What's so interesting about my house this week?

[Pandora]

Hello Mil peeps! In particular all you lovely Chinook chaps and chapesses. Do any of you know exactly what it is about my house and the field behind it that warrants 2-5 low level overflights per day for the last week, and 6 low level orbits in 15 minutes today just as I was trying to get my baby to sleep? I know that you have to practice somewhere, but I would imagine that the same square mile could get a bit boring after a while. It makes my windows rattle. Also it is upsetting my chickens - small problems I know, but Mr Pandora is not going to be pleased if I don't have enough eggs to make him currant buns tonight. It hasn't upset my horses yet, though I do wear a fluorescent bib when I am with them as your lovely bosses at the MOD have told the British Horse Society that all horsey peeps need to do to get the Chinook chappies to avoid them is wear one. I think this smacks of MOD management passing the buck if you ask me, so they can blame the pilot next time a horse rider falls on their head because their horse didn't enjoy the low thrum of a Chinook 100ft over it's head, but what do I know?

I am not going to pinpoint exactly where I am, suffice to say it is somewhere in Berkshire, next door to a certain famous person's house. (We'll get the answer after the break!) We get lots of low flying traffic, not least Sky New helis, all trying to see what he is up to now, but by far the most irritating of the lot is this Chinook. The nearest military establishment at Greenham Common was closed down some time ago and it's runway dug up, so I am sure you are not aiming for there.

[Grabbers]

Pandora,

Did you read your thread before you posted? B:mad:y NIMBYs

[airborne_artist]

Pandora - I like to think of it as the sound of freedom :ok: and we have horses and chickens who are very used to the wokkas.

[Pandora]

Bigbluecar, thanks for the link, but I don't have a complaint, just what I think is a reasonably valid curiosity about what it is that is making my house worth a second, third, fourth, fifth AND sixth glance.

L Peacock - if I was a naturist you'd all be flying in the other direction. :eek:

And Grabbers, well done on taking less than half an hour to get the word NIMBY onto the thread. I don't have any problem at all with any aircraft flying over my house - it would be rather hypocritical after all. I just had a bit of a moment of frustration that for no understandable reason I am suddenly the owner of the most exciting 5 acres in Britain. Yes I did read my post, and I believe I asked in the nicest way I could if there was any particular reason, not that I did not wish for the military to be able to practice their low flying skills. I fly with lots of ex-mil pilots who are generally lovely people, and whenever I have come across an ex-mil who has the uncanny knack of being able to pee people off without saying more than a sentence they invariably turn out to have been navigators who wanted to be Tornado pilots. So tell me; are you a frustrated navigator? Now go and wind your neck in and continue to protect the right of the good people of this country to wonder what that helicopter is doing. Thank you.

[Al R]

Pandora,

Why are you cross that military aviation is disturbing your peace, on a lazy Friday afternnon? It has to practice somewhere you know, so are you complaining about it everywhere or just on your doorstep?

I could be wrong mind, but this smacks a bit, well.. of nimbyism? :hmm:

[GPMG]

Pandora,
those people who are annoying your chickens, are training so that they can stay alive whilst annoying the Taliban in the near future.

Unlike you and your chickens the Taliban are sporting 7.62 and .50 cal machine guns.

So please, be proud of the fact that in a small way you are serving your country by suffering very little and not complaining about it whilst the men and women in those Chinooks practice techniques to stop themselves from being shot down.

I realise that any noise makes it difficult to get a young one to sleep but in 16 -18 years time your little cherub may be training for war and I garuntee that you will want them to have as much quality training as possible.

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

It hasn't upset my horses yet, though I do wear a fluorescent bib when I am with them as your lovely bosses at the MOD have told the British Horse Society that all horsey peeps need to do to get the Chinook chappies to avoid them is wear one. I think this smacks of MOD management passing the buck if you ask me, so they can blame the pilot next time a horse rider falls on their head because their horse didn't enjoy the low thrum of a Chinook 100ft over it's head, but what do I know?

but by far the most irritating of the lot is this Chinook."

It's got a bit of a Nimby ring to it.....................:rolleyes:

[Al R]

Seldom Fit sagely observed: It's got a bit of a Nimby ring to it.............

