The huge amount of older guys getting their CPLs

[Rawrawhammer]

Having done 5 of my CPL exams in Perth, I noticed a scary amount of older guys sitting their exams.For the most part there was 70% or more 30+ year old sitting the exams.Talking about this recently to a few guys at the school they were showing concerns about this aswell.
I don't think there;s anything wrong with this but if there's more older guys training then youngins then there's something wrong.

Although once the fee-help scheme comes through later this year we'll see about 20x more kids lining up and flooding the market :D

[Di_Vosh]

Your Point is??



DIVOSH!

[basementjaxx]

And why would increased numbers in older guys and girls sitting their CPL's be a "scary" thing?

BJ

[HardCorePawn]

As one of these 'scary' older guys, I have to wonder why it is that you (and your colleagues) seem so scared of us?

:confused:

[Islander Jock]

Maybe he's scared of the competition.:ELook at it from an employers perspective. More mature pilot, less likely to turn up p1ssed or stoned, less likely to be using the flying schoold or charter job merely as a stepping stone in their mad scramble to make it into the regionals.
There are probably many more good reasons why age and maturity will be a more attractive option over youth and inexperience.

[Mach E Avelli]

Maybe there's more older guys because of the high costs involved. Unless you have a rich daddy it takes a few years to get the money together, or the credit rating necessary to borrow the money. Good on 'em, I say.
However, there is probably a practical upper limit to "old" if you are just starting out, or trying to get back in after many years out of the business. At just what age does it become a lost cause? Like fitness to fly beyond 60, it's a highly variable number depending on the individual. There's something a bit sad about pilots who hang on too long and don't admit to themselves that they are losing it. Like professional tennis, the time to go is when you are at the top of your game.

[Capt Wally]

30+ you consider older?:bored: Geez had you said 50+ I would have agreed but at 30+ yr still wet behind the ears!:)


CW

[Howard Hughes]

30+ is old? That's still 30-35 years of working life left...:rolleyes:

I would actually say that someone who is 30+ with a bare commercial and some 'life experience', is far more employable than a 20 something straight from school wanna be who is still 'wet behind the ears'...;)

'Generation Y' have a lot to learn!:hmm:

[FlyingChipmunk]

your comments reflect your age RawHammer.

Even starting out at 40 gives the dude/dudette a very fulfilling 25yr long career. The real "scary" thing that you may want to consider is that almost all the airlines out there prefer taking in a 'life experienced' and older green CPL as compared to a much, much younger person for many reasons I will not delve into.......for which, there are the cadet schemes.

Just my recent observations and personal opinion.

[desmotronic]

its the hordes of 457 visas you need to worry about.

[Mr. Hat]

I can't see a problem with OLDER guys learning to fly.
We even have space for a walking frame on our plane (for those that have made it to 30)

[Kangaroo Court]

I find the ignorance of the thread starter the most scary thing of all.:D

[HardCorePawn]

Even starting out at 40 gives the dude/dudette a very fulfilling 25yr long career. The real "scary" thing that you may want to consider is that almost all the airlines out there prefer taking in a 'life experienced' and older green CPL as compared to a much, much younger person for many reasons I will not delve into.......for which, there are the cadet schemes.

Just my recent observations and personal opinion.

I certainly hope this is the case... otherwise I am just boring holes in the sky... and my account balance! :\

[dj Mcrae]

So ... Who payed for your training so far rawrawhammer? probably someone over 30 i would bet.

Now I can see why some Airlines would want to employ older people if the young ones show the attitude you have just put across.

i would say the reason is there are so many 30+ doing there CPL would show that opportunities exist for life experience... Not some secret agenda against pimple faces.

I'm on the borderline so i don't know who's side i should be on (sarcas) I guess i should ask my younger GF that i stole off a 22YO.

:ouch:

[Rawrawhammer]

Misunderstanding here guys.All I am trying to say is that when there is more "second career" people entering a field then young "straight from schools" then it's a bit scary.By scary I mean that it makes one like my self think.."what am I doing?too risky?I have a huge loan strapped to my back and not many other young guys seem to be doing it?WTF am I doin?".Do you see what I mean.
Don't get me wrong, I am 100% for older guys changing careers and entering into aviation but that wasn't my point.

Compare any other field of education and you will see that it's 90% under 25s studying/training so it makes Aviation be the odd one out.That's another reason why it is so strange although no other field requires 50k plus cash to get started, the difference is stil too significant in my eyes.

cheers again

[lgst]

Being an ancient old man of 32...:8, I reckon it is great so many people are having a crack at 30+. Most 30+ trainees have had a long interest in aviation & most will remember when they were in their early 20's the aviation industry had a glut of low hour pilots, September 11, Ansett collapse etc, that put many of us off from fulfilling our ambitions. The HECS-Help scheme as far as I know applies to course fees and not flying fees. It is great for anyone of any age to fulfill their dream.That is my piece for the day!:)

Cheers.

[lgst]

I can see your point RawRaw, it is a big risk for anyone and generally 20-somethings will be requiring finance if they haven't secured backing from family etc. Good luck mate and follow your dream.

[tinpis]

In the olden days it took 20 odd years to find a decent job.:(

[lgst]

So the current surge in 30+ trainees is related to pilot shortage and perceived opportunities in the industry at the moment? Is the shortage as bad as people say it is?

[dj Mcrae]

Its a risk for us all... As for your first post being rather narcissistic rrh your second back peddling post makes much more sense.

Good luck to us all

[Wizofoz]

Just another sign that Australia is being dragged (kicking and screaming) into LAST century!

The scene in Europe has for many years been either young guns being sponsored through, or "Second Career" guys self-funding.

For anyone but the major airlines, the second group are attractive employees as they are more mature, stable, and once established with a job and a base, less likely to want to move as they have family ties and commitments.

