SIA career [Archive] - PPRuNe Forums

ironbutt57

26th Sep 2000, 10:20

the biggest hurdle is to find an expat job where you are not stepping on the toes of local pilots trying to advance their careers...many countries for years the locals couldn't be bothered to fly airplanes..not an honorable career..no pay...for whatever reason...but these places are becoming fewer and farther between...if you go to a place where you're not wanted but begrudgingly accepted..after the "thrill" of airline flying is gone give it 6 months, then you find yourself unhappy and feeling unwanted..and in some cases under the legal burden of some staggering training bond...the worse the place is the higher the bond to trap you there...read the pages on Pprune..disregard the sour grapes as well as the "hiney-kissers" who defend their national airlines abuses and decide for yourself...beware of huge training bonds...be careful what you wish for...you might get it!!! Just remember flying is not your life it's what you do to support your lifestyle if you find yourself without a life or lifestyle then what's the point?

Gladiator

26th Sep 2000, 19:52

Exakkery, correc, correc.

Contrails

28th Sep 2000, 04:51

Thank you for your answers.
One more doubt: Are these problems for F/O position or Capt. (or both)?

Slasher

28th Sep 2000, 13:41

Both. SIAs crap is distributed evenly among the foreign trash. Rank is no barrier or advantage.

Gordo

29th Sep 2000, 05:47

Hey contrail just another thing,
there have been expat captains who have been relatively happy here for up to 10-15 years who have been pissed off enough recently to leave for other folk, so that doesn't really instill a lot of confidence in the system.
Please take wanwinglo's advice and try the likes of Eva, Korean, China air etc
and spare yourself a big mistake.

Ps Glad, didn't that use to drive you effing bonkers?! (correc, correc)

[This message has been edited by Gordo (edited 29 September 2000).]

Gladiator

29th Sep 2000, 07:42

More than you know. Oh, and here is another good one.

"How long have you been with us?"

Slasher

29th Sep 2000, 14:03

What drove ME bloodey nuts was the standard 5 questions asked by each ninja turtle whenever I went for a cabin walk to stretch my legs:

1st: Have you had your dinner?

2nd: Do you want a drink?

3rd: Where are you from?

4th: How long have you been with us?

5th: Is your wife with you?

Must be part of their training program.

Gladiator

29th Sep 2000, 19:47

Actually Slasher, "Have you had your dinner", or "have you eaten", is a Chinese greeting translated from Chinese into English. It really has nothing to do with whether you are actually hungry or not.

It stems from the days of extreme poverty when a meal was a big deal. So it became a standard form of greeting, "have you eaten".

As for, "where are you from", and, "is your wife with you", those are the standard questions when she wants to jump you (my experience). Damn Slasher, tell me you did not waist a good piece of a**.

Contrails

1st Oct 2000, 06:28

Thank you buddies, I appreciated very much your answers. It's really very hard to fly where you're not welcome. But if they need so many pilots with experience, and I think they don't have pilots in conditions to take the controls, why do they have an "environment" like that? Is there any kind of expat. pilot association? With a French-Portuguese name is Maurice de Vaz from Singapore? Are the salaries good enough to live in Singapore and you can save anything to stay there and say goodbye when your contract is over?
Sorry folks, I know, silly questions again, but I'm very interested in your opinion, I would like to learn something with you.

addinfurnightem

1st Oct 2000, 09:30

Contrails - are you planning to join as a Captain or an F/O and on what fleet? It all makes a big difference. Some of your countrymen are here, (as Capts.), and love it, especially the lack of crime and the exchange rate!

noodles

1st Oct 2000, 18:59

Slasher & Gladiator, the actual phrase is "have you taken your lunch?" It used to drive me nuts. You eat food but take medicine. If you answered "taken it where" you would get a blank look.

It is fascinating though, as Gladiator rightly points out, to ponder the many superstitions and beliefs that stem from the peasant background of the Chinese majority.

Gordo

2nd Oct 2000, 17:16

Wait, there's more..

"Crew Joint"

"Walking Street"

"Get your Dry Stores"

"Are you going to COSCO?"

Gladiator

2nd Oct 2000, 19:05

Gordo you forgot, "makan, makan".

Why repeat everything twice?

Zandor

2nd Oct 2000, 21:21

Is Maurice de Vaz from Singapore?

Gladiator

3rd Oct 2000, 02:15

Singaporean, he is dark with origins from Sri Lanka. He is a smart cookie, actually in person (outside SIA parameters) he is a nice guy.

titan

3rd Oct 2000, 06:19

addinfurnightem:
So easily lead. In 1994 I was looking at the world almanac(I think the CIA put it out - seriously, go to their web site) and lo and behold, there was little Singapore with the world's second highest rate of burglary with violence. It seems that the worker on the building site earning $250/month for a 12 hour/6 day week has really nothing to lose when he looks out and sees all those $500,000 Mercedes everywhere. But Changi has a reputation and people will do what ever is required to make sure they don't get caught.
The other big point here is that most crime is soughted out on a family to family basis. Uncle Wong plays with the little girl down the street and a $100,000 changes hands to overcome the problem. Both families are happy. Of course the little girl is traumatised for life, but the family picked up a cool hundred, and at the end of the day, in Singapore, it is only money that matters.
The Parkway is infamous for deviants, but shh ....... dont let the tourists find out!

The Prisoner

3rd Oct 2000, 06:27

"You like spicy food, argh?"
"How much you pay, lah?"
"How you find Singapore"

my answer to the last inanity was to reply
"like my harse'ole"
"what you mean, lah?"
"well,hot, sticky, and very smelly"

addinfurnightem

3rd Oct 2000, 07:22

TITAN - not so easily led, you ever spent much time in Brazil? no, thought not.
Go back to your CIA web site and check out the crime figures for that country! Cheers.

Gladiator

3rd Oct 2000, 08:42

Addinfur in all fairness come on we all know Singapore is nothing but a (as one user put it) shopping mall by day, a place infested by hookers at night (be careful, the girl might even be a guy).

Crime rate is one of the highest in the world if you look at the ratio. The number of crimes commited (much of the the crimes are swept under the carpet and or never reported) are very high for a population of just over 3 million.

I do not have time right now, but will come back with a great story. A great personal story of Singapore police/justice system.

It is time to drink beer (I can afford it now that I do not live in Singapore).

Gordo

3rd Oct 2000, 09:05

Just to add to the last part of titan's last message,

A few years ago a "Mr Wong" incident happened
to an expats couple's young daughter.

The Police(!!!) actually advised them to make a cash deal with the (extermely wealthy and upstanding no doubt) parents of the offender.They fought for a conviction but I can't recall what happened.They did leave sing pretty soon after though.

There is a lot of crime that does not get officially recorded but just passed over as 'incidents' where nothing much is done about them.

[This message has been edited by Gordo (edited 03 October 2000).]

Kaptin M

3rd Oct 2000, 11:05

Some more venting of the spleen, by the late Gladiator:

Crime rate is one of the highest in the world if you look at the ratio. The number of crimes commited (much of the the crimes are swept under the carpet and or never reported) are very high for a population of just over 3 million.

And so how does the Ayatollah happen to have access to this interesting "fact" your[/b] flying one]?

[i]They fought for a conviction but I can't recall what happened...........how about researching it, and coming up with a factual end to this one, Gordo.

addinfurnightem

3rd Oct 2000, 11:51

Sorry Gladiator and Gordo, I just don't buy your thesis. Check the crime figures for Rio de J. and Sao Paulo and compare them to Singapore.
Contrails wanted answers, his fellow countrymen, who I fly with DO like Singapore for its low crime and the exchange rate against their own currency, their words.
(If the Far East forum wasn't so full of BS and invective some of them might bother to read it!).

Gordo

3rd Oct 2000, 15:16

The incident concerened did happen and the reason I can't recall is because I just plain don't remember.