Phew, not just me then.

[1.4G]

could get a bit boring

You have..........................................

[Master of None]

Pandora,

If your house is where I suspect it is then there is a training field close by. That is a field that the landowner has allowed the JHC assets to use for landings. The useage of those fields is often curtailed for periods of the year when it may be predudicial to the use of the landowner, for example Pheasant breeding. This means that you may not see a movement for weeks and then suddenly it begins again. The field near you is quite unique and has certain characteristics that make it very useful for trainees on the conversion training. This would mean that a course of say 8 trainee pilots will all go there in a period of days and after that it would revert to its usual sporadic use. Please don't take that as any form of guarantee mind!

I apologise for the tone of some of the other replies, I personally as a Chinook Pilot thought you were just asking a simple question rather than seeking to grind any particular axe.

[Pontius]

Guys,

Instead of just (a)trying to justify the reason for the helicopter being there in the first place or worse (b)accusing everybody who doesn't enjoy the sound of whirling wings trying to smash into each other of being a NIMBY, why not simply answer the entirely reasonable question? Is there an exercise going on? Is the weather limiting the normal playground? Has someone painted 'Piss off Biggles' on a local barn?

All of these might be valid reasons and would answer Pandora's question (which, I believe, was written in just about as light-hearted way as possible). Just slagging a fellow pilot off because they don't enjoy their normal peace being interrupted, not once but six times, does nothing to further the reputation of the respondents.

XXX

Pontius
Ex-military and FAR too good to have had to fly anything with rotors or navigator :)

Edited to add: Sorry Master Of None, your considered reply and my posting crossed in the ether.

[devsan]

im intrigued to find out who the famous person is:)

lets have some good ole name dropping

[It's Not Working]

Master & Pontius - Good answers, thank you.

Pandora - Great post and well phrased.

[JUBBLY99]

Thanks pontius for bringing sense to this thread. A perfectly reasonable request from a member of the public.

For all other post on this thread not everyone is out to get us!

[Romeo Oscar Golf]

Pretty poor responses from guys who seem to be up themselves. Well done the helpful ones. A perfectly reasonable question without a suggestion of Nimbyism, which would not get a straight and honest answer through official channels. I say that as one who was once required to investigate and respond to similar questions or complaints on behalf of my military bosses and also on environmental and H&S issues when I was employed by Civil air.
I would get a little pi**ed off if I had babies, livestock and horses and had to endure the god awful cacophony of heavy rotors and nobody could or would give some sort of explanation.
Hope the sensible answers help, Pandora.
Rog, (ex fast jet navigator and bizjet taxi driver, responsible for causing more low level noise pollution than was fair, but enjoyed it).:E

[Chris Kebab]

..i'm equally intrigued as to who the ex nav is strutting around Berkshire pi$$ing off the locals claiming to be an ex Tornado pilot.:)

[animo et fide]

Pandora

As a current chinny crewman, let me re-assure you that all we do in our own backyard is essential training. Feel free to pm me for anything else

[minigundiplomat]

Pandora,

as someone who has kids myself, I can understand your frustration. I am probably one of the people you are threaders with at the moment, and although I am sorry for any inconvenience, I can tell you that it is essential and that we do not target set properties for our 'attention'.

However, I am sure this will be of little comfort to you and your offspring. As others have mentioned, there is a system in existence for you to register your frustration, and see if there is a way of meeting in the middle. The Corporate Communications Officer or Officer Commanding Operations Wing at RAF Odiham are probably a good start.

The telephone number for RAF Odiham is 01256 702134.

[Wavey Gravey]

Unlike you chickens the Taliban are sporting 7.62 and .50 cal machine guns.You have clearly never met iner-city chickens :bored:

[Riskman]

Pandora you have my sympathy. Having been stationed at Odiham and living right on the corner of the maried patch that the pilots seemed to use as the marker for turning on to finals I know what the noise is like.

Our cat always tried to catch the Chinooks but ignored the Pumas.:hmm:

[Pandora]

Master of None, many thanks for your reasoned reply. As you surmised;
I personally as a Chinook Pilot thought you were just asking a simple question rather than seeking to grind any particular axe.
I was indeed just wishing to see whether there was a reason rather than having a go.