As for it being "Scary", don't worry about it Rawhammer, the way it's going there are plenty of opportunities for all. And whilst the older guys will find satisfying careers in regionals and the local jet operators, it is the likes of you who will be flying the heavy metal to (and, if you want, from) the exotic locals.

[Lodown]

30 + age group. Maybe more a reflection on less takeup in the profession by school leavers than a growth in the older wannabee. More kids getting a degree or a blue collar job that pays a decent wage, then coming back to the fun of flying when they get a little older with a fallback option.

Pilots with other job options? Not a good sign for the employee-rape-and-pillage management style of recent years.

[Mr. Hat]

ah the good ol Gen Y.

Can't wait to get to the left seat to fly with these characters (not)....

....after the 18 months hard yards it takes them to get a regional gig from commencement of training.

[Howard Hughes]

Me thinks a return to the days of m(Y) way or the Highway, is on the cards Mr Hat!:eek:

[airman1]

It doesn’t matter how old you are as long as you can hold a class one medical and show that you meet the required CASA standard when conducting the flight test. Old/ancient ……….is 60 plus in my book:E

Even Capt Wally deserves the YOUNG prefix....... Young Wally where's the debate????:ok:

[Howard Hughes]

Even Capt Wally deserves the YOUNG prefix.......
Well perhaps 'Youngish'...;)

[tio540]

Rawrawhammer

Funny thing is, it's an older guy and gal that are paying for your licence, cooking your meals, and probably doing your washing.

[Capt Wally]

ah come one boys CW ain't that young nor is he dead just yet!:)
I started late as a pilot & just played with planes part time for a few years before that magical word 'restructuring' came in with the Co. I worked for at the time & my 'mates' went full steam ahead, broke & destitute of course:bored:
'airman1' yr obvioulsy holding the 'key' there, trying to 'wind' up CW:E

now now 'HH' you will want to reach my age some day (meaning yr still alive) so be nice:ok:


CW:)

[airman1]

'airman1' yr obvioulsy holding the 'key' there, trying to 'wind' up CW

My apologizes Capt Wally I should have more respect for my elders!!!:=

Remember .......your only as old as you feel!!! :ok:

[Capt Wally]

ahhh that's fine 'airman1' my 'spring' broke a long time ago !:E

I guess one of the benifits of being older, respect:ok:

CW

[Howard Hughes]

your only as old as you feel!!!
Actually you are only as old as the Woman/Man (delete as applicable) you are feeling...:E

[vmx]

Good post there Rawrawhammer (certainly got us old farts wound up!), and I'm one of those greyhairs you'd have seen with furrowed brow in the Perth exam centre. But I understand where you're coming from. If I was a 20-something weighing up whether to go $40K into hock or head north for 5 years and get $120K pa in the mines I know which one I'd choose (be on the flight to Karattha tomorrow!).

Maybe many of the greyhairs are in a similar situation to me. I flew helos 20 years ago before giving it away to feed, cloth and house a family. My thinking at the time was that I didn't want to end up being a broke and burnt out pilot at 50, so instead went into other industries and built some great experience and skills. But the intention was always to return to aviation when I could afford to.

Now at 45 with the kids almost off the hands and the mortgage halved I've got another 20 years working life to go, so I'm hitting the books again (cursing the need to wear reading glasses :}).

So yes, I agree that for a young'un in might look a bit of a worry when the number of greyhairs starts to outnumber the pimply brigade, but as another poster noted, the airlines will always be looking for fresh fodder.

There was a similar post on another aviation forum recently, obviously from a young wannabe asking the old hands "would you do it again?" Well, everyone is different, and all I say whenever a Gen Y says that they want to be a commercial pilot is "think very carefully about it. You have a 40 year working life and there's an awful lot of things you can do in that time." Pick the time to make money and give your family security, pick the time to have fun, and if you're really really lucky, do both.

[Pinky the pilot]

I gained my CPL in 1985 at age 30 and obtained my first full time job in PNG at 35!:eek:

Through various circumstances I have now been out of Aviation completely for just over three years, but fully intend to renew the IFR rating and have another go at returning to the only thing on this Earth that I truly love!!:ok:

I'm now 53, but I'm still going to have another go as soon as finances permit.:cool:

Remember, you young types;Age and treachery will always overcome youth and enthusiasm!:E:eek::ok:

[vmx]

I gained my CPL in 1985
Oh yeah, weren't the 80's fun as a newly minted CPL :ugh:

[partial aviator]

Employ a teenager NOW !

while they know everything ...........

[Peter Fanelli]

Employ a teenager NOW !

while they know everything ...........
That's on a sign not far from me, gives me a chuckle everytime i see it.

For me CPL in 1982 and first full time flying job in 1988.

First overnight in Boulia Jan 23 1988 :eek:

[weezythef]

once the gewd ol' "fee-help" arrives which seems to be around the corner, then we'll see the tables turn and will have plenty of young fellas comng through.And I mean PLENTY :ouch:

[Pinky the pilot]

Oh yeah, weren't the 80's fun as a newly minted CPL

vmx; Em nau!! Was'nt it the truth!!:{:{

First overnight in Boulia Jan 23 1988

Ohmigawd Peter! The place was bad enough in 2005!!:eek: I never knew just how much Bundy a ringer could drink until I propped up the front bar of the Pub in Boulia on a Saturday night and watched the 'nightlife' there!!

'Course, the locals used to look somewhat askance at the bloke with the bottle of Red in front of him on the bar,.....''Bloody mail run Pilot...'' but I really learned a lot there!!

Such as how to avoid 'black looks'.....:eek: (EG; 'Buy me a drink, Handsome?')

Age does indeed have it's benefits!:ok: