Night night, Nighthawk

[BEagle]

I find it hard to believe, but the USAF is retiring the F-117A:

http://www.daytondailynews.com/blogs/content/shared-gen/blogs/dayton/flydayton/entries/2008/03/10/f117a_stealth_fighters_retired.html

Fantastic jet.

Still, if it frees the budget for higher-priority spending?

Maybe there's a lesson here?

[Pontius Navigator]

Maybe they have worked out there are no potential target sets left at the moment. Maybe it will be obsolete before the next time it is needed.

Same logic for disposing of Sea Harrier and Jaguar and Lynx. Good theory if you can see a short time ahead.

[blue monday]

As the article states - it has been in service for 27 yrs:eek:, So there is a strong argument its done its time, then again i got sentimental when the RAF retired the Jaguar early so can understand why some will mourn the retirement.

[tonker]

I wonder how long it's replacement has been flying!

[goose boy]

Why keep a mini when you have a porsch in your garage ??????


Its hard to wonder what its replacement will look like, No doubt it has been
flying top secret sorties for some time now just like the Nighthawk did from area 51 (and it dosent exsist),lol, the american goverment denied the nighthawk exsisted for some time so I wonder how long the nighthawks replacement has been flying ??????. the only reason they admitted the nightawk exsisted was because it was old to them and they had better aircraft and technology in the pipeline.

I have heard it will be called the Aroura and the technology is going to be mind blowing ??? Might expain some of the strange lights seen around a few off the map bases.

Shame to se it go as it is a great machine, wonder if they will sell me one , lol

I bet the first pics would be worth a fourtune, lol

G.B

[Occasional Aviator]

Looks like the CIA online english scrambler is still working.

[GreenKnight121]

The replacement for the F-117 is indeed in service.

It is called the F-22.

Yes, the F-22 has a limited strike capability... but remember the F-117 was only capable of carrying 2 x 2,000 lb bombs (or 2 x 1,000 lb, etc.)... hardly a world-beating capability there.

The F-117 had its IR/laser target location/designation system... and it is also a 27+ year old one.

Note that, of 59 F-117 built, 7 crashed, 10 were retired in December 2006 and 27 since then. That meant that only one squadron (15 aircraft) is still in operation.

In contrast, 4 active USAF, one reserve USAF, and one ANG squadrons are operational with the F-22 (the reserve & ANG squadrons share aircraft & maintenance tasks with the active squadrons).

[Ewan Whosearmy]

The F-117 is being retired, but the airframes and motors are being kept in what amounts to flyable storage.

[FlapJackMuncher]

Same motor as the U2S isn't it?
But that is due to go soon also IIRC.

[noregrets]

ISTR that, post-Kosovo, it doesn't fly anywhere nowadays without dedicated ECM jamming cover, thus calling into question its unique selling point, ie its 'invisibility' to radar.

Great ac though - still looks amazingly futuristic, even given its advancing years.

[Ewan Whosearmy]

FJM

No, the F-117 uses the F404, whereas the U-2S uses the F118 (a derivative of the F110).

[Red Snow]

Virtually all the fleet is going into secure storage, back in the barns at TTR. The main reason, I understand, is that there is not much else you can do with them.
The amount of work needed to de-coat/prepare them for public display is huge, and very expensive. The few that are on display were prepared by volunteers.

[gareth herts]

I'm not sure these have been slated for retirement have they? I thought they were going to continue ad infinitum!

[J.A.F.O.]

but the USAF is retiring the F-117A

So, are they selling any off? :ok:

[0497]

The USAF is currently in the market for a new stealth bomber. There's a concern that they might not have enough B2s.

B2, new stealth bomber, F-22, F-35 'bomb truck'
+
B1s and B52s

There's still/going to plenty to spare.

[Brian Abraham]

From AVweb today

Final Flight For Stealth Fighters

The U.S. Air Force is retiring its fleet of F-117 Nighthawks, which were the world's first attack aircraft to employ stealth technology. The single-seater aircraft made its first flight in 1981 at the Tonopah Test Range in Nevada. The Nighthawk program remained classified until 1988, when a photo of the jet was first unveiled to the public. The Air Force said the decision to ground the fighters was based on economics. "With aging aircraft fleets and infrastructure, senior Air Force leadership has made hard choices to pay for modernization of our overall aircraft inventory," said Air Force spokeswoman Diana Filliman. "One of these decisions was to accelerate the retirement of the F-117, and use the savings generated to accelerate the recapitalization and modernization efforts underway across the fleet." Fifty-nine of the F-117s were built, the last one in 1990, and seven of them crashed. During more than 1,000 sorties flown by Nighthawks during Operation Desert Storm in the early 1990s, not one was shot down, the Air Force said.

"It was like flying into the biggest fireworks demonstration you have ever seen," recalls Brig. Gen. Greg Feest, reflecting on the first night the F-117s were deployed over Iraq. "Realize, we were in the heart of it. Because of the delivery system we had at the time, we had to be down low. We couldn't fly over the AAA (anti-aircraft artillery) ... We didn't know if [the stealth technology] was going to work. The engineers all assured us that it would. At the end I was amazed to see I had a checkmark next to every call sign and every pilot's name, knowing we were all coming home." After a retirement ceremony this week, the airplanes will be stored in Nevada. The Nighthawk's mission will be taken over by the F-22 Raptor.

[Ewan Whosearmy]

The single-seater aircraft made its first flight in 1981 at the Tonopah Test Range in Nevada

Not quite. It first flew about 30 months prior (IIRC) at the Groom Lake test site.

[Brian Abraham]

Details I have shows first flight 18 June 1981 at Groom. First production aircraft accepted by the USAF (4450 TS) 2 Sep 1982 at Tonopah.

[chevvron]

I've looked for Tonopah on google maps and all I can find is a small Tonopah airport (civil), so is the airbase shielded by 'stealth' technology?

[Brian Abraham]

Details here http://www.lazygranch.com/ttr.htm

[gareth herts]

Have Blue (the demonstrator) flew on 1st December 1977 with Bill Park at the controls.

[Ewan Whosearmy]

Details I have shows first flight 18 June 1981 at Groom. First production aircraft accepted by the USAF (4450 TS) 2 Sep 1982 at Tonopah.

Brian

My bad on the date.

[FoxtrotAlpha18]

As Gareth said, 1977 was the Have Blue, an about 2/3 scale proof of concept demonstrator, whereas 1981 was the YF-117, so you're both right actually! :ok:

The YF-117 was placed at the Blackbird Airpark at Palmdale last week alongside an A-12, SR-71 and D-21 - nice 'black' assortment of Lockheed memorabillia there! :ooh:

I remember flying 'with' F-117s in GWII - well...we were DCA'ing their tankers as they came and went, but anyway - they never went anywhere without a huge 'gorilla' entourage of EA-6Bs and/or F-16CG/Js in tow!


BTW - TTR is at 37°48'6.79"N, 116°46'37.53"W. Those who have been to Red Flag will agree that there's some fun flying to be had in this area!

[green granite]

I've looked for Tonopah on google maps and all I can find is a small Tonopah airport (civil), so is the airbase shielded by 'stealth' technology?

Fire up google earth and type in area 51.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i11/orangeherald/area51.jpg

[Zoom]

and one ANG squadrons are operational with the F-22

And the US ANG continues to be equipped with more up-to-date kit than the RAF.

Not sure where it came from but in 1983 my colleagues and I were aware of the planform of the B-2 but not the F-117, and this was long before we had confirmation of the existence of any stealth aircraft project.

[hoodie]

green granite, Tonopah (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tonopah_Test_Range_Airport) isn't the same place as Area 51/Groom Lake. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Area_51)

[Brewster Buffalo]

From Wiki

During the Kosovo War the 250th Missile Brigade equipped with the SA-3 'Goa' anti-aircraft missile system, downed a F-117A. According to NATO Commander Wesley Clark,and other NATO generals, Serb air defenses found that they could detect F-117s with their radars operating on unusually long wavelengths. This made them visible on radar screens for short times.

Reportedly several SA-3s were launched, one of which detonated in close proximity to the F-117A, forcing the pilot to eject. According to an interview they had a number of spotters spread out looking for F-117s and other NATO aircraft. The commanders of the SAMs guessed the flight paths of earlier F-117A strikes from rare radar spottings and positioned their SAM launchers and spotters accordingly. It is believed that the SA-3 crews and spotters were able to locate and track F-117A visually, probably with the help of infra-red and night vision systems.

Some American sources acknowledge that a second F-117A was also damaged during a raid in the same campaign, and although it made it back to its base, it supposedly never flew again.

which explains

post-Kosovo, it doesn't fly anywhere nowadays without dedicated ECM jamming cover, thus calling into question its unique selling point, ie its 'invisibility' to radar.

[FormerFlake]

During the Kosovo War the 250th Missile Brigade equipped with the SA-3 'Goa' anti-aircraft missile system, downed a F-117A. According to NATO Commander Wesley Clark,and other NATO generals, Serb air defenses found that they could detect F-117s with their radars operating on unusually long wavelengths. This made them visible on radar screens for short times.



About 6 weeks later the Chinese Embassy in Belgrade is bombed. Looks like they found the radar in question!! Just should have checked the address before launching the HARMs!!!!