Research it !?? no thanks.
As far as I'm concerned this is an internet chat forum, not a court of law.

Chill :)

Gladiator

3rd Oct 2000, 21:09

Addinfur,

1) My info is very accurate, it comes from people that served as police in Singapore.
2) Who cares about Rio, Singapore has high crime rate per population.
3) If Far East forum is full of BS, what are you doing here reading it.
4) When Far East forum was created, you cried foul, told Danny you did not want to be a part of it (You do remember Meth. do you not).

M, you are a geek. I had an e-mail from a SIA cabin crew. In that e-mail she brought to my attention a posting by you.

This post happened last year in the cabin crew forum. You contributed to a discussion about cabin crew uniforms. Your input about SIA cabin crew uniforms finally proved that you have never been a crewmember at SIA (SIA cabin crew do not wear two kinds of shoes as part of their uniform as mentioned by M).

I doubt that you are even a pilot. This was way too obvious during your comments in Singapore Airlines vs. Gladiator posts parts 1 & 2.

In other post M told another contributor that he works on the third floor of a building on Changi Road (SIA training center).

In another post he claims that he or she does not work for SIA.

Which is it M, are you losing track of what you are, are not, or want to be.

Conclusion, M is an employee of Singapore government. His job is counter propoganda on the internet. Probably engages other forums that are not aviation related looking for anything anti-Singaporean.

The trouble is he does not understand aviation. That is why he has never engaged or has not been able to enagage in discussing technical aspects of aviation.

Agent M you must wear Coke bottle glasses. Wear your sandals, scrape them as you walk, catch two buses to get to the MRT, carry your food in the little orange bag from the hawker center and go to work. Sure hope you have a good chair.

Kaptin M

4th Oct 2000, 00:39

Sure hope you have a good chair. I do, thanks, it's on the left, which is not somewhere you're likely to see for a very, very long time.

As for the shoes, I stated that the females wear a dark-colored, leather pair when going to anf from the aircraft, and flip-flops, on board. In fact the male cabin crew, wear black leather ones all the time, that in itself [the difference onboard between the guys and the ladies] already counts as two different types.

Not very observant of you at all - or is it a case of further mis-information being espoused by the Ayatollah?!

Gladiator

4th Oct 2000, 04:33

Bull sh*t agent M, you have been caught red handed. Do not even try to play lawyer. It took one SIA cabin crew to catch you slip big time. It was just a matter of time anyway. I suspected it a long time ago when you asked to be spoon fed about technical details.

Like many other non-pilots even you agent M have the same rights as pilots to post on PPRuNe.

Gladiator

4th Oct 2000, 08:16

You are busted agent M. Busted by a SIA cabin crew.

Original post by Agent M, a.k.a Kaptin M (did you mean Captain, did not know how to spell it, or intended it to be Kaptin).

Dec 7, 1999 Cabin Crew forum

...and slip-on shoes [slippers]...if you had observed, the cabin crew change from their leather [outside the aircraft], to these much more practical, and comfortable accessories for the flight...no pinched, or smelly feet, after hours of walking the aisles,

So in trying to play lawyer Agent M you are getting yourself deeper into sh*t. So who changes from outside shoes to inside the aircraft shoes. Do you mean the male cabin crew or female cabin crew?

Facts Agent M are that the male and female SIA cabin crew wear the same thing outside and inside the aircraft.

Malaysian (MAS)on the other hand does what you described in your Dec 1999 post.

You have been busted and outsmarted by a girl Agent M. It is you that changes to sandals at work.

The Ayatollah will rockandrolla, Agent M's ass is grass and Ayatollah is a lawnmower.

Gladiator

4th Oct 2000, 11:19

Yesterday we were on the subject of crime in Singapore and Singapore's justice/police system. And now my personal experience with Singapore's system of justice.

Date: September 14, 1995
Location: Singapore
Police report No.: B216088 filed at Mountbatten NPP

While driving on Paya Lebar Road, a typical Singaporean driver did not like the fact that I changed lanes. The usual hand on the horn dance began.

I chose to ignore the idiot as his behavior was not unusual for Singapore drivers. He then continued to try to get a reaction out of me. I continued to ignore him. Not satisfied, he opened his window and threw an object towards my windscreen while traveling at 25 mph. The object was a can of Pepsi that missed my windscreen by a few inches and contacted the front of the car.

He then sped away. I chased him for approximately 20 minutes. I finally caught up with him and forced him to stop. He started to scream and shout in Hokkien.

Lucky for me a police car happened to be driving by. The police car stopped and asked us to follow him to the Mountbatten police post.

I told the police that I wished to file criminal charges against the wreckless driver because the can of Pepsi could have gone through the windscreen and caused bodily hurt.

The other driver admitted to the police that he lost his temper and threw the can of Pepsi at my car. I filed a police report.

A few days later I was summoned to the main police station in Geylang. There I was told that there has been an investigation and the case has been closed with no further action required.

I asked why. The reply was that they conducted an investigation and they believe Singaporeans do not engage in the action described in my report.

My reply was that the driver has already admitted to the police, Cpl. Balamurgan, badge number 8797, that he did in fact throw the can of Pepsi at my car. Furthermore I can have Cpl. Balamurgan appear in court and testify to this fact.

I was then advised that having Cpl. Balamurgan appear in court is not possible. The reason is that the word of a member of Singapore police force under the rank of Sgt. does not count.

You gotta be ****ting me. Mickey Mouse police/justice system. On the way home I wondered how the case would have turned out if it was the other way around.

It was at that moment when I realized Michael Fay could have been innocent.

GreatWayToFly

5th Oct 2000, 14:45

That is the fact.SINGAPORE is a racist state.Not just only against the whites,as long as you are not chinese you are discriminated against.Try getting a PR for an Indian or Malay from Malaysia.This divide and rule thing is really doing a great job for SQ.Expats against locals and among locals,Singaporean against Malaysian.
Quite disturbing though to find individuals defending the screw up and the policies there.

Capt Pax

10th Oct 2000, 00:17

Here we go again. Another topic with good potential, ruined when it becomes a pissing match between Gladiator and Kaptin M. Jet Blast to you guys.

And Gladiator, Michael Fay was a prick, caught and convicted dead to rights. If you don't believe me I'll give you the names of the teachers and administrators at SAS who all have been there in excess of 10 years who will openly admit that the kid was a jerk. Only problem with his punishment was that his mother and father didn't have to receive the same thing for gross incompetence in spending so much of their time showing off their money that they had no frigging idea what their kid was doing with his spare time.

Gladiator

10th Oct 2000, 03:02

Capt. Pax I do not intend to get into a pi55ing match with you.

However, whether Michael Fay was a prick or not is not the issue here. The issue is having experienced Singapore's police system, I am qualified to state, "he could have been innocent".

He could have been an innocent prick. Now how pure were you as a teenager? Bomb a few mailboxes? TP a few cars? Or were you involved in church activities during your free time.

When were you a teenager? 50's with a crew cut, 60's (but did'nt inhale)? If your claim of a former USAF officer is true, then you were of an acceptable moral behavior (I know because I too attended OCS, USMC) to have been accepted in the first place.

However, be rest assured a good number of the officers you served with were not model teenagers either, a few were also pricks as a teenager.

Highlander744

11th Oct 2000, 07:32

Glad, I get your point - but it smacks of something J. Nic would have said ( A Few Good Men ) after being asked " Did you, or did you not, order a Code Red ". By the way dude, don't go identifying the enemy ( your Oct 4th msg ) it's not good protocol and you know the world is round, right? Otherwise your comments are justified (unlike the system in question). Loved Slashers dinner annectdote in Integrity Post.

Stay well and keep the Force.

------------------
Highlander744 - In the end there will only be ONE.

