Overheard Emergencies.

[GoneWest]

Please educate me in the ways of US airspace.

There is a longer story behind this question - that we can get to later - but let's say you are wombling through the skies and one of your radios is tuned to 121.5 (guard!!).

Scenario 1 - you hear an aircraft calling for assistance...but it receives no response from any ATC unit.

Scenario 2 - you hear an ELT suddenly start transmitting its siren squeak.

What would/should you do in either instance??

[pigboat]

Generally, for scenario 1, call the aircraft in question, request his position and the nature of the emergency. Relay that info to whatever ATC/FSS unit you're working. They will then attempt to work the aircraft themselves. If this proves impossible they will have you try to switch him to another ATC/FSS unit closer to his position. If that fails, they may switch both of you to a discrete frequency and have you relay. That is the general rule of thumb. No two situations are alike.

For situation 2, check the time. If it's between the hour and five minutes past, it could be someone checking the operation of his ELT. That's only normally a couple of sweeps, tho. Listen out for a couple of minutes to discern if the signal is increasing or decreasing. Call the ATC/FSS unit you're working, tell them you've got an ELT signal and advise them if it's increasing or decreasing, and how long you've had it. They'll tell you what to do next.

[zerozero]

I like Pigboat's answer. That's exactly what I'd do.

I'm on pins and needles waiting to see where GoneWest will take this next and what relevance this question has on American airspace.


:)

[pigboat]

OXO, I cheated a little. :D Had that situation 1 happen once. We were going into SAT, and some poor guy was trying to sort out the terrain somewhere. We relayed with center for a bit, and he was finally able to talk to Texarkana, I think it was.

Wonder if he would have called Pan Pizza, or whatever it is, if he hadda been a Brit? :D

[zerozero]

Mr. Pigboat: Experience is not "cheating" in my opinion. I'm glad you were able to help out some poor guy in Texas.

Do they have Pan Pizza down there?

If they do they probably put BBQ sauce on it.

Fly safe, keep your ears on.

GoneWest: Still waiting...

[GoneWest]

Sorry, cats and kittens...got swamped at work - few nights in hotels with no computer (told you I needed help - anybody know a US citizen with JAA experience??).

Zero - "airspace" phrase came up because in the UK there is a substantially different response to 121.5...although most 'towers' monitor it, there is a dedicated team 24/7 (two actually, depending on your aircraft lat/long at the time). I would know exactly what to do in UK airspace - and just wanted to know the differences...if there are any.

Forgive the long "cut and paste" posting...here's a copy of the e-mail that I sent to the FAA (before I posted on here - note that I got a response on here, before I got one from the FAA)......

.........................................

Whenever I'm flying over an unpopulated area, if there is no nearby ATC unit, I tune the aircraft radio to 121.5

Numerous reasons - good frequency to be on if I have a problem, may be able to help if I hear anyone else with a problem...and peace and quiet in the headset instead of listening to dozens of Unicom airfields all chatting at the same time (and sometimes about flying).

Let's take the second reason from that list...may be able to help if I hear anyone else with a problem.

A few months ago, whilst operating in the Hernando County area, I heard the call...(on 121.5)...

"Cessna 120, request assistance". There was no response.

Five minutes later..."Cessna 120, request assistance" Again, no response.

Another five minutes later "Cessna 120, request assistance" I called the aircraft, gave him my callsign and asked if I could help. Cessna 120 told me that he was completely lost and required navigational assistance to get home.

I asked for his altitude - 2000 feet - no problem
I asked for his fuel endurance - half tanks - no great problem
I asked if he had a mode Charlie transponder and the knowledge of how to operate it - at this point came the call "Cessna 120 this is Tampa approach, call Orlando on 119.4"

My next line - once establishing the safety of the aircraft and the experience of the pilot was to suggest that he call Orlando and use the radar to get a fix.

Question is...what should the procedure have been? Why did he not get help from ATC (any ATC) during the first fifteen minutes of calling on 121.5? More importantly - for my future reference, what should I do if I hear of another aircraft calling in distress or urgency situations?

More recently, Tuesday 25th July, I was operating to the west of Orlando and heard an ELT go off. I recorded the time (16:12 UTC, 12:12 EDT), my aircraft altitude (3,500') and my position (southern edge of Lake Apopka).

I looked at the current chart for the nearest VOR, took the frequency for FSS (St. Petersburg, 122.1R) and then tuned the VOR to 112.2 (ORL) and called St. Pete. "St. Petersburg Radio, Warrior N53379 on 112.2". No reply. Second call - exactly the same. Third call, exactly the same. Having checked and double checked the frequencies and the volume settings, I made a blind transmission to St. Petersburg that I could hear a very clear signal from an ELT and gave a radial and distance from ORL.

I then called Orlando Approach on 119.4, "Orlando Approach, Warrior N53379" No response - hey, could be on the landline. Give him a minute and call back. He called a couple of other traffic and I called again. He responded with "Warrior 53379, remain outside class B airspace, I'll call you in a couple of minutes".

I immediately called back and said "Warrior 53379, just calling to report a strong ELT signal at the Southern edge of Lake Apopka". To say the guy didn't care is an incredible understatement. He was not in the slightest bit interested and gave me little response other than a "huh, OK".

I was now approaching Kissimmee, so left him, landed and reported the same thing to the ground controller - who sat up, took notice and recorded the details.

Again, I ask - for my own education - what IS the procedure? What should I have done differently?

...........................................

Any more comments or questions?

[zerozero]

In my humble opinion (really), short of homing in on the ELT yourself, there's nothing more that you could've done.

It seems to me that you fully used the system as it was designed.

However the problem is not with American airspace, it's design or the people using it.

The problem goes back about 20 years ago when Ronnie Reagan fired a whole slew of controllers. ATC has been desperately short ever since.

ATC is swamped (especially in Florida). ;)

Fly safe.

P.S. You might want to write a letter to the editor of your local newpaper or even one to the local congressman. Explain that attempts to use the system failed to raise the appropriate authority when time was of the essence.

[ 29 July 2001: Message edited by: zerozero ]

[GoneWest]

ZZ...considering the amount of effort I put into promoting flight safety (remember my work with the FAA), I don't think it would be prudent to scamper off to the press or News Channel 5 with this story. :) :)

I'm saddened though - and a little alarmed - that the two attempts at declaring an emergency I witnessed both fell on stony ground.

However many - or few - controllers there are, surely a distress message from any aircraft is more important than any other call.

Thanks for the words of encouragement. ;)

Glad we can communicate (professionaly) at last.