A couple of questions about YRED signage

[PyroTek]

Hey,
Last time i was at YRED, while taxiing, I looked at a couple of yellow signs near the runway.
one said:
WARNING: BIRD HAZZARD EXISTS
Last time i checked Hazard has one "z"... More CASA spelling errors?

and the other one says:
Takeoff rwy 07 preferred
Landing rwy 25 preferred

Is that saying that they want you to takeoff for a head on collision with a landing aircraft and vise versa? or is there something I'm missing?
Also, in an old ERSA i have... from 6/11/2001, it says the same, but in the current ERSA it says nothing of the sort.

Can anyone clear this up?

[Jabawocky]

Well spotted

The runway thing is preffered....weather and time of day etc.....common sense should always prevail

J:ok:

[PyroTek]

of course common sense should prevail.

However, current AIP says that rwy 07 is preferred, shouldn't they remove the sign in that case?
I think that it is a bit of a safety hazard to have a sign like that and have 2 circuits, in reverse, happening..
It has nothing about landing on rwy 25 except that it wants right hand circuits.

and secondly, i think they should fix the bird HAZZARD sign because of grammar nazis like me

[WannaBeBiggles]

Well spotted mate.

Maybe it's CASA's way of seeing who meets ICAO level 6 english? :}

[QF2]

Shhh Pyro! If CASA start fixing signs it'll give them another excuse to bump up the cost of our medicals again! :}

[Creampuff]

Pyro: The apostrophe is a solecism (and an exquisite irony) in: “Grammar-Nazi’s like me”. Also, the hyphen is unnecessary.

If a Grammar Nazi’s house is made of glass …

By the way, CASA does not paint and plant signs at airports.

[dude65]

Clear as mud troops:ok:

Operational Aerodrome Information:

S27 12.4 E153 04.1
UTC +10 Var 11 Deg E
Field Elevation 7 feet
Runway 07/25 (853m)
CTAF (Commom Traffic Advisory Frequency) 118.8 MHz
PAL (Pilot Activated Lighting) 07/25 122.8 MHz
Unicom (Redcliffe Unicom) 118.8 MHz (available during club hours only)
FIA (Brisbane Radar) 125.7 MHz
Left hand circuits Runway 07
Right hand circuits Runway 25
Take Off Runway 07 except when operationally unacceptable
Residential areas, especially on the West of AD are to be avoided at all times
NO straight in approaches permitted on either runway

[T28D]

Actually straight forward, circuit arranged away from residential areas, a very common practice.

[VH-FTS]

The Redcliffe City Council (operators of the aerodrome) are responsible for the signage. Maybe after watching too much Dukes of Hazzard?

The neighbours at the western end of the runway are a bunch of :{ and the aerodrome was nearly shut down a number of years ago. A comprimise was the fly neighbourly advice you are reading.

Take-off on 07 where traffic allows. Land on 25 if there is no traffic.

Another thing is the ERSA says no straight in approaches, but there are a number of tools that seem to ignore this. No doubt it makes the neighbours even more happy.

Soon you guys will have development at the eastern end of the runway and no doubt a curfew. Rich people living on canals make a lot of noise.

[PyroTek]

There is a curfew:
"Night OPS not permitted BTN 2200-0600 Local, except in EMERG"

[VH-FTS]

Could become worse if people are conducting circuits off 25 first thing on a Saturday or Sunday morning.

[SmokingHole]

yeah 'cause you wouldn't want to upset all the redders bogans with engine noise on a sunday morning

[GoDsGiFtToAvIaTiOn]

Another thing is the ERSA says no straight in approaches, but there are a number of tools that seem to ignore this.

Am I missing something here?

If I am coming in from the west, how does overflying the final approach path to Rwy 07 at cruise power to join a left hand circuit cause less noise than flying a straight in approach - which would normally be flown at a reduced power setting?