[This message has been edited by Highlander744 (edited 11 October 2000).]

asianpilot

11th Oct 2000, 09:00

Cane Michael Fay. No more wayward Yank, Chinese, Indian, British, Aussie, you name it, kids bombing mailboxes, stealing road signs, vandalising public properties, spray painting cars......

Tolerate Michael Fay. How many more cars to be vandalised before you put a stop to it?

The trouble with ****ing self righteous liberals is that they want blood if their own cars are vandalised.

Singapore Laws are tough to deter criminals. That is why people you don't like it here and you won't be able to survive the system either, Gladiator. The same reason you had to leave Iran.

After Fay was sentenced, this was reported in the U.S.

The Singapore Embassy has received more than 100 letters and 200 telephone calls in support of Michael's sentence; Michael's hometown newspaper's opinion columns are full of similar letters supporting Singapore; and numerous talk show hosts and newspaper columnists report a definite support of Michael's sentence.

[This message has been edited by asianpilot (edited 11 October 2000).]

Gladiator

11th Oct 2000, 21:46

All the people, mews reporters, talk show hosts did not have an experience with the Singapore police system.

I did.

Therefore, that makes me qualified to determine that reasonable doubt exists, which leads me to state:

"Michael Fay COULD have been innocent".

p.s. Jimmy what do you know about why I left Iran? I was not even born there, stick to what you know.

noodles

12th Oct 2000, 04:46

Tough laws to deter crime?

Why did the majority of expensive cars at the Condo I lived in have key scratch marks on all the side panels then? Jealous Singaporeans perhaps need tougher laws to further deter their actions.

What is interesting, Asian pilot, is the sentence comparison between Manslaughter and property damage in Singapore. Which crime has the greater sentence? If I drive drunk into a bus stop and kill a handful of people I have less to fear than being a vandal in the Wonder Island.

How dare anyone touch a man's 5 C's?

Ay-Oh.

Gladiator

13th Oct 2000, 00:16

I have even a better one. In Singapore, a foreign (slave) construction worker was paralized due to an accident while on the job.

The supervisor of the construction project took the injured worker in the woods and left him in a water drain to die.

Lucky for the paralized worker there were soldiers in the woods conducting exercises. He was rescued and sent to a hospital.

No criminal charges were ever brought against the Singaporean construction supervisor.

To my view this incident qualified as First Degree attempted murder.

Mickey Mouse judicial system. In Singapore, a 'Murss' (Mercedes Benz) has more value than life.

411A

13th Oct 2000, 07:15

Say there GLADIATOR, it sounds as tho you did not fit in at SQ at all well. Think they are glad to be RID of you. Why did you go there in the first place?

Gladiator

14th Oct 2000, 08:10

We had no idea what we were getting into. There was no way for us to know?

But now it is different, we bring the message via the internet. If you go, at least you have the right information and know what to expect.

Slasher

14th Oct 2000, 14:45

Glad while on the subject of the Singapore MM system, I was told once by a customs bloke there (one of the very few good ones) that not everybody who gets caught with a bag of heroine automaticaly gets the gallows. Have you or anyone else heard about this? When I asked him exactley who decides who gets off and who gets the chop he shrugged his shoulders. Apparantley its because if they hung everyone who they caught with any kind of hard drugs they believe tourists might be frightened off from going there. Only about 30-40% of cases are made public.

I do fully agree of course with their death penalty but do you have any idea of who decides (and what criterion is used) as to whos hung and who gets let off with a "P!ss off & dont come back Jack!" pasted in his passport?

asianpilot

14th Oct 2000, 17:53

' a bag of Heroine? ' Slasher? Didn't know you can carry them in bags unless they are dead or something. Murder is definitely punishable by death.

Noodle, it used to be you got away with a thousand dollar fine for beating up a fellow driver in a case of road rage. For a thousand anyone Sinagporean could beat up Gladiator. They have changed the law to compulsory jailing for road rage assaults. Now Singaporeans think twice before beating up expat f/o. Tough laws protect you after all.

If the can of Pepsi killed Gladiator, the Singaporean who did it would have been honoured as a hero on National Day. I think that was the biggest regret of the Singapore Police Force, the can of Pepsi didn't do its work.
:)

[This message has been edited by asianpilot (edited 14 October 2000).]

Balthazar

14th Oct 2000, 20:39

Asianpilot, I'm not sure what your point is. The Singaore justice system, whilst being extremely punitive, seems to be very egalitarian. The police on the otherhand may be slightly self serving. Just don't get involved in politics, then you dance to the beat of a different drum. A drum to which most locals are more that happy to have leading thier band.

One of the many things that I have learnt, is that Singapore has a lot to offer, as long as you ignore the bull**** and the racism ( that comes from the heartlanders more than the elite).

ManaAdaSystem

14th Oct 2000, 21:52

Asianpilot, that last posting speak volumes about your own person!
And i dont care how many smileys you produce.

411A

15th Oct 2000, 03:33

Say there GLADIATOR, it is only your word and a FEW others. I wonder how many pilots SQ has had over the years who got along OK?
I spent 4 years there, was treated very well and left with good feelings. What was it that made your stay so very disagreeable? Other than your miserable attitude that is.

Gladiator

15th Oct 2000, 05:20

411 were you there as an expat? Captain? FO? started as an SO on local terms? Did you retire? Did you have children while in Singapore?

Majority of the FO on local terms have left. What does that tell you? The majority did not want to be there. May be the majority have/had miserable attitudes.

[This message has been edited by Gladiator (edited 15 October 2000).]

Kaptin M

15th Oct 2000, 05:44

Even if that is the case gLAD, the majority aren't whinging, whining, and carrying on like pork chops in a synagogue, as YOU do.

It seems hard for anyone to be able to discuss Singapore Airlines, without you entering into the posting, and immediately spewing out your venom. Furthermore, it does appear YOU can't control this obsession.

411A

15th Oct 2000, 05:47

GLADIATOR: Was in SQ on the B707, Line & Training Captain, expat terms. No children. Would agree that education IS expensive. Also housing, altho offset with rental assistance. There were only a few F/O's on local terms at that time (1980) all on the B747. Several received commands and have moved on, mainly for better salary. However, all were treated well as far as I know. Did not hear any complaints.

Al Salil

15th Oct 2000, 06:48

Look no further than here for a taste of Singapore and the locals' treatment of foreigners (Ang Mo's):
http://www.angelfire.com/biz6/airen117

Gladiator

15th Oct 2000, 20:38

411A things had changed from those days. In fact I flew with many from your time, i.e. J Siroux, etc, different ball game after the large number of expats on local terms arrived.

There is no whining, only posting of facts as they happened in a court of law. Information brought to you uncensored.

PILLOW

16th Oct 2000, 08:02

Gladiator
The construction worker you mentioned is from Bangladesh . His supervisor
was sentenced to 15 years in prison for attempted murder . The worker received a
$ 200,000 compensation .

[This message has been edited by PILLOW (edited 17 October 2000).]

[This message has been edited by PILLOW (edited 18 October 2000).]

[This message has been edited by PILLOW (edited 18 October 2000).]

Sunny

16th Oct 2000, 10:49

Al Salil, If you believe that Ang Moh's are regarded that way in Singapore then you are sadly mistaken.

[This message has been edited by Sunny (edited 16 October 2000).]

Sir Jerker

18th Oct 2000, 03:13

Gladiator is absolutely correct. Why did he go to Singapore? he had absolutely no idea what he was getting into. No expats do because if they did they wouldn't go.

Kaptin M; you remind me of an old joke. The Englishman wanted to become an American but the doctor told him that 1/4 of his brain would have to be cut out to achieve this. The Englishman said that was okay. After the operation, the doctor told him that they had made a mistake and cut out 95% of his brain by mistake. The patient said "That's okay lah".