp?F=24

jaycee58
7th Jun 2008, 23:43
I always make one thing very clear to my daughter:- if you're not in bed by 11 o'clock...come home:)