You mentioned pheasant breeding, which would make sense as there are places very very close to me where that happens. It would sound as though this unique field you mention is indeed close to me. This answers my question.

Also thank you to the others who could see my point of view. Not all who ask questions are NIMBYs. My last home had a grass strip 200m from the end of the garden with all the hairdryer powered light aircraft they attract, I still marvel at the sight of the Red Arrows flying over, and love to watch local 'lazy Friday afternoon' pilots in their little Pitts and Zlins looping the loop nearby. Is it so unreasonable to wonder what is happening when a 14 ton woppa woppa seems to be peering in your window on a frequent basis?

[exscribbler]

I wish they'd come and fly over my house; we haven't seen any military aircraft over this part of South Yorkshire for bl@@dy years!

[airborne_artist]

Pitts and Zlins looping the loop nearby Que? Doing aeros, including a loop, but looping the loop, never!

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

Pandora,

Apologies if I am wrong but your opening post whilst on the face of it a fairly innocuous question also included the following observations

"just as I was trying to get my baby to sleep"

"It hasn't upset my horses yet, though I do wear a fluorescent bib when I am with them as your lovely bosses at the MOD have told the British Horse Society that all horsey peeps need to do to get the Chinook chappies to avoid them is wear one"

"but by far the most irritating of the lot is this Chinook."

At first glance you appear to be asking a simple question but you rather needlessly included the 3 references above with regards to how the Chinook's noise was affecting your life which certainly had the sceptic in me raising my eyebrows.

You then follow this with a very eloquent put down for Grabbers where you tell him

"I fly with lots of ex-mil pilots who are generally lovely people, and whenever I have come across an ex-mil who has the uncanny knack of being able to pee people off without saying more than a sentence they invariably turn out to have been navigators who wanted to be Tornado pilots."

Followed with

"Eloquent words mightyr. Please let me never find myself in a cockpit for 10 hours with you when you have finished saving the world.

to shut mightyr up.

But you also tell us that

"L Peacock - if I was a naturist you'd all be flying in the other direction"

"Also it is upsetting my chickens - small problems I know, but Mr Pandora is not going to be pleased if I don't have enough eggs to make him currant buns tonight."

Now whilst it is conceivable that a self confessed Ge's bird who purports to be Barbara from the good life yet has enough knowledge of things military to know that Nav's are all frustrated Tornado pilots and have an innate ability to piss people off could exist I am sorry but I have do have my doubts.

My initial thoughts that there is more than a hint of Nimby now include a whiff of Walt.

[Al R]

First things first. My Nimby post was done semi-tongue in cheek and because it was a lazy Friday afternoon. I assumed that Pandora was (is) having a laugh when I read 'her' post and although I'm not half as gallant as most others here, there you go.

Pandora, I hope your current buns are a-ok this morning. :ok:

[Ventre A Terre]

...and not all navigators are frustrated Tornado pilots (I like to think for a living :E) but that's probably for a different thread.

VAT

[Hempy]

Sounds like a noise complaint I kept a copy of around here somewhere about Hornets and the Salt Ash weapons range near Willy, hang on...

here it is, MA 15+ strong coarse language (http://www.users.on.net/%7Edrew.dickson/Work/NoiseComplaint.wav)

[Al R]

Coffee --> Mouth --> Keyboard.

Thats the funniest thing I've heard in ages.

[Pandora]

Deary me. Some of you have a sense of humour, and some definitely don't! Yes, I'm flowery - I'm a girl. You don't have too many of those in the Forces from what I gather. And it is possible to have a baby, an ability to bake cakes AND a flying licence of some sort. We have different skillsets to blokes.

Have none of the slightly more aggressive ones of you out there EVER had a WTFIT? moment and on being told the answer, gone 'oh right! There you go!'

If truth be told it's rather nice to have a bit of a banter, and I am looking forward to flying with some of my ex-mil colleagues in the near future, having spent the last year reproducing. I particularly remember a sidesplittingly funny trip with a chap who was once rather involved in a particularly notorious incident in the Navy, which resulted in (among other things) a famous return from the dead and a lot of telling off. I like to hear your stories and enjoy going to the bar with you, but that doesn't mean that I LOVE every aspect of everything aviation or military. Would be boring if we all did.

Al R - my buns are a bit burnt this morning if truth be told, and a bit larger than I would expect them to be. I don't know why. But Mr Pandora liked them all the same. ;)

Toodle-oo, all.

[Chicken Leg]

I thought Pandora'a post read as an innocent question with a hint of humour, but making some valid points. She just wanted an answer, not a lecture on how great you lot are.

Now the conspiracy theorists are out as well!:rolleyes:

Pandora You'll know better next time than to post onto a forum that is frequented by so many Lord Flasheart's. Did you not realise that it is not the place of a pathetic civvy to ever question their actions. Now tottle off back to the kitchen whilst they save the human race. To55ers!

P.S. They won't appreciate your comments regarding your land, chickens, horses etc as they don't do outdoor activity (unless of course they are saving the world). Don't have time for it your see. It would affect the flying programme.

[Al R]

Pandora said: .. we have different skillsets to blokes.

Al R - my buns are a bit burnt this morning if truth be told, and a bit larger than I would expect them to be. I don't know why. But Mr Pandora liked them all the same. ;)

Thats dreadful, and I do accept your point about skillsets. But before you start expanding (although it seems you're done with that for the time being) with things like flying and socialising, shouldn't you be getting the key core skills right first? Mr P might be mortified to learn that Mrs P is quietly struggling with domestic basics.

I've always appreciated buns too, and I'm sure that you are grateful of Mr P's sympathetic handling of a potentially delicate situation.

Chicken Leg said: Well, lots really.

You need to have a word with Mrs P about morale and keeping your chin up. Although, if I suspect, your chicken legs compare unfavourably with her whopping buns, you might end up feeling even more grumpy.

[minigundiplomat]

Pandora You'll know better next time than to post onto a forum that is frequented by so many Lord Flasheart's. Did you not realise that it is not the place of a pathetic civvy to ever question their actions. Now tottle off back to the kitchen whilst they save the human race. To55ers!



I had already replied:


Pandora,

as someone who has kids myself, I can understand your frustration. I am probably one of the people you are threaders with at the moment, and although I am sorry for any inconvenience, I can tell you that it is essential and that we do not target set properties for our 'attention'.

However, I am sure this will be of little comfort to you and your offspring. As others have mentioned, there is a system in existence for you to register your frustration, and see if there is a way of meeting in the middle. The Corporate Communications Officer or Officer Commanding Operations Wing at RAF Odiham are probably a good start.

The telephone number for RAF Odiham is 01256 702134.


I await your apology.

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

Imagine my surprise when old drumstick enters a thread contributes nothing but can't resist having a bit of a crab bash..........as predictable as ever chap :rolleyes:

[Wingswinger]

Since I have worked out that Pandy must live somewhere quite near me I reckon the "famous person" is Andrew Lloyd-Webber.

Shame West Berks is not in the more popular parts of the UK LFS for the FJ chaps or we'd have a few simulated attacks and LL combat training as well. :E

WS
(ex-mil fast-jet noise and general nuisance-maker but I usually did it over Wales, NE and NW England or Scotland )

[Out Of Trim]

According to the myth, Pandora opened a jar (commonly referred to as Pandora's (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pandora%27s_box) box) releasing all the evils of mankind— greed, vanity, slander, envy, pining, chinooks, fast jets — leaving only hope inside once she had closed it again.

She just opened her box again, and let let hope out - If she was hoping to cut down the number of Chinook overflights that is!

:E



OK - I added the bit about chinooks and fast jets...

[GPMG]

What? She had Chinooks and Fast jets trapped in her box? Is she a relation to Joan Crawford?

Any Spanish revolutionaries?

[Chicken Leg]

I await your apology.

Not sure that I owe you one smallweaponambassadore. My post was clearly aimed at the idiots who berated poor Pandora for asking a perfectly reasonable question. As you were not one of said idiots, my post obviously did not apply to you. ;)

Imagine my surprise when old drumstick enters a thread contributes nothing but can't resist having a bit of a crab bash..........as predictable as ever chap

Perhaps, but this whole 'the world owes us a living' crap and the 'I can't believe the lack of respect I get' boll***s is self appreciating horse 5hit. The MOD is a Government Department and is therefore accountable, ultimately, to Joe Public. That includes Pandora and her chickens (arrrrr chickens!). I was gob smacked by some of the responses to her question. Is it any wonder that the public hold us in such low regard. Let's just go and keep trashing her property and then in a couple of weeks/months/years, we can start another thread and whine about why people like her don't support the Help for Heroes campaign or don't sign the latest petition aimed at giving us better accommodation or the like.

If we want to discourage people (who have the wherewithal to come onto a military forum) from asking us questions about what we do, that's fine. But we can't then expect their support when this Governments next 5hits all over us.

Rant over!;)

[Chicken Leg]

When you post on an internet forum, you invite all and sundry to read your opinions and answer your questions; you are highly unlikely to please everyone and may even attract some harsh replies. Dry your eyes princess and get on with it.

You don't expect to please everyone? She asked a question and was viscously attacked (yeah, I know. Maybe a little exaggeration! ;)) for having the neck to do so. Are we so important that we are now beyond having our actions questioned?

[Pontius]

I particularly remember a sidesplittingly funny trip with a chap who was once rather involved in a particularly notorious incident in the Navy, which resulted in (among other things) a famous return from the dead and a lot of telling off.

Well, some of us know exactly who you're talking about (good mate but he does work for the competition) :}

Now to have a look at the status list and see who's been on maternity leave for a bit.......I think I know who the mysterious Pandora is and hope the 10 hours+ spent with me wasn't too bad :)

[Backwards PLT]

This is getting interesting - so can Pandora get me a job and/or rating etc? We should all start be extra nice to her.:)

I always did like chickens and horses.

ps and I am with the "it was a reasonable question, get over yourselves" crowd

[RAFEmployee]

Why has someone deleted my post!

[xraydice]

It's obvious, Pandora just leave a tray of your currant buns out for the lads, It would appear that they can smell your baking on appoach , Its a compliment , As for baby , well some folk have those airplane mobiles in the nursery, you've the real thing... :)
I can sympathise to some extent I have some high levels of low level rotary traffic,the horses are nonplussed ,the chix still lay and only visiting relatives get concerned by the face to face contact with the crew !

[tezzer]

I am drawn to a line in Notting hill where Rhys Ifans utters the immortal line

" I new a girl called Pandora, never got to see her box mind "

[SRENNAPS]

Now, Chicken Liver, get off your high horse and realise that there is no


Quote:
'the world owes us a living' crap and the 'I can't believe the lack of respect I get' boll***s is self appreciating horse 5hit



I think you will find there is............ and Chicken Liver has not been the first person to try and point it out.

[ACW599]

It's just such a pity that EGOS Field 24 (N52°43’42” W002°59’48” or 52.72842N 2.99677W or SJ 32790 14987 or UTM 30U 500225 5842050 or IO82MR) can't be found by Chinooks. Only Squirrels and Griffins have the high-tech navaids necessary to find this very elusive field.

EGOS Ops are on Ext 7227. . .

[PatrickH]

I'm a civvie... Living under the boscombe down circut and the approach? to middle wallop... aircraft morning, noon and night... my complaint - not enough fixed wings in the air! - sort it out guys :ok:

[Zoom]

Yes, not much aerial activity of any nature my way. The biggest thing to happen here since the Battle of Bosworth Field was the air ambulance landing on the village green a few weeks ago. What's happened to all the low-flying jets that used to give me a buzz a while back?

[Molesworth Hold]

EGOS Ops are on Ext 7227. . .

I wouldn't do that, the cast of Last of the Summer Wine enjoy their naps When not sleeping there is the Sudoku and some high pressure biscuit munching to be done.
http://phill.co.uk/comedy/losw/losw28.jpg

What does Dedicated User Area actually mean?

[P-T]

In all fairness Pandora, if you didn't want any sh!tty comments you should have phrased your questions/comments in a more "friendly" manner. I sympathize with you're predicament, as I also have a young child and other nuisances cause her to wake up, but you have to accept that these crew haven't gone "who can we p!ss off today then?". They are doing it because they have planned a route and there probably haven't been any official complaints.

So the best advice I can give is, call the complaints cell and get them to advise the crews of the issue. Or accept that once in a while a few Chinooks are going to come and repel the earth in your area.

Having been on the receiving end of many complaints I can honestly say that once there has been a valid complaint, the crews have done their best to avoid any further animosity (where possible).

You had a box and you opened it, you have to deal with the consequences when you come on to the military forum and criticize the military! I think it would be a very sad day if the military didn't speak out when they thought that they were being made the focus of an attack. If you think you didn't say anything out of order, then all you need to do is look at the amount, severity and tone of the replies from the military and civilian posters, then make a assessment.

Sorry to jump in with my 2p worth so late in, but this really my blood boiling. I'm happy now, I'll get off my box, maybe you should too, or instead of wingeing about it on PPRUNE, do what one of the first threads suggests. Do a proper job.

P.S. What's all this Nav abuse. I can take it from Military Pilots, but not from a civvie! :ouch:

[AIDU]

I'm a girl. You don't have too many of those in the Forces from what I gather.

Amazingly enough there are quite a few girls in the RAF and they even let them fly some of the war planes. Oh and some of them are Navigators, obviously too thick to be Pilots but at least they know how all of the white goods in a kitchen and utility room work, which is an added bonus.

[P-T]

I think girls make better navigators these days. As they are used to playing will all those switches on the cooker, kettle, microwave etc. Not much different from the tilt and gain and the comms. box's. In fact I think OASC should re think the aptitude tests for Nav's and bring in some Zanussi equipment and a pile of washing to see which candidate can wash, dry and iron the quickest!

:ok: Sorry to the female Nav's who know me.

[SRENNAPS]

mileandahalf

(and some others after his post)

I don’t need to elaborate; you only have to read quite a lot of the posts on this forum.

Groan, Groan, Groan........Slag, Slag, Slag......Moan, Moan, Moan....and definitely more Slag, Slag, Slag.

And before you start, this is not a personal dig at you and yes I have sometimes been guilty of the above (normally when a few Friday night beers have got the better of me).

However, every other thread on Military Aircrew seems to degenerate into a fight these days. Whether it is somebody asking a question or somebody who has posted a second thread on the same subject, there are many here that will attack them just for the sake of it.
It even degenerates into a slagging match when somebody starts a thread after an aircraft crash or worst still a thread of condolence. How sad is that.

The number of members that attack other members over there (sorry “their”) grammar is pathetic. The amount of personal insults, with the use of swear words cleverly disguised with the use of “&@$$K{£, is, in my opinion, totally unacceptable (especially by so called officers).

And it always amazes me the number of “Can’t you take a bit of banter” replies from people that probably would not understand banter if it hit them in the face.

Sadly a lot of the attitude here is perceived by others (particularly civilians) as being arrogant, negative, I have a big chip on my shoulder and finally “‘the world owes us a living' crap and the 'I can't believe the lack of respect I get' boll***s is self appreciating horse 5hit” .

Accept that, because the truth is (and the newspapers love it) that’s how it is with a lot of people here.

As for me being in the minority here, you may well be right. But then again this forum is full of members that joined around the 2005/6/7 mark, many of whom have been in the RAF 5 minutes. Some of you (not all) seem to think you truly are superior beings. Well rest assured you are not. There are plenty of people out there that work hard, show dedication to their cause and quite frankly are more than capable of doing your jobs (probably better) without the moaning and slagging.

That will do for another week or so.

[AIDU]

That will do for another week or so.

Ooooohhh!!!!!! Been on the old red vino? Can’t you take a bit of banter? You probably would not understand banter if it hit you in the face.:ok:

[airborne_artist]

I'm a girl. You don't have too many of those in the Forces from what I gather.

But the ones we have do quite well - GAPAN award to Rescue 193 (http://www.fleetairarmoa.org/asp/news.asp?NewsItem=26&Archived=1)

[Echo 5]

P.S. What's all this Nav abuse. I can take it from Military Pilots, but not from a civvie!



I think that this hits the nail on the head. Some of you on here are somewhat pi$$ed off because Pandora has already achieved what some of you aspire to and others never will, ie working up the front end of a civvy aircraft. No denials guys.............there is always someone on a mil thread batting on about how cheaply they can (or cannot) get their ATPL prior to the next phase of their flying career. Oh, she will have two wings on her brevet not one.

With regard to Pandoras posts on this thread........I detect no whingeing or nimbyism.....in fact what I do detect is a sense of humour.

I have read some of her posts on various other threads and not only can she string several sentences together she can also SPELL, unlike some here.

Goodnight all.:)

[P-T]

Sorry, didn't realize you had to join before 2000 to be able have a valid opinion or point to make.

I for one have opted for the americanized spell checker, as the English Oxford Dictionary has recently succumbed to our cousins demands. As for expletives, the use of colorful language is an addition to the English language and used in the correct way can have a very strong influence.

However, being from Wales I would expect you'll understand when I say "dwi'n flin bod ti wedi cymerud shwt gymaint o haint o'r neges diwethaf, dwi'n umddiheirio" :)

By the way, the RAF have moved on considerably in the last 20 years. They even allow Officers to wear jeans in the mess now!!!:{

Echo 5, I've done both, military and now a Civvie Pilot. Can I have your next uninformed comment please................

[Chris Kebab]

The rather bizarre aspect of the above nav discussion is that one of the few people I know who can afford a house in Berks is an ex tornado pilot who used to be a nav:confused:

[AIDU]

she can also SPELL, unlike some here.

Some of you on here are somewhat pi$$ed of because Pandora.

Whoops. I guess you are not one of them either.;)

[Echo 5]

Well spotted AIDU.

P-T,

Biting well tonight are we not !!

Please tell me does "dwi'n flin bod ti wedi cymerud shwt gymaint o haint o'r neges diwethaf, dwi'n umddiheirio" roughly translate into

" Wales aspirations to win the 6 Nations Grand Slam will be thwarted on 8th March by Ireland at Croke Park ? " ;)

[P-T]

I've had the hook pulled through the flesh of my cheek, so I'm all better now!

With regards to the translation - you can but hope. I always go back to basics when we are in the 6 Nations. As long as we beat the English I don't care. My championship is over, I'm over the moon.

Simple things please simple minds, as no doubt, a few posters on here will agree.

[CaptainFillosan]

I think this thread is probably about to come to its end. Not much more to add is there after all.

With regard to Pandora's posts on this thread........I detect no wingeing or nimbyism.....in fact what I do detect is a sense of humour.

I have quite liked Pandora's eloquent posts and even some of the return banter. But just like other similar threads there are always them that are either holier than thou OR just plain 'ol smart arses! Well, this lady (you can tell) has made a donkey or two out of them.

Pandora, I suspect your offspring are going to appreciate a happy and good Mum in later years. Good luck to you and yours.

[Hempy]

The rather bizarre aspect of the above nav discussion is that one of the few people I know who can afford a house in Berks is an ex tornado pilot who used to be a nav:confused:

Does he pee you off?

[Al R]

This all started off with some scope for a bit of a craic (Pandora sounds like she's awesome with her buns), but it has turned into quite the the most nauseating, cringworthy, aimless and depressing thread I can remember (in all my few months here that is that is).

[MrBunker]

I rather fancy I recognise Pandora's turn of phrase. If she's who I think she is then she's no NIMBY and a top person to boot.

ATB

[AIDU]

but it has turned into quite the the most nauseating, cringworthy, aimless and depressing thread I can remember No I disagree some, no most of your threads are a lot worse.

[wg13_dummy]

Fact of the matter is some doris has whinged about a couple of wokkas flying near her shack. Shes says it was an innocent question but as has been pointed out, the question did have some rather cutting hooks attached to it.

I think shes on a fishing trip to be honest.

I think some of the defensive comments on here are apt. If a civvy waltzed into your crew room and said the same, how would you react?

I'd tell her to get the brews on first.