GG

[BN APP 125.6]

Might also help if:

RAC teach students to fly a circuit that does not require an intermediate refuelling stop (pushing all aircraft following - as well as themselves - nowhere near gliding range of anywhere) and avoids the noise sensitive areas at the western approaches (the reason for the early right turn on dep 25)

and, A certain HELO trg school does not conduct mustering training adjacent to the private schools and residential areas on the western grassed area.

With the canal development at the Eastern side now reaching right up to the aerodrome boundary, pressure from newly arrived cashed up NIMBY's is only going to get worse. It is in all of our interests not to give them any more excuses than neccessary to whinge to our newly enlarged council and their newly increased entourage of aviation-ignorant councillors.

[VH-FTS]

Might also help if:

RAC teach students to fly a circuit that does not require an intermediate refuelling stop and avoids the noise sensitive areas at the western approaches (the reason for the early right turn on dep 25)

:D

Where'd all the senior instructors go?

[flying-spike]

M@c@ir thats where and another trying to get into QFlink at the moment!

[spanner90]

Perhaps somebody watched one too many episodes of "The Dukes of Hazzard"!;)

[jbr76]

Left hand circuits Runway 07 / Right hand circuits Runway 25


That basically means if Rwy 07 is in use, it will be L/H circuits only. And if Rwy 25 is in use, R/H Circuits only ( due to noise abatement procedures ) No exceptions for either Runway configurations. Neither will there be takeoffs on runway 07 and landings on runway 25, unless there has been a wind shift mid-circuit and the relevant aircraft have mutually arranged traffic separation to accommodate such a change to allow a landing on runway 07/25.

Take Off Runway 07 except when operationally unacceptable

If the windsock is indicating a wind in favour of Rwy 25 (usually happens early in the mornings) You will be using Rwy 25.

If the windsock is around to its 'usual' position indicating the classic SE tradewinds, or there is nil wind conditions, Rwy 07 must be used.

Some of the R/A guys love to continue to use Rwy25 even when the wind from the S/W has completely dropped off and conditions have shifted to nil wind. That clearly is in breach of noise abatement procedures.

[PyroTek]

I am aware of your first point, and your 2nd point, jbr76, HOWEVER, What is the point of having a sign saying "Landings rwy 25 preferred?"
Is that just for noise abatement?
It's kind of confusing.....

What's the point in using the signs if it's normal procedure to use 07 for takeoffs in nil winds/the 'normal' SE Winds, and 25 when the sock shows otherwise?

Makes the sign kind of redundant, in my opinion.

Is there something I'm not getting/am missing?

[WannaBeBiggles]

If the windsock is indicating a wind in favour of Rwy 25 (usually happens early in the mornings) You will be using Rwy 25.

If the windsock is around to its 'usual' position indicating the classic SE tradewinds, or there is nil wind conditions, Rwy 07 must be used.


Or you have adhoc circuits done by helo's and ultralights like you sometimes see! (Saw Helo doing a departure on 25 and 30 seconds later heard a ultralight making a base call for 07) :ugh:

[VH-FTS]

I am aware of your first point, and your 2nd point, jbr76, HOWEVER, What is the point of having a sign saying "Landings rwy 25 preferred?"
Is that just for noise abatement?
It's kind of confusing.....

What's the point in using the signs if it's normal procedure to use 07 for takeoffs in nil winds/the 'normal' SE Winds, and 25 when the sock shows otherwise?

Makes the sign kind of redundant, in my opinion.

Is there something I'm not getting/am missing?


Here's the application of the above. I departed YRED one morning (5am), wind slightly favouring rwy 25 (only a couple of knots max) so I used 07 for take-off to keep the neighbours happy.

Second scenario, came back to YRED late one night. Slight seabreeze still blowing favouring 07, but I used 25 again to keep the D-Bay residents happy. Not that a Cessna is too loud.

Pretty simple to understand.

Don't mean to sound like a prick Pyro, but you ask a lot of questions that could easily be answered correctly by your instructor.

[PyroTek]

True, I just never think of the questions during the lesson, I'm more focussed on flying! :cool:

Thanks anyway.