Some questions..

[Octane]

Hi all,

A few things bugging me, hopefully someone can shed the light..

1. After I use skype an IE window automatically opens to query the call quality. But I don't use IE, prefering Firefox instead! It's annoying but I can't work out a solution.

2. I've downloaded Thunderbird email client and having a look at it. With this software and others like it are they designed to use an email address that comes with your ISP account only? i.e. they aren't meant to handle 3rd party yahoo or hotmail accounts etc?

3. Why is it only IE supports my banks webpage. Firefox and Opera will open the page but it doesn't function properly/fully. I'd really like to delete IE to free up space and this is the only reason I haven't. The bank site is the only site I have a problem with. My other banks site works fine on FF or Opera...

Thanks,

Cheers
Octane

[hellsbrink]

No3 is generally easy, it's what your bank has decided to use. You have no choice.

Thunderbird should be able to be configured with your ISP email and not just hotmail/gmail/whatever.

No.1? No idea, don't do Skype but it wouldn't surprise me if there is an option in the setup somewhere to disable that. I sure someone else can sort that one out

[bnt]

No.1: IE is probably your default web browser, so it comes up first when the URL is requested. In the Firefox Preferences (Main Tab), check the box "Always check to see if Firefox is the default browser", then restart it. Next time you start IE, it will complain that it's not the default any more - tell it No.

No. 2: Thunderbird can support anything that uses standard mail protocols: POP3/SMTP or IMAP. I have it set up for three different accounts at the moment: GMail (custom POP3), a POP3 mail account, and another IMAP mail account from my university. I've never used Hotmail, but according to this guy (http://ask-leo.com/what_are_the_pop3_and_smtp_settings_for_hotmail.html), they don't give you any POP3 or IMAP options. Not Thunderbird's fault - Microshaft's. :oh:

[twiggs]

Question 3.
Try using the Firefox add-on IE Tab.
It allows you to use firefox but with an IE "engine" and therefore some websites that only work with IE will function adequately using this add-on.
IE Tab (https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/1419)

Question 2.
Microsoft have even discontinued the access of Hotmail via Outlook Express for new accounts so I doubt you will find any program that will be able to access it.

[Background Noise]

Re Q 3 - check you have the latest update for firefox - I had the same problem with my online banking but it was fixed by an update. Check also with the bank's own help pages to see which browsers are supported.

[seacue]

I note that Windows Update uses IE. Does that mean I wouldn't be able to update XP if I somehow managed to remove IE?

[Bushfiva]

No, because you can't remove the IE Rendering engine.

[Octane]

Secue,

As Bushfiva says, IE in integral part of the Windows operating system. Its all intertwined so you cannot simply discard IE. Think this was the basis of a court case in the EU.

Back to my question re Thunderbird, If I was at a hotspot in say Singapore, would an email client like Thunderbird retrieve my ISP email from my Australian ISP's mail server via the net? Is this how a mail client actually works? Sorry if I'm asking the bleeding obvious! Thanks for the replies and BNT, ask-leo.com is a good find, I spent hours on his site...

Cheers

Octane

[Saab Dastard]

Does that mean I wouldn't be able to update XP if I somehow managed to remove IE?

I think it may do, as I can't use Windows update on the MS site with Firefox. I have to admit that I've not tried using the IE plug-in for FF to see if that would work - frankly, it's easier just to use IE!

SD

[Saab Dastard]

If I was at a hotspot in say Singapore, would an email client like Thunderbird retrieve my ISP email from my Australian ISP's mail server via the net? Is this how a mail client actually works?

Possibly - and sort of!

Your incoming messages are stored by your ISP on a mail server before being downloaded to the local message store in the email client (internet mail is a "store and forward" system) on your PC.

The traditional protocols for retrieving mail are POP3 and IMAP - your local email client connects to the server directly to log in and download messages, and to send messages.

Note that older POP3 servers will not store messages after you have connected to the server and downloaded them, whereas an IMAP server gives you the option to leave copies on the server.

This goes back to the days when dial-up was the norm, and calls were costly, so messages were sent / received as quickly as possible, then the call disconnected, and mail could be read and composed "off-line".

The problem is that - for security - you generally cannot directly access that server from the wider internet, but only from "inside" your ISP's network - which you are with your broadband connection from home. Some ISPs may allow pop3 / imap internet access to their email servers, but mine certainly doesn't!

Having said that, if you have a dial-up modem connection, you would be coming in on the "inside" of the ISP network, and you could dial-up from anywhere in the world (at a cost), so you could access email directly.

More recently, it has become possible to access the message store on the mail server at your ISP via a web browser - but ONLY if your ISP provides that service, obviously. Of course you then have the problem of differences between your local message store and the server message store.

I think that this form of web browser email access can sometimes be used by a local client such as Tbird or Outlook Express to connect and actually download messages to the local mail store, but again not all ISPs' email systems will support this. Your best bet is to contact your ISP to see what mechanisms they support.

SD

[The Flying Pram]

I've just looked at the IE Tab developers website (http://ietab.mozdev.org/) and the headline is "Believe it or not, we really ran Windows Update from Mozilla/Firefox."

[Octane]

SD

So in a nutshell, Email clients are really designed to reside on your desktop machine in an office environment permanently connected to your ISP? If so, when on the move you have to dial up your ISP at international call costs or miss out if cable connected ISP? That would imply most people rely on 'free' email accounts when travelling. I guess a way around it would be to set up a website? I'm starting to see the light!

Cheers

Octane

[bnt]

So in a nutshell, Email clients are really designed to reside on your desktop machine in an office environment permanently connected to your ISP?
No, they can use any Internet connection, regardless of whether it's dial-up, broadband, wireless, whatever. Why would you think they were limited in such a way?
The problem is that - for security - you generally cannot directly access that server from the wider internet, but only from "inside" your ISP's network - which you are with your broadband connection from home. Some ISPs may allow pop3 / imap internet access to their email servers, but mine certainly doesn't!
I saw this, and while I don't doubt it happens, I wouldn't like to use that ISP. I use POP/SMTP mail from an independent service (Spamcop), which has no such restrictions. They authenticate every connection, for sending and receiving mail, and I have used it on three continents.

In the "old days", SMTP servers for sending mail were often unsecured "open relays", they would let anyone send mail. That is no longer advisable in this spam-ridden era, obviously. So ISPs secure them, sometimes by credentials (as mine does); or by limiting the sending of mail, by IP address, to users on their own networks.

I really don't see what an ISP would gain by limiting POP3 access (for receiving mail) to addresses on their own network. If they do, they surely let you get mail on a webmail server, at least. But whatever the situation is, the protocols, and clients that use them, don't limit you in the ways you describe. It's down to whatever the ISP or mail provider decides to let you do.

(I'm assuming that this ISP actually gives you a genuine Internet address, and doesn't keep all their customers behind NAT (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Network_address_translation). I didn't think any ISP would be so bloody stupid, but then I visited Dubai and used a friend's home Etisalat connection. :* )

[Tarq57]

Octane, if your ISP provides it, you can log in to the ISP webpage and retrieve emails via a browser (Firefox, IE, whatever).
Most ISP's provide that, here, where it is called webmail. (and possibly also called webmail internationally...I don't know.)
Go to your ISP's homepage, log in (usually a "members" or "users" tab somewhere) and see if it is available, or phone them and ask. It should be pretty straightforward.
Once you're logged in, accessing your emails - that would normally be accessed by your email program (T'bird or OE) - is just like using the browser to access hotmail etc.
You can't use T' bird/OE to access Hotmail. It's designed for a browser.
Not a Skype user, but some external applications don't give the option for using a different browser for updates. Ask Skype about it, probably on the forum. (Bound to be one.)
FF with the IE extension can process M$ updates. But I've never bothered. Just use IE, for updates only. My computer has FF as the default browser, but if I click the "windows (or ms) updates" function, IE automatically opens.

[Out Of Trim]

You can usually use Slimbrowser or Avant Browser instead of IE as they both use the IE engine but, in a more pleasant way! Most sites will think your using IE, although some sites will still not operate properly.

MS updates do though work with both these two. However, as stated earlier - You cannot remove IE. I have IE7 and just use it occasionally when nothing else will work! But use Slimbrowser most often.