Freq separation

[Alo58]

Flying in a remote but busy part of a leading(?) African country a year ago, I discovered published freq separation in uncontrolled airspace, ie. two different frequencies (GND - 1500'AGL) in the same piece of airspace. When I pointed out the potential danger of this to the authorities of that country, I was informed they are aware of the problem, yet cannot do anything about it right then, due to pending development in the area (?)

Could any sane person with safety in mind, enlighten me on:
(1) What's the publication on this in the UK? (reference please)
(2) Could something like this be allowed? Surely a practice like this is inviting disaster, eg a midair.

[HEATHROW DIRECTOR]

<< I discovered published freq separation in uncontrolled airspace, ie. two different frequencies (GND - 1500'AGL) in the same piece of airspace.>>

That statement is not wholly clear - 2 frequencies GND-1500'AGL?? I don't understand. There must be many areas where two, or more, frequencies are in use for the same piece of airspace, controller or uncontroller.

[Alo58]

Allow me to tap into your vast knowledge & experience in this field. All I really need is for someone to clarify the (potential) "danger element" in this scenario. Besides the 'see and be seen' rule for VFR flights, position reports are equally as important. This is evident in many countries's aviation legislation (AIP's, etc.), even more so those countries which are signatories to ICAO. The requirement for most, if not all light aircraft is to carry at least one apparatus (radio), be it a fixed or hand-held unit, for two-way R/T communication. My question is merely this: How can two or more aircraft monitor and possibly act on position reports, when on different frequencies in the same area?

[HEATHROW DIRECTOR]

Bob... in your initial post you did say outside controlled airspace. The situation you describe must occur thousands of times daily in the UK. I worked at an airfield outside CAS where we ran a busy approach control service with a holding pattern. We would be talking to aircraft in our hold, yet other aircraft would fly right through without talking to anyone. In the UK, aircraft fly outside controlled airspace under both IFR and VFR and do not necessarily provide position reports to anyone. Some pilots may contact nearby radar units; some may contact the FIS but none are under any obligation to do so..

Hope that helps..

[Alo58]

Hi again

But was there a designated & published freq to use for pos reports, should they so desire? Am I correct in my understanding that in your situation u described, there was no radar, no FPL's filed, NO knowledge of these aircraft and no designated freq to use for position reports? The fact that they did not make any pos reports shows they a) have confidence in some sort of facility or system to detect them and give them false security and comfort, or b) are overconfident in their own weak human ability or c) they are all cowboys? The latter I just cannot believe. Why then bother with any frequencies in uncontrolled airspace?
The UK AIP GEN 3.4.5, as well as the CAP413 R/T manual Chapter 6 refers to a common frequency (135.475 MHz) known as ‘SAFETYCOM’ which was made available for use at aerodromes where no other frequency is allocated to enable pilots to broadcast their intentions to other aircraft that may be operating on, or in the vicinity of, the aerodrome. Why? For the very same reason which is the core of my concern.

[SkyCamMK]

Bob, this is England we are free to fly our own aircraft in Class G airspace without radio if we wish and why not? I do not really understand your question. Are you a journalist and do you have a pilot licence? Do not forget that there are gliders, balloons, microlights, ultralights, paragliders and parachutes up there too! Good job the sky is a big place eh?

[HEATHROW DIRECTOR]

<<Am I correct in my understanding that in your situation u described, there was no radar, no FPL's filed, NO knowledge of these aircraft and no designated freq to use for position reports? >>

I don't suppose any private pilot flying around the UK outside controlled airspace knows what a "position report" is. In the case I described there was large RAF station nearby with radar but pilots are not required to make use of such facilities if they don't want to. They are not required to file a FPL either if they choose not to. We have FIS available and pilots can use it if they choose but any private piloits who chooses to swan around outside controlled airspace doesn't even need a radio in the UK.

You ought to see the radar picture around London on a summer Sunday afternoon - hundreds of "unidentified" aircraft, many of whom will not be talking to anyone. Providing they remain clear of controlled airspace and aerodrome traffic zones they are free to do as they